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- Welcome, everyone to 
We 
dnesday Nite at the Lab.

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I'm Tom Zinnen.

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I work here at the UW-Madison 
Biotechnology Center.

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I also work for UW-Extension 
Cooperative Extension,

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and on behalf of those folks 
and our other co-organizers,

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Wisconsin Public Television,

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the Wisconsin Alumni Association

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and the 
UW-Madison Science Alliance.

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Thanks again for coming to 
We 
dnesday Nite at the Lab.

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We do this every Wednesday 
night, 50 times a year.

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Tonight, it's my pleasure to 
introduce to you Nick Smith.

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He is the brand new 
enologist here at

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UW-Madison in the 
Department of Food Science.

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He was born in Lionel 
Lakes, Minnesota,

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and went to the University 
of Minnesota for his

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undergraduate on the 
Minneapolis campus.

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Then he got his enology training 
at Oregon State University,

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worked for a couple of 
years in California,

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came back to the Twin Cities

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to get a master's degree 
in food science

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on the St. Paul campus, 
and then in April came

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to Madison to be, 
as far as I know,

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the first dedicated 
enologist here at UW-Madison.

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I think it's a great 
time to be thinking about

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grapes and wine 
here in Wisconsin.

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Please join me in 
welcoming Nick Smith

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to Wednesday Nite at the Lab.

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(Applause)

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- Thanks, Tom. 
Good evening.

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Happy you all could 
come out tonight

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and talk about some 
Wisconsin wine.

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Occasionally I have a 
little trouble switching

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to Wisconsin since for so 
many years I said Minnesota.

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(Laughter)

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Forgive me if I make a 
little slip up there.

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As Tom mentioned, I 
am the first dedicated

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enologist here at 
University of Wisconsin,

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part of the brand new 
Fermentation Sciences program,

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which I will introduce 
shortly here.

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Kind of a rundown of what 
we'll talk about tonight.

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I'm going to introduce 
myself a little bit, although

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Tom did a very good 
job of that already,

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as well as the new program 
and the new project

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that we have going here at 
the University of Wisconsin.

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We'll talk a little bit 
about Wisconsin grape

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and wine history, move on 
to some industry statistics,

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and then kind of go 
into discussions of 
cold climate grapes,

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what makes them 
unique, how those

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uniquenesses impact 
wine production

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and what I study and 
research and work with the

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industry on improving, 
talking about a bit about

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quality and what 
that really means,

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and then talking about 
the research that we have

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going on here at the 
University of Wisconsin,

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both of what I'm doing 
and a bit of what the

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horticulture department 
is doing as well

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as the genetics department 
here, right above us actually.

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So it's a brand new position.

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I started March 28th.

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So I've only been 
here a few months.

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So it's part of the 
Fermentation Sciences program.

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Dr. Jim Steele is the 
chair of that program.

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We're getting that 
started so I'm basically

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the first employee of 
that program as well.

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So they're doing a lot 
of research on beer

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and wine production up there.

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What makes this interesting 
is this position

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was started by an initiative 
from the industry itself.

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It is not a university based,

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they did not sponsor 
it initially.

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The Wisconsin Vintners 
Association, along

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with the Wisconsin 
Winery Association,

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the Wisconsin Grape 
Growers Association,

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got together, teamed up,

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and wrote a grant to 
fund this position.

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And we got funding 
for several years

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to get the position started.

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What's fascinating 
about this from my

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perspective, having 
worked in other states in

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the industry, is that 
the first one on there

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is the Amateur Wine 
Association out of Milwaukee.

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So to have an amateur 
wine association be one

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of the biggest supporters 
and proponents of

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our program I think 
is pretty amazing.

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And they've been very 
helpful in getting

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this all started and organized.

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So the position itself 
main focus is on

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improving the quality 
of Wisconsin wine.

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So my main objectives 
are to go out,

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meet with wineries, 
address quality concerns,

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do analysis, as well as 
formulate research to

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help improve the overall quality 
of Wisconsin wine and grapes.

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My background, as Tom mentioned,

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is I originally got my 
undergraduate degree in

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finance and marketing 
from the University of

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Minnesota's Carlson 
School of Management,

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ended up continuing on in 
food science for a while.

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During that time, I spent 
a year at Oregon State

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studying food science, 
finished up that year,

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and the headed south 
into California where

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I started an 
internship a year ago,

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10 years ago in August of 2015.

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That's when I kind of 
got full on into wine.

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So I worked at a facility 
that used to be owned

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by Ste. Michelle Wine Estates 
out of Hopland, California.

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Finished my internship 
there and got a job,

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position at Beringer 
Vineyards working as a

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wine chemist doing 
lots of lab analysis.

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Before I actually went out west,

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I actually did research 
at the University of

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Minnesota for the 
enologist who was there.

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She informed me that 
there was a position

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opening up at the 
University of Minnesota,

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applied for that position, 
and eventually moved

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back to the University 
of Minnesota about 2006

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to do research wine 
production there.

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I was the research winemaker

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and wine analyst for 
the breeding program.

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Briefly between here 
and University of

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Minnesota I did go 
back and do commercial

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wine production and 
cider production at Four

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Daughters Winery and Vineyard 
down in Rochester, Minnesota.

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And then when this 
position opened up,

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I applied and accepted and 
shortly thereafter moved here.

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So it was a very 
quick succession.

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Before we talk about 
Wisconsin wine history,

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we're all here tonight 
so I'm assuming

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most of you are wine consumers.

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Is that correct? 
(Laughter)

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All right, so, next 
question is, how many of you

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are actually avid consumers 
of Wisconsin wine?

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A very good show of hands.

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Great. I ask those 
questions in Minnesota

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and don't always get 
the same response.

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So that's good.

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They've been growing 
grapes for quite a long

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time on some level in 
Wisconsin since the

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1840s when Agoston 
started the vineyard not

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far north of here, 
what eventually would 
become Wollersheim.

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And the first commercial winery 
in the state started in 1867.

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So we're going on 
close to 50 years

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of having commercial wine

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production in the 
state of Wisconsin.

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Wollersheim started in 1972.

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They're prominent 
because they are

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the largest winery 
here in Wisconsin.

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There's been several 
viticulture areas that have

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been named and 
established in Wisconsin

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viticulture areas are 
areas recognized by the

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federal government for 
having very specific

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wine growing, grape 
growing characteristics.

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So it's good for marketing 
and differentiation of

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the wineries and grapes 
grown in those areas.

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University of Wisconsin 
didn't really start

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getting into grape 
research probably around

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2000, 2005, 2008 
when they started

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establishing vineyards 
at the agricultural

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research sites around the state,

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one of which is over 
here in west Madison.

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And then in 2015, just 
shortly not long ago,

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that's when I came on board.

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So that's kind of the 
history of Wisconsin wine.

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A little bit of statistics.

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Currently, there are 
actually about 110 wineries

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licensed in the 
state of Wisconsin.

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So you can see from 
several years ago, that's

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quite an increase 
of over 20 wineries.

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We're growing roughly five to 
10 wineries every single year.

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That's been consistent for 
the last five or 10 years.

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Up to probably 700-plus 
acres of grapes.

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I would say probably 
more than that.

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It's a little hard to get 
a good estimate since a

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lot of small growers don't 
report how many acres they have.

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You can see in the last 
13 years, they've more

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than doubled the size and number

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of grapes grown 
here in Wisconsin.

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The five largest wineries 
are Wollersheim, Door

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44, Parallel 44, which 
are the same business,

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Danzinger Vineyards, 
Door Peninsula and Elmaro.

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A couple wineries that 
I've kind of gotten into

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recently are Dancing 
Dragonfly and Villa Bellezza.

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I think those will 
probably move into the top

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five here pretty soon.

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We should be proud of 
some of our wineries,

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particularly Wollersheim Winery.

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It's one of the largest 
independent held

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wineries outside of California,

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including Oregon and Washington.

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So I think it's about 13th.

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They're producing 100,000 
cases, roughly, every year.

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We'll talk a bit about 
cold climate grapes.

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Some of you are 
probably familiar

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with these particular varieties.

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Worked a lot with 
these varieties

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when I was at the 
University of Minnesota.

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Marquette had just gotten 
introduced when I started there.

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So I'm probably one of 
the few people who has

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the most experience of 
actually producing that grape.

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So the cold climate 
grapes, these hybrids,

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they're an interspecific 
cross between either

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Vitis labrusca or 
Vitis riparia and

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the typical wine grapes 
of Vitis vinifera.

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Vitis vinifera are 
your Chardonnays,

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your Merlots, and 
your Cabernets.

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Vitis riparia is also 
known as river grapes since

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that's where it 
predominately grows are in

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rivers along the riverbanks.

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Very small berries, small 
clusters, dark juice,

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high acid, very high 
sugar, herbaceous flavor.

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I talk about these 
characteristics because a lot

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of this genetics get 
carried over into our other

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varieties that we're 
trying to grow now.

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These are the type of 
things that we have to

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learn how to handle when we 
try to make these into wine.

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On the other side there's 
labrusca varieties

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which tend to be a little 
bit lower in sugar, but

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they have a very 
specific flavor profile.

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The University of Minnesota 
has relied a lot on

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Vitis riparia for its 
cold climate genetics.

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Whereas, Elmer Swenson, 
who I'll mention again here

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shortly, since he's a Wisconsin 
based grape breeder, he

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used a lot of labrusca based.

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When we think of hybrids we 
think of them in kind of one

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general camp, but there's 
really two sort of separate

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angles that they can take.

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And the challenges that they

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present aren't 
quite all the same.

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So you can see the Vitis 
riparia is grown pretty much

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native throughout 
the Upper Midwest

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and Canada and down 
into even Texas.

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You can see from 
this picture maybe

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just how tiny and scraggly 
those grape clusters are.

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So they're kind of 
hard to deal with.

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Very tiny berries. 
Lots of pigment.

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It takes a lot of picking to get

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any real production 
out of those.

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So, in terms of breeding and 
varieties you might see here

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in the Wisconsin market, 
MarÈchal Foch and LÈon Millot...

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are things that are grown 
quite a bit here in the

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southeastern part of Wisconsin.

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Wollersheim grows 
a lot of these.

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Botham Vineyard grows both 
of these pretty extensively.

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And they've been around 
since 1910 or in the 1910s

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when a French breeder 
named Eugene Kuhlmann

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produced those varieties,

246
00:10:44,600 --> 00:10:46,066
and they've been very 
popular ever since.

247
00:10:46,166 --> 00:10:50,233
They're kind of the basis for 
cold climate wine production.

248
00:10:50,333 --> 00:10:54,666
And in Minnesota and north 
and west of here, they don't

249
00:10:54,766 --> 00:10:56,566
grow as well as they do here.

250
00:10:56,666 --> 00:10:59,833
So other breeders, including 
the University of Minnesota,

251
00:10:59,933 --> 00:11:02,433
have been working on 
trying to improve on those

252
00:11:02,533 --> 00:11:04,266
and create other 
varieties that are better

253
00:11:04,366 --> 00:11:06,400
suited for these climates.

254
00:11:06,500 --> 00:11:07,900
The University of 
Minnesota has been working

255
00:11:08,000 --> 00:11:12,033
on grapes for a very 
long period of time,

256
00:11:12,133 --> 00:11:14,633
started breeding 
roughly in 1905,

257
00:11:14,733 --> 00:11:17,700
and started coming out with 
their first round of grapes

258
00:11:17,800 --> 00:11:21,366
that they released 
in about 1944.

259
00:11:21,466 --> 00:11:23,333
I highlighted Bluebell 
there since that's one

260
00:11:23,433 --> 00:11:26,800
you occasionally do see 
wineries producing in the wine.

261
00:11:26,900 --> 00:11:29,566
I don't know if the other three 
really even exist anymore.

262
00:11:29,666 --> 00:11:32,066
I think they might 
actually be extinct.

263
00:11:32,166 --> 00:11:35,333
But the initial 
emphasis of the program

264
00:11:35,433 --> 00:11:38,600
was on table grapes, 
juice, jelly production.

265
00:11:38,700 --> 00:11:40,733
It wasn't until about 
the '70s or '80s when

266
00:11:40,833 --> 00:11:43,100
they actually shift 
focus and put more energy

267
00:11:43,200 --> 00:11:45,900
and effort into actually 
wine grape production.

268
00:11:46,000 --> 00:11:48,600
Their first wine grape was 
released in '96 called--

269
00:11:48,700 --> 00:11:50,933
which many of you who 
have been to wineries

270
00:11:51,033 --> 00:11:52,700
around the state 
have probably seen.

271
00:11:54,600 --> 00:11:57,000
They're actually hinting that 
they'll release a new variety,

272
00:11:57,100 --> 00:12:00,400
at least when I was still 
working there they hinted at it.

273
00:12:00,500 --> 00:12:02,900
I don't know what the 
current status of that is,

274
00:12:03,000 --> 00:12:04,833
but hopefully they'll 
have that out soon.

275
00:12:04,933 --> 00:12:06,833
On top of the 
university breeders,

276
00:12:06,933 --> 00:12:08,733
there's been a lot 
of private breeders.

277
00:12:08,833 --> 00:12:10,900
There's a lot of people with an

278
00:12:11,000 --> 00:12:13,666
interest in growing 
these varieties.

279
00:12:13,766 --> 00:12:16,266
So way back even in the 1870s,

280
00:12:16,366 --> 00:12:18,666
Lewis Swelter created 
numerous varieties,

281
00:12:18,766 --> 00:12:20,866
but one of his 
biggest ones was Beta,

282
00:12:20,966 --> 00:12:23,333
which would have been 
one of the most popular

283
00:12:23,433 --> 00:12:26,666
varieties grown in the Upper 
Midwest prior to Prohibition

284
00:12:26,766 --> 00:12:29,400
and was actually 
pretty widely grown

285
00:12:29,500 --> 00:12:31,400
in both Minnesota and Iowa.

286
00:12:31,500 --> 00:12:33,600
David MacGregor is 
a private breeder.

287
00:12:33,700 --> 00:12:35,800
He came up with Petite Amie, 
which isn't necessarily

288
00:12:35,900 --> 00:12:38,000
very popular here in Wisconsin,

289
00:12:38,100 --> 00:12:40,666
but you do find some 
of it in Minnesota.

290
00:12:40,766 --> 00:12:43,066
After that, of course, 
is Tom Plocher.

291
00:12:43,166 --> 00:12:47,000
He created the Petite Pearl, 
which is becoming a popular

292
00:12:47,100 --> 00:12:49,233
grape grown, or a very 
interested variety,

293
00:12:49,333 --> 00:12:50,666
here in Wisconsin.

294
00:12:50,766 --> 00:12:52,633
It's a relatively new 
variety so we don't know

295
00:12:52,733 --> 00:12:54,400
a great deal about it.

296
00:12:54,500 --> 00:12:55,833
We got some of those grapes

297
00:12:55,933 --> 00:12:57,966
from the research 
center this year.

298
00:12:58,066 --> 00:13:00,033
So we'll get some new 
information on those.

299
00:13:00,133 --> 00:13:02,400
And he's planning to 
breed at least a couple

300
00:13:02,500 --> 00:13:04,200
new varieties here this year.

301
00:13:04,300 --> 00:13:06,233
One of the other 
major universities

302
00:13:06,333 --> 00:13:08,500
that does grape breeding 
is also New York.

303
00:13:08,600 --> 00:13:12,100
I mention them mostly because 
of varieties like Traminette.

304
00:13:12,200 --> 00:13:14,700
You might see those 
in local wineries.

305
00:13:14,800 --> 00:13:18,666
Traminette is not cold 
hardy enough for Wisconsin,

306
00:13:18,766 --> 00:13:20,633
but they do grow in 
Illinois and Arkansas.

307
00:13:20,733 --> 00:13:22,533
So you occasionally do see them

308
00:13:22,633 --> 00:13:24,433
in tasting rooms 
around Wisconsin.

309
00:13:26,900 --> 00:13:28,933
I can't talk about 
Wisconsin grape

310
00:13:29,033 --> 00:13:30,966
breeding without mentioning 
Elmer Swenson, who many consider

311
00:13:31,066 --> 00:13:32,900
the godfather of grape breeding,

312
00:13:33,000 --> 00:13:35,800
especially the 
Wisconsin supporters.

313
00:13:35,900 --> 00:13:37,133
It should be noted, though,

314
00:13:37,233 --> 00:13:39,300
that he did work for the 
University of Minnesota

315
00:13:39,400 --> 00:13:41,133
for about 10 years, 
and while he was

316
00:13:41,233 --> 00:13:44,366
there they joint 
released two varieties.

317
00:13:44,466 --> 00:13:46,333
Edelweiss, which is a 
common grape variety that

318
00:13:46,433 --> 00:13:49,233
is turned into wine, 
particularly here and Nebraska,

319
00:13:49,333 --> 00:13:51,700
as well as Swenson Red.

320
00:13:51,800 --> 00:13:55,166
And he created a whole slew 
of other grape varieties.

321
00:13:55,266 --> 00:13:59,933
He also produced and released 
St. Pepin, a popular one,

322
00:14:00,033 --> 00:14:02,300
and Brianna around 
here and a few of those

323
00:14:02,400 --> 00:14:04,333
other varieties 
you might see when

324
00:14:04,433 --> 00:14:06,900
you're out and about 
in tasting rooms.

325
00:14:07,900 --> 00:14:11,333
So, what's the general 
differences between 
these varieties?

326
00:14:11,433 --> 00:14:13,233
Well, one is color.

327
00:14:13,333 --> 00:14:15,233
In terms of red 
grapes, the color

328
00:14:15,333 --> 00:14:17,233
intensity and the pigmentation

329
00:14:17,333 --> 00:14:21,566
is very intense compared to, 
say, your average vinifera.

330
00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:25,400
One of the things 
that they have besides

331
00:14:25,500 --> 00:14:28,933
pigment in the skins is 
also their pigmented pulp.

332
00:14:29,033 --> 00:14:32,266
Cabernet and Pinot 
noir have a clear pulp.

333
00:14:32,366 --> 00:14:35,100
Our varieties actually 
have a pigmented pulp.

334
00:14:35,200 --> 00:14:36,566
So when you press 
these things out,

335
00:14:36,666 --> 00:14:38,666
they're actually very dark 
right from the beginning.

336
00:14:38,766 --> 00:14:41,800
And the white grapes, they 
have a bit of a yellow tint,

337
00:14:41,900 --> 00:14:43,666
but they also can brown a bit.

338
00:14:43,766 --> 00:14:47,266
So there's a high 
polyphenol oxidase activity.

339
00:14:47,366 --> 00:14:50,533
If you ever cut open an 
apple or a banana starts

340
00:14:50,633 --> 00:14:54,200
to turn brown, so those 
enzymes also exist in grapes.

341
00:14:54,300 --> 00:14:56,700
The hybrids seem to 
have a lot more of those

342
00:14:56,800 --> 00:14:58,933
then many of the vinifera.

343
00:14:59,033 --> 00:15:00,800
One thing you'll 
definitely notice

344
00:15:00,900 --> 00:15:04,133
if you try cold climate wines is

345
00:15:04,233 --> 00:15:07,066
that they tend to be 
a lot more acidic.

346
00:15:07,166 --> 00:15:09,333
Quite a bit more 
than Vitis vinifera.

347
00:15:09,433 --> 00:15:11,266
Titratable acidity, 
11 grams per liter

348
00:15:11,366 --> 00:15:14,266
to 15 to 17 grams per liter.

349
00:15:14,366 --> 00:15:16,800
A majority of that is 
actually malic acid,

350
00:15:16,900 --> 00:15:19,100
where vinifera is 
typically 50/50.

351
00:15:19,200 --> 00:15:21,433
It's got an even split 
of tartaric to malic,

352
00:15:21,533 --> 00:15:23,966
where some of these 
varieties, like La Crescent,

353
00:15:24,066 --> 00:15:28,266
can be almost 75% malic 
acid, which is important when

354
00:15:28,366 --> 00:15:32,366
we discuss later how we 
manage the acid in the winery.

355
00:15:32,466 --> 00:15:34,466
So just kind of 
a general summary

356
00:15:34,566 --> 00:15:36,833
of some titratable acidities

357
00:15:36,933 --> 00:15:39,866
just to give you an idea 
that Frontenac is roughly two

358
00:15:39,966 --> 00:15:42,966
to three times more acidic than 
your average red table wine.

359
00:15:43,066 --> 00:15:44,966
Sometimes three times as much.

360
00:15:45,066 --> 00:15:47,933
So these are some of 
the challenges that 
we have to embrace

361
00:15:48,033 --> 00:15:51,600
and work with when we're making 
wines from these varieties.

362
00:15:51,700 --> 00:15:53,600
But there are other 
varieties out there,

363
00:15:53,700 --> 00:15:55,266
other styles of wine out there

364
00:15:55,366 --> 00:15:57,466
that could fit those quite well.

365
00:15:57,566 --> 00:15:59,066
So, sparkling wine is 
probably a good use

366
00:15:59,166 --> 00:16:01,600
for some of these varieties.

367
00:16:04,133 --> 00:16:07,933
One other difference is the 
amount of tannin in the variety,

368
00:16:08,033 --> 00:16:09,833
especially red grapes.

369
00:16:09,933 --> 00:16:13,500
Very little tannins 
in the finished wine.

370
00:16:13,600 --> 00:16:15,966
And it's almost 
completely opposite.

371
00:16:16,066 --> 00:16:20,400
So, vinifera have a 
great deal of tannins

372
00:16:20,500 --> 00:16:23,566
and not nearly as much 
anthocyanin content,

373
00:16:23,666 --> 00:16:25,500
where the cold climate 
varieties have a tremendous

374
00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:28,033
amount of anthocyanins 
and not a lot of tannins.

375
00:16:28,133 --> 00:16:30,366
So theirs is kind of reversed.

376
00:16:30,466 --> 00:16:32,700
A lot of people 
would like to see

377
00:16:32,800 --> 00:16:34,166
more tannins in their varieties.

378
00:16:34,266 --> 00:16:35,866
I kind of prefer 
the fact that we

379
00:16:35,966 --> 00:16:37,633
don't have a lot 
of tannin in that.

380
00:16:37,733 --> 00:16:39,900
If we had high 
tannin and high acid,

381
00:16:40,000 --> 00:16:41,800
it'd be a very difficult 
wine to work with,

382
00:16:41,900 --> 00:16:43,966
even more than it already is.

383
00:16:44,066 --> 00:16:47,866
Acid tends to increase 
the perception of tannins,

384
00:16:47,966 --> 00:16:50,066
as well as tannins increasing 
the perception of acid.

385
00:16:50,166 --> 00:16:53,333
So having both of those 
would be a bit challenging.

386
00:16:55,933 --> 00:16:59,500
The sugar content can vary a 
bit depending on the variety,

387
00:16:59,600 --> 00:17:02,200
it's parentage, and 
where it's grown.

388
00:17:02,300 --> 00:17:04,666
One of the challenges I 
had when I was in Minnesota

389
00:17:04,766 --> 00:17:06,700
is that the varieties 
accumulated a lot of sugar.

390
00:17:06,800 --> 00:17:08,666
So it could be a 
very alcoholic wine

391
00:17:08,766 --> 00:17:10,700
or put a lot of stress on these.

392
00:17:10,800 --> 00:17:13,366
Don't seem to have that 
issue down here in Wisconsin,

393
00:17:13,466 --> 00:17:15,633
in this part of 
Wisconsin as much,

394
00:17:15,733 --> 00:17:18,233
but those are some of 
the issues you can have.

395
00:17:18,333 --> 00:17:22,366
The fact that it is lower is 
helpful for different types

396
00:17:22,466 --> 00:17:24,666
and different styles of wines.

397
00:17:24,766 --> 00:17:26,933
And some of the 
other properties,

398
00:17:27,033 --> 00:17:28,366
are just for processing scape.

399
00:17:29,500 --> 00:17:31,466
Some of the difficulties is

400
00:17:31,566 --> 00:17:34,433
some of the labrusca based 
ones have a slip skin.

401
00:17:34,533 --> 00:17:36,433
So it's a very difficult pulp,

402
00:17:36,533 --> 00:17:38,666
and it will just slip 
right out of the skin,

403
00:17:38,766 --> 00:17:41,866
which makes pressing extremely 
difficult for those varieties.

404
00:17:43,166 --> 00:17:46,466
But we're here to talk about 
embracing cold climate wine.

405
00:17:46,566 --> 00:17:49,133
So things that we do 
well, these varieties

406
00:17:49,233 --> 00:17:51,400
are almost all very aromatic.

407
00:17:51,500 --> 00:17:53,133
Very distinct.

408
00:17:53,233 --> 00:17:57,600
Unmistakeable aroma 
profiles for these wines,

409
00:17:57,700 --> 00:17:59,533
which I think is great 
and people need to

410
00:17:59,633 --> 00:18:02,666
kind of embrace that and 
promote that a little more.

411
00:18:02,766 --> 00:18:05,966
And things we can do with 
acidic wine with low tannin

412
00:18:06,066 --> 00:18:08,366
and low sugar content 
is we can make things

413
00:18:08,466 --> 00:18:10,100
like sparkling wine.

414
00:18:10,200 --> 00:18:12,933
It's a perfect option 
for our varieties as is.

415
00:18:13,033 --> 00:18:15,866
As well as things like Rosé.

416
00:18:15,966 --> 00:18:19,366
I mention here and up and 
coming style called Pet Nat,

417
00:18:19,466 --> 00:18:22,466
which is a carbonated 
form of sparkling wine

418
00:18:22,566 --> 00:18:24,533
but not nearly as carbonated.

419
00:18:24,633 --> 00:18:26,800
So what they'll do is 
they'll take wine as

420
00:18:26,900 --> 00:18:29,066
it's nearing fermentation 
and bottle it.

421
00:18:29,166 --> 00:18:31,633
And the residual sugar 
will ferment out,

422
00:18:31,733 --> 00:18:34,600
much like a carbonated 
bottled conditioned beer.

423
00:18:34,700 --> 00:18:37,200
So it's a low 
carbonated dry wine,

424
00:18:37,300 --> 00:18:39,833
which I hear are quite nice.

425
00:18:39,933 --> 00:18:41,166
It's an up and coming trend

426
00:18:41,266 --> 00:18:43,600
I see a lot of it coming 
out of Europe right now.

427
00:18:43,700 --> 00:18:44,933
Dessert wines and ports also

428
00:18:45,033 --> 00:18:47,333
work very well 
with our varieties.

429
00:18:47,433 --> 00:18:49,300
Two of the largest and fastest

430
00:18:49,400 --> 00:18:51,800
growing markets 
in the wine world

431
00:18:51,900 --> 00:18:55,433
are Sauvignon Blanc, which 
typically are dry acidic wines,

432
00:18:55,533 --> 00:18:58,000
as well as Rosés, which 
things like Marquette

433
00:18:58,100 --> 00:19:00,366
and Frontenac can 
make very nice Rosés.

434
00:19:00,466 --> 00:19:03,000
Now we say that 
the Midwest is kind

435
00:19:03,100 --> 00:19:04,800
of like the wild west 
of grape growing.

436
00:19:04,900 --> 00:19:06,266
There are no limits.

437
00:19:06,366 --> 00:19:08,566
There's nothing telling us 
what we can and can't do.

438
00:19:08,666 --> 00:19:10,300
So hopefully some creativity and

439
00:19:10,400 --> 00:19:13,833
adventurous people will come 
out and create some new things.

440
00:19:15,466 --> 00:19:19,200
So some statistics on both 
Sauvignon Blanc and Rosé.

441
00:19:19,300 --> 00:19:20,933
You can see that 
the blended table

442
00:19:21,033 --> 00:19:24,366
market was up 33% last year.

443
00:19:24,466 --> 00:19:27,433
So I think that's a good 
opportunity for wineries here

444
00:19:27,533 --> 00:19:31,300
to take advantage of that, 
as well as to maybe embrace

445
00:19:31,400 --> 00:19:36,400
some of the lesser sweet 
styles, like Sauvignon

446
00:19:36,500 --> 00:19:39,900
Blanc and New Zealand ones, 
which tend to be dry and acidic.

447
00:19:41,200 --> 00:19:44,466
I should note that while the 
blush category is up 33%,

448
00:19:44,566 --> 00:19:48,233
White Zinfandel was actually 
down 7% over the last year.

449
00:19:49,933 --> 00:19:52,366
All that is great, 
but one of the things

450
00:19:52,466 --> 00:19:56,833
I'm here for is to 
talk about quality.

451
00:19:56,933 --> 00:19:59,400
So, quality in Wisconsin wine.

452
00:19:59,500 --> 00:20:03,133
My purpose is to help improve 
the quality of Wisconsin wine,

453
00:20:03,233 --> 00:20:05,700
identifying some of the top 
quality challenges and issues.

454
00:20:05,800 --> 00:20:08,366
So last, when I first got here,

455
00:20:08,466 --> 00:20:11,233
I surveyed all the wineries 
in the state to get an

456
00:20:11,333 --> 00:20:14,066
idea the things they 
thought were the top quality

457
00:20:14,166 --> 00:20:16,633
challenges for the 
state of Wisconsin.

458
00:20:16,733 --> 00:20:20,066
These are the issues 
that they brought up,

459
00:20:20,166 --> 00:20:21,700
and they're the typical 
culprits of almost

460
00:20:21,800 --> 00:20:24,433
any wine production 
area out there.

461
00:20:24,533 --> 00:20:27,366
So, oxidation, 
sulfide production,

462
00:20:27,466 --> 00:20:29,466
volatile acidity, 
quality of fruit.

463
00:20:29,566 --> 00:20:34,700
A little less pressing 
is just wine style,

464
00:20:34,800 --> 00:20:37,000
matching the fruit with the type

465
00:20:37,100 --> 00:20:39,266
of wine or good style of wine,

466
00:20:39,366 --> 00:20:41,900
and just issues of fruit 
growing and wine quality

467
00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:44,500
So not just figuring out how 
to make the grapes survive,

468
00:20:44,600 --> 00:20:46,800
but how to grow the 
grapes in a way that they

469
00:20:46,900 --> 00:20:48,466
can actually 
produce better wine.

470
00:20:48,566 --> 00:20:51,200
So there's like two layers there 
that we're trying to get to,

471
00:20:51,300 --> 00:20:53,900
the first layer and 
then the second layer.

472
00:20:56,033 --> 00:20:58,000
But what is quality mean?

473
00:20:58,100 --> 00:21:01,266
And that's one of the challenges 
of my position is that

474
00:21:01,366 --> 00:21:03,766
quality itself is 
kind of a vague term,

475
00:21:03,866 --> 00:21:07,933
and it varies a lot 
by individual and who 
you're talking to.

476
00:21:08,033 --> 00:21:09,900
So someone in the 
service industry might

477
00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:14,933
talk about complexity, body, 
weight, food and wine pairing.

478
00:21:15,033 --> 00:21:18,366
The Sauvignon Blanc from 
New Zealand tastes like

479
00:21:18,466 --> 00:21:20,366
it should be a Sauvignon 
Blanc from New Zealand,

480
00:21:20,466 --> 00:21:23,433
or if the flavor profile is 
off, integration and harmony

481
00:21:23,533 --> 00:21:24,800
and all these terms that they

482
00:21:24,900 --> 00:21:28,333
like to use for 
their wine quality.

483
00:21:28,433 --> 00:21:32,466
From a producer perspective, 
is it free from faults?

484
00:21:32,566 --> 00:21:34,200
Is it bottle stable?

485
00:21:34,300 --> 00:21:36,866
Did it produce the type of 
wine that I was trying to make?

486
00:21:36,966 --> 00:21:38,800
That might be what producers are

487
00:21:38,900 --> 00:21:42,800
looking for in terms of 
what they define quality.

488
00:21:43,800 --> 00:21:47,166
Here's two drastically 
different types of wine.

489
00:21:47,266 --> 00:21:52,100
Screaming Eagle being a thousand 
dollar-plus per bottle cult

490
00:21:52,200 --> 00:21:54,466
wine out of California 
and Beringer producing

491
00:21:54,566 --> 00:21:56,866
and $8 bottle of White Zin,

492
00:21:56,966 --> 00:22:00,200
When we talk about quality, 
which one has more quality?

493
00:22:00,300 --> 00:22:02,166
Which is a higher quality wine?

494
00:22:02,266 --> 00:22:04,866
Well, it depends on how 
you want to look at it.

495
00:22:04,966 --> 00:22:06,633
You might say the 
Screaming Eagle,

496
00:22:06,733 --> 00:22:08,500
because of its complexities and

497
00:22:08,600 --> 00:22:11,666
where it's from, is 
a high quality wine.

498
00:22:11,766 --> 00:22:15,000
But I could easily say that 
Beringer is a high quality wine

499
00:22:15,100 --> 00:22:19,133
because that wine, I did 
tons of analysis on that wine

500
00:22:19,233 --> 00:22:22,066
so I can tell you 
that a lot of effort

501
00:22:22,166 --> 00:22:23,766
and research goes into 
that wine production.

502
00:22:23,866 --> 00:22:26,100
Very careful about it.

503
00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:28,133
A lot of effort goes into it.

504
00:22:28,233 --> 00:22:31,466
When you got pick up a bottle 
of White Zin from Beringer

505
00:22:31,566 --> 00:22:34,800
off the shelf, one bottle 
could be produced last month,

506
00:22:34,900 --> 00:22:37,833
the other bottle could have 
been bottled six months ago,

507
00:22:37,933 --> 00:22:40,166
they'll be identical 
pretty much.

508
00:22:40,266 --> 00:22:42,733
That's a difficult 
feat to achieve.

509
00:22:42,833 --> 00:22:45,600
That reproducibility that they

510
00:22:45,700 --> 00:22:47,400
have should not be understated.

511
00:22:47,500 --> 00:22:51,133
So it depends on what you 
determine quality to be.

512
00:22:51,233 --> 00:22:54,366
When you start talking 
about wine faults

513
00:22:54,466 --> 00:22:56,733
and things that are bad quality,

514
00:22:56,833 --> 00:22:59,133
it gets to be a bit 
of fine line between

515
00:22:59,233 --> 00:23:02,066
what constitutes complexity 
and what's objectionable

516
00:23:02,166 --> 00:23:05,233
So somebody might 
like a bit of a--

517
00:23:05,333 --> 00:23:06,666
character in their 
wine; someone else might

518
00:23:06,766 --> 00:23:08,733
think it's the worst thing ever.

519
00:23:08,833 --> 00:23:10,600
Where that line 
is drawn is really

520
00:23:10,700 --> 00:23:13,400
dependent upon you 
as an individual.

521
00:23:13,500 --> 00:23:16,233
Your experience with wine. 
How much wine have you drank?

522
00:23:16,333 --> 00:23:17,766
How many different regions have

523
00:23:17,866 --> 00:23:20,233
you drank it from in 
your history with that?

524
00:23:20,333 --> 00:23:22,333
As well as perspective.

525
00:23:22,433 --> 00:23:25,900
The example that I saw 
of perspective is, say,

526
00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:28,900
two individuals smell 
rosemary in a wine.

527
00:23:29,000 --> 00:23:31,200
One person might 
associate that with

528
00:23:31,300 --> 00:23:35,266
a culinary rosemary chicken or 
some other food application,

529
00:23:35,366 --> 00:23:38,566
but another person 
might compare that with

530
00:23:38,666 --> 00:23:41,400
a personal care 
product, like a lotion.

531
00:23:41,500 --> 00:23:43,900
So which would you rather 
have your wine smell like?

532
00:23:44,000 --> 00:23:46,533
So, two people smelling the 
same thing are going to have two

533
00:23:46,633 --> 00:23:50,333
very different ideas on whether 
they like that wine or not.

534
00:23:50,433 --> 00:23:52,033
And then you get 
into physiology,

535
00:23:52,133 --> 00:23:55,233
which is every one of us 
smells wine differently.

536
00:23:55,333 --> 00:23:56,866
What we're sensitive to

537
00:23:56,966 --> 00:23:59,733
and not sensitive to 
is very individual.

538
00:23:59,833 --> 00:24:03,366
So every person's 
experience is unique.

539
00:24:03,466 --> 00:24:06,866
It makes quality kind of 
a challenge to define.

540
00:24:06,966 --> 00:24:12,300
So I refer to Dr. Bisson out 
of UC Davis who defined GRAY,

541
00:24:12,400 --> 00:24:14,966
which is generally 
recognized as yucky.

542
00:24:15,066 --> 00:24:16,400
So these are the 
compounds I focus

543
00:24:16,500 --> 00:24:19,066
on when it comes 
to Wisconsin wine.

544
00:24:19,166 --> 00:24:22,066
As we mentioned before, 
here's a few examples or

545
00:24:22,166 --> 00:24:23,633
some of the common examples

546
00:24:23,733 --> 00:24:26,333
of issues you might 
find in wine and cider.

547
00:24:26,433 --> 00:24:31,433
So, sulfides, oxidation and 
acid aldehyde, cork taint,

548
00:24:31,533 --> 00:24:34,266
which is a compound called 
trichloroanisole, or TCA

549
00:24:34,366 --> 00:24:37,466
if you want to sound hip 
for your next dinner party,

550
00:24:37,566 --> 00:24:39,400
Brettanomyces, 4-ethylphenol,

551
00:24:39,500 --> 00:24:44,433
4-ethylguaiacol, acidic 
acid, ethyl acetate, VA,

552
00:24:44,533 --> 00:24:48,033
and a few other things 
we'll talk about.

553
00:24:48,133 --> 00:24:50,933
I don't know if that is very 
visible from back there,

554
00:24:51,033 --> 00:24:53,366
but sulfides are not a 
very pleasant compound.

555
00:24:53,466 --> 00:24:54,766
They're usually a result of

556
00:24:54,866 --> 00:24:56,966
stressed yeast in 
a fermentation.

557
00:24:57,066 --> 00:25:01,166
They start kicking out, 
start out as rotten

558
00:25:01,266 --> 00:25:04,000
eggs all the way down 
to canned vegetables.

559
00:25:04,100 --> 00:25:06,933
So these are kind of 
some of the initial areas

560
00:25:07,033 --> 00:25:11,366
of some wine flaws that 
you might come across.

561
00:25:11,466 --> 00:25:14,500
Definitely probably 
not acceptable

562
00:25:14,600 --> 00:25:16,733
except in very tiny amounts.

563
00:25:19,933 --> 00:25:24,133
Another area that's a 
problem is oxygen pressure

564
00:25:24,233 --> 00:25:27,300
on the wine during storage as 
well as stress fermentations.

565
00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:31,000
So if the wine is stored in 
an environment that has a lot

566
00:25:31,100 --> 00:25:34,733
of oxygen pressure 
on it, whether it is 
a low grade plastic

567
00:25:34,833 --> 00:25:36,833
tank where the oxygen can 
transmit through the side

568
00:25:36,933 --> 00:25:40,566
or a lot of head space, 
ethanol can be converted

569
00:25:40,666 --> 00:25:43,000
over to acid aldehyde.

570
00:25:43,100 --> 00:25:45,766
Acid aldehyde at low 
levels can give kind of

571
00:25:45,866 --> 00:25:49,600
a fruitier aspect to your wine.

572
00:25:49,700 --> 00:25:52,500
Higher levels start to 
smell like rotten apples.

573
00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:56,633
Further than that I 
get airplane glue,

574
00:25:56,733 --> 00:25:58,266
model airplane glue aroma.

575
00:25:58,366 --> 00:25:59,433
(Laughter)

576
00:25:59,533 --> 00:26:02,766
Nuttiness but generally 
considered a flaw,

577
00:26:02,866 --> 00:26:04,066
unless you're sherry 
where it's expected

578
00:26:04,166 --> 00:26:07,333
and needs to be in 
very high levels.

579
00:26:07,433 --> 00:26:10,333
So wine flaws are 
always in kind of

580
00:26:10,433 --> 00:26:11,666
an interesting area depending

581
00:26:11,766 --> 00:26:13,766
on what you're 
trying to achieve.

582
00:26:13,866 --> 00:26:17,866
This is a common sort of flaw 
that we find in Wisconsin

583
00:26:17,966 --> 00:26:23,066
just because of 
proper application of 
sulfur dioxide as well

584
00:26:23,166 --> 00:26:26,133
as minimizing oxygen 
exposure, which,

585
00:26:26,233 --> 00:26:28,433
as you get on smaller 
and smaller scales

586
00:26:28,533 --> 00:26:30,600
and more surface area, 
tends to be a much bigger

587
00:26:30,700 --> 00:26:33,500
challenge for small 
wineries to maintain.

588
00:26:34,500 --> 00:26:38,866
So TCA is a combination 
of mold and chlorine.

589
00:26:38,966 --> 00:26:41,833
So a little bit of mold 
plus any sort of chlorine

590
00:26:41,933 --> 00:26:46,866
in the environment, most people 
think it's based from cork,

591
00:26:46,966 --> 00:26:49,533
but it could be from 
the winery itself.

592
00:26:49,633 --> 00:26:50,933
If there's any mold and they use

593
00:26:51,033 --> 00:26:52,933
a chlorinated cleaning 
component, you can get winery

594
00:26:53,033 --> 00:26:55,033
borne TCA as well.

595
00:26:56,033 --> 00:26:58,666
Not a very pleasant compound. 
It's super potent.

596
00:26:58,766 --> 00:27:01,100
It's parts per 
trillion sensitivity.

597
00:27:01,200 --> 00:27:03,700
Like as low as five 
parts per trillion

598
00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:06,400
people can start to pick 
up on this compound.

599
00:27:06,500 --> 00:27:09,733
So like one gram in an 
Olympic sized swimming pool

600
00:27:09,833 --> 00:27:11,800
is what we can detect.

601
00:27:11,900 --> 00:27:14,566
Cork is, you can 
see where you might

602
00:27:14,666 --> 00:27:18,166
get a little bit of mold 
or whatever from the cork.

603
00:27:18,266 --> 00:27:20,800
That's an agricultural product.

604
00:27:20,900 --> 00:27:24,300
So, some unpleasant 
compounds from Brettanomyces.

605
00:27:24,400 --> 00:27:26,866
Brettanomyces is 
a spoilage yeast.

606
00:27:26,966 --> 00:27:30,000
It's present in the environment. 
It's on the grapes.

607
00:27:30,100 --> 00:27:34,233
If a winemaker is not in a 
situation where they have

608
00:27:34,333 --> 00:27:36,233
a high pH wine, 
Brettanomyces thrives

609
00:27:36,333 --> 00:27:39,400
well in higher pH environments.

610
00:27:39,500 --> 00:27:41,866
Low pH, they don't 
survive as well.

611
00:27:41,966 --> 00:27:44,633
Sulfides are good 
at maintaining them.

612
00:27:44,733 --> 00:27:47,100
But they can produce, 
and if there's

613
00:27:47,200 --> 00:27:49,600
a lot of residual nitrogen left,

614
00:27:49,700 --> 00:27:51,233
one of the things 
I didn't mention

615
00:27:51,333 --> 00:27:52,933
before was that a 
lot of these hybrids

616
00:27:53,033 --> 00:27:55,400
actually have a lot 
of nitrogen content.

617
00:27:55,500 --> 00:27:57,366
You need a certain 
amount of nitrogen

618
00:27:57,466 --> 00:27:59,566
content to maintain a 
healthy fermentation.

619
00:27:59,666 --> 00:28:01,800
In a lot of cases, depending 
on where it's grown,

620
00:28:01,900 --> 00:28:08,433
I've seen fruit out of 
Iowa have yeast assimilable

621
00:28:08,533 --> 00:28:11,666
nitrogen content, or 
primary nitrogen content

622
00:28:11,766 --> 00:28:14,666
that the yeast use, 
at six to seven times

623
00:28:14,766 --> 00:28:16,600
what the yeast actually needs.

624
00:28:16,700 --> 00:28:19,500
A lot of that gets leftover 
in the final fermentation.

625
00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:21,966
If you're not properly 
maintaining your wine,

626
00:28:22,066 --> 00:28:24,500
it can feed spoilage 
organisms pretty well.

627
00:28:24,600 --> 00:28:26,300
it can feed spoilage 
organisms pretty well.

628
00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:28,166
And then you get some 
pretty awful things.

629
00:28:28,266 --> 00:28:29,866
Unless, of course, 
you like sour beer,

630
00:28:29,966 --> 00:28:31,800
then those are the things 
you're looking for.

631
00:28:31,900 --> 00:28:33,866
It depends in what you're into.

632
00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:39,266
Another concern here in 
Wisconsin and a lot of places

633
00:28:39,366 --> 00:28:41,333
is acidic acid 
and the conversion

634
00:28:41,433 --> 00:28:43,200
of the acidic acid 
to ethyl acetate,

635
00:28:43,300 --> 00:28:46,466
which smells like 
nail polish remover.

636
00:28:49,033 --> 00:28:50,666
Acidic acid,

637
00:28:50,766 --> 00:28:54,200
if you've got a lot of 
oxygen present on your wine

638
00:28:54,300 --> 00:28:56,700
and you're not 
properly sulfiding it, 
then the acetobater

639
00:28:56,800 --> 00:28:59,133
can take over and 
start kicking it out.

640
00:28:59,233 --> 00:29:01,900
Otherwise, stress yeast, 
particularly ice wines,

641
00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:04,433
can get a bit of VA naturally.

642
00:29:04,533 --> 00:29:07,100
It's kind of a natural 
process for that.

643
00:29:08,166 --> 00:29:10,933
This mousiness is typically 
associated with cider.

644
00:29:11,033 --> 00:29:13,500
I kind of bring it up because 
it's an interesting particular

645
00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:18,200
compound because you can't 
smell it at the cider pH.

646
00:29:18,300 --> 00:29:20,933
So until you taste it, 
you won't know it's there.

647
00:29:21,033 --> 00:29:25,166
So it's kind of a horrible 
shock sort of reality.

648
00:29:27,033 --> 00:29:30,066
The pH, and it depends 
on the individual,

649
00:29:30,166 --> 00:29:33,333
so if you're an individual 
who has a higher pH saliva,

650
00:29:33,433 --> 00:29:35,933
it raises the pH of 
the wine or the cider,

651
00:29:36,033 --> 00:29:37,433
and then it becomes 
nice and noticeable

652
00:29:37,533 --> 00:29:39,366
on the finish of your palate.

653
00:29:39,466 --> 00:29:43,733
It's not the greatest way 
to finish a sip of wine.

654
00:29:45,266 --> 00:29:48,000
Some other common things 
are protein formation.

655
00:29:48,100 --> 00:29:52,066
Haze formation due to 
protein instability

656
00:29:52,166 --> 00:29:54,600
due to heating of the wine.

657
00:29:54,700 --> 00:29:57,033
Potassium bitartrate are 
obviously little crystals

658
00:29:57,133 --> 00:29:59,000
you might get if you chill wine.

659
00:29:59,100 --> 00:30:00,800
Wineries still put 
a lot of effort

660
00:30:00,900 --> 00:30:02,666
to remove those from wine.

661
00:30:02,766 --> 00:30:04,133
Apparently consumers still might

662
00:30:04,233 --> 00:30:06,333
mistake them for 
glass particles.

663
00:30:06,433 --> 00:30:08,300
It's a lot of effort to do that.

664
00:30:08,400 --> 00:30:11,166
A lot of energy goes 
into chilling wine down

665
00:30:11,266 --> 00:30:14,466
and getting the potassium 
bitartrate to settle

666
00:30:14,566 --> 00:30:17,333
out of it simply for 
cosmetic reasons.

667
00:30:17,433 --> 00:30:19,833
You do get a little bit of 
acid reduction from that.

668
00:30:19,933 --> 00:30:23,100
So wineries who like to do 
it kind of get a little bit,

669
00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:26,100
take down their 
acidity a little bit.

670
00:30:29,100 --> 00:30:32,200
But, again, depending 
on who you are,

671
00:30:32,300 --> 00:30:34,133
sometimes hazes are good.

672
00:30:34,233 --> 00:30:37,600
A couple of kind of recent,

673
00:30:37,700 --> 00:30:39,733
last five or 10 years, popular

674
00:30:39,833 --> 00:30:41,466
wines is a thing 
called orange wine.

675
00:30:41,566 --> 00:30:44,466
So it's white wine that's 
been fermented on its skins.

676
00:30:44,566 --> 00:30:46,333
Some of it has been fully 
filtered and processed

677
00:30:46,433 --> 00:30:48,500
out to look like a 
clear wine, but some

678
00:30:48,600 --> 00:30:53,266
of it's just left raw, 
hazy, and kind of natural.

679
00:30:53,366 --> 00:30:54,700
So there's a whole 
group of people

680
00:30:54,800 --> 00:30:56,033
that get into that.

681
00:30:56,133 --> 00:30:57,733
I talked about Pet 
Nat a little bit.

682
00:30:57,833 --> 00:30:59,533
So you get a wine 
that has sediment

683
00:30:59,633 --> 00:31:01,166
in it because of 
that refermentation

684
00:31:01,266 --> 00:31:02,833
of the yeast in the bottle.

685
00:31:02,933 --> 00:31:04,800
So the world is kind of 
changing in the world

686
00:31:04,900 --> 00:31:07,033
of wine of what's 
considered acceptable

687
00:31:07,133 --> 00:31:08,866
and unacceptable anymore.

688
00:31:08,966 --> 00:31:11,066
So you can see 
the orange wine on

689
00:31:11,166 --> 00:31:13,366
top there is very cloudy.

690
00:31:13,466 --> 00:31:15,500
That's intentional.

691
00:31:18,700 --> 00:31:21,166
So in terms of 
Wisconsin wine and

692
00:31:21,266 --> 00:31:23,833
whether or not these GRAY 
issues are more common,

693
00:31:23,933 --> 00:31:25,633
it's hard to say.

694
00:31:25,733 --> 00:31:27,666
I've been to wine 
regions all over

695
00:31:27,766 --> 00:31:29,100
the country and the world, and

696
00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:32,133
I've experienced and encountered 
these problems everywhere.

697
00:31:32,233 --> 00:31:36,266
The typical issues obviously 
are experience in both

698
00:31:36,366 --> 00:31:39,633
just recognizing 
what these flaws are

699
00:31:39,733 --> 00:31:42,900
and how to prevent 
them in production.

700
00:31:43,000 --> 00:31:44,300
Expertise.

701
00:31:44,400 --> 00:31:48,200
One of the things 
recognizing that commercial

702
00:31:48,300 --> 00:31:50,133
wine production is 
a much different

703
00:31:50,233 --> 00:31:53,166
animal than home 
wine production,

704
00:31:53,266 --> 00:31:54,566
which can be a 
challenge for some

705
00:31:54,666 --> 00:31:57,066
people to make 
that transition and

706
00:31:57,166 --> 00:31:58,400
realizing there's 
a whole new world

707
00:31:58,500 --> 00:31:59,766
of technology that they have to

708
00:31:59,866 --> 00:32:02,366
learn how to deal 
with to get better

709
00:32:02,466 --> 00:32:05,233
at producing a commercial wine.

710
00:32:06,200 --> 00:32:08,266
A lot of people get into the

711
00:32:08,366 --> 00:32:11,666
winemaking world without 
having a scientific background.

712
00:32:11,766 --> 00:32:15,100
Wine production is a 
very scientific thing.

713
00:32:15,200 --> 00:32:17,766
So you'll get people who 
are close to retirement,

714
00:32:17,866 --> 00:32:20,166
decide they want to open a 
winery, probably haven't had

715
00:32:20,266 --> 00:32:23,666
a chemistry class since 
sophomore year of high school.

716
00:32:23,766 --> 00:32:25,733
It makes things a little 
challenging at times.

717
00:32:25,833 --> 00:32:27,066
It's a very capital intensive

718
00:32:27,166 --> 00:32:29,633
and expensive proposition 
to start a winery.

719
00:32:29,733 --> 00:32:33,033
Having proper equipment 
and laboratory equipment to do

720
00:32:33,133 --> 00:32:37,233
quality wine production 
can be a bit of a challenge.

721
00:32:38,600 --> 00:32:40,400
So, things we do here.

722
00:32:40,500 --> 00:32:42,033
Well, we have 
analytical services.

723
00:32:42,133 --> 00:32:45,133
So we can do some of the 
higher end analysis for you.

724
00:32:45,233 --> 00:32:46,833
I do site visits.

725
00:32:46,933 --> 00:32:48,900
I go out and I 
consult with wineries

726
00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:51,400
and help them work 
through their challenges.

727
00:32:51,500 --> 00:32:54,400
If they wish to contact me and 
work on those, we'll do that.

728
00:32:54,500 --> 00:32:57,200
Otherwise, I hold workshops 
and educational events

729
00:32:57,300 --> 00:32:59,833
where we'll address 
specific winemaking issues.

730
00:32:59,933 --> 00:33:02,566
And then we're working 
on some various cold

731
00:33:02,666 --> 00:33:04,466
climate specific research

732
00:33:04,566 --> 00:33:07,233
to improve the 
quality of the wine,

733
00:33:07,333 --> 00:33:10,666
to understand how we can make 
wine out of these varieties.

734
00:33:10,766 --> 00:33:13,666
So, horticulture has 
probably presented here,

735
00:33:13,766 --> 00:33:16,700
I'm pretty sure at least once 
or twice, but some of the things

736
00:33:16,800 --> 00:33:18,133
they're working on 
is the impact of

737
00:33:18,233 --> 00:33:22,100
fruit shading and sun exposure 
on the quality of fruit.

738
00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:23,566
So they're going 
out and pulling the

739
00:33:23,666 --> 00:33:26,966
leaves off and leaving some 
vines very well shaded,

740
00:33:27,066 --> 00:33:29,066
some vines very well exposed,

741
00:33:29,166 --> 00:33:31,766
and looking at kind 
of the differences of

742
00:33:31,866 --> 00:33:34,500
what the chemistry of 
those varieties are.

743
00:33:34,600 --> 00:33:36,533
They're also looking 
at trellising,

744
00:33:36,633 --> 00:33:38,300
different types of trellises.

745
00:33:38,400 --> 00:33:40,300
Best ways to grow 
various varieties.

746
00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:42,900
One type of trellis 
system might not

747
00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:44,733
work well with one 
variety than another.

748
00:33:44,833 --> 00:33:47,666
They're looking at some pest

749
00:33:47,766 --> 00:33:51,700
management as well as disease 
management options as well.

750
00:33:52,966 --> 00:33:55,766
So on our side over in enology,

751
00:33:55,866 --> 00:33:58,800
it was a pretty 
easy thing to take

752
00:33:58,900 --> 00:34:00,866
the fruit shading 
thing and let's

753
00:34:00,966 --> 00:34:02,500
make some wine out of it

754
00:34:02,600 --> 00:34:04,766
and we can compare 
the flavor of that.

755
00:34:04,866 --> 00:34:07,300
It's hard to say whether 
one is better than the other

756
00:34:07,400 --> 00:34:08,933
based on your 
personal preferences,

757
00:34:09,033 --> 00:34:11,500
but at least we'll be able 
to give these examples

758
00:34:11,600 --> 00:34:13,633
of shading to winemakers 
and they can make decisions

759
00:34:13,733 --> 00:34:15,466
about the style of wine 
they want to choose

760
00:34:15,566 --> 00:34:18,000
based on the results 
that we can give them.

761
00:34:18,100 --> 00:34:20,666
Looking at the impact 
of skin contact

762
00:34:20,766 --> 00:34:22,766
and fermentation temperature.

763
00:34:22,866 --> 00:34:27,800
And then I will hopefully 
focus on the future of wine

764
00:34:27,900 --> 00:34:30,566
and research that I was doing 
at the University of Minnesota,

765
00:34:30,666 --> 00:34:32,566
which was biological acid 
management using yeast

766
00:34:32,666 --> 00:34:36,700
and bacteria to help 
manage acidity in wine

767
00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:39,600
and dealing with that high 
malic acid content we have here.

768
00:34:39,700 --> 00:34:42,600
I guess one of my ultimate 
goals is to identify

769
00:34:42,700 --> 00:34:45,266
the flavor compounds 
in cold climate grapes

770
00:34:45,366 --> 00:34:49,666
and understand how viticulture 
and enology influences those.

771
00:34:49,766 --> 00:34:52,600
So we can give winemakers 
a range of options

772
00:34:52,700 --> 00:34:55,566
on how to make 
their wine based on

773
00:34:55,666 --> 00:34:58,600
how flavor is influenced.

774
00:35:01,000 --> 00:35:05,633
So some of the research 
we're doing right now with

775
00:35:05,733 --> 00:35:08,366
an undergraduate group 
doing their senior project

776
00:35:08,466 --> 00:35:13,500
is actually looking at skin 
temperature and skin contact

777
00:35:13,600 --> 00:35:16,800
and fermentation temperature 
during red wine production.

778
00:35:16,900 --> 00:35:19,600
Traditional red wine 
production, seven to 14 days

779
00:35:19,700 --> 00:35:22,500
of skin contact before 
they press it out.

780
00:35:22,600 --> 00:35:26,333
Warmer temperatures, 75 
to 85 degrees Fahrenheit.

781
00:35:26,433 --> 00:35:29,200
And the goal there is to 
extract as much tannins

782
00:35:29,300 --> 00:35:32,633
and phenols and color and 
flavors from the grapes.

783
00:35:32,733 --> 00:35:34,800
One of the things I 
mentioned earlier is

784
00:35:34,900 --> 00:35:37,066
that we don't have 
a lot of tannins

785
00:35:37,166 --> 00:35:39,066
and we have a lot of color.

786
00:35:39,166 --> 00:35:41,500
It doesn't make 
sense for us to be

787
00:35:41,600 --> 00:35:44,933
using standard vinifera 
practices to be making wine.

788
00:35:47,100 --> 00:35:50,033
So these undergraduates, 
a very ambitious group of

789
00:35:50,133 --> 00:35:52,300
undergraduates that we 
have in the department,

790
00:35:52,400 --> 00:35:54,933
were evaluating the 
color, phenolic content,

791
00:35:55,033 --> 00:35:58,033
and flavor differences 
in two varieties of wine,

792
00:35:58,133 --> 00:36:03,766
Marquette and Frontenac, and 
looking at cool fermented

793
00:36:03,866 --> 00:36:07,533
and ambient temperature 
fermentations

794
00:36:07,633 --> 00:36:09,233
at different skin contact times.

795
00:36:11,366 --> 00:36:13,266
They're still in 
process with that.

796
00:36:13,366 --> 00:36:15,700
Hopefully we'll have those 
results and we can bring it to

797
00:36:15,800 --> 00:36:19,266
Winemakers for their 
annual meeting this winter.

798
00:36:21,633 --> 00:36:25,200
It's going to be impossible 
to read, but there's an arrow

799
00:36:25,300 --> 00:36:27,800
pointing at the skin and then 
there's a long list of things

800
00:36:27,900 --> 00:36:29,233
that we find in the skin.

801
00:36:29,333 --> 00:36:32,466
That's where the 
skin contact research

802
00:36:32,566 --> 00:36:36,733
comes into play here is, 
are all those compounds

803
00:36:36,833 --> 00:36:38,300
in the skins of hybrid varieties

804
00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:40,266
things we actually 
want in the wine?

805
00:36:40,366 --> 00:36:42,333
And is it better to do 
a shorter skin contact

806
00:36:42,433 --> 00:36:45,233
versus a longer skin 
contact fermentation?

807
00:36:50,233 --> 00:36:52,733
We know that from other 
research that exposing

808
00:36:52,833 --> 00:36:54,500
the fruit to more sun 
does lower acidity,

809
00:36:54,600 --> 00:36:57,666
gives it more 
sugar, and increases

810
00:36:57,766 --> 00:36:59,733
the phenolic content

811
00:36:59,833 --> 00:37:02,300
and gives it a different 
flavor profile.

812
00:37:02,400 --> 00:37:05,333
The three varieties 
that we're looking at

813
00:37:05,433 --> 00:37:08,733
for this year are Marquette, 
Frontenac, and Petite Pearl.

814
00:37:09,933 --> 00:37:12,400
Horticulture is examining 
the basic chemistry

815
00:37:12,500 --> 00:37:14,466
of these things throughout 
the growing season.

816
00:37:14,566 --> 00:37:16,800
And we're going to take them, 
we're fermenting them right now,

817
00:37:16,900 --> 00:37:18,300
and we're going to look at

818
00:37:18,400 --> 00:37:20,066
the flavor differences 
and see if there

819
00:37:20,166 --> 00:37:22,933
is a change in the kind 
of hybrid herbaceousness

820
00:37:23,033 --> 00:37:25,466
and vegetable character of 
some of these varieties,

821
00:37:25,566 --> 00:37:27,300
and whether or not 
shading or unshading

822
00:37:27,400 --> 00:37:29,833
is actually a positive 
or negative attribute.

823
00:37:33,033 --> 00:37:35,133
So in terms of tannins, 
Cornell University

824
00:37:35,233 --> 00:37:37,133
is doing a lot of 
research on tannins.

825
00:37:37,233 --> 00:37:39,466
I say there's not a lot of 
tannins in the final wine,

826
00:37:39,566 --> 00:37:41,166
but there's actually a 
fair amount of tannins

827
00:37:41,266 --> 00:37:42,500
in the grapes themselves.

828
00:37:42,600 --> 00:37:44,700
An active area of research 
is trying to figure out

829
00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:47,133
why there's not tannin 
in the final wine.

830
00:37:47,233 --> 00:37:49,866
There are hypotheses, and 
research indicates that

831
00:37:49,966 --> 00:37:54,400
there's a grape solid, a 
grape particle that during

832
00:37:54,500 --> 00:37:56,333
fermentation is binding 
with the tannins

833
00:37:56,433 --> 00:37:58,166
and is causing those 
tannins to settle

834
00:37:58,266 --> 00:37:59,533
out of the fermentation.

835
00:37:59,633 --> 00:38:01,900
They've done research 
where they've added

836
00:38:02,000 --> 00:38:03,966
tannins at the start 
of the fermentation

837
00:38:04,066 --> 00:38:05,866
and measured how much 
tannins were afterward,

838
00:38:05,966 --> 00:38:07,533
and it takes a tremendous

839
00:38:07,633 --> 00:38:09,100
amount of tannins 
to get any result.

840
00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:13,000
So these particles are very 
powerful and very active.

841
00:38:15,166 --> 00:38:19,100
So research that I've done 
quite a bit of back in Minnesota

842
00:38:19,200 --> 00:38:21,666
and will continue to do 
so moving forward here

843
00:38:21,766 --> 00:38:24,200
at the University of 
Wisconsin is looking

844
00:38:24,300 --> 00:38:25,833
at acid management 
because one of the things

845
00:38:25,933 --> 00:38:28,133
that we're having one of 
the biggest challenges

846
00:38:28,233 --> 00:38:30,533
we have are the high 
acidity of these grapes

847
00:38:30,633 --> 00:38:34,500
and grape varieties, 
particularly malic acid.

848
00:38:34,600 --> 00:38:37,433
It's not just so 
much purely sourness

849
00:38:37,533 --> 00:38:38,866
that we got to worry about,

850
00:38:38,966 --> 00:38:41,133
but it's the interaction of 
acid with other compounds.

851
00:38:41,233 --> 00:38:43,400
So the more acid we 
have in there, the more

852
00:38:43,500 --> 00:38:45,000
likely you're 
going to taste some

853
00:38:45,100 --> 00:38:46,700
of the bitterness 
compounds that might

854
00:38:46,800 --> 00:38:49,866
be present and the more 
likely you're going to

855
00:38:49,966 --> 00:38:51,600
have some astringency 
because malic acid

856
00:38:51,700 --> 00:38:54,933
itself has an 
astringent character.

857
00:38:55,033 --> 00:38:57,100
So in terms of what we have

858
00:38:57,200 --> 00:38:59,533
available to us 
to manage acidity,

859
00:38:59,633 --> 00:39:02,200
there's really, once 
it gets to the winery,

860
00:39:02,300 --> 00:39:04,833
there's a couple, a few 
methods we can deal, use.

861
00:39:04,933 --> 00:39:07,200
So there's some 
chemical methods,

862
00:39:07,300 --> 00:39:09,133
and then there's using biology.

863
00:39:10,833 --> 00:39:13,500
So as far as chemical 
deacidification,

864
00:39:13,600 --> 00:39:17,833
we have potassium bicarbonate, 
calcium carbonate or chalk.

865
00:39:17,933 --> 00:39:19,500
Otherwise, you can use water

866
00:39:19,600 --> 00:39:21,733
and try to reduce 
acidity that way,

867
00:39:21,833 --> 00:39:23,233
or add a lower acid.

868
00:39:23,333 --> 00:39:25,100
Grape to it.

869
00:39:25,200 --> 00:39:26,766
In terms of biological 
deacidification,

870
00:39:26,866 --> 00:39:29,500
we have the bacteria in yeast.

871
00:39:31,800 --> 00:39:33,633
So potassium bicarbonate,

872
00:39:33,733 --> 00:39:37,366
calcium carbonate are 
two of the main ones.

873
00:39:39,366 --> 00:39:41,266
The important factor 
to realize there

874
00:39:41,366 --> 00:39:43,933
is that most of those only 
work on tartaric acid.

875
00:39:44,033 --> 00:39:46,366
They won't reduce the 
malic acid content.

876
00:39:46,466 --> 00:39:49,400
So if you have a variety 
of lots of malic acid,

877
00:39:49,500 --> 00:39:53,800
we can't really reduce 
that acid very far.

878
00:39:53,900 --> 00:39:56,300
And it leaves a 
much higher level

879
00:39:56,400 --> 00:39:58,966
of malic acid ratio 
there, which kind of gives

880
00:39:59,066 --> 00:40:01,500
it a more harshness to the wine.

881
00:40:03,000 --> 00:40:06,633
So we're trying to 
use biological methods 
to reduce acidity.

882
00:40:06,733 --> 00:40:09,533
We're looking at yeast 
and bacteria that convert

883
00:40:09,633 --> 00:40:12,400
malic acid to some 
other byproduct.

884
00:40:12,500 --> 00:40:16,200
So, bacteria convert 
malic acid to lactic acid,

885
00:40:16,300 --> 00:40:20,200
and then there's yeast that 
convert malic acid to ethanol.

886
00:40:21,633 --> 00:40:24,433
And we can do that, and 
there are yeast strains

887
00:40:24,533 --> 00:40:27,666
that have been identified 
that do that very well.

888
00:40:27,766 --> 00:40:31,433
There's some nontraditional 
wine strains.

889
00:40:31,533 --> 00:40:34,566
So Saccharomyces is the 
traditional strain we use

890
00:40:34,666 --> 00:40:37,466
for wine production 
and beer production.

891
00:40:37,566 --> 00:40:39,633
But there's a strain 
of yeast called

892
00:40:39,733 --> 00:40:42,200
Schizosaccharomyces pombe,

893
00:40:42,300 --> 00:40:45,333
which does a great 
amount of malic

894
00:40:45,433 --> 00:40:47,733
to ethanol fermentation.

895
00:40:47,833 --> 00:40:50,900
And then research here 
potentially in the genetics

896
00:40:51,000 --> 00:40:53,233
department might identify 
some yeast strains and

897
00:40:53,333 --> 00:40:55,600
produce some yeast 
strains that can do

898
00:40:55,700 --> 00:40:58,500
some biological acid 
management as well.

899
00:40:58,600 --> 00:41:01,000
So there are certain strains 
out there that have been

900
00:41:01,100 --> 00:41:05,633
identified that do some 
level of acid reduction.

901
00:41:06,633 --> 00:41:09,966
71B I've used in the 
past can reduce acidity

902
00:41:10,066 --> 00:41:12,300
by two grams per liter,

903
00:41:12,400 --> 00:41:15,466
which is a significant 
amount of acid reduction.

904
00:41:19,700 --> 00:41:21,066
Then there's 
malolactic fermentation

905
00:41:21,166 --> 00:41:24,000
using malolactic bacteria.

906
00:41:24,100 --> 00:41:27,100
And, besides acid 
reduction, winemakers use

907
00:41:27,200 --> 00:41:29,566
malolactic bacteria for flavor

908
00:41:29,666 --> 00:41:32,033
and style as well as 
microbial stability.

909
00:41:32,133 --> 00:41:36,033
That's just one less thing 
that an organism can utilize

910
00:41:36,133 --> 00:41:38,966
from fermentation once 
it's gotten bottled.

911
00:41:39,066 --> 00:41:41,300
And there's a range 
of organisms out

912
00:41:41,400 --> 00:41:43,133
there capable of 
malolactic fermentation.

913
00:41:43,233 --> 00:41:45,500
Lots of lactic acid bacteria.

914
00:41:45,600 --> 00:41:49,666
A strain that we commercially 
use is Oenococcus.

915
00:41:49,766 --> 00:41:52,266
So malolactic 
fermentation is not

916
00:41:52,366 --> 00:41:54,466
really actually a fermentation.

917
00:41:54,566 --> 00:41:55,766
It's kind of a misnomer.

918
00:41:55,866 --> 00:41:58,466
Most fermentations take 
sugar and convert it

919
00:41:58,566 --> 00:42:01,100
to an acid so it 
actually increases

920
00:42:01,200 --> 00:42:02,766
the acidity of what 
you're trying to do.

921
00:42:02,866 --> 00:42:05,266
So malolactic fermentation is 
actually reducing the acidity,

922
00:42:05,366 --> 00:42:07,600
and it does that using an enzyme

923
00:42:07,700 --> 00:42:10,366
that converts to malic 
acid or lactic acid.

924
00:42:15,400 --> 00:42:18,566
Some other byproducts or 
other compounds there.

925
00:42:18,666 --> 00:42:22,533
It can also begin to chew 
on and use to produce

926
00:42:22,633 --> 00:42:24,266
other compounds.

927
00:42:24,366 --> 00:42:28,833
It can break citric 
acid down into diacetyl

928
00:42:28,933 --> 00:42:32,633
and pyruvate and acidic acid.

929
00:42:32,733 --> 00:42:36,000
I bring up diacetyl 
because it's a compound

930
00:42:36,100 --> 00:42:40,200
that's produced and it 
masks fruity aroma in wine.

931
00:42:40,300 --> 00:42:44,600
So we look at using bacteria 
to manage acidity in wine.

932
00:42:44,700 --> 00:42:46,233
This is a byproduct 
that's a negative aspect.

933
00:42:46,333 --> 00:42:49,833
So how do we manage 
your diacetyl production

934
00:42:49,933 --> 00:42:52,933
and malolactic fermentation 
so that it doesn't decrease

935
00:42:53,033 --> 00:42:54,400
the fruitiness of wine?

936
00:42:54,500 --> 00:42:55,866
Especially if 
you're going to use

937
00:42:55,966 --> 00:42:58,166
it on Rosé or a 
white wine where you

938
00:42:58,266 --> 00:43:01,500
want to enhance fruitiness 
as much as possible.

939
00:43:03,266 --> 00:43:05,166
A couple of formulas.

940
00:43:05,266 --> 00:43:07,566
Always feels to good to 
throw some of those on there.

941
00:43:07,666 --> 00:43:10,066
But, basically, we're converting 
malic acid, lactic acid

942
00:43:10,166 --> 00:43:12,266
just by using the 
enzyme to cleave

943
00:43:12,366 --> 00:43:16,466
off one of the carbon 
groups on the malic acid.

944
00:43:17,533 --> 00:43:20,100
And so the research 
that I look into

945
00:43:20,200 --> 00:43:24,666
then is the timing of 
malolactic bacteria additions.

946
00:43:24,766 --> 00:43:27,466
One of the reasons why 
we look into that is that

947
00:43:27,566 --> 00:43:30,533
we know that yeast 
can convert diacetyl

948
00:43:30,633 --> 00:43:34,566
to another compound that's 
not nearly as strong smelling.

949
00:43:34,666 --> 00:43:39,266
It doesn't have as nice a name 
as diacetyl, 2, 3-butanediol.

950
00:43:42,100 --> 00:43:44,600
It's helpful to know that if

951
00:43:44,700 --> 00:43:49,233
the yeast is present 
we can alter the timing

952
00:43:49,333 --> 00:43:51,900
of malolactic fermentation 
such that we can remove

953
00:43:52,000 --> 00:43:56,566
that diacetyl and be able 
to apply it to fruity wines

954
00:43:56,666 --> 00:43:59,333
that we don't want the 
diacetyl mass character.

955
00:44:02,433 --> 00:44:05,033
The challenge, though, 
is that a lot of people

956
00:44:05,133 --> 00:44:07,566
around here make sweet wines,

957
00:44:07,666 --> 00:44:10,466
and then to prevent 
further fermentation

958
00:44:10,566 --> 00:44:13,300
they'll use the compound 
potassium sorbate.

959
00:44:15,066 --> 00:44:19,666
It inhibits further yeast 
activity in the wine.

960
00:44:19,766 --> 00:44:21,800
The only problem is is that 
they're using that typically

961
00:44:21,900 --> 00:44:23,866
because they don't feel 
confident enough in their

962
00:44:23,966 --> 00:44:26,566
sterile filtration to 
prevent further fermentation

963
00:44:26,666 --> 00:44:28,433
once the wine is bottled.

964
00:44:29,433 --> 00:44:33,733
Consequently, if there is 
a bacterial infection or a

965
00:44:33,833 --> 00:44:37,000
bacterial present with 
wines that have potassium

966
00:44:37,100 --> 00:44:38,700
sorbate, then there's 
a geranium taint

967
00:44:38,800 --> 00:44:40,166
issue that can result.

968
00:44:40,266 --> 00:44:42,166
So they convert that 
sorbic acid into a

969
00:44:42,266 --> 00:44:44,933
compound that smells a 
lot like geranium leaves.

970
00:44:49,966 --> 00:44:52,400
When I was at the 
University of Minnesota,

971
00:44:52,500 --> 00:44:55,966
my graduate research project was 
looking at malolactic bacteria

972
00:44:56,066 --> 00:44:58,866
additions and timing on 
Marquette wine production.

973
00:44:58,966 --> 00:45:02,000
And one of the things I 
found was that it did reduce

974
00:45:02,100 --> 00:45:05,366
the time of malolactic 
fermentation completion.

975
00:45:05,466 --> 00:45:08,166
That's another advantage of 
a co-inoculation strategy,

976
00:45:08,266 --> 00:45:11,833
which is adding bacteria 
within 24 hours after adding

977
00:45:11,933 --> 00:45:14,066
your yeast versus the 
traditional method,

978
00:45:14,166 --> 00:45:16,800
which is to add 
bacteria after alcoholic

979
00:45:16,900 --> 00:45:18,733
fermentation is completed.

980
00:45:18,833 --> 00:45:21,466
The impact, no impact on 
the liking of the wine

981
00:45:21,566 --> 00:45:25,866
and it reduced malolactic 
fermentation overall time.

982
00:45:25,966 --> 00:45:28,300
So, knowing that there's 
all these advantages

983
00:45:28,400 --> 00:45:31,433
to using bacteria, looking 
at how we can apply that

984
00:45:31,533 --> 00:45:33,633
to white and sweet 
wine production

985
00:45:33,733 --> 00:45:37,200
would be great for the 
Wisconsin wine industry.

986
00:45:37,300 --> 00:45:38,900
The other biological method

987
00:45:39,000 --> 00:45:42,566
that's out there is 
Schizosaccharomyces pombe,

988
00:45:42,666 --> 00:45:46,433
which is a commercial 
product under ProMalic.

989
00:45:46,533 --> 00:45:49,100
It's naturally considered 
a spoilage organism.

990
00:45:49,200 --> 00:45:50,933
So what this company did was

991
00:45:51,033 --> 00:45:53,400
encapsulate it in 
an alginate shell.

992
00:45:53,500 --> 00:45:56,266
So we can put them 
into these mesh bags,

993
00:45:56,366 --> 00:45:58,900
add them to the wine.

994
00:45:59,000 --> 00:46:01,566
It starts doing the malo 
to ethanol fermentation,

995
00:46:01,666 --> 00:46:03,066
and then once we're complete or

996
00:46:03,166 --> 00:46:05,833
reached the desired 
level of acid reduction,

997
00:46:05,933 --> 00:46:08,266
we can pull it out and 
hopefully take all that yeast

998
00:46:08,366 --> 00:46:11,466
with us so that it 
doesn't result in some of

999
00:46:11,566 --> 00:46:13,800
the negative sensory 
aspects that people

1000
00:46:13,900 --> 00:46:15,766
believe it can produce.

1001
00:46:17,433 --> 00:46:19,333
I would like to research that

1002
00:46:19,433 --> 00:46:21,233
a bit further and actually look

1003
00:46:21,333 --> 00:46:24,000
at other strains and see if 
there's a way to actually use

1004
00:46:24,100 --> 00:46:25,733
it in its natural form without

1005
00:46:25,833 --> 00:46:27,400
the alginate shell to see if we

1006
00:46:27,500 --> 00:46:32,433
can produce wines that 
have low acid content.

1007
00:46:32,533 --> 00:46:38,366
I've used the ProMalic 
in the past and have had 
some success with it.

1008
00:46:38,466 --> 00:46:42,433
So I've taken La Crescent 
that had a TA, titratable

1009
00:46:42,533 --> 00:46:44,966
acidity probably in 
the 12 to 14 range,

1010
00:46:45,066 --> 00:46:48,066
and had a final product 
about 6.5 grams per liter.

1011
00:46:48,166 --> 00:46:51,333
So it does work, and 
it can work quite well.

1012
00:46:51,433 --> 00:46:53,500
But just a matter of 
what are the fermentation

1013
00:46:53,600 --> 00:46:57,233
conditions that we can 
succeed with that as well as

1014
00:46:57,333 --> 00:47:00,566
minimizing flavors 
and trying to tailor

1015
00:47:00,666 --> 00:47:02,833
that to specific wine styles.

1016
00:47:05,100 --> 00:47:08,400
At one point there was a 
group of researchers out of

1017
00:47:08,500 --> 00:47:12,766
British Columbia who actually 
took both the aspects of

1018
00:47:12,866 --> 00:47:16,133
Oenococcus and S. pombe 
and created a genetically

1019
00:47:16,233 --> 00:47:18,433
modified yeast called MLO1.

1020
00:47:18,533 --> 00:47:20,566
It was on the 
market for a while.

1021
00:47:20,666 --> 00:47:24,500
It got approved by the 
Tobacco, Tax, and Trade Bureau.

1022
00:47:24,600 --> 00:47:26,733
I believe it's still 
potentially out there.

1023
00:47:26,833 --> 00:47:29,733
This was originally sold 
under the Red Star brand,

1024
00:47:29,833 --> 00:47:31,300
which eventually 
got bought out by

1025
00:47:31,400 --> 00:47:33,833
a French company called Linares

1026
00:47:33,933 --> 00:47:36,766
French aren't very happy 
about genetically modified

1027
00:47:36,866 --> 00:47:38,400
creatures so this kind 
of disappeared from

1028
00:47:38,500 --> 00:47:40,766
the market after that merger.

1029
00:47:40,866 --> 00:47:42,500
But it is something 
that was out there

1030
00:47:42,600 --> 00:47:45,000
and was approved by the TTB.

1031
00:47:46,266 --> 00:47:49,233
One of the things that 
we hopefully can develop

1032
00:47:49,333 --> 00:47:52,600
here is that the 
Hittinger Lab upstairs

1033
00:47:52,700 --> 00:47:54,400
has found ways to 
create some novel

1034
00:47:54,500 --> 00:47:56,900
yeast strains under 
a new technology.

1035
00:47:57,000 --> 00:47:59,500
So right now it's being applied 
mainly to beer production

1036
00:47:59,600 --> 00:48:02,166
but could some of these 
yeasts actually enhance

1037
00:48:02,266 --> 00:48:05,366
and produce interesting 
wines and ciders.

1038
00:48:05,466 --> 00:48:07,333
So hopefully we'll be 
able to start researching

1039
00:48:07,433 --> 00:48:09,766
that in the future as well.

1040
00:48:12,266 --> 00:48:14,933
So, embracing the cold 
climate wine production,

1041
00:48:15,033 --> 00:48:18,833
looking at and identifying 
processing techniques

1042
00:48:18,933 --> 00:48:20,866
that influence flavor, 
managing acidity,

1043
00:48:20,966 --> 00:48:23,700
coming up with some 
new yeast strains.

1044
00:48:23,800 --> 00:48:26,466
And I like to say there's a 
lot of room for experimentation

1045
00:48:26,566 --> 00:48:28,666
and creativity in this industry.

1046
00:48:28,766 --> 00:48:30,466
Canada, for example, 
some researchers

1047
00:48:30,566 --> 00:48:33,600
up there are looking 
at grape drying.

1048
00:48:33,700 --> 00:48:36,500
The Amarone raisin 
style wine production.

1049
00:48:36,600 --> 00:48:38,966
Instead of just taking 
grapes and putting them

1050
00:48:39,066 --> 00:48:42,066
into the attic of a barn and 
blowing air through them,

1051
00:48:42,166 --> 00:48:44,700
they've looked at a wide 
range of doing that,

1052
00:48:44,800 --> 00:48:46,833
including using retired tobacco

1053
00:48:46,933 --> 00:48:50,500
dryers to rapidly dry 
down grapes and create

1054
00:48:50,600 --> 00:48:52,600
different types of 
wines and take advantage

1055
00:48:52,700 --> 00:48:56,633
of the properties that those 
grapes have available to them.

1056
00:48:56,733 --> 00:48:59,933
So there's 
opportunities out there,

1057
00:49:00,033 --> 00:49:02,000
and there's not restrictions.

1058
00:49:02,100 --> 00:49:04,066
Not Europe where 
you have to grow

1059
00:49:04,166 --> 00:49:05,366
your grapes a certain way,

1060
00:49:05,466 --> 00:49:06,733
produce your wines 
a certain way.

1061
00:49:06,833 --> 00:49:09,366
There's all sorts of 
options and opportunities.

1062
00:49:09,466 --> 00:49:12,466
So, if you're, I guess, 
an adventurous sort,

1063
00:49:12,566 --> 00:49:15,433
growing grapes and wine 
and making wine here in

1064
00:49:15,533 --> 00:49:18,666
Wisconsin is kind of 
a great place to be.

1065
00:49:18,766 --> 00:49:21,333
And with that, I thank 
you all for coming.

1066
00:49:21,433 --> 00:49:23,133
There's my contact information,

1067
00:49:23,233 --> 00:49:26,966
if you have any other questions 
about making wine in Wisconsin.

1068
00:49:27,066 --> 00:49:29,066
(Applause)