WEBVTT 00:00.000 --> 00:07.540 align:start ANNOUNCER: This is the Washington Week Webcast Extra. 00:07.540 --> 00:08.690 align:start GWEN IFILL: Hello, I'm Gwen Ifill. 00:08.690 --> 00:11.870 align:start I'm joined around the table by Molly Ball of The Atlantic, Chuck Babington of the 00:11.870 --> 00:15.010 align:start Associated Press, Dan Balz of The Washington Post, and Yochi Dreazen of Foreign Policy 00:15.010 --> 00:17.620 align:start magazine. 00:17.620 --> 00:20.810 align:start As we enter this Memorial Day weekend, we thought it might be fitting to talk about one 00:20.810 --> 00:24.150 align:start of the issues following our veterans once they return home. 00:24.150 --> 00:29.130 align:start The Pentagon has recently decided to end its suicide prevention program, Vets4Warriors. 00:29.130 --> 00:32.960 align:start The program is only five years old, but it has already assisted tens of thousands of 00:32.960 --> 00:35.560 align:start veterans. But it is at risk, isn't it, Yochi? 00:35.560 --> 00:36.930 align:start YOCHI DREAZEN: It is. 00:36.930 --> 00:39.470 align:start And this was a program that was being operated from this nondescript call center in New 00:39.470 --> 00:41.060 align:start Jersey. 00:41.060 --> 00:44.740 align:start It is staffed only by veterans, the idea being that if you are a veteran speaking to 00:44.740 --> 00:47.910 align:start someone else who had served, you might be more comfortable than talking to a civilian - 00:47.910 --> 00:50.710 align:start you'd think, this person went through what I went through, they speak the language, they 00:50.710 --> 00:52.570 align:start came from the same world. 00:52.570 --> 00:56.120 align:start And it's being molded into the military's kind of overarching program called Military 00:56.120 --> 00:57.750 align:start OneSource. 00:57.750 --> 01:01.990 align:start And it's going to save the Pentagon about $5 million, which is so insignificant for a 01:01.990 --> 01:05.090 align:start place that spends close to a billion dollars a year on mental health, and it's just 01:05.090 --> 01:07.130 align:start inexplicable. 01:07.130 --> 01:11.570 align:start GWEN IFILL: How effective has this been, as this particular subset - I mean, it seems 01:11.570 --> 01:15.200 align:start to make sense that you would try to consolidate all your efforts, but has this been 01:15.200 --> 01:17.610 align:start successful in a unique way? YOCHI DREAZEN: It has. 01:17.610 --> 01:22.480 align:start It's had about 110,000 calls just in the last two or three years, and the people who 01:22.480 --> 01:25.610 align:start call call in part because they know who they're going to get on the phone. 01:25.610 --> 01:28.920 align:start They know it will be a veteran - it won't be another volunteer, it won't be a civilian. 01:28.920 --> 01:30.850 align:start They know exactly who they're going to reach. 01:30.850 --> 01:35.120 align:start So to get rid of that program and bring it into this kind of bigger overarching program, 01:35.120 --> 01:38.590 align:start which has many flaws - including the fact that not everyone who answers the phone is a 01:38.590 --> 01:42.670 align:start veteran - is mildly inexplicable. And we broke this story last week. 01:42.670 --> 01:48.870 align:start Yesterday then saw Robert Menendez and Cory Booker, the senators from New Jersey, four 01:48.870 --> 01:51.870 align:start members of the House from New Jersey, write a letter to the secretary of Defense to say, 01:51.870 --> 01:54.300 align:start why are you doing this? Reconsider it. Review it. 01:54.300 --> 01:57.370 align:start Whether it's enough to save it is probably unlikely, but at least they're paying 01:57.370 --> 01:59.640 align:start attention to the decision. GWEN IFILL: OK, thank you. 01:59.640 --> 02:03.280 align:start Dan, you wrote a story this week about the money that's driving this campaign. 02:03.280 --> 02:07.550 align:start If there's one thing that we know is consistent, and that - and only seems to get bigger 02:07.550 --> 02:11.320 align:start and more unwieldy, it's the degree to which money is driving who is in this race, who is 02:11.320 --> 02:15.170 align:start not, who gets heard. DAN BALZ: Well, I mean, the public gets hurt. 02:15.170 --> 02:18.570 align:start GWEN IFILL: No, who gets heard. DAN BALZ: Oh, who gets heard, sorry. 02:18.570 --> 02:25.440 align:start You know, what we - what we are seeing in this campaign is an almost exponential 02:25.440 --> 02:28.810 align:start distortion of what we've seen in the past. 02:28.810 --> 02:31.280 align:start It's largely because of the role of the super PACs. 02:31.280 --> 02:35.480 align:start Super PACs were a relatively new entity in 2012. They played a role. 02:35.480 --> 02:38.920 align:start You could argue that in the general election they weren't that significant. 02:38.920 --> 02:42.530 align:start In the primaries, with the Republicans, they probably did have real impact, both in 02:42.530 --> 02:47.100 align:start preserving the candidacies of some of the candidates who otherwise were underfunded or in 02:47.100 --> 02:50.260 align:start helping Mitt Romney swat away those challenges. 02:50.260 --> 02:55.830 align:start What you're seeing now - and in many ways Jeb Bush personifies this - is the centrality 02:55.830 --> 03:01.070 align:start of a super PAC in the thinking and the strategy and the preparation by a candidate. 03:01.070 --> 03:03.040 align:start Jeb - GWEN IFILL: Even the staffing. 03:03.040 --> 03:07.710 align:start DAN BALZ: Jeb Bush is not an official candidate, in part because he is spending much of 03:07.710 --> 03:11.680 align:start this first part of the year stockpiling money into his super PAC. 03:11.680 --> 03:17.190 align:start It is in some ways a mockery of the way the campaign finance system ought to be run. 03:17.190 --> 03:21.360 align:start He's playing within the rules. I'm not saying he's breaking the rules. 03:21.360 --> 03:24.060 align:start But he's stretching the spirit of the law. 03:24.060 --> 03:31.870 align:start And it points up, again, the shredding of the system we've had really for - that we had 03:31.870 --> 03:36.680 align:start for 30 years in financing particularly the primaries and the general election, and that's 03:36.680 --> 03:39.250 align:start all gone now and this is kind of the Wild West. 03:39.250 --> 03:41.920 align:start GWEN IFILL: It caught my ear that Hillary Clinton has said on more than one occasion on 03:41.920 --> 03:45.690 align:start the campaign trail she thinks this is a terrible thing the way the money system has 03:45.690 --> 03:48.950 align:start evolved, but I don't hear her taking herself out of that. DAN BALZ: Well, no. 03:48.950 --> 03:53.200 align:start I mean, she said she wants a constitutional amendment if necessary, and she took the 03:53.200 --> 03:56.900 align:start extraordinary step of essentially saying I will have a litmus test for Supreme Court 03:56.900 --> 04:00.900 align:start nominees people who would overturn Citizens United, which was the case that opened a lot 04:00.900 --> 04:03.300 align:start of this up. 04:03.300 --> 04:09.580 align:start And yet she is operating in an environment in which there's going to be some direct 04:09.580 --> 04:13.740 align:start coordination with a super PAC that is stretching the limits of what the law would 04:13.740 --> 04:18.080 align:start suggest, and there's no single step that she's been prepared to take. 04:18.080 --> 04:21.290 align:start I understand no candidate, you know, wants to unilaterally disarm. 04:21.290 --> 04:23.190 align:start GWEN IFILL: We've heard that. DAN BALZ: We all get that. 04:23.190 --> 04:28.870 align:start And yet there's nothing that she's been willing to do about her own candidacy that says 04:28.870 --> 04:31.830 align:start I'm going to - you know, I'm going to sort of put my money where my mouth is. 04:31.830 --> 04:34.670 align:start GWEN IFILL: Molly, let's talk about some of the people on the fringes of this race, 04:34.670 --> 04:37.940 align:start because you wrote two pretty good pieces - actually, very good pieces - in the last 04:37.940 --> 04:39.910 align:start couple of weeks. MOLLY BALL: Thank you, Gwen. (Laughter.) 04:39.910 --> 04:46.780 align:start GWEN IFILL: We're being generous - about John Kasich, the governor of Ohio, and Lindsey 04:46.780 --> 04:50.350 align:start Graham, the senator from South Carolina, who you argue we should be taking seriously. 04:50.350 --> 04:53.320 align:start MOLLY BALL: Well, I didn't - I'm not predicting that he's going to get any traction as 04:53.320 --> 04:55.480 align:start a presidential candidate. 04:55.480 --> 04:58.120 align:start But it is interesting, you know, we were talking the main show about that crowded debate 04:58.120 --> 04:59.990 align:start stage. 04:59.990 --> 05:03.200 align:start These are both candidates who could potentially be excluded from the debates, despite 05:03.200 --> 05:08.870 align:start the fact that, you know, one of them is a three-term senator who's been a powerful voice 05:08.870 --> 05:13.440 align:start in the Republican Party in Washington for more than two decades and the other is the 05:13.440 --> 05:17.770 align:start two-term governor of Ohio who also served for nearly two decades in the House of 05:17.770 --> 05:21.920 align:start Representatives and who Newt Gingrich gives a large share of the credit for balancing the 05:21.920 --> 05:24.220 align:start budget in the 1990s. 05:24.220 --> 05:27.990 align:start So these are both people whose - who ought to have the gravitas to entitle them to have 05:27.990 --> 05:33.290 align:start a voice in this race, and both interesting candidates who I think ought not be 05:33.290 --> 05:36.860 align:start underestimated. Kasich is a - puts on a compelling show. 05:36.860 --> 05:41.170 align:start When you get him in front of a group of people, he's got a sort of unorthodox, authentic 05:41.170 --> 05:43.770 align:start presentation. GWEN IFILL: That's a very nice way of putting it. (Laughter.) 05:43.770 --> 05:46.150 align:start MOLLY BALL: He's a little rough around the edges in a way that I think people can find 05:46.150 --> 05:48.080 align:start pretty appealing. 05:48.080 --> 05:51.180 align:start And Lindsey Graham's been going around to some of these early state cattle calls, and 05:51.180 --> 05:55.120 align:start the activists respond well to him because he's loose and he's funny, he's sort of irreverent. 05:55.120 --> 05:57.120 align:start He's not what you expect. 05:57.120 --> 06:02.510 align:start But either of these guys, you know, it'll be tough for them to break in, just given how 06:02.510 --> 06:04.560 align:start many other people are out there. 06:04.560 --> 06:07.590 align:start GWEN IFILL: And we're waiting to see Governor - former Governor O'Malley of Maryland 06:07.590 --> 06:10.970 align:start get into this race, too, and see whether he can break through on the Democratic side. 06:10.970 --> 06:14.110 align:start MOLLY BALL: That's right. His announcement is scheduled for the 06:14.110 --> 06:17.270 align:start 30th of this month in Baltimore. GWEN IFILL: Governor Pataki's on the 28th. 06:17.270 --> 06:19.840 align:start (Laughter.) What? I'm just saying. YOCHI DREAZEN: Thought about him. 06:19.840 --> 06:23.480 align:start MOLLY BALL: My calendar is full of presidential announcements as well. 06:23.480 --> 06:25.610 align:start It's an exciting time. 06:25.610 --> 06:29.990 align:start But you know, I think O'Malley has an advantage that he is pretty much guaranteed a 06:29.990 --> 06:34.520 align:start large amount of airtime because there are not as many candidates on the Democratic side 06:34.520 --> 06:38.630 align:start and because he gives Hillary a foil, if he's willing to do it. 06:38.630 --> 06:45.970 align:start And both O'Malley and Bernie Sanders have been a little bit cautious in how much they're 06:45.970 --> 06:51.760 align:start willing to really criticize Hillary, but I think the media is hungry for a foil for 06:51.760 --> 06:56.210 align:start Hillary and is hungry to see her get an actual contest. 06:56.210 --> 06:57.550 align:start GWEN IFILL: It'll be fun to see. 06:57.550 --> 07:00.620 align:start And of course, we have Rick Santorum coming up soon, as well. 07:00.620 --> 07:03.450 align:start MOLLY BALL: That's right. GWEN IFILL: Chuck, Congress, Capitol Hill. 07:03.450 --> 07:07.690 align:start We talked about the trade bill. We talked about the NSA bulk collection data. 07:07.690 --> 07:11.530 align:start But also they actually - well, may have been - kicked it down over a couple of months, 07:11.530 --> 07:14.500 align:start but a big, huge highway bill, infrastructure. 07:14.500 --> 07:17.440 align:start We were obsessed with it only a week ago, after the Amtrak crash. 07:17.440 --> 07:20.870 align:start CHARLES BABINGTON: Yeah, it was - it was set to - it is set to expire on June 1, right, 07:20.870 --> 07:25.900 align:start and generally out - you know, bridges and highways, summer, warm weather's the best time 07:25.900 --> 07:28.470 align:start to work on them. 07:28.470 --> 07:31.510 align:start It looks like there will probably be maybe a two-month extension to keep it going. 07:31.510 --> 07:37.690 align:start But when this is the type of stopgap - resorting to stopgap measures that we see over 07:37.690 --> 07:39.960 align:start and over in this Congress. 07:39.960 --> 07:44.650 align:start And it wasn't that long ago that things like highway funding and, you know, funding 07:44.650 --> 07:47.560 align:start basic parts of the government weren't that hard to do. 07:47.560 --> 07:52.630 align:start And now, because the partisanship - the main reason is that partisanship has become so 07:52.630 --> 07:57.240 align:start extreme and the divisions are so deep that it's hard to get even basic things done. 07:57.240 --> 08:01.340 align:start GWEN IFILL: I wonder if the death of pork-barrel spending, which used to be a robust 08:01.340 --> 08:09.010 align:start part of congressional action, also contributed to lack of agreement on simple things 08:09.010 --> 08:11.450 align:start like, should I resurface this bridge. 08:11.450 --> 08:14.520 align:start CHARLES BABINGTON: I can't tell you how often I hear a congressional leader say, in 08:14.520 --> 08:19.060 align:start private of course or off the record, you know, if only we could do earmarks again, you 08:19.060 --> 08:23.490 align:start know, give favors to this congressman or that senator for, you know, a local project or 08:23.490 --> 08:27.570 align:start something. And sometimes they were construction-type projects. 08:27.570 --> 08:30.870 align:start But those were the - they greased the skids for bigger problems. 08:30.870 --> 08:33.270 align:start And you know, they had - they had a smell to them, and that's why they were done away 08:33.270 --> 08:34.840 align:start with. 08:34.840 --> 08:39.410 align:start And yet you can make an argument that they were a reasonably small price in the big 08:39.410 --> 08:42.290 align:start picture to get bigger things done. GWEN IFILL: OK. 08:42.290 --> 08:45.150 align:start Well, no more, but maybe it'll come back because of that very reason. 08:45.150 --> 08:48.990 align:start That's what politics is, trading. Thank you, everybody. Thank you for watching as well. 08:48.990 --> 08:52.430 align:start While you're online, check out everything else our panelists are covering in News You 08:52.430 --> 08:57.370 align:start Need to Know, every day at our PBS.org/WashingtonWeek website. 08:57.370 --> 09:10.520 align:start And we'll see you next time on the Washington Week Webcast Extra.