WEBVTT

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- Today we are pleased to
introduce Dr. Patrick Steele

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as part of the Wisconsin
Historical Museum's

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<i>History Sandwiched In
lecture series.</i>

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The opinions expressed today
are those of the presenter,

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and are not necessarily
those of the

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Wisconsin Historical Society
or the museum's employees.

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(laughter)

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Patrick W. Steele is
an associate professor

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of history at Concordia
University Wisconsin.

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He earned his B.A.
and M.A. in history

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at the University of
Wisconsin-Milwaukee.

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He attended Marquette
University where he earned

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his Ph.D. in modern
American history.

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Before arriving at
Concordia, he taught at the

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University of
Wisconsin-Fox Valley,

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the University of
Wisconsin-Fond du Lac

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and Wisconsin Luther College.

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Here today to discuss
how and why Milwaukee

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lost its beloved
Braves to Atlanta,

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please join me in
welcoming Patrick Steele.

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(applause)

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- Thank you, thank you.

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It's a pleasure being
here, thank you very much.

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It's great to see
the attendance.

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I wish I had room in
here for everybody.

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Hopefully you can see the
slides from wherever you are,

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but thank you very much
from the bottom of my heart.

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It's always nice when
I go out and talk

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to see a lot of people out here.

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And, kind of the focus today,
with the book coming out,

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I really wanted to talk
about the fan base,

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because every time I come,
I meet people that talk

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about their memories of being
there, seeing the Braves play,

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the connection they
had, getting a chance

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to meet the players, and
the sadness that they had

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when the team left, and
I think for me that's

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one of the reasons why I
wanted to write the book.

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Not having lived through it,
they left before I was born,

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I think that maybe there's
a little bit of objectivity

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in looking back
from my perspective.

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And it really may be, it is an
attempt to tell the story why

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so that fans who grew up
with the team will maybe

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understand a little
bit, ultimately

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why the team is no longer here.

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So we're going to talk a
little bit about the fan base,

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talk about Milwaukee
in particular,
southeastern Wisconsin.

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Wisconsin and
Milwaukee had long time

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success in minor
league baseball.

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In fact the American
Association Milwaukee Brewers

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won the Little World Series
both in 1951 and 1952.

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They were part of the
overall Braves organization.

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They played down at
little Borchert Field,

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and if you're familiar
with Bob Buege's book,

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Bob wrote the foreword for
mine, he also wrote a book
on Borchert Field.

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I highly encourage you to take a
look at it, it's a great read.

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But the Brewers were
very successful,

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and without the Brewers,
and the success they had

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at Borchert Field, there
never would have been

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pressure to
ultimately try and do

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something bigger as
far as a stadium.

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And I talk about it a
little bit in my book,

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but the whole idea of
building a municipal stadium

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was kind of a foreign concept,
and it really was a stretch,

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and maybe a little bit
visionary by Milwaukee County

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ultimately to do this,
to build a stadium

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ostensibly for a
minor league team,

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but the reality was
they were hoping

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to garner a major league team.

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If Major League
Baseball ever expanded,

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or if, for the first
time in decades,

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a team made the
decision to move.

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The first team they
really set their eyes on,

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and people are always
shocked about this,

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was the St. Louis Cardinals.

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The Cardinals were
under an ownership group

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that got into a
little bit of trouble,

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and Major League Baseball, in
particular the National League,

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was forcing their owner
out, and Fred Miller,

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the president of
Miller Brewing Company,

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made a strong effort to try and

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get the St. Louis
Cardinals to come here.

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When Augie Busch figured
out that Fred Miller,

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one of his rivals, was
attempting to buy the team,

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the Busch family did buy
into the Cardinals ownership

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that they still
retain to this day.

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And so that never happened,
and that pretty much

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could have been the story,
except for this gentleman here.

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Some of you know who
he is by picture,

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others maybe by reputation.

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This of course is the
world famous Bill Veeck.

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Now Veeck was the owner of
the minor league Brewers

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for a period of
time in the 1940s.

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He's the son of the president
of the Chicago Cubs,

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and really was the innovator.

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Some may argue is the
Clown Prince of Baseball.

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I don't know if he
was that, maybe he was

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simply the Clown
Prince of Promoting,

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but certainly this guy
always never seemed to have

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two nickels to his own
name, but managed to buy

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into multiple major league
franchises at one point.

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Well, he owned the
Brewers, like I said.

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Sold them when he came
out of World War II

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because he wanted to
buy a major league team.

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He was lucky enough to
buy the Cleveland Indians

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right as they were peaking.

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He was the president
of their club when they

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played the Boston
Braves in 1948.

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Sold the team
shortly thereafter.

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He ultimately put
another ownership group

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to buy the St. Louis Browns.

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Now the St. Louis Browns have
a strong Milwaukee connection.

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Some of you are
familiar with this.

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The Browns were originally the

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major league Milwaukee Brewers.

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In the American League in 1901,
one of the charter members.

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Well, Veeck bought the team,
he bought Sportsman Park

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where they played
down in St. Louis,

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realized that even
though the Cardinals

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were renting Sportsman
Park from him,

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they were not making enough
revenue in there as the Browns,

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and needed to go somewhere else.

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Milwaukee was scheduled
to open up a new stadium.

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There was a possibility that
maybe they could go there.

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Now before he was able
to buy the Browns,

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he was competing for that
with this gentleman here.

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This is Fred Miller.

05:24.400 --> 05:27.000 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
Fred Miller is the
president of Miller Brewing,

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grandson of the founder.

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He is probably
the most prominent

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Wisconsin sports official
that we have had.

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He's in the College
Football Hall of Fame,

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played for Knute
Rockne at Notre Dame,

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he was on the Packers
board of directors,

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was instrumental in
bringing Miller Brewing

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as a major sponsor to the NFL
saving the franchise up there.

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He was also instrumental
in building County Stadium,

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building the Milwaukee Arena,
have a strong influence

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on all three of the
major professional sports

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that play in Wisconsin
today, the NBA,

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Major League
Baseball, and the NFL.

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Fred Miller was
also part of a group

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trying to buy the
St. Louis Cardinals,

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or excuse me, the
St. Louis Browns.

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And he got undercut a
little bit by Bill Veeck,

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and he and Veeck
had been friends,

06:14.800 --> 06:17.100 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
because Miller had sponsored
the minor league Brewers

06:17.200 --> 06:19.833 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
for several years, so they
had a strong connection there.

06:19.933 --> 06:23.366 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
And I don't know if Miller
ever got over the fact that

06:23.466 --> 06:25.433 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
Bill Veeck bought the team
out from underneath him,

06:25.533 --> 06:28.133 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
because I think that Miller
really wanted to buy the team,

06:28.233 --> 06:30.200 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
bring it here, and he
was so dedicated to

06:30.300 --> 06:33.000 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
southeastern Wisconsin,
that had he done that,

06:33.100 --> 06:34.466 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
we probably still
would be the home

06:34.566 --> 06:36.466 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
of the major league Brewers,
but they would have been

06:36.566 --> 06:40.166 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
part of that original franchise
that's now playing in Baltimore.

06:40.266 --> 06:42.933 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
So Miller is behind the
scenes really pushing to get

06:43.033 --> 06:49.533 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
either St. Louis Browns,
Cardinals, or eventually

06:49.633 --> 06:51.966 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
the Boston Braves
potentially to come.

06:52.066 --> 06:54.000 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
And what would bring
a team to Milwaukee?

06:54.100 --> 06:56.900 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
And that's what I want to
talk about a little bit.

06:57.000 --> 06:59.233 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
This is one of the
original postcards,

06:59.333 --> 07:00.833 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
Milwaukee County Stadium.

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As I look around here,
I'm pretty sure everybody

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in here maybe went to a
game at County Stadium

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or certainly saw a game.

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Nobody here would ever
argue that County Stadium

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was a destination spot.
(laughter)

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I have always said
it looked like it was

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designed by East
German architects

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and built by a Soviet
engineering firm.

07:20.400 --> 07:22.266 align:left position:37.5%,start line:89% size:52.5%
(laughter)

07:22.366 --> 07:26.033 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
But it fit the bill
for what was ostensibly

07:26.133 --> 07:27.500 align:left position:12.5%,start line:89% size:77.5%
to be a minor league ballpark.

07:27.600 --> 07:30.166 align:left position:32.5%,start line:83% size:57.5%
You can see the
original design for it

07:30.266 --> 07:33.866 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
was to be wide open on the
sides, particular here.

07:33.966 --> 07:36.500 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
And this would give
view to the veterans

07:36.600 --> 07:38.666 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
up on what they called
the old Soldiers Home.

07:38.766 --> 07:41.400 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
It's part of the VA
facility now in Milwaukee,

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but they actually had
grandstands built out there

07:44.533 --> 07:46.300 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
where the veterans
could go out, sit there,

07:46.400 --> 07:47.766 align:left position:15%,start line:89% size:75%
and they could watch a game.

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It was part of the
deal to actually

07:49.366 --> 07:50.966 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
get the ground to put
County Stadium up,

07:51.066 --> 07:54.300 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
because originally
that was federal land.

07:54.400 --> 07:58.166 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
So it did take an Act of
Congress to get this built.

07:59.166 --> 08:02.866 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
One of my favorite
photographs of the stadium

08:02.966 --> 08:04.700 align:left position:22.5%,start line:89% size:67.5%
is this one right here.

08:04.800 --> 08:07.600 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
This one's probably
from about '54, '55.

08:07.700 --> 08:09.566 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
It's got the bunting
on from opening day.

08:09.666 --> 08:12.000 align:left position:15%,start line:89% size:75%
It's got the teepees on there

08:12.100 --> 08:14.766 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
to really kind of
showcase what it was.

08:14.866 --> 08:17.366 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
For people of my generation
that grew up with the Brewers,

08:17.466 --> 08:19.700 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
it's a little bit unusual
not to see in bolden letters

08:19.800 --> 08:22.066 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
on the side Milwaukee
County Stadium,

08:22.166 --> 08:24.666 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
but this of course is before
some of the major renovations

08:24.766 --> 08:27.100 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
that went into the
ballpark to actually come.

08:27.200 --> 08:30.800 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
Now, when Lou Perini
makes the decision

08:30.900 --> 08:32.766 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
to bring the team
here, and there's a

08:32.866 --> 08:37.566 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
long story behind that, I'll
keep it short, in theory.

08:38.766 --> 08:41.666 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
People ask me, and
it's in the book, but

08:41.766 --> 08:44.366 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
"Why did the Boston
Braves leave?"

08:44.466 --> 08:45.933 align:left position:12.5%,start line:89% size:77.5%
And the answer's really simple.

08:46.033 --> 08:49.400 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
They drew 280,000, just
barely more than 280,000

08:49.500 --> 08:51.400 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
for the entire 1952 season.

08:52.400 --> 08:54.733 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
Now even though Perini
owned his own stadium,

08:54.833 --> 08:56.633 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
he owned Braves Field,
there was limited parking

08:56.733 --> 08:59.800 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
around the facility, they
were clearly a second tier

08:59.900 --> 09:02.333 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
team in compare to
the Boston Red Sox,

09:02.433 --> 09:07.066 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
but Lou Perini, like Fred
Miller, was a local guy.

09:07.166 --> 09:10.600 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
He was a Boston guy, he
was a New England guy

09:10.700 --> 09:12.633 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
through and through, he
wanted to save the team.

09:12.733 --> 09:15.600 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
He ultimately believed
if he had one more year,

09:15.700 --> 09:19.166 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
if he had 1953, he could have
saved the team in Boston.

09:20.500 --> 09:23.600 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
And there is a possibility,
because what he knew

09:23.700 --> 09:25.733 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
was what became
evident on the field.

09:25.833 --> 09:27.900 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
The team was really good.

09:28.000 --> 09:30.300 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
It was on the verge of
becoming really good.

09:30.400 --> 09:32.166 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
And there were a few
players matriculating

09:32.266 --> 09:34.633 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
yet through the
minor league system.

09:34.733 --> 09:38.000 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
If he could just get them
into Boston before they left,
he might have saved it.

09:38.100 --> 09:40.366 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
Unfortunately for him
and the fans of Boston,

09:40.466 --> 09:42.600 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
that would not happen
because Bill Veeck

09:42.700 --> 09:45.900 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
wants to move his St. Louis
Browns to Milwaukee,

09:46.000 --> 09:47.466 align:left position:10%,start line:5% size:80%
and he's looking at the stadium.

09:47.566 --> 09:50.800 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
Now, take a look at
a photograph here

09:50.900 --> 09:52.900 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
to kind of explain this.

09:53.000 --> 09:55.666 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
Well, this is a picture
here, and this is what was
appealing about it.

09:55.766 --> 09:58.666 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
This is shortly before the
stadium actually opened.

09:58.766 --> 10:01.200 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
If you look very carefully
in the seating bowl

10:01.300 --> 10:03.866 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
down here in the bottom,
there's no seats installed yet.

10:03.966 --> 10:06.533 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
A lot of this would be
temporary seats, fold-up seats

10:06.633 --> 10:09.200 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
that they would have for
the first season at least,

10:09.300 --> 10:11.666 align:left position:12.5%,start line:89% size:77.5%
in some places going into '54.

10:13.000 --> 10:16.033 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
Portions of the scoreboard
out in right field

10:16.133 --> 10:18.466 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
were parts that were
eventually brought in

10:18.566 --> 10:21.133 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
from the old Braves
Field in Boston.

10:21.233 --> 10:24.333 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
They moved some of the parts
here, including the organ.

10:24.433 --> 10:26.733 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
But you can look at the
stadium and you can see that

10:26.833 --> 10:29.966 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
in our vision, if you've
been there towards the end,

10:30.066 --> 10:31.833 align:left position:17.5%,start line:89% size:72.5%
this doesn't look like it.

10:31.933 --> 10:35.533 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
One of the things that Lou
Perini did in his agreement

10:35.633 --> 10:37.333 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
with the Milwaukee
County Board was,

10:37.433 --> 10:42.066 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
"If I bring my team, you need
to put some improvements in."

10:42.166 --> 10:44.566 align:left position:27.5%,start line:77% size:62.5%
Now this is a brand
new ballpark, hadn't
even opened yet,

10:44.666 --> 10:47.766 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
and he put in a request
for up to $2 million,

10:47.866 --> 10:50.566 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
which in 1953 was
substantive money,

10:50.666 --> 10:55.033 align:left position:10%,start line:5% size:80%
but he wanted improved lighting,
improved office facilities,

10:55.133 --> 10:57.900 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
the Braves would take up
much more headquarters space

10:58.000 --> 11:00.133 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
in County Stadium than the
minor league Brewers would,

11:00.233 --> 11:02.700 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
had a bigger staff, scouting,
all this other stuff,

11:02.800 --> 11:06.066 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
had to be addressed
within the stadium before
he agreed to do it.

11:06.166 --> 11:08.533 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
Fred Miller working behind
the scenes helps the County

11:08.633 --> 11:10.866 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
to go along with this,
and ultimately the Braves

11:10.966 --> 11:13.133 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
will make the decision in March

11:13.233 --> 11:16.000 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
to come to Milwaukee
and give it a shot.

11:16.100 --> 11:18.700 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
And they were greeted by
an overwhelming fan base.

11:18.800 --> 11:20.300 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
And again, some of these
pictures, I realize,

11:20.400 --> 11:22.900 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
focus specifically
on the stadium,

11:23.000 --> 11:25.900 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
but that's where
the fans go, right?

11:26.000 --> 11:28.000 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
That's the place
where you go to meet.

11:28.100 --> 11:30.866 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
Now, the photograph I
have up next is also
one of my favorites.

11:30.966 --> 11:32.566 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
This is taken much much later.

11:32.666 --> 11:35.600 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
This is actually taken just
before Miller Park was built.

11:35.700 --> 11:38.066 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
You can see by this photograph,
and the reason I love it

11:38.166 --> 11:40.266 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
is if you look at the
roof line of the stadium

11:40.366 --> 11:42.800 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
you can see the areas
that they added on.

11:42.900 --> 11:46.233 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
This was all done during
the Braves tenure.

11:46.333 --> 11:49.166 align:left position:32.5%,start line:83% size:57.5%
Part of it was
because in '53 and '54

11:49.266 --> 11:51.533 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
it was so hard to get seats
for the fans that wanted

11:51.633 --> 11:54.833 align:left position:12.5%,start line:83% size:77.5%
to come up that they needed to
keep expanding the facility.

11:54.933 --> 11:56.466 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
So it turned out
to be much bigger

11:56.566 --> 11:58.200 align:left position:17.5%,start line:89% size:72.5%
than they ever anticipated.

11:58.300 --> 12:00.100 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
Now if you remember
my story that I told

12:00.200 --> 12:01.833 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
in the beginning about
having the opening

12:01.933 --> 12:04.300 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
to the side so the
veterans up on the hill,

12:04.400 --> 12:06.933 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
well this blocked
off their view.

12:07.033 --> 12:08.700 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
So what the team
would offer then,

12:08.800 --> 12:11.933 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
is seats inside the
stadium at a reduced cost,

12:12.033 --> 12:14.133 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
and they would set a
block aside every game

12:14.233 --> 12:17.633 align:left position:10%,start line:83% size:80%
and if within 24 hours, if those
tickets were still available,

12:17.733 --> 12:20.666 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
then they would turn around
and sell those to the fans.

12:20.766 --> 12:22.566 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
What you can also see
in this photograph, too,

12:22.666 --> 12:29.600 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
is the fully-developed
bleacher areas in the outfield.

12:29.700 --> 12:32.133 align:left position:12.5%,start line:83% size:77.5%
That would not come until very
late in the Braves tenure.

12:32.233 --> 12:35.900 align:left position:12.5%,start line:83% size:77.5%
Prior to that it was gravel and
temporary seating out there,

12:36.000 --> 12:37.533 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
and it was not very
conducive to fans

12:37.633 --> 12:39.166 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
that had to sit out
in the bleachers,

12:39.266 --> 12:41.266 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
particularly women
wearing high heeled shoes

12:41.366 --> 12:42.833 align:left position:32.5%,start line:83% size:57.5%
had a hard time
walking through there

12:42.933 --> 12:45.166 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
because it was simply
gravel underneath,

12:45.266 --> 12:48.333 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
it would attract
flies and mosquitoes.

12:48.433 --> 12:49.933 align:left position:35%,start line:83% size:55%
It was not a
particularly nice place

12:50.033 --> 12:52.933 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
to go catch a game
on a nice humid day,

12:53.033 --> 12:54.933 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
so eventually they would
put asphalt underneath

12:55.033 --> 12:56.700 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
and they put the nice
bleachers up there.

12:56.800 --> 12:58.666 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
But, again, this
is much much bigger

12:58.766 --> 13:01.300 align:left position:12.5%,start line:83% size:77.5%
than the County ever envisioned
that they would have.

13:01.400 --> 13:03.233 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
And the seating
capacity was much bigger

13:03.333 --> 13:05.233 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
than they had ever
expected, and part of it was

13:05.333 --> 13:08.366 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
because of all of the
fans that showed up.

13:08.466 --> 13:12.000 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
Now, from this photograph,
we'll take a look at this one.

13:12.100 --> 13:14.566 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
This is actually
taken from 1953.

13:14.666 --> 13:19.300 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
This is within the first summer
of baseball being played there.

13:19.400 --> 13:22.100 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
You can see the temporary
seating in the outfield,

13:22.200 --> 13:23.533 align:left position:15%,start line:89% size:75%
a lot of people sitting down.

13:23.633 --> 13:26.133 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
There's a clear cyclone
fence that kind of

13:26.233 --> 13:28.200 align:left position:10%,start line:89% size:80%
runs the perimeter of the field.

13:28.300 --> 13:30.933 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
But the neat part is,
as you look around,

13:31.033 --> 13:37.133 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
all the sections are filled,
and this was fairly common.

13:37.233 --> 13:39.233 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
Now part of it was
because the excitement

13:39.333 --> 13:42.400 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
of actually having
major league baseball.

13:42.500 --> 13:45.233 align:left position:12.5%,start line:83% size:77.5%
And one of the things I'll talk
about as the presentation goes,

13:45.333 --> 13:48.100 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
is the whole idea
of fan retention.

13:48.200 --> 13:52.100 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
That bringing fans in is
part of the experience.

13:52.200 --> 13:56.000 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
My wife and I went to
the Brewers-Braves series

13:56.100 --> 13:59.600 align:left position:22.5%,start line:77% size:67.5%
over the weekend, and I
try to go every year the
Braves come to town.

13:59.700 --> 14:01.800 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
I always take my mom because
she likes to boo them,

14:01.900 --> 14:04.500 align:left position:12.5%,start line:83% size:77.5%
so as long as the Brewers have
been in the National League

14:04.600 --> 14:08.800 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
I take my mom out there so
she has her chance to do that.

14:08.900 --> 14:11.366 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
But just walking the ballpark,
my wife and I were talking,

14:11.466 --> 14:13.166 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
and when our kids were
little, when we used to

14:13.266 --> 14:15.033 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
take them to County Stadium,
there was nothing really

14:15.133 --> 14:17.966 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
for kids to do, because you
went there to watch baseball.

14:18.066 --> 14:21.166 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
You didn't go there to play
on slides and swings, right?

14:21.266 --> 14:23.766 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
You didn't go there to go
throw a simulated ball.

14:23.866 --> 14:26.333 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
You went there to
see a baseball game.

14:26.433 --> 14:28.700 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
So the dynamics of the
way we view games now

14:28.800 --> 14:30.900 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
and fan retention,
things that they do

14:31.000 --> 14:32.833 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
to keep fans at the ball park,

14:32.933 --> 14:36.600 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
is much different now than it
used to be back in the day.

14:36.700 --> 14:39.100 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
But you can see here,
full stands mean

14:39.200 --> 14:41.433 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
full concession sales, all
kinds of other things going on,

14:41.533 --> 14:43.733 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
and it was a great
time to be a Braves fan

14:43.833 --> 14:47.566 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
because the team moves,
and they got good.

14:47.666 --> 14:50.000 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
And they were, of all the
teams that are going to move,

14:50.100 --> 14:54.833 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
and I'll show you this in
some slides I have a little
bit down the road,

14:54.933 --> 14:57.300 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
they'll move and they got good.

14:57.400 --> 14:59.800 align:left position:35%,start line:5% size:55%
That was the
exception to the rule.

14:59.900 --> 15:02.800 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
Because almost every other
team that moved with the
exception of the Braves

15:02.900 --> 15:05.400 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
and in theory the
Los Angeles Dodgers,

15:05.500 --> 15:07.666 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
every other team that moved
was a second-tier team

15:07.766 --> 15:10.666 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
that was not particularly good
and not really competitive.

15:10.766 --> 15:14.333 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
And certainly that
bears out when you look
at attendance factors.

15:14.433 --> 15:16.300 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
One other photograph I'm
going to show you here

15:16.400 --> 15:18.133 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
about a stadium,
and you can tell I'm

15:18.233 --> 15:20.700 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
very fascinated
by County Stadium,

15:20.800 --> 15:24.400 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
is an overhead
shot taken in 1959.

15:24.500 --> 15:26.400 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
And again you can see
that there is more

15:26.500 --> 15:29.666 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
of the temporary bleacher
buildup in the outfield.

15:29.766 --> 15:33.833 align:left position:25%,start line:77% size:65%
It's not complete, if
you look very carefully,
from the left field

15:33.933 --> 15:36.566 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
foul line over to center
field, you can see

15:36.666 --> 15:38.800 align:left position:32.5%,start line:83% size:57.5%
what looks like
a pasture almost.

15:38.900 --> 15:41.200 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
That was from the temporary
seating that they put up there

15:41.300 --> 15:43.733 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
during the previous
fall for Packer games.

15:44.800 --> 15:48.533 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
So it's one of the things
obviously that we lost

15:48.633 --> 15:51.600 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
when the Brewers made the
decision to move to Miller Park,

15:51.700 --> 15:54.300 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
and the decision was made
to eliminate County Stadium.

15:54.400 --> 15:56.433 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
Obviously we lost the
ability to host Packer games

15:56.533 --> 15:59.200 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
down in Milwaukee, but
certainly the Packers

15:59.300 --> 16:01.800 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
have accommodated Packers
fans from the area

16:01.900 --> 16:03.800 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
by offering tickets up
there, but prior to that

16:03.900 --> 16:06.166 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
when the stadium was built,
that was one of the other deals

16:06.266 --> 16:08.833 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
to help get the taxpayers
in the county to help do it.

16:08.933 --> 16:10.800 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
The Packers were
playing some games,

16:10.900 --> 16:13.533 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
they played some out at,
originally at Borchert Field,

16:13.633 --> 16:16.433 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
they played some out at
State Fair Park, kind of
played all over the place.

16:16.533 --> 16:19.666 align:left position:10%,start line:5% size:80%
County Stadium was not a perfect
place to see an NFL game,

16:19.766 --> 16:22.833 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
but, boy, in the 1950s and
1960s, if you got a ticket

16:22.933 --> 16:25.033 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
out at County Stadium to
see those Packer teams play,

16:25.133 --> 16:27.933 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
I don't think you're
complaining too much, right?

16:28.033 --> 16:30.500 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
The other thing I want
to point out, too,

16:30.600 --> 16:33.000 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
is the expansive parking lots.

16:33.100 --> 16:35.500 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
And this is one of the
reasons that made Milwaukee

16:35.600 --> 16:37.533 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
attractive, it's also going
to be one of the reasons

16:37.633 --> 16:40.466 align:left position:32.5%,start line:83% size:57.5%
why the Braves
ultimately will leave.

16:40.566 --> 16:42.800 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
While the fans are paying
to be in the stadium,

16:42.900 --> 16:44.466 align:left position:15%,start line:89% size:75%
you see all those cars there?

16:44.566 --> 16:46.133 align:left position:12.5%,start line:89% size:77.5%
So I'm standing here right now,

16:46.233 --> 16:49.333 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
and if I took a guess
from everybody here,

16:49.433 --> 16:51.066 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
most people, unless
they've read the book,

16:51.166 --> 16:53.666 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
would not know how much the
Braves made off the parking lot.

16:53.766 --> 16:56.733 align:left position:20%,start line:77% size:70%
See all those cars there?
You know how much money
they made that day?

16:56.833 --> 16:58.466 align:left position:25%,start line:89% size:65%
Nothing. Not a dime.

16:58.566 --> 17:00.733 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
The Braves did not get any
of the parking lot revenue.

17:00.833 --> 17:03.333 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
That all went directly
to the County.

17:03.433 --> 17:06.166 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
So you can see the lost
revenue opportunities

17:06.266 --> 17:08.000 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
for a team like the
Braves, but other owners

17:08.100 --> 17:10.433 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
like Walter O'Malley
of the Dodgers,

17:10.533 --> 17:12.500 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
he looks at what he
had at Ebbets Field,

17:12.600 --> 17:15.300 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
while baseball fans look at
Ebbets field nostalgically,

17:15.400 --> 17:17.100 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
it was beautiful, it was
all these other things.

17:17.200 --> 17:20.633 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
There's no parking around it.
It was not easy to get to.

17:20.733 --> 17:22.900 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
What did people want in
the post-World War II era?

17:23.000 --> 17:25.433 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
They want to get in
their car, they want to
go to the ball game,

17:25.533 --> 17:28.666 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
they want to be able
to get their stuff, and they
want to be able to go home.

17:28.766 --> 17:30.466 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
You're out in a
wide-open area here.

17:30.566 --> 17:32.466 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
You're not leaving your
car in a neighborhood.

17:32.566 --> 17:36.500 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
You are leaving your car out
around the expansive lots

17:36.600 --> 17:38.233 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
of the stadium,
you could tailgate,

17:38.333 --> 17:40.000 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
you could do all
those other things.

17:40.100 --> 17:42.066 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
Owners are looking
at it as pure revenue

17:42.166 --> 17:44.200 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
that's directly to
their bottom line.

17:44.300 --> 17:46.600 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
Helps pay for scouts
and stadium maintenance

17:46.700 --> 17:48.633 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
and all these other
things, but the Braves

17:48.733 --> 17:51.400 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
wouldn't get any
of that revenue.

17:51.500 --> 17:54.366 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
Now as we talk about the fans,

17:54.466 --> 17:57.700 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
and we talk about
the Milwaukee Braves,

17:57.800 --> 18:00.166 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
we talk about some
of the fan favorites.

18:00.266 --> 18:02.466 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
And I don't talk a lot
about players in the book

18:02.566 --> 18:05.166 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
because they're not a
major part of the book.

18:05.266 --> 18:07.266 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
But I like to point it out
whenever I have a chance

18:07.366 --> 18:09.066 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
to talk to people like
you is that guys like

18:09.166 --> 18:11.266 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
Johnny Logan, Logan played
both for the Brewers,

18:11.366 --> 18:13.333 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
you can see there in
his Brewers uniform.

18:13.433 --> 18:16.766 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
If you look very carefully
actually, it's stylized to
look like the Braves.

18:16.866 --> 18:20.233 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
The Braves ownership
group bought them in 1946.

18:20.333 --> 18:22.433 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
You can see the cap
that he's wearing.

18:22.533 --> 18:25.133 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
Everybody identifies it today
as a Milwaukee Braves cap.

18:25.233 --> 18:28.400 align:left position:25%,start line:77% size:65%
It was technically a
Milwaukee Brewers cap
before it was a Braves cap.

18:28.500 --> 18:31.166 align:left position:22.5%,start line:77% size:67.5%
And there of course is
Johnny Logan when he was
playing for the Braves.

18:31.266 --> 18:35.133 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
Photographs taken at spring
training I think in '57.

18:37.600 --> 18:39.900 align:left position:12.5%,start line:89% size:77.5%
But the fans loved the players,

18:40.000 --> 18:41.766 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
and the players loved the
fans, because there wasn't

18:41.866 --> 18:44.700 align:left position:12.5%,start line:83% size:77.5%
as much of a disconnect between
the players and the people.

18:44.800 --> 18:48.233 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
Baseball players then
weren't making 106%

18:48.333 --> 18:51.433 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
of what the average
person was making or more.

18:51.533 --> 18:54.800 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
They were making more
than most people,

18:54.900 --> 18:57.466 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
but they were still living
in local neighborhoods.

18:57.566 --> 18:59.033 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
A gentleman here
before told a story

18:59.133 --> 19:01.166 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
about getting a baseball
signed from Eddie Matthews,

19:01.266 --> 19:04.500 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
who was that that was
telling me that story?

19:04.600 --> 19:08.133 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
My aunt tells stories
of when she was a kid,

19:08.233 --> 19:11.366 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
going to play catch with Lew
Burdette, right down the block.

19:11.466 --> 19:13.566 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
People have all kinds
of stories like that

19:13.666 --> 19:15.433 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
when the Braves were in town,

19:15.533 --> 19:17.166 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
and there was a
connection that they had,

19:17.266 --> 19:20.300 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
and the Braves, particularly
those who had played in Boston,

19:20.400 --> 19:21.933 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
really loved the
fact that they were

19:22.033 --> 19:24.100 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
embraced so well
by the community.

19:25.266 --> 19:27.966 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
And that embracing
by the community

19:28.066 --> 19:30.333 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
wasn't just Milwaukee County.

19:31.366 --> 19:34.233 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
It wasn't just
southeastern Wisconsin.

19:34.333 --> 19:36.700 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
It was the state of Wisconsin.

19:36.800 --> 19:38.233 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
And it's shocking
for some people

19:38.333 --> 19:41.733 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
when we think about this
in the 21st century,

19:41.833 --> 19:46.666 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
but if you polled people in
Wisconsin in '55, '56, '57,

19:46.766 --> 19:49.933 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
their favorite team was the
Braves, not the Packers.

19:50.033 --> 19:52.300 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
Then it's shocking for people,

19:52.400 --> 19:54.866 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
because the Packers have
been king for so long,

19:54.966 --> 19:56.866 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
they don't understand
how big the Braves were

19:56.966 --> 19:59.033 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
for that window of time.

19:59.133 --> 20:02.100 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
Of course part of the window
of time that they were so good

20:02.200 --> 20:05.266 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
is because of men like
this, Warren Spahn.

20:05.366 --> 20:08.200 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
The all-time winningest
left-hand pitcher

20:08.300 --> 20:10.200 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
in Major League Baseball.

20:10.300 --> 20:12.633 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
Yet we don't have a statue
to him in Milwaukee.

20:12.733 --> 20:17.166 align:left position:22.5%,start line:77% size:67.5%
They had one in Atlanta
where he never played,
but we don't have one here.

20:17.266 --> 20:20.133 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
So, if we could do anything,
let's get the movement going

20:20.233 --> 20:22.666 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
to get a statue here
for Warren Spahn.

20:22.766 --> 20:26.200 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
But Spahnny was the
ultimate Milwaukee Brave.

20:26.300 --> 20:29.100 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
People argue, was it
Aaron, was it Matthews.

20:29.200 --> 20:30.800 align:left position:35%,start line:83% size:55%
Was it one of
those guys?

20:30.900 --> 20:35.433 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
Maybe, but Spahnny had that
gravitas before he came here.

20:35.533 --> 20:37.100 align:left position:22.5%,start line:89% size:67.5%
People knew who he was.

20:37.200 --> 20:39.300 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
We mentioned the 1948
World Series before.

20:39.400 --> 20:41.333 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
You know, Spahn and
Sain then pray for rain.

20:41.433 --> 20:43.966 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
I mean, he was a
known commodity.

20:44.066 --> 20:48.500 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
But he was the face
of the organization

20:48.600 --> 20:50.433 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
for most of the time they
were here in Milwaukee,

20:50.533 --> 20:52.000 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
and he was somebody
that the fans

20:52.100 --> 20:54.000 align:left position:17.5%,start line:89% size:72.5%
really really responded to.

20:54.100 --> 20:57.366 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
I would have loved to
have seen him pitch.

20:57.466 --> 20:59.100 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
I got to see him
throw out the last

20:59.200 --> 21:02.133 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
opening day first
pitch to Del Crandall.

21:02.233 --> 21:05.333 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
It really was neat
to see him out there.

21:05.433 --> 21:08.433 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
He was very feeble by that
point, but it was still

21:08.533 --> 21:10.900 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
that he took the
time to come up here

21:11.000 --> 21:12.666 align:left position:10%,start line:5% size:80%
to pay his respects to the fans,

21:12.766 --> 21:14.600 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
shows you how much all
of you meant to him

21:14.700 --> 21:17.900 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
and I think that's the
neatest part of the story.

21:18.000 --> 21:20.000 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
So I'm going to transition
a little bit from

21:20.100 --> 21:21.800 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
showing you a couple
of these cool pictures

21:21.900 --> 21:23.333 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
and talk a little
bit about retention,

21:23.433 --> 21:25.666 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
because retention's going
to be one of the big things

21:25.766 --> 21:28.666 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
that help you understand
the dynamics of

21:28.766 --> 21:31.666 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
why the Braves are
no longer here.

21:31.766 --> 21:34.133 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
So I'm going to show
you a couple graphs,

21:34.233 --> 21:36.500 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
and you're going to get used
to one particular graph line,

21:36.600 --> 21:39.533 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
because I'm going to show it
to you in comparison to a
couple of the other teams.

21:39.633 --> 21:41.933 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
And I do this so we
really kind of grasp

21:42.033 --> 21:46.733 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
ultimately why the team is
as successful as we thought,

21:46.833 --> 21:49.900 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
because certainly they
were, in particular

21:50.000 --> 21:51.400 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
in comparison to other teams.

21:51.500 --> 21:54.533 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
So let's look at the first one.

21:54.633 --> 21:57.000 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
This is season attendance
following relocation.

21:57.100 --> 22:01.033 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
Now understand this, and I
talk about this in the book.

22:01.133 --> 22:03.900 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
Attendance alone
is not an indicator

22:04.000 --> 22:07.533 align:left position:25%,start line:77% size:65%
of the profitability
of a baseball club
or a football club.

22:07.633 --> 22:10.266 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
For example, when you
look at this graph,

22:11.866 --> 22:14.300 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
the Atlanta Braves
would make more money

22:14.400 --> 22:18.233 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
playing in an empty stadium
than they would make

22:18.333 --> 22:20.133 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
playing in front
of a full stadium

22:20.233 --> 22:22.500 align:left position:15%,start line:89% size:75%
at Milwaukee County Stadium.

22:22.600 --> 22:25.466 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
It's just the dynamics
of broadcast revenue

22:25.566 --> 22:27.300 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
and all the advertising
things that go with it

22:27.400 --> 22:29.733 align:left position:12.5%,start line:89% size:77.5%
so it's not the only indicator.

22:29.833 --> 22:32.433 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
I'm putting this in
because one of the things

22:32.533 --> 22:34.166 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
that irritated me
the most when I was

22:34.266 --> 22:36.366 align:left position:10%,start line:89% size:80%
doing the research for the book,

22:36.466 --> 22:38.266 align:left position:10%,start line:89% size:80%
was that the Braves organization

22:38.366 --> 22:42.133 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
still to this day
blames the fans.

22:42.233 --> 22:44.466 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
They blame the fans
for not showing up.

22:44.566 --> 22:47.066 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
They talk about empty stands
and this was the reason

22:47.166 --> 22:48.666 align:left position:35%,start line:83% size:55%
why the team
ultimately had to leave

22:48.766 --> 22:50.500 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
and go to Atlanta because
the fans weren't there.

22:50.600 --> 22:53.566 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
And it's just not accurate,

22:53.666 --> 22:56.466 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
because there were more
fans in the worst year

22:56.566 --> 22:58.566 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
prior to the lame duck
year, there were more fans

22:58.666 --> 23:00.233 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
that went to games at
Milwaukee County Stadium

23:00.333 --> 23:03.433 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
than went to games at
Wrigley Field that year.

23:03.533 --> 23:06.066 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
That went to games
at Fenway Park.

23:06.166 --> 23:07.733 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
And we would never
say Boston or Chicago

23:07.833 --> 23:09.233 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
are bad baseball towns.

23:09.333 --> 23:11.933 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
Yet, Milwaukee was labeled
as a bad baseball town.

23:12.033 --> 23:14.166 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
Let's take a look
at these numbers here.

23:14.266 --> 23:17.300 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
So if you look at the
beginning of the graph you
see it starts at minus one.

23:17.400 --> 23:18.966 align:left position:32.5%,start line:83% size:57.5%
That's the year
before they left.

23:19.066 --> 23:21.066 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
That's the indicator where
they were the year before.

23:21.166 --> 23:25.066 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
So for example, for
the Milwaukee Braves

23:25.166 --> 23:27.066 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
the year before was when
they were in Boston.

23:27.166 --> 23:28.700 align:left position:20%,start line:89% size:70%
They drew about 280,000.

23:28.800 --> 23:30.800 align:left position:12.5%,start line:89% size:77.5%
Look at this massive spike up.

23:30.900 --> 23:33.066 align:left position:30%,start line:89% size:60%
So what happens?

23:33.166 --> 23:35.933 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
The team moves to
Milwaukee in 1953,

23:36.033 --> 23:39.500 align:left position:12.5%,start line:83% size:77.5%
so year zero is the first year,
look at this spike, right?

23:40.666 --> 23:43.033 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
And it accelerates out
the first couple years.

23:43.133 --> 23:44.800 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
There's a little bit
of settling right here,

23:44.900 --> 23:47.400 align:left position:15%,start line:89% size:75%
and then you've got '57, '58,

23:47.500 --> 23:50.000 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
and then we start to
get the decline in '59.

23:50.100 --> 23:53.966 align:left position:25%,start line:77% size:65%
Now let's take a look
the comparison to the
Milwaukee Brewers.

23:54.066 --> 23:55.766 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
The Milwaukee Brewers
when they came in 1970,

23:55.866 --> 23:58.300 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
so this would be
1969 in Seattle.

23:58.400 --> 24:03.366 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
It is a much slower,
steadier incline.

24:03.466 --> 24:07.300 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
Now there's a big rise here,
and there's a big drop off,

24:07.400 --> 24:09.300 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
and if you're not familiar
with what this is,

24:09.400 --> 24:11.833 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
this was the 1981
baseball strike.

24:11.933 --> 24:14.700 align:left position:20%,start line:77% size:70%
So that's the only reason
why there was the big
drop down in attendance,

24:14.800 --> 24:17.766 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
but you look, it's a
much more measured,

24:17.866 --> 24:20.400 align:left position:20%,start line:89% size:70%
slowly building fan base.

24:20.500 --> 24:23.233 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
Now let's look at
the Atlanta Braves.

24:23.333 --> 24:28.233 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
Okay, so the last year,
this is 1965 in Milwaukee.

24:28.333 --> 24:30.666 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
This is the first year
they're in Atlanta.

24:30.766 --> 24:32.966 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
Look they did not even come
close to where they were

24:33.066 --> 24:35.833 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
when they came to Milwaukee.
And look at this.

24:35.933 --> 24:40.400 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
The attendance line is much
much lower the entire time.

24:40.500 --> 24:43.500 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
They get a little bit
of spike, look at here,

24:43.600 --> 24:45.366 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
there's almost a merger
at the same point.

24:45.466 --> 24:47.366 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
That's one of the
weirdest anomalies.

24:47.466 --> 24:49.533 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
There's a merger at almost
the exact same point year 11

24:49.633 --> 24:51.333 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
where they're all at
about the same attendance.

24:51.433 --> 24:55.900 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
And then the Atlanta one
kind of stays steady.

24:56.000 --> 24:57.766 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
The Milwaukee one
obviously went down further

24:57.866 --> 25:01.066 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
in '65 because that
was the lame duck year.

25:01.166 --> 25:04.033 align:left position:17.5%,start line:89% size:72.5%
Now what do I see in this?

25:04.133 --> 25:07.100 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
Now again, I'm not a math
major, I'm a history professor.

25:07.200 --> 25:10.300 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
What I see is that fan
retention in Milwaukee

25:10.400 --> 25:13.133 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
was better than
it was in Atlanta.

25:13.233 --> 25:14.733 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
You cannot look at
this graph and say

25:14.833 --> 25:18.033 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
that the fans in Milwaukee
were not good fans, okay?

25:18.133 --> 25:20.066 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
The drop off obviously
towards the end

25:20.166 --> 25:22.366 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
is because everybody knew
the team was going to go.

25:22.466 --> 25:24.900 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
Now one of the arguments
I address a little
bit in the book,

25:25.000 --> 25:26.533 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
but I always like
to point it out

25:26.633 --> 25:29.300 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
when I talk to crowds like
this, is this is what I believe.

25:29.400 --> 25:33.533 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
That I believe if you reverse
this chart, you start it here.

25:33.633 --> 25:36.666 align:left position:15%,start line:89% size:75%
If this would have been 1953,

25:36.766 --> 25:38.500 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
and you work your
way this way.

25:38.600 --> 25:41.000 align:left position:25%,start line:77% size:65%
And you got a little
bit of settling there,
we would talk about

25:41.100 --> 25:44.033 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
one of the greatest successes
in baseball, still to this day.

25:44.133 --> 25:47.533 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
Because it would not have
built unrealistic expectations.

25:47.633 --> 25:50.600 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
See, every team that
moved had a dramatic spike

25:50.700 --> 25:52.766 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
in attendance, but
then usually there was

25:52.866 --> 25:56.400 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
an immediate settling effect,
because nobody wanted to pay

25:56.500 --> 25:59.033 align:left position:12.5%,start line:83% size:77.5%
good money to go out and see a
sixth- or a seventh-place team.

25:59.133 --> 26:01.666 align:left position:15%,start line:89% size:75%
Well which teams are moving?

26:01.766 --> 26:03.900 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
The Philadelphia
Athletics, right?

26:04.000 --> 26:07.066 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
Their best days were two
decades in their past, right?

26:07.166 --> 26:09.833 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
They were a sixth or seventh
place, bottom-feeding team.

26:09.933 --> 26:12.633 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
St. Louis Browns, the entire
time they were in St. Louis,

26:12.733 --> 26:15.000 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
you know how many
pennants they won? One,

26:15.100 --> 26:18.900 align:left position:37.5%,start line:5% size:52.5%
during the
World War, in 1944.

26:19.900 --> 26:22.533 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
That was it, one
pennant the entire time.

26:22.633 --> 26:24.266 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
Those are the teams
that are moving.

26:24.366 --> 26:28.000 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
The Boston Braves won
the World Series in 1914.

26:28.100 --> 26:29.633 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
They lost it in 1948.

26:29.733 --> 26:31.966 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
You're not talking
about a stellar team

26:32.066 --> 26:34.566 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
that had just lots of
achievement behind it.

26:34.666 --> 26:37.400 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
Now, again, the
exception is the Dodgers,

26:37.500 --> 26:39.366 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
okay, and we'll
address that dynamic

26:39.466 --> 26:42.400 align:left position:35%,start line:5% size:55%
a little bit
differently in a moment.

26:42.500 --> 26:46.566 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
So here is a relocation
chart that again has

26:46.666 --> 26:48.500 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
the Braves, it has
the Brewers in it,

26:48.600 --> 26:51.133 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
but it also then has
the Baltimore Orioles.

26:51.233 --> 26:54.200 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
And the Baltimore
Orioles of course were
the St. Louis Browns.

26:54.300 --> 26:57.000 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
Now, of all the major league
teams that wanted to move

26:57.100 --> 27:00.333 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
during this era, only two
owners ever got shot down.

27:00.433 --> 27:01.866 align:left position:27.5%,start line:89% size:62.5%
One was Bill Veeck.

27:01.966 --> 27:04.433 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
The owners looked at
him as a socialist.

27:04.533 --> 27:08.533 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
They're like, "Oh, he wants
equal pay for everything,

27:08.633 --> 27:11.000 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
"and we just simply
can't have that".

27:11.100 --> 27:16.500 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
And Veeck always looked at
it, it's not a fairness issue,

27:16.600 --> 27:18.400 align:left position:17.5%,start line:89% size:72.5%
it was a competitive issue.

27:18.500 --> 27:20.900 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
You can't have the New York
Yankees playing in a stadium

27:21.000 --> 27:22.666 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
playing against the
Cleveland Indians,

27:22.766 --> 27:25.400 align:left position:32.5%,start line:83% size:57.5%
and one team is
making, raw numbers,

27:25.500 --> 27:28.633 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
say they're making $100,000
and the other teams' making 10.

27:28.733 --> 27:33.300 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
It creates an unequal
playing field, okay?

27:33.400 --> 27:37.933 align:left position:30%,start line:77% size:60%
Well, the Browns
ultimately, Veeck is
going to get forced out,

27:38.033 --> 27:40.466 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
new ownership buys the team,
they move them to Baltimore.

27:40.566 --> 27:43.866 align:left position:10%,start line:83% size:80%
They said specifically, "We want
to repeat the Milwaukee Miracle.

27:43.966 --> 27:46.833 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
"We want to outdo in '54
what Milwaukee did in '53".

27:46.933 --> 27:49.933 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
Well, what you can see
is they never came close.

27:50.033 --> 27:52.933 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
But if you look at here
again, look at this.

27:53.033 --> 27:56.500 align:left position:32.5%,start line:83% size:57.5%
Steady growth,
little bit of settling.

27:56.600 --> 27:58.533 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
Little bit of settling but
look at where they are.

27:58.633 --> 28:01.833 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
Their base number is better
than where they started,

28:01.933 --> 28:04.700 align:left position:12.5%,start line:89% size:77.5%
but it's not as high as it was

28:04.800 --> 28:06.766 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
for the most part when
they first arrived.

28:06.866 --> 28:10.333 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
This is a fairly common
trend in baseball.

28:10.433 --> 28:15.333 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
It doesn't happen here,
because the Braves got good.

28:15.433 --> 28:19.500 align:left position:10%,start line:83% size:80%
See, that's the thing that makes
the Braves story different.

28:19.600 --> 28:22.066 align:left position:15%,start line:89% size:75%
So the next slide, and again,

28:22.166 --> 28:24.333 align:left position:12.5%,start line:83% size:77.5%
this is one of the other ones,
the Kansas City Athletics.

28:24.433 --> 28:26.633 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
Again, the Philadelphia
Athletics moved to Kansas City,

28:26.733 --> 28:30.500 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
so this is their last
year here in Philadelphia.

28:30.600 --> 28:35.400 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
You can see the spike up,
and again the slow settling

28:35.500 --> 28:37.900 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
of attendance because
they were playing

28:38.000 --> 28:42.233 align:left position:32.5%,start line:83% size:57.5%
in a glorified
minor league park.

28:42.333 --> 28:44.033 align:left position:15%,start line:89% size:75%
They had an owner ultimately

28:44.133 --> 28:45.866 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
in Charlie O. Finley
that nobody liked.

28:45.966 --> 28:48.833 align:left position:27.5%,start line:77% size:62.5%
If you're familiar
with the story of the
Kansas City Athletics,

28:48.933 --> 28:51.333 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
Arnold Johnson who owned
the team before them

28:51.433 --> 28:53.600 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
had been the previous owner
of Yankee Stadium,

28:53.700 --> 28:56.033 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
had a very very
close relationship

28:56.133 --> 28:58.033 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
with the Yankee ownership,
and any great player

28:58.133 --> 29:00.000 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
that ever seemed to
come through Kansas City

29:00.100 --> 29:03.933 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
got traded to the
Yankees, like Roger Maris.

29:04.033 --> 29:07.600 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
So there's a whole laundry
list of incidents like that

29:07.700 --> 29:10.800 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
so that the fans of the
Kansas City Athletics

29:10.900 --> 29:12.733 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
never really embraced
the team as much.

29:12.833 --> 29:15.166 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
But I'll point this out
again, look at, in Kansas City

29:15.266 --> 29:17.933 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
they were still higher than
where they were in Philadelphia,

29:18.033 --> 29:21.500 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
but you don't have
this drop off that

29:21.600 --> 29:23.300 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
ultimately you'll see
later with Milwaukee,

29:23.400 --> 29:26.400 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
and why does the drop
off happen in Milwaukee?

29:26.500 --> 29:30.866 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
Because, I believe,
expectations were too high.

29:30.966 --> 29:32.900 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
Because when the team moved

29:33.000 --> 29:36.000 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
and they got good,
there was fan interest

29:36.100 --> 29:39.500 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
to keep the attendance
artificially high.

29:39.600 --> 29:43.100 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
There never was a
settling effect that had--

29:43.200 --> 29:45.266 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
Let's just say for
example, the Braves don't

29:45.366 --> 29:47.366 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
go to the World Series in '57,

29:47.466 --> 29:50.933 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
and they go instead
in like, '62, '63.

29:51.033 --> 29:53.566 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
What you would have
probably had is a settling

29:53.666 --> 29:55.233 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
of the attendance
on the front end,

29:55.333 --> 29:58.700 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
to probably somewhere
between 700 and 900,000,

29:58.800 --> 30:02.033 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
and then slowly build back up
again as the team got good.

30:02.133 --> 30:04.866 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
It would have created more
realistic expectations

30:04.966 --> 30:07.300 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
what fan attendance was
supposed to be like.

30:07.400 --> 30:10.100 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
See, when you talk
to people in 1965,

30:10.200 --> 30:13.533 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
and they talk-- I read
this in multiple articles--

30:13.633 --> 30:17.133 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
they expected the stadium to
be packed like it was in '53.

30:17.233 --> 30:20.700 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
You can't sell the stadium
out 12 years in a row.

30:21.700 --> 30:24.466 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
You can't sell it out
13 seasons in a row.

30:24.566 --> 30:26.600 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
That's just too difficult.

30:26.700 --> 30:28.733 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
So the next slide I have,
it's a little bit convoluted,

30:28.833 --> 30:32.066 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
I grant you that, but
if I can figure it out
I know you guys can, too,

30:32.166 --> 30:34.066 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
because again, I'm
not a graph guy.

30:34.166 --> 30:37.233 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
And I had my son
put this together.
(laughter)

30:37.333 --> 30:40.033 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
See, told you.
And they're multi-colored here.

30:40.133 --> 30:44.533 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
So what I did was, I had
him put together a chart

30:44.633 --> 30:47.366 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
of season attendance,
again, overlay it so you can

30:47.466 --> 30:49.300 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
kind of see where
all of them are.

30:49.400 --> 30:52.466 align:left position:22.5%,start line:77% size:67.5%
Now this does not have
every team that moved.
It has most of them.

30:52.566 --> 30:55.800 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
The one that outperformed,
and this blue line right here

30:55.900 --> 30:58.166 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
is the one you got
used to seeing before.

30:58.266 --> 31:00.933 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
This was the Milwaukee
Braves right here.

31:01.033 --> 31:05.566 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
This light blue one is the
Brooklyn Dodgers to Los Angeles.

31:05.666 --> 31:09.066 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
Playing in a much bigger
stadium at the Coliseum,

31:09.166 --> 31:12.466 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
and eventually moving
into Dodger Stadium.

31:12.566 --> 31:14.833 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
Certainly their attendance
was much higher.

31:14.933 --> 31:17.400 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
Again we see a little
bit of a spike down here.

31:17.500 --> 31:21.400 align:left position:10%,start line:83% size:80%
Ironically the Milwaukee Brewers
outdrew them a couple of years.

31:21.500 --> 31:24.733 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
But you see again, even with
the Dodgers, what do you see?

31:24.833 --> 31:26.900 align:left position:20%,start line:89% size:70%
A settling effect, right?

31:27.000 --> 31:29.233 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
Team moved, they went to
the World Series in '59,

31:29.333 --> 31:30.866 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
went to the World
Series a couple times

31:30.966 --> 31:32.566 align:left position:10%,start line:89% size:80%
in the 1960s, and what happened?

31:32.666 --> 31:35.633 align:left position:12.5%,start line:83% size:77.5%
Little bit of a settling effect
as they moved into the 70s.

31:35.733 --> 31:39.033 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
The green one, San
Francisco Giants.

31:39.133 --> 31:41.666 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
Never matched the
initial attendance

31:41.766 --> 31:44.000 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
in San Francisco
that the Braves did.

31:44.100 --> 31:47.066 align:left position:32.5%,start line:83% size:57.5%
What do we see?
We see a settling.

31:47.166 --> 31:49.600 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
A slow steady climb,
and then what happens?

31:49.700 --> 31:51.666 align:left position:32.5%,start line:89% size:57.5%
A big drop off.

31:51.766 --> 31:54.233 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
The Oakland Athletics,
when they moved

31:54.333 --> 31:56.733 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
from Kansas City
ultimately, look at this.

31:56.833 --> 31:59.666 align:left position:17.5%,start line:89% size:72.5%
Never, ever, ever got close

31:59.766 --> 32:02.100 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
to where the Braves
were in Milwaukee.

32:04.233 --> 32:07.333 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
And again you can see
the drop off here.

32:07.433 --> 32:09.466 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
I have the Kansas City
Athletics,

32:09.566 --> 32:11.366 align:left position:12.5%,start line:89% size:77.5%
I talked about that one before.

32:11.466 --> 32:14.300 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
Nobody would say Baltimore's
a bad baseball town.

32:14.400 --> 32:17.000 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
Nobody would say San
Francisco's a bad baseball town.

32:17.100 --> 32:18.733 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
People were saying
Milwaukee was.

32:18.833 --> 32:22.300 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
And the numbers just
simply don't bear it out.

32:23.433 --> 32:25.333 align:left position:30%,start line:89% size:60%
So what happened?

32:25.433 --> 32:28.433 align:left position:32.5%,start line:83% size:57.5%
Why did we lose
our beloved Braves?

32:28.533 --> 32:33.700 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
Well, in 1962 Lou Perini
had taken his corporation

32:33.800 --> 32:36.200 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
the previous year,
made it public.

32:36.300 --> 32:39.400 align:left position:22.5%,start line:77% size:67.5%
He was in construction,
had a lot of jobs out
on the East Coast,

32:39.500 --> 32:41.866 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
and sold it to a
group out of Chicago.

32:41.966 --> 32:44.366 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
Now, the group out of
Chicago did not necessarily

32:44.466 --> 32:46.933 align:left position:32.5%,start line:83% size:57.5%
buy the team, I
believe, to move it.

32:47.033 --> 32:49.066 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
I think that's a narrative,
and I actually spoke

32:49.166 --> 32:50.666 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
to Bill Bartholomay,
he's the second one

32:50.766 --> 32:53.166 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
in the photograph
here, and we spoke

32:53.266 --> 32:54.833 align:left position:35%,start line:83% size:55%
for about two
hours on the phone.

32:54.933 --> 32:58.433 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
He was as cordial as could
be, answered the questions.

32:58.533 --> 33:02.333 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
I have no way to judge the
veracity of his statements.

33:02.433 --> 33:04.100 align:left position:15%,start line:89% size:75%
But he made one point to me,

33:04.200 --> 33:06.733 align:left position:20%,start line:77% size:70%
and I've told this story
repeatedly, but he said
to me, he's like,

33:06.833 --> 33:08.666 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
"Look, you know, when
we first bought the team

33:08.766 --> 33:10.433 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
"we didn't really
plan to move it".

33:10.533 --> 33:13.100 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
He said, "Look, my wife
and I, we had a place

33:13.200 --> 33:15.466 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
"out in Lake Geneva for
me to go see a ball game,

33:15.566 --> 33:18.900 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
"it was 40 minutes in the
car up to our box, and
we could see a game."

33:19.000 --> 33:21.000 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
When the team moved to Atlanta,
what did he have to do?

33:21.100 --> 33:22.866 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
He had to get on a
plane, fly to Atlanta,

33:22.966 --> 33:25.666 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
and he's away from his home,
he's away from his office,

33:25.766 --> 33:27.833 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
he's like, "It wasn't
really convenient".

33:28.833 --> 33:31.300 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
They wanted to be
baseball owners.

33:31.400 --> 33:34.933 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
The problem was, they most
likely overpaid for the team.

33:35.033 --> 33:37.300 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
It was harder to be
a baseball owner

33:37.400 --> 33:39.100 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
than it was to be
a U.S. Senator,

33:39.200 --> 33:41.433 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
because there were
only 16 baseball teams

33:41.533 --> 33:43.133 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
when the Braves first
came to Milwaukee.

33:43.233 --> 33:45.833 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
Now then through
expansion obviously there
would be a few more,

33:45.933 --> 33:48.800 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
but it was still
ultimately very difficult
to be a baseball owner.

33:48.900 --> 33:51.766 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
So when they got the
chance to own the team,

33:51.866 --> 33:54.266 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
they bought it on the idea that

33:54.366 --> 33:57.466 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
it was going to be
Milwaukee in the 1950s.

33:57.566 --> 33:59.233 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
That you're going to be
drawing somewhere between

33:59.333 --> 34:02.600 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
1.5 to 2 million, your
break-even point is

34:02.700 --> 34:05.033 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
somewhere between
a million and 1.5,

34:05.133 --> 34:07.033 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
and the reality was that
first year they owned it

34:07.133 --> 34:09.800 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
they barely drew
more than 700,000.

34:09.900 --> 34:11.800 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
Now, that's shocking.

34:11.900 --> 34:13.666 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
It's a shocking number
when you consider

34:13.766 --> 34:16.666 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
they were up over 2.5 just
a couple of years earlier

34:16.766 --> 34:18.400 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
to be down to 700,000.

34:19.400 --> 34:21.933 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
Well, it is shocking,
but baseball attendance

34:22.033 --> 34:23.933 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
was down everywhere.

34:24.033 --> 34:26.400 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
It wasn't just in Milwaukee.

34:26.500 --> 34:28.333 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
See, by the time
this ownership group

34:28.433 --> 34:30.933 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
was buying into the team,
professional football

34:31.033 --> 34:35.100 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
was superseding the fan
interest across the nation.

34:35.200 --> 34:38.233 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
It had an impact directly
on newspaper coverage.

34:38.333 --> 34:40.266 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
So when you look at
the sports pages,

34:40.366 --> 34:43.533 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
more and more coverage went
to football than baseball.

34:43.633 --> 34:46.700 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
Well, in Wisconsin is
there anything going on

34:46.800 --> 34:49.066 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
with professional football
that might have a strong,

34:49.166 --> 34:52.166 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
well let's see, that
was the highlight

34:52.266 --> 34:54.333 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
of the Vince Lombardi years.

34:54.433 --> 34:57.033 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
So it probably had a stronger
impact in Milwaukee as well,

34:57.133 --> 34:59.866 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
so you're starting a deal
with kind of a perfect storm.

34:59.966 --> 35:02.766 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
You've got owners that
are buying a team,

35:02.866 --> 35:05.900 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
maybe overpaid for it,
at a time when fan interest

35:06.000 --> 35:09.200 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
is dissipating in baseball in
general across the country.

35:09.300 --> 35:11.400 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
Maybe a little bit more
in particular in Wisconsin

35:11.500 --> 35:13.966 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
simply because the
interest in the Packers.

35:14.066 --> 35:16.266 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
And now I'll throw
another one at you.

35:16.366 --> 35:18.833 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
At the same time all
of this is happening,

35:18.933 --> 35:22.733 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
the Braves are paying
more to use their facility

35:22.833 --> 35:24.966 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
than any other team in
Major League Baseball.

35:25.066 --> 35:27.700 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
And I think that was
the most shocking thing

35:27.800 --> 35:30.600 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
that I found doing
my research, was

35:30.700 --> 35:32.600 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
the expenditures
that the Braves were

35:32.700 --> 35:35.700 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
obligated to pay to be at
Milwaukee County Stadium.

35:35.800 --> 35:38.100 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
So one of the things that
the new Braves ownership

35:38.200 --> 35:39.966 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
attempted to do to
kind of alleviate

35:40.066 --> 35:42.833 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
some of the financial issues
they had, was sell stock.

35:42.933 --> 35:45.066 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
Now I have a story in
the book where I talk

35:45.166 --> 35:47.133 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
about stock sale, and certainly
they were disappointed.

35:47.233 --> 35:49.566 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
They never sold the amount
of stock they were hoping to.

35:49.666 --> 35:52.766 align:left position:12.5%,start line:83% size:77.5%
One of the people they brought
on to help kind of sell it,

35:52.866 --> 35:55.800 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
they appointed Vince Lombardi
to the board of directors,

35:55.900 --> 35:58.033 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
kind of the face
of the Green Bay Packers,

35:58.133 --> 36:00.333 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
kind of help this idea
of communal ownership,

36:00.433 --> 36:03.800 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
and it just never
really went well.

36:03.900 --> 36:06.366 align:left position:12.5%,start line:89% size:77.5%
I don't have an answer for it.

36:06.466 --> 36:08.766 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
Some people argued, "Well,
you know, it was stock,

36:08.866 --> 36:10.566 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
"it didn't really
have any voting,

36:10.666 --> 36:12.733 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
there was really "nothing
you could do with it."

36:12.833 --> 36:14.233 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
All the decisions
would still be made

36:14.333 --> 36:17.100 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
by the basic owners, they
were just basically taking--

36:17.200 --> 36:19.033 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
And I'm like, well that's
kind of the same thing

36:19.133 --> 36:21.400 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
the Packers have done
twice in my lifetime,

36:21.500 --> 36:23.533 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
where they've sold
stock that really is

36:23.633 --> 36:26.100 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
meaningless but it's
a piece of paper.

36:26.200 --> 36:29.033 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
Is anybody in here
a Packer owner?

36:29.133 --> 36:30.466 align:left position:45%,start line:5% size:45%
I am.

36:33.233 --> 36:34.766 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
We love our ownership.

36:34.866 --> 36:37.266 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
And then one of the
other things certainly

36:37.366 --> 36:39.100 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
that you find out
from the book is that

36:39.200 --> 36:41.366 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
the relationship with the
Milwaukee County Board

36:41.466 --> 36:43.166 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
was not particularly good.

36:43.266 --> 36:45.733 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
At a time when maybe you
needed really strong leadership

36:45.833 --> 36:49.300 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
from the Board, it was not
as strong as it needed to be.

36:49.400 --> 36:50.966 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
Certainly for the
stadium negotiations

36:51.066 --> 36:54.266 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
starting in '57, they
got very contentious,

36:54.366 --> 36:57.266 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
and I understand it a little
bit from both perspectives.

36:57.366 --> 36:59.966 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
The Braves need to maximize
the revenues they're making.

37:00.066 --> 37:01.533 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
Anything that they
sell in the stadium, again,

37:01.633 --> 37:03.233 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
as I look around the
room I see some people

37:03.333 --> 37:04.800 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
wearing Brewers things,
I see some people

37:04.900 --> 37:06.700 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
wearing some Braves
things, right?

37:06.800 --> 37:08.433 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
Teams want to make
the revenue from that

37:08.533 --> 37:09.900 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
because it helps them
pay for things like

37:10.000 --> 37:12.400 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
scouts, and spring
training facilities

37:12.500 --> 37:15.233 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
and all this other stuff, they
want to be able to control it.

37:15.333 --> 37:17.800 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
Well, anything the Braves
want to sell at Milwaukee
County Stadium,

37:17.900 --> 37:19.666 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
they had to get the approval
from the County Board.

37:19.766 --> 37:22.633 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
They wanted to raise basic
prices on things like beer

37:22.733 --> 37:25.300 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
and had to go through
the County Board.

37:25.400 --> 37:28.533 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
It wasn't likely to happen, and
so when another stadium deal

37:28.633 --> 37:30.600 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
comes along that says,
"Hey, you can get all the

37:30.700 --> 37:33.766 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
"parking lot revenue, you
can control the prices

37:33.866 --> 37:37.666 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
inside your stadium, we'll
give you a long-term lease".

37:37.766 --> 37:40.666 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
Who wouldn't be
interested at least

37:40.766 --> 37:42.933 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
in listening to
that opportunity?

37:43.033 --> 37:45.166 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
Because one of the things the
new ownership group found out

37:45.266 --> 37:47.033 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
within the first six
months they owned the team,

37:47.133 --> 37:48.500 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
they were going to
be butting heads

37:48.600 --> 37:50.433 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
with the County Board
just like Lou Perini had.

37:51.900 --> 37:56.300 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
So, one of the newspaper
articles that I have here

37:56.400 --> 37:59.300 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
is the ongoing reports that
the team was going to leave.

37:59.400 --> 38:01.633 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
And I talk about this
in a couple other

38:01.733 --> 38:03.600 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
different presentations
that I've done,

38:03.700 --> 38:06.100 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
but the Braves and
every team in baseball

38:06.200 --> 38:07.766 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
had been rumored to
move for a while.

38:07.866 --> 38:09.566 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
I mean, the first
rumors you really see

38:09.666 --> 38:12.266 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
the Braves were going to
go somewhere was 1955.

38:12.366 --> 38:14.266 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
We're still in the middle
of the Milwaukee Miracle,

38:14.366 --> 38:16.800 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
and it was just kind of
an outlier in an article

38:16.900 --> 38:19.500 align:left position:20%,start line:77% size:70%
where a guy said, "Well,
you know, someday you might
see these teams move",

38:19.600 --> 38:21.633 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
and the Braves were one of
the teams that were listed.

38:21.733 --> 38:23.366 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
But every team was rumored
to be going somewhere.

38:23.466 --> 38:26.166 align:left position:10%,start line:83% size:80%
I mean, the Yankees were rumored
to be going to California.

38:26.266 --> 38:31.166 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
So I don't put a lot of
credence to that until 1963.

38:31.266 --> 38:34.566 align:left position:12.5%,start line:83% size:77.5%
At the All Star break in 1963,<i>&nbsp;
The Sporting News</i>

38:34.666 --> 38:39.033 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
reported that the Bartholomay
group had a deal in theory

38:39.133 --> 38:41.100 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
in place to take their
team down to Atlanta

38:41.200 --> 38:42.900 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
when Atlanta's new
stadium opened.

38:44.333 --> 38:47.233 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
Now, is there truth that
there was a deal in place?

38:47.333 --> 38:51.066 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
I don't think they
had a signed deal.

38:51.166 --> 38:54.533 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
I don't even think they were
close to a verbal agreement.

38:54.633 --> 38:56.233 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
But they were certainly
moving in that direction,

38:56.333 --> 38:58.133 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
and the Braves ownership
group made it clear that

38:58.233 --> 39:01.200 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
they were willing to talk
to them when their
stadium lease was up.

39:01.300 --> 39:03.933 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
And the ownership group
looked at it this way,

39:04.033 --> 39:05.533 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
their stadium lease they
had in Milwaukee County,

39:05.633 --> 39:07.933 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
they viewed it like
a player contract.

39:08.033 --> 39:11.600 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
You can cut a player, you
might still have to pay him,
but you can cut a player,

39:11.700 --> 39:13.666 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
they thought they could
do the same thing with
their municipal stadium.

39:13.766 --> 39:15.200 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
They thought at the
point that they could

39:15.300 --> 39:16.900 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
go to Atlanta was up to them.

39:17.000 --> 39:18.666 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
Certainly there
will be a different

39:18.766 --> 39:21.333 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
interpretation from
Milwaukee County.

39:22.433 --> 39:25.066 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
One of my favorite
photographs of this era

39:25.166 --> 39:31.200 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
is we start to put a night
cast on our time in Milwaukee.

39:31.300 --> 39:35.366 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
Twilight has come, rumors
are now proven to be true

39:35.466 --> 39:37.266 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
that the team is
ultimately going to leave,

39:37.366 --> 39:39.700 align:left position:17.5%,start line:89% size:72.5%
the owners will blame you.

39:40.700 --> 39:43.000 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
Unfortunately, and I
think that's the most

39:43.100 --> 39:46.500 align:left position:12.5%,start line:89% size:77.5%
unfair thing thrown at the fans

39:46.600 --> 39:49.766 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
in the state of Wisconsin, is
that they simply disappeared,

39:49.866 --> 39:52.500 align:left position:12.5%,start line:89% size:77.5%
and it really wasn't the case.

39:52.600 --> 39:54.600 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
Certainly they were not
there is as strong of numbers

39:54.700 --> 39:56.566 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
as they were before, but as
you saw from the other numbers,

39:56.666 --> 39:58.300 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
they were better than
almost every other place,

39:58.400 --> 40:00.266 align:left position:15%,start line:89% size:75%
every other team that moved.

40:00.366 --> 40:04.000 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
I have a couple photographs
here as we get near the end.

40:04.100 --> 40:06.700 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
This is some of the
photographs from the last night

40:06.800 --> 40:08.700 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
at County Stadium and
that the Braves played

40:08.800 --> 40:11.133 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
as the Milwaukee Braves.

40:11.233 --> 40:14.066 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
Hall of Famer Eddie
Matthews looking over,

40:14.166 --> 40:17.133 align:left position:32.5%,start line:83% size:57.5%
the only player
to play in Boston,

40:17.233 --> 40:19.066 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
Milwaukee and Atlanta
for the Braves.

40:19.166 --> 40:21.433 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
And then a bunch of
the other players

40:21.533 --> 40:23.200 align:left position:15%,start line:89% size:75%
here standing in the dugout.

40:23.300 --> 40:25.800 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
And I think one of the things
that I have heard a lot

40:25.900 --> 40:28.666 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
from fans that are older
than I am, they would say,

40:28.766 --> 40:30.433 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
"Well, you know, the
problem was we didn't really

40:30.533 --> 40:32.466 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
"know the guy, all the
guys we liked were gone.

40:32.566 --> 40:34.733 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
"The players they got in
return never really developed".

40:34.833 --> 40:37.800 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
And certainly that was
the case the Braves

40:37.900 --> 40:41.633 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
would contend periodically,
but they just never could

40:41.733 --> 40:44.866 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
consistently put together
a winning product.

40:44.966 --> 40:46.766 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
While they finished
with a winning record

40:46.866 --> 40:48.700 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
every year they
were in Milwaukee,

40:48.800 --> 40:51.833 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
they just didn't get
close to that first tier

40:51.933 --> 40:54.400 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
after 1959, they just
really kind of settled

40:54.500 --> 40:57.233 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
into the bottom half
of the National League.

40:58.266 --> 41:02.633 align:left position:12.5%,start line:83% size:77.5%
"Taps" at the final game, again
look at the sparse crowds.

41:02.733 --> 41:05.400 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
But look at, again I'll
point out the expansion.

41:05.500 --> 41:08.300 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
You can see how far out now
the bleacher sections go.

41:08.400 --> 41:11.166 align:left position:12.5%,start line:83% size:77.5%
Certainly the stadium footprint
looks dramatically different

41:11.266 --> 41:17.266 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
by 1965 than it had in '53
when the team first came.

41:18.266 --> 41:20.566 align:left position:12.5%,start line:89% size:77.5%
One of the saddest photographs,

41:20.666 --> 41:22.333 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
this one's been in a
lot of different books,

41:22.433 --> 41:23.833 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
but "See you next year
Braves", and unfortunately

41:23.933 --> 41:26.666 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
Milwaukee would not see
the Braves again until 1970

41:26.766 --> 41:28.733 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
when they came up to
play an exhibition game.

41:28.833 --> 41:31.466 align:left position:25%,start line:77% size:65%
And then fortunately
with the Brewers going
in the National League,

41:31.566 --> 41:33.166 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
now the Braves come
back on a regular basis.

41:33.266 --> 41:36.566 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
So my mother who grew up
a diehard Braves fan.

41:36.666 --> 41:39.766 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
I took her to the
first Braves game back

41:39.866 --> 41:42.266 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
at Milwaukee County Stadium,
and I talk about the story

41:42.366 --> 41:44.166 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
a little bit in the
beginning of the book.

41:44.266 --> 41:47.300 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
Unfortunately, Greg Maddux
was just lights out that day.

41:47.400 --> 41:49.233 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
The Brewers did not really
look good against him

41:49.333 --> 41:53.333 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
but my mom stood and
she booed the Braves,

41:53.433 --> 41:56.033 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
just to get it
out of her system.
(laughter)

41:56.133 --> 41:59.433 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
I did live up to that promise
I made her as a young lad.

41:59.533 --> 42:02.433 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
And then, one more graph, you
knew it was coming, right?

42:02.533 --> 42:05.933 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
All right, so here is
a retention graph.

42:06.033 --> 42:08.400 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
Now this one I love for a
couple of different reasons.

42:08.500 --> 42:10.966 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
So, the way this works is,
this is the first year,

42:11.066 --> 42:13.866 align:left position:22.5%,start line:77% size:67.5%
so this is 100% of your
attendance the first
year you're in there.

42:13.966 --> 42:16.333 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
So your number may
vary from city to city

42:16.433 --> 42:19.000 align:left position:22.5%,start line:89% size:67.5%
but that's 100%, right?

42:19.100 --> 42:22.233 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
So as we break the numbers
down, look what happens.

42:22.333 --> 42:27.033 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
The Milwaukee Braves went
up over their 100% mark

42:27.133 --> 42:31.466 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
all the way out to year six,
going into year seven,

42:31.566 --> 42:33.533 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
when it went below where
they had been in '53,

42:33.633 --> 42:36.066 align:left position:15%,start line:89% size:75%
and progressively slid down.

42:36.166 --> 42:38.200 align:left position:20%,start line:89% size:70%
In Atlanta, look at this.

42:38.300 --> 42:40.300 align:left position:15%,start line:89% size:75%
They dropped off right away.

42:40.400 --> 42:43.566 align:left position:20%,start line:83% size:70%
They never got, we use 13
years or 13 baseball seasons,

42:43.666 --> 42:46.100 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
for all the graphs I
showed you was 13 seasons

42:46.200 --> 42:47.866 align:left position:15%,start line:89% size:75%
to compare apples to apples,

42:47.966 --> 42:49.533 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
the Braves experience
versus everybody else.

42:49.633 --> 42:53.100 align:left position:12.5%,start line:83% size:77.5%
Look at this. In Atlanta, they
never got close to 100%

42:53.200 --> 42:56.400 align:left position:22.5%,start line:77% size:67.5%
of where they had been
in '66 when the team
first played there.

42:56.500 --> 42:58.200 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
Look at again, the
Milwaukee Brewers.

42:58.300 --> 43:00.066 align:left position:30%,start line:89% size:60%
They dropped off.

43:00.166 --> 43:03.466 align:left position:25%,start line:83% size:65%
The team was not very
good, they get above 100%.

43:03.566 --> 43:06.633 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
And they get going, and
they're above that benchmark,

43:06.733 --> 43:08.300 align:left position:30%,start line:83% size:60%
until you get to
right here, and again,

43:08.400 --> 43:11.333 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
this was the strike in 1981
and they came out of it in '82,

43:11.433 --> 43:13.133 align:left position:32.5%,start line:83% size:57.5%
of course go to
the World Series.

43:13.233 --> 43:15.966 align:left position:15%,start line:83% size:75%
They set the record initially
at County Stadium in '83,

43:16.066 --> 43:17.700 align:left position:32.5%,start line:83% size:57.5%
then attendance
kind of settled in.

43:17.800 --> 43:19.166 align:left position:12.5%,start line:89% size:77.5%
Certainly it's much higher now.

43:19.266 --> 43:21.333 align:left position:27.5%,start line:83% size:62.5%
I was at the Braves
game over the weekend,

43:21.433 --> 43:24.133 align:left position:17.5%,start line:83% size:72.5%
and I think on their final
game, the attendance so far

43:24.233 --> 43:26.766 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
for the year is up over
1.6 million already,

43:26.866 --> 43:28.933 align:left position:22.5%,start line:83% size:67.5%
and we're only halfway
through the year.

43:29.033 --> 43:36.033 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
So again, Lou Perini, Boston,
1952, they drew 280,000.

43:36.133 --> 43:38.766 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
In 2018 in Milwaukee
we're at 1.6 million

43:38.866 --> 43:41.100 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
and we're just barely over
halfway through the season.

43:41.200 --> 43:43.500 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
So that's the difference
that attendance will do.

43:43.600 --> 43:45.333 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
Now, one last thing.

43:46.533 --> 43:48.833 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
Finances have everything
to do with this.

43:48.933 --> 43:51.633 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
The local business community
did what they could

43:51.733 --> 43:53.333 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
to support the team
while they were here.

43:53.433 --> 43:55.333 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
They simply could not
match up with the dollars

43:55.433 --> 43:57.366 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
that Coca-Cola could
bring to the table.

43:57.466 --> 44:01.300 align:left position:32.5%,start line:5% size:57.5%
It's one of the
reasons ultimately
why the team would go.

44:01.400 --> 44:03.166 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
I will say this.

44:03.266 --> 44:06.600 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
If the decision to move,
if that would have been

44:06.700 --> 44:08.233 align:left position:30%,start line:5% size:60%
10 years earlier
or 10 years later,

44:08.333 --> 44:10.533 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
so if they would have
looked to take them,

44:10.633 --> 44:13.566 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
say in 19, you know if
the Braves would have
come even earlier,

44:13.666 --> 44:16.800 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
I don't know if the Braves
would have ever left.

44:16.900 --> 44:18.766 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
And certainly 10 years later
that wouldn't have happened.

44:18.866 --> 44:22.600 align:left position:17.5%,start line:5% size:72.5%
Had they been able to lock
the Braves into a long-
term deal in 1957,

44:22.700 --> 44:24.833 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
sign them to a 10-year lease,

44:24.933 --> 44:27.366 align:left position:25%,start line:5% size:65%
meant that they were
locked through the 1967,

44:27.466 --> 44:29.533 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
Atlanta would have gone
to look for somebody else.

44:29.633 --> 44:32.433 align:left position:15%,start line:5% size:75%
The two teams they wanted was
either the Cleveland Indians
or the Milwaukee Braves,

44:32.533 --> 44:35.300 align:left position:22.5%,start line:5% size:67.5%
were the only two teams
that had leases coming up.

44:35.400 --> 44:37.700 align:left position:20%,start line:5% size:70%
If Milwaukee County would
have had the foresight

44:37.800 --> 44:40.066 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
to get a long-term
lease in place,

44:41.700 --> 44:43.500 align:left position:12.5%,start line:5% size:77.5%
the Braves might still be here.

44:43.600 --> 44:47.600 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
That is my story on
the Milwaukee Braves
and their fan base.

44:47.700 --> 44:50.400 align:left position:27.5%,start line:5% size:62.5%
Thank you very much
for coming today.

44:50.500 --> 44:53.500 align:left position:37.5%,start line:5% size:52.5%
(applause)