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>> Norma Saldivar: Good evening.

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Thank you so much

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for being with us this evening.

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It's my distinct pleasure to

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introduce this evening's

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Hilldale Lecturer.

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The Hilldale Lecture Series was

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inaugurated in 1973, and is

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sponsored by the four divisional

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committees of the faculty.

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Through the Hilldale Lecture

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Series, we are given the

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opportunity to hear from

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distinguished thinkers who have

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contributed to contemporary

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culture and science, and have

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received international

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recognition and acclaim.

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This evening's guest is most

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definitely a man of distinction,

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and undeniably worthy to be with

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us tonight as the Hilldale

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Lecturer.

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A journalist and writer, our

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guest began his distinguished

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career here in Madison as a true

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cub reporter while still in high

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school, reporting on the local

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war protests.

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He is currently Associate Editor

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at the Washington Post, where he

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has worked since 1977.

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In 1993, he won his first

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Pulitzer Prize for National

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Reporting, for his work on the

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life and times of Bill Clinton.

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In 2008, he was part of the team

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of reporters who won the

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Pulitzer for coverage of the

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Virginia Tech tragedy.

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That same year, the 2008

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Pulitzer Gold Medal Award went

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to the team reporting on Walter

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Reed Medical Center, for which

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he served as editor.

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In addition, he has been a

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Pulitzer finalist twice for his

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achievements in journalism and

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then again for his book, They

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Marched Into Sunlight, the

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inspiration for the Sunlight

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Project and Symposium.

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Tonight's distinguished guest

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has also written on a variety of

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subjects, which include

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critically acclaimed and best

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selling books, First in his

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Class, a biography about Bill

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Clinton; Rome 1960: When the

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World Stirred at the Summer

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Olympics; Clemente: The Passion

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and Grace of Baseball's Last

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Hero; and When Pride Still

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Mattered: A Life of Vince

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Lombardi, which incidentally,

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has been adapted to the stage

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and opened this past October on

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Broadway at Circle in the Square

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Theater, starring Dan Lauria and

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Judith Light.

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His latest book released in

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January is an anthology of his

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newspaper articles entitled Into

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the Story: A Writer's Journey

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Through Life, Politics, Sports

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and Loss.

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His current work is a

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multi-generational biography of

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Barack Obama entitled Out of

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This World, to be published in

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2012.

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Our guest is a fellow of a

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Society of American Historians.

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He's the son of a newspaper

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editor, a husband to

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environmentalist Linda, father

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to Andre and Sarah, grandfather

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to Heidi and Eva, and a resident

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of Washington, DC, and his

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hometown Madison, Wisconsin.

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He's a man of distinction who's

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written works of great detail,

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revelation, depth and humanity.

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In reading his writing, and then

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meeting our guest, I'm reminded

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of a wonderful quote by the

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great American playwright

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Tennessee Williams, who once

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said, "If the writing is honest,

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it cannot be separated from the

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man who wrote it."

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Ladies and gentlemen, I am very

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pleased to present to you, this

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evening's Hilldale Lecturer,

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David Maraniss.

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[APPLAUSE]

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>> David Maraniss: Thank you,

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Norma, Andrew and all of the

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people who made this conference

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possible, and the Memorial

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Union, of which I am now on the

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Board of Directors, largely

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because I used to hang out here

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and not go to class, and to

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Dean Sheehan, and everyone

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who made this possible.

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In Madison, again, we live in

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interesting times.

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I grew up here.

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So did my wife.

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We went to school here.

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We came back to do research for

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the book about which this

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conference is about, They

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Marched Into Sunlight, in 2001,

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and realized that we could come

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home again.

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So we bought a house here and

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spend as much time as my work

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allows, and to be honest, as

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much time as the weather allows

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here.

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But Madison, as you all know, is

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a special place, really, unlike

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almost anywhere else in America.

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Part of it is the natural

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beauty.

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Part of it is the progressive

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tradition of this city and of

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this university.

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The sifting and winnowing in

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search of truth.

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And most of it really has to do

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with the people, who are

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incredibly startlingly friendly,

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first of all.

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When you come from Washington,

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my wife said that the first

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encounter she had when we landed

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on Wednesday was in the Women's

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room at the airport, where two

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women were in a fight over who

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was more sorry for whatever they

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were doing.

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I'm sorry.

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No, I'm sorry.

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No, I'm sorry.

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And that's Madison.

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So it's startling friendliness,

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and intelligence, and a

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progressive political awareness

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that is always welcoming and

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uplifting to come back to,

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especially from Washington.

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I wish I'd been here a few weeks

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ago, during the uprising at the

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capitol.

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But even now, this is a

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fascinating time to be back, and

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to be here dealing with the

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subjects of our discussions, and

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our dances of these two days,

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which connect so interestingly

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to what's going on in the past.

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I emphasize these dances,

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because they're really want

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brought me here.

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You know, I'm honored to be able

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to speak and be called a

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Hilldale Lecturer, and I'm

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fascinated by the panel

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discussions that are going on.

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But it's the dance that really

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is where my heart is right now.

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Several years ago, a great

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choreographer and friend of mine

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named Robin Becker called me and

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said that she wanted to try to

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something with the book that

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she'd read, They Marched Into

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Sunlight.

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My standing joke is that all of

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my books are in various stages

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of not being made into movies.

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One of them actually is a play

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on Broadway right now, Lombardi,

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which is great fun.

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But of all the different

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possible art forms, there's

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something about modern dance,

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and a transformation of a book

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into dance that I just found

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fascinating and actually

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thrilling.

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I've been to several of the

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workshops of this particular

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dance in New York City at the

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92nd Street Y.

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I have not seen Jin-Wen's dance

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yet, but I know that that will

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be fabulous, too.

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But all of this, and we're

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actually going to show one scene

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from Robin Becker's dance during

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my speech, because as I said,

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I'm not here to talk, I'm here

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to be part of this larger

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effort.

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One dance is really worth a

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thousand words, especially of my

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words.

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You know, in some ways, the

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Madison of today resonates with

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the Madison of 1967, the time of

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my book and of these dances.

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Both were years of intensifying

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public protest, of people

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standing up against powerful

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interests, challenging the

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government and corporate

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interests, questioning the

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morality and legality of an

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action.

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Then, it was the war in Vietnam.

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Now, it's the war against public

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workers, teachers.

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All public movements, all great

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movements, when you boil it down

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to the essence, they are a

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combination of at least two

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important things.

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One is idealism.

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And the other is self-interest.

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That's not putting self interest

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in a negative light, it's just

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what can drive people to these

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moments.

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You always wonder, when was

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Madison going to come back and

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be what it was in the 1960s.

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And unfortunately or fortunately

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in some ways, it took something

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of this magnitude.

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But when you look at any of the

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great movements in American

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history, and world history, but

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in America, you have the civil

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rights movement, the women's

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feminist movement.

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Around the world, the fall of

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Eastern Europe, the revolutions

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that started spreading from

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Tunisia to Egypt and through the

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Middle East.

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All of these have that same

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combination, a yearning for

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freedom and idealism, and also a

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feeling of people that they're

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getting a raw deal, and that's

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the self-interest.

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In Madison, not only the

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combination of jobs, the value

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of real work, the worth of

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teachers and labor unions,

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questions about a society where

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a pair of billionaires can

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mettle with and try to undo the

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great progressive traditions of

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this state, what one of the

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great professors here, Bill

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Cronon, called a radical break

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from the progressive traditions

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of this state, what this state

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stands for.

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The combination in the '60s

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really was a yearning for peace,

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a distaste for this war, and

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also the self-interest was the

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draft.

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It's the largest difference,

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whenever you analyze what

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happened in Madison or around

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this country in the 1960s and

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the war in Vietnam, and what

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happened starting with the 1991

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invasion of Iraq and then

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the wars of George W. Bush,

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was the draft.

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Every one of us, every guy my

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age, every girlfriend of someone

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my age, every mother and father,

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had to deal with, what is that

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person going to do.

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Am I going to oppose the war?

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Am I going to go to prison?

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Am I going to burn my draft

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card?

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Am I going to go?

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Am I going to try to get out of

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it some way?

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You know, join the International

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Guard, or eating my way out of

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it, or whatever.

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Every single person, and I

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didn't mean to make it flippant,

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because it was a very serious

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discussion.

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It was the fuel of that whole

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movement.

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So you shouldn't denigrate that

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notion of self-interest, because

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it can fuel idealism in very

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powerful ways.

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It touched everyone, because of

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that, in a way that it doesn't

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today.

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The soldiers who come home

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today, it'd be as though

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the 99.8% of society had no clue

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what they'd endured.

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There are many serious

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differences, of course, between

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then and now.

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And one of the interesting ones,

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which is a positive today, is

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that when you looked at the

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anti-war movement from the time

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of this book, one of the goals

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of so many people who were

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leading the movement,

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particularly on college campuses

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like Madison, was to try to

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spread it into the larger

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community.

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That was a constant discussion

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about how do you get people

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outside of this campus to see

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what's going on, and to be part

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of this.

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It was largely unsuccessful in

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many ways.

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Today, it's inherently

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successful.

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The coalition that's built in

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the last month or so, six weeks,

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in Wisconsin, it's fully joined.

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You have the fire fighters,

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the teachers, the laborers,

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the janitors, the students,

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the teaching assistants, and

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the professors, and people of

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all stripes being bound in this

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single cause.

12:47.000 --> 12:50.000
Then of course, part of the

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story of my book, which takes

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place on October 19, 1967, was

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the behavior of Madison police

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when they marched into the

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Commerce Building, now Ingraham

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Hall, stormed into that building

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wielding batons and bashing

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heads.

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Now, in this remarkable

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sensibility of today, you find

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mostly, the police at the state

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capitol, I wish I were there,

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but I've heard many reports that

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the police were neutral, or

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sympathetic, or would take off

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their uniforms and be part of

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it.

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So there was a wholly different

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sociological sensibility at

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work.

13:39.000 --> 13:41.000
When They Marched Into Sunlight

13:41.000 --> 13:43.000
came out in 2003, I would say

13:43.000 --> 13:46.000
that it was about a time when

13:46.000 --> 13:49.000
Americans were fighting and

13:49.000 --> 13:51.000
dying in a place where they

13:51.000 --> 13:53.000
didn't know the language or the

13:53.000 --> 13:55.000
culture, where they didn't know

13:55.000 --> 13:56.000
who was a friend or who was an

13:56.000 --> 13:59.000
enemy, they were fighting a war

13:59.000 --> 14:01.000
that was started under very

14:01.000 --> 14:03.000
questionable circumstances, and

14:03.000 --> 14:05.000
that no one seemed to know how

14:05.000 --> 14:07.000
to end.

14:07.000 --> 14:09.000
There were also these profound

14:09.000 --> 14:12.000
questions about the meaning of

14:12.000 --> 14:14.000
patriotism, and the role of

14:14.000 --> 14:18.000
dissent in American life.

14:18.000 --> 14:19.000
It was about Vietnam, that I was

14:19.000 --> 14:21.000
talking, but it had a very

14:21.000 --> 14:25.000
familiar ring, it echoes several

14:25.000 --> 14:27.000
years ago, unfortunately, as it

14:27.000 --> 14:29.000
still does today.

14:29.000 --> 14:32.000
My book and these dances are

14:32.000 --> 14:35.000
about war and peace.

14:35.000 --> 14:37.000
The book is a non-fiction

14:37.000 --> 14:39.000
account of two days in October,

14:39.000 --> 14:42.000
1967, when the war was raging in

14:42.000 --> 14:44.000
Vietnam, and the anti-war

14:44.000 --> 14:46.000
movement was raging here at

14:46.000 --> 14:47.000
home.

14:47.000 --> 14:49.000
In Vietnam, a battalion of the

14:49.000 --> 14:51.000
First Infantry Division, the

14:51.000 --> 14:53.000
Black Lions Battalion, marched

14:53.000 --> 14:56.000
off into the jungle on what was

14:56.000 --> 14:58.000
called a search and destroy

14:58.000 --> 14:59.000
mission.

14:59.000 --> 15:04.000
The strategy of the war machine

15:04.000 --> 15:07.000
at that point was to search and

15:07.000 --> 15:09.000
destroy the North Vietnamese and

15:09.000 --> 15:10.000
the Viet Cong and they'll win

15:10.000 --> 15:12.000
the war, just a battle of

15:12.000 --> 15:13.000
attrition.

15:13.000 --> 15:15.000
Go out and find them and kill

15:15.000 --> 15:16.000
them, and it's over.

15:16.000 --> 15:18.000
This battalion marched into the

15:18.000 --> 15:20.000
jungle 44 miles northwest of

15:20.000 --> 15:22.000
Saigon.

15:22.000 --> 15:24.000
Unknowingly marching into an

15:24.000 --> 15:27.000
ambush, 160 American soldiers,

15:27.000 --> 15:30.000
1200 Viet Cong, the First Viet

15:30.000 --> 15:32.000
Cong Division.

15:32.000 --> 15:35.000
The men of that battalion saw

15:35.000 --> 15:37.000
the worst that man could do to

15:37.000 --> 15:38.000
man that day.

15:38.000 --> 15:40.000
Sixty of them were killed, the

15:40.000 --> 15:41.000
other 60 wounded in that single

15:41.000 --> 15:44.000
battle.

15:44.000 --> 15:46.000
At the same time, here at the

15:46.000 --> 15:49.000
University of Wisconsin, the Dow

15:49.000 --> 15:51.000
protest was underway against Dow

15:51.000 --> 15:53.000
Chemical Company, the makers of

15:53.000 --> 15:55.000
Napalm and Agent Orange, who

15:55.000 --> 15:58.000
came to the campus to recruit.

15:58.000 --> 16:00.000
In that protest, the sit down

16:00.000 --> 16:02.000
strike at the Commerce building

16:02.000 --> 16:04.000
turned into the first violent

16:04.000 --> 16:07.000
confrontation on a college

16:07.000 --> 16:09.000
campus of the Vietnam War, when

16:09.000 --> 16:11.000
the police went in there and

16:11.000 --> 16:13.000
essentially started their own

16:13.000 --> 16:15.000
riot.

16:15.000 --> 16:17.000
And in Washington at that very

16:17.000 --> 16:20.000
moment, Lyndon Johnson had no

16:20.000 --> 16:21.000
clue how to deal with the war or

16:21.000 --> 16:23.000
the antiwar.

16:23.000 --> 16:25.000
At the very moment, there's a

16:25.000 --> 16:28.000
12-hour time difference between

16:28.000 --> 16:31.000
Vietnam and Washington, DC,

16:31.000 --> 16:35.000
it was 8:30 in the morning in

16:35.000 --> 16:38.000
Vietnam when this battalion left

16:38.000 --> 16:41.000
their night perimeter, their

16:41.000 --> 16:43.000
base camp, and marched into the

16:43.000 --> 16:46.000
jungle, largely to their deaths.

16:46.000 --> 16:47.000
It was 8:30 at night, the

16:47.000 --> 16:49.000
previous night, in Washington.

16:49.000 --> 16:51.000
Johnson was meeting with his war

16:51.000 --> 16:52.000
council and turned to his

16:52.000 --> 16:54.000
Secretary of Defense, Robert

16:54.000 --> 16:57.000
McNamara, and uttered the words,

16:57.000 --> 17:01.000
"How are we ever going to win?"

17:04.000 --> 17:05.000
Those are the specifics

17:05.000 --> 17:06.000
of the story, much of which

17:06.000 --> 17:10.000
is conveyed in these dances.

17:10.000 --> 17:12.000
But the themes are really what

17:12.000 --> 17:13.000
drive my book, and what

17:13.000 --> 17:16.000
energized Robin's amazing dance

17:16.000 --> 17:19.000
and Jin-Wen's dance, as well.

17:19.000 --> 17:21.000
As different as these soldiers

17:21.000 --> 17:23.000
and students were, young

17:23.000 --> 17:25.000
protesters, on the surface,

17:25.000 --> 17:27.000
really more bound them together

17:27.000 --> 17:29.000
than separated them.

17:29.000 --> 17:30.000
It's the commonality of the

17:30.000 --> 17:33.000
human experience that the dances

17:33.000 --> 17:35.000
evoke, and that fascinate me and

17:35.000 --> 17:37.000
are at the core of my book.

17:37.000 --> 17:39.000
The fears, the questions, people

17:39.000 --> 17:42.000
facing the unknown.

17:42.000 --> 17:43.000
Young soldiers and young

17:43.000 --> 17:46.000
protesters, not equivalent in

17:46.000 --> 17:48.000
terms of the consequences of

17:48.000 --> 17:49.000
what might happen to them that

17:49.000 --> 17:51.000
day, but equivalent in terms of

17:51.000 --> 17:53.000
the choices they had to make.

17:53.000 --> 17:55.000
What do you do?

17:55.000 --> 17:56.000
Whom do you trust?

17:56.000 --> 17:57.000
What are the consequences

17:57.000 --> 17:58.000
of your actions?

17:58.000 --> 18:00.000
Where's the line drawn between

18:00.000 --> 18:04.000
self preservation and virtue?

18:04.000 --> 18:06.000
Heading off to the unknown.

18:06.000 --> 18:07.000
Young versus old.

18:07.000 --> 18:09.000
The young being betrayed

18:09.000 --> 18:10.000
by the old.

18:10.000 --> 18:12.000
Brother versus brother.

18:12.000 --> 18:15.000
Love and hate.

18:15.000 --> 18:16.000
The meaning of loyalty

18:16.000 --> 18:18.000
and patriotism.

18:18.000 --> 18:21.000
And the eternal sorrow of war.

19:11.000 --> 19:16.000
♪ ♪

25:48.000 --> 25:51.000
(applause)

26:07.000 --> 26:08.000
>> That's Joe and Yoko

26:08.000 --> 26:10.000
from Robin Becker's amazing

26:10.000 --> 26:13.000
dance troupe.

26:13.000 --> 26:15.000
Thank you.

26:15.000 --> 26:17.000
(applause)

26:26.000 --> 26:29.000
Dance, obviously, is an

26:29.000 --> 26:30.000
expression of the body.

26:30.000 --> 26:34.000
It's the language.

26:34.000 --> 26:38.000
Body is a language.

26:38.000 --> 26:40.000
Robin and I both, I mean, I'm

26:40.000 --> 26:42.000
not a choreographer.

26:42.000 --> 26:44.000
It'd be laughable to see me try

26:44.000 --> 26:46.000
to dance.

26:46.000 --> 26:49.000
But we share this common view

26:49.000 --> 26:51.000
that the issues of war and peace

26:51.000 --> 26:53.000
can be told so powerfully in

26:53.000 --> 26:56.000
terms of the body.

26:56.000 --> 26:57.000
And when you think about it in

26:57.000 --> 26:58.000
so many ways, I mean, think

26:58.000 --> 27:01.000
of the images that stick in

27:01.000 --> 27:02.000
your mind, that are etched in

27:02.000 --> 27:04.000
your mind.

27:04.000 --> 27:06.000
That naked girl running from the

27:06.000 --> 27:10.000
napalm in Vietnam, the body.

27:10.000 --> 27:12.000
In my book, the story that

27:12.000 --> 27:14.000
haunts me the most is a very

27:14.000 --> 27:16.000
little story of a kid named

27:16.000 --> 27:18.000
Tom Coburn, the youngest member

27:18.000 --> 27:20.000
of the Black Lions Battalion,

27:20.000 --> 27:22.000
17 years old.

27:22.000 --> 27:24.000
So skinny that he could hide

27:24.000 --> 27:26.000
behind a rubber tree about this

27:26.000 --> 27:28.000
thick.

27:28.000 --> 27:31.000
In the midst of that battle,

27:31.000 --> 27:33.000
there were Viet Cong up in the

27:33.000 --> 27:35.000
trees, tied up into the trees.

27:35.000 --> 27:37.000
And Tom Coburn had found a

27:37.000 --> 27:39.000
moment of safety underneath the

27:39.000 --> 27:41.000
tree.

27:41.000 --> 27:43.000
And five yards away

27:43.000 --> 27:44.000
was one of his comrades,

27:44.000 --> 27:47.000
who was being shot at.

27:47.000 --> 27:49.000
Tom Coburn had to deal with

27:49.000 --> 27:53.000
what to do.

27:53.000 --> 27:54.000
Should he go out there and try

27:54.000 --> 27:57.000
to save that comrade and get

27:57.000 --> 27:59.000
killed himself, or should he

27:59.000 --> 28:01.000
try to preserve himself?

28:01.000 --> 28:03.000
He's only 17 years old.

28:03.000 --> 28:04.000
It's an unfair question to put

28:04.000 --> 28:06.000
to any human being, and

28:06.000 --> 28:08.000
especially a 17-year-old kid

28:08.000 --> 28:10.000
in a strange country

28:10.000 --> 28:12.000
fighting for he knows not what.

28:12.000 --> 28:15.000
Coburn stayed where he was,

28:15.000 --> 28:18.000
didn't move.

28:18.000 --> 28:20.000
It's haunted him

28:20.000 --> 28:21.000
his entire life.

28:21.000 --> 28:23.000
When I first called him to

28:23.000 --> 28:25.000
interview him for my book, he

28:25.000 --> 28:29.000
was living in Pontiac, Michigan.

28:29.000 --> 28:33.000
I told him that I was trying to

28:33.000 --> 28:35.000
talk to every soldier from that

28:35.000 --> 28:36.000
battalion who had survived

28:36.000 --> 28:38.000
the battle.

28:38.000 --> 28:41.000
About 20 seconds into what I was

28:41.000 --> 28:43.000
saying, he started crying

28:43.000 --> 28:45.000
and said, "I can't talk."

28:45.000 --> 28:47.000
This was 28 years after the

28:47.000 --> 28:50.000
battle.

28:50.000 --> 28:53.000
So I marked down his name and

28:53.000 --> 28:55.000
remembered that I would try to

28:55.000 --> 28:57.000
reach him again, because there

28:57.000 --> 28:59.000
must be some story there.

28:59.000 --> 29:02.000
Finally, three years later,

29:02.000 --> 29:04.000
there was a reunion of the

29:04.000 --> 29:06.000
soldiers, coming together

29:06.000 --> 29:08.000
largely because I had found them

29:08.000 --> 29:10.000
and brought them together.

29:10.000 --> 29:11.000
Tom Coburn came to that reunion

29:11.000 --> 29:14.000
out in Las Vegas.

29:14.000 --> 29:17.000
The body.

29:17.000 --> 29:19.000
He said he was ready to talk to

29:19.000 --> 29:21.000
me, that he trusted me.

29:21.000 --> 29:22.000
All of the soldiers had told him

29:22.000 --> 29:24.000
to talk to me.

29:24.000 --> 29:25.000
And he started telling me

29:25.000 --> 29:26.000
that story that I just told you

29:26.000 --> 29:29.000
about that moment when he froze,

29:29.000 --> 29:31.000
and how all of these years after

29:31.000 --> 29:33.000
that, any time he was in any

29:33.000 --> 29:34.000
situation where he heard a loud

29:34.000 --> 29:38.000
noise, it would freak him out,

29:38.000 --> 29:40.000
and he couldn't hold jobs

29:40.000 --> 29:42.000
because of that, and people

29:42.000 --> 29:43.000
would make fun of him.

29:43.000 --> 29:45.000
And when he had a job in a

29:45.000 --> 29:47.000
moving company, some young kids

29:47.000 --> 29:49.000
who worked there, punks, would

29:49.000 --> 29:50.000
just make loud noises on purpose

29:50.000 --> 29:54.000
to watch him run away.

29:54.000 --> 29:56.000
He was telling me this story,

29:56.000 --> 29:58.000
and telling me of being under

29:58.000 --> 29:59.000
that tree, and not being able to

29:59.000 --> 30:01.000
move.

30:01.000 --> 30:03.000
He was holding a glass of water

30:03.000 --> 30:05.000
and the glass started shaking

30:05.000 --> 30:07.000
more and more, until it spilled

30:07.000 --> 30:08.000
all over his body while I was

30:08.000 --> 30:10.000
talking to him.

30:10.000 --> 30:13.000
That's the impact of war.

30:13.000 --> 30:15.000
The body.

30:15.000 --> 30:17.000
When my wife Linda and I went to

30:17.000 --> 30:19.000
Illinois, as we were doing the

30:19.000 --> 30:20.000
research, we went to a place the

30:20.000 --> 30:22.000
Peace Hospital, which is full of

30:22.000 --> 30:24.000
kids whose fathers from Vietnam

30:24.000 --> 30:29.000
had fought in areas where there

30:29.000 --> 30:31.000
were large swaths of Agent

30:31.000 --> 30:33.000
Orange.

30:33.000 --> 30:35.000
These children are deformed.

30:35.000 --> 30:37.000
There was this little

30:37.000 --> 30:40.000
15-year-old girl who was about

30:40.000 --> 30:42.000
3-foot high.

30:42.000 --> 30:43.000
She had drawn a painting that

30:43.000 --> 30:45.000
she gave to me.

30:45.000 --> 30:46.000
There was another beautiful girl

30:46.000 --> 30:48.000
who had black splotches all over

30:48.000 --> 30:50.000
her body.

30:50.000 --> 30:52.000
There were dozens, scores of

30:52.000 --> 30:54.000
these kids at this hospital, all

30:54.000 --> 30:56.000
of whom had felt a generational

30:56.000 --> 31:00.000
effect on the body of war.

31:00.000 --> 31:02.000
And it continues into the new

31:02.000 --> 31:04.000
century.

31:04.000 --> 31:06.000
One of my best friends, Michael

31:06.000 --> 31:08.000
Weisskopf, a fellow journalist

31:08.000 --> 31:10.000
with whom I wrote a book, and

31:10.000 --> 31:12.000
have worked for 30 years, went

31:12.000 --> 31:14.000
to Iraq to cover it.

31:14.000 --> 31:16.000
He was in a Humvee with

31:16.000 --> 31:18.000
soldiers, something came into

31:18.000 --> 31:20.000
the Humvee, he just

31:20.000 --> 31:21.000
instinctively picked it up to

31:21.000 --> 31:23.000
throw it out.

31:23.000 --> 31:24.000
He saved six lives and lost his

31:24.000 --> 31:26.000
right arm.

31:26.000 --> 31:31.000
He'll never have that arm again.

31:31.000 --> 31:33.000
The story of Greg Gadson, who

31:33.000 --> 31:36.000
was a football player

31:36.000 --> 31:38.000
at West Point.

31:38.000 --> 31:40.000
One of the characters in my

31:40.000 --> 31:42.000
book, one of the scenes from

31:42.000 --> 31:44.000
Robin's dance is called

31:44.000 --> 31:46.000
Holleder's Run.

31:46.000 --> 31:48.000
Donald Holleder was an

31:48.000 --> 31:49.000
All American football player

31:49.000 --> 31:51.000
at West Point.

31:51.000 --> 31:52.000
He was a major in Vietnam.

31:52.000 --> 31:54.000
He was in a helicopter when this

31:54.000 --> 31:56.000
ambush got underway.

31:56.000 --> 31:58.000
He landed the helicopter and

31:58.000 --> 32:00.000
started running instinctively

32:00.000 --> 32:02.000
toward the trouble.

32:02.000 --> 32:04.000
He got shot down, running just

32:04.000 --> 32:06.000
as he did as a quarterback for

32:06.000 --> 32:09.000
the Army football team.

32:09.000 --> 32:11.000
Thirty years later, Greg Gadson,

32:11.000 --> 32:13.000
another great football player

32:13.000 --> 32:16.000
from West Point is in Iraq.

32:16.000 --> 32:18.000
In 2007, a roadside bomb goes

32:18.000 --> 32:20.000
off, he loses both legs and one

32:20.000 --> 32:22.000
arm.

32:22.000 --> 32:25.000
He sort of became adopted by the

32:25.000 --> 32:27.000
Black Lions who I had written

32:27.000 --> 32:29.000
about in this book.

32:29.000 --> 32:31.000
So, I go to visit Greg

32:31.000 --> 32:34.000
at Walter Reed.

32:34.000 --> 32:36.000
An incredible survivor, this

32:36.000 --> 32:39.000
powerful black man from

32:39.000 --> 32:41.000
Virginia, who had gone off to

32:41.000 --> 32:43.000
fight in Iraq, and gave two legs

32:43.000 --> 32:45.000
and an arm.

32:45.000 --> 32:49.000
Just seeing him all the times I

32:49.000 --> 32:52.000
did was a constant reminder of

32:52.000 --> 32:56.000
war in the body.

32:56.000 --> 32:59.000
I thought I'd turned Greg into a

32:59.000 --> 33:00.000
Packers fan because I gave him a

33:00.000 --> 33:02.000
copy of my Lombardi book.

33:02.000 --> 33:04.000
I don't know if any of you

33:04.000 --> 33:06.000
remember, but the next year when

33:06.000 --> 33:09.000
the Packers played the New York

33:09.000 --> 33:11.000
Giants in the NFL-NFC

33:11.000 --> 33:13.000
championship game, Greg Gadson

33:13.000 --> 33:15.000
is on the Giants' sideline,

33:15.000 --> 33:17.000
their good luck charm.

33:17.000 --> 33:19.000
So, I've always blamed him for

33:19.000 --> 33:23.000
that loss.

33:23.000 --> 33:26.000
The body and Walter Reed.

33:26.000 --> 33:28.000
Two of my great friends at the

33:28.000 --> 33:30.000
Washington Post, who I edited,

33:30.000 --> 33:32.000
Dana Priest and Anne Hull, spent

33:32.000 --> 33:34.000
many months going over to a

33:34.000 --> 33:36.000
certain part of Walter Reed.

33:36.000 --> 33:38.000
This is a vast medical center in

33:38.000 --> 33:39.000
Washington.

33:39.000 --> 33:42.000
Terrific medical care.

33:42.000 --> 33:43.000
Greg Gadson was alive because of

33:43.000 --> 33:45.000
the medical care, and how it's

33:45.000 --> 33:47.000
changed since the era of

33:47.000 --> 33:48.000
Vietnam.

33:48.000 --> 33:50.000
He would've died in Vietnam.

33:50.000 --> 33:51.000
So many of these soldiers in the

33:51.000 --> 33:53.000
modern wars come home with these

33:53.000 --> 33:56.000
incredible wounds.

33:56.000 --> 33:58.000
Wounds of the body and of the

33:58.000 --> 33:59.000
soul.

33:59.000 --> 34:01.000
So Walter Reed was great at

34:01.000 --> 34:02.000
fixing them.

34:02.000 --> 34:04.000
And then it could care less

34:04.000 --> 34:05.000
about them, after that first

34:05.000 --> 34:07.000
moment, if they're no longer of

34:07.000 --> 34:08.000
any use to the Army, to the

34:08.000 --> 34:10.000
military machine.

34:10.000 --> 34:12.000
So there was this whole quarter

34:12.000 --> 34:14.000
of Walter Reed Medical Center

34:14.000 --> 34:16.000
that people didn't know about,

34:16.000 --> 34:17.000
where they were warehousing,

34:17.000 --> 34:19.000
essentially, these soldiers who

34:19.000 --> 34:21.000
weren't ready to go back into

34:21.000 --> 34:23.000
the military, were not ready to

34:23.000 --> 34:25.000
go home, still recovering from

34:25.000 --> 34:27.000
their wounds.

34:27.000 --> 34:29.000
They were living in a hell hole

34:29.000 --> 34:31.000
that had mold on the walls.

34:31.000 --> 34:33.000
There were mice droppings

34:33.000 --> 34:34.000
everywhere.

34:34.000 --> 34:38.000
That series of stories really

34:38.000 --> 34:43.000
exposed decades of hypocrisy, of

34:43.000 --> 34:48.000
sort of the military right wing

34:48.000 --> 34:51.000
seizing the issue of patriotism

34:51.000 --> 34:53.000
and making it theirs.

34:53.000 --> 34:54.000
And it was all fine, except when

34:54.000 --> 34:55.000
the soldiers were of no use to

34:55.000 --> 34:57.000
them anymore, then they were

34:57.000 --> 34:59.000
housed at Walter Reed in this

34:59.000 --> 35:03.000
godforsaken place.

35:03.000 --> 35:06.000
And it was the body.

35:10.000 --> 35:12.000
In 1967, Lyndon Johnson

35:12.000 --> 35:15.000
was president.

35:15.000 --> 35:16.000
Today, the president

35:16.000 --> 35:17.000
is Barack Obama.

35:17.000 --> 35:19.000
I'm writing a book

35:19.000 --> 35:21.000
about Barack Obama.

35:21.000 --> 35:22.000
I wrote a book in which LBJ

35:22.000 --> 35:24.000
was a character.

35:24.000 --> 35:26.000
It's fascinating and haunting to

35:26.000 --> 35:30.000
me that really, Barack Obama is

35:30.000 --> 35:32.000
president.

35:32.000 --> 35:33.000
He wouldn't be president if not

35:33.000 --> 35:34.000
for Lyndon Johnson.

35:34.000 --> 35:36.000
We all have these contradictions

35:36.000 --> 35:38.000
in us.

35:38.000 --> 35:39.000
But it was exactly on Barack

35:39.000 --> 35:42.000
Obama's third birthday, August

35:42.000 --> 35:45.000
4, 1964, that the Senate passed

35:45.000 --> 35:47.000
the final version of the Civil

35:47.000 --> 35:51.000
Rights Act that made Barack

35:51.000 --> 35:53.000
Obama possible.

35:53.000 --> 35:56.000
It was that signing of that bill

35:56.000 --> 35:59.000
on Barack Obama's birthday, when

35:59.000 --> 36:01.000
Johnson turned to his aid Bill

36:01.000 --> 36:03.000
Moyers and said, "We've lost.

36:03.000 --> 36:04.000
The democratic party has lost

36:04.000 --> 36:06.000
the country for a generation,"

36:06.000 --> 36:07.000
which for the most part

36:07.000 --> 36:11.000
turned out to be true.

36:11.000 --> 36:13.000
But it also produced, all those

36:13.000 --> 36:14.000
years later, the first black

36:14.000 --> 36:16.000
president in American history.

36:16.000 --> 36:18.000
If you don't count Bill Clinton.

36:18.000 --> 36:21.000
(laughter)

36:21.000 --> 36:22.000
Despite all the falsehoods

36:22.000 --> 36:25.000
and mythology, and boy,

36:25.000 --> 36:27.000
do I get bombarded with it,

36:27.000 --> 36:28.000
that the right wing has spread

36:28.000 --> 36:30.000
about Obama, the birthers

36:30.000 --> 36:32.000
and the whole notion

36:32.000 --> 36:34.000
of where he was born.

36:34.000 --> 36:36.000
I've been to Kenya.

36:36.000 --> 36:39.000
He wasn't born there.

36:39.000 --> 36:40.000
I've been to Hawaii.

36:40.000 --> 36:41.000
To believe that he was not

36:41.000 --> 36:43.000
born in Hawaii, you would

36:43.000 --> 36:44.000
have to believe that there was

36:44.000 --> 36:45.000
a conspiracy involving

36:45.000 --> 36:48.000
the newspapers in Honolulu

36:48.000 --> 36:51.000
in August, 1961, that they knew

36:51.000 --> 36:52.000
that this person was going to

36:52.000 --> 36:54.000
grow up to be the first black

36:54.000 --> 36:55.000
president of the United States,

36:55.000 --> 36:56.000
and that he really wasn't born

36:56.000 --> 36:57.000
there, so we're just going to

36:57.000 --> 36:58.000
pretend, that we should put

36:58.000 --> 36:59.000
his birth announcement

36:59.000 --> 37:01.000
in the newspaper.

37:04.000 --> 37:05.000
Anyway, despite all of those

37:05.000 --> 37:10.000
falsehoods, Barack Obama did

37:10.000 --> 37:14.000
grow up in Hawaii in a very

37:14.000 --> 37:16.000
different milieu than the

37:16.000 --> 37:18.000
people of my generation, the

37:18.000 --> 37:21.000
post-war baby boom generation.

37:21.000 --> 37:23.000
He did grow up with a liberal,

37:23.000 --> 37:25.000
antiwar mother, although she was

37:25.000 --> 37:26.000
not in the United States for a

37:26.000 --> 37:29.000
lot of the '60s, she was in

37:29.000 --> 37:32.000
Indonesia.

37:32.000 --> 37:34.000
But he also grew up in Honolulu.

37:34.000 --> 37:37.000
A black kid in a place where

37:37.000 --> 37:38.000
there were very few other

37:38.000 --> 37:40.000
African Americans.

37:40.000 --> 37:42.000
And the only other ones were in

37:42.000 --> 37:44.000
the military at Hickam Air Force

37:44.000 --> 37:46.000
Base, and at Schofield Barracks,

37:46.000 --> 37:48.000
Pearl Harbor.

37:48.000 --> 37:50.000
So Barack Obama was never

37:50.000 --> 37:52.000
anti-military.

37:52.000 --> 37:54.000
His first instinct was to see

37:54.000 --> 37:55.000
the military as a place that was

37:55.000 --> 37:56.000
something where people of his

37:56.000 --> 37:59.000
color could go.

37:59.000 --> 38:02.000
Many people supported him in the

38:02.000 --> 38:05.000
2008 election, I'm sure people

38:05.000 --> 38:07.000
in this room, because of what he

38:07.000 --> 38:10.000
did in 2003, when he, in

38:10.000 --> 38:12.000
Chicago, at the Federal Plaza,

38:12.000 --> 38:14.000
gave a speech opposing the war

38:14.000 --> 38:16.000
in Iraq before it started, the

38:16.000 --> 38:19.000
downtown rally in Chicago.

38:19.000 --> 38:21.000
But Barack Obama was very

38:21.000 --> 38:23.000
cautious when he appeared at

38:23.000 --> 38:24.000
that rally.

38:24.000 --> 38:26.000
He was worried that his words

38:26.000 --> 38:28.000
would be misinterpreted.

38:28.000 --> 38:30.000
His first words in that speech

38:30.000 --> 38:32.000
were, "Let me begin by saying

38:32.000 --> 38:34.000
that although this has been

38:34.000 --> 38:35.000
billed as an antiwar rally,

38:35.000 --> 38:37.000
I stand before you as someone

38:37.000 --> 38:39.000
who is not opposed to war

38:39.000 --> 38:41.000
in all circumstances."

38:41.000 --> 38:42.000
And he used that refrain

38:42.000 --> 38:44.000
throughout the speech.

38:44.000 --> 38:46.000
"I don't oppose all wars."

38:46.000 --> 38:47.000
He went on to talk about the

38:47.000 --> 38:48.000
civil war that drove away the

38:48.000 --> 38:50.000
scourge of slavery, and World

38:50.000 --> 38:52.000
War II, where his grandfather

38:52.000 --> 38:55.000
fought against the Nazis,

38:55.000 --> 38:57.000
and two of his great uncles,

38:57.000 --> 38:59.000
including one who walked into

38:59.000 --> 39:00.000
one of the concentration camps,

39:00.000 --> 39:02.000
Ohrdruf, right after it was

39:02.000 --> 39:05.000
liberated.

39:08.000 --> 39:11.000
Then going into Afghanistan and

39:11.000 --> 39:16.000
9/11, he supported those, too.

39:16.000 --> 39:18.000
We're still in Afghanistan,

39:18.000 --> 39:24.000
ten years later.

39:24.000 --> 39:25.000
That's 2-1/2 times the length

39:25.000 --> 39:28.000
of World War II

39:28.000 --> 39:31.000
and of the Civil War,

39:31.000 --> 39:34.000
we've been in Afghanistan.

39:34.000 --> 39:36.000
Obama's entire life, as I've

39:36.000 --> 39:38.000
studied it, has been an effort

39:38.000 --> 39:42.000
to avoid traps.

39:42.000 --> 39:45.000
He avoided the trap of life

39:45.000 --> 39:48.000
without a father, his Kenyan

39:48.000 --> 39:51.000
father and mother really never

39:51.000 --> 39:53.000
lived together, not even for the

39:53.000 --> 39:54.000
two years that you think they

39:54.000 --> 39:56.000
might've.

39:56.000 --> 39:58.000
His father was never there.

39:58.000 --> 40:00.000
He avoided the trap of being

40:00.000 --> 40:02.000
born what in Hawaii they call a

40:02.000 --> 40:05.000
"Hapa," a mixed race kid, on an

40:05.000 --> 40:08.000
island further away from any

40:08.000 --> 40:10.000
land mass than anywhere in the

40:10.000 --> 40:13.000
world.

40:13.000 --> 40:15.000
He avoided the trap of being

40:15.000 --> 40:16.000
black in a white dominated

40:16.000 --> 40:18.000
society.

40:18.000 --> 40:21.000
The traps of the anger that can

40:21.000 --> 40:23.000
overwhelm a young black man in

40:23.000 --> 40:25.000
this society.

40:25.000 --> 40:26.000
The traps of politics in

40:26.000 --> 40:29.000
Chicago, which is by definition

40:29.000 --> 40:32.000
a trap, and the politics of

40:32.000 --> 40:34.000
Springfield, Illinois, and of

40:34.000 --> 40:36.000
Washington, DC.

40:36.000 --> 40:38.000
But the traps of war are so

40:38.000 --> 40:40.000
different from all of those

40:40.000 --> 40:42.000
others.

40:42.000 --> 40:44.000
And he hasn't shown yet that

40:44.000 --> 40:45.000
he's figured out how to avoid

40:45.000 --> 40:49.000
these traps or get around them.

40:49.000 --> 40:51.000
From my study of him, I've said

40:51.000 --> 40:54.000
for two years that I thought he

40:54.000 --> 40:56.000
would figure it out.

40:56.000 --> 40:58.000
And now to be honest, I just

40:58.000 --> 41:00.000
don't know.

41:00.000 --> 41:01.000
It's a very difficult situation

41:01.000 --> 41:03.000
for him.

41:03.000 --> 41:06.000
One of the differences between

41:06.000 --> 41:09.000
now and 1967 is the regard that

41:09.000 --> 41:12.000
all of us, whether we opposed

41:12.000 --> 41:15.000
the war in Afghanistan, the war

41:15.000 --> 41:18.000
in Iraq, any wars that are going

41:18.000 --> 41:20.000
on now, the regard that we give

41:20.000 --> 41:23.000
the soldiers.

41:23.000 --> 41:24.000
It wasn't that way in the

41:24.000 --> 41:26.000
Vietnam War.

41:26.000 --> 41:27.000
And any Vietnam vet will tell

41:27.000 --> 41:29.000
you.

41:29.000 --> 41:30.000
You know, whether they got spit

41:30.000 --> 41:32.000
on when they came home, some of

41:32.000 --> 41:34.000
that is mythology, but it's real

41:34.000 --> 41:35.000
in the sense that it represents

41:35.000 --> 41:37.000
the sensibility that they felt

41:37.000 --> 41:38.000
they were facing, that the

41:38.000 --> 41:40.000
country could not care less

41:40.000 --> 41:42.000
about them.

41:42.000 --> 41:44.000
That's changed, and that's great

41:44.000 --> 41:47.000
and very important.

41:47.000 --> 41:48.000
It's important to the body of

41:48.000 --> 41:51.000
these soldiers, to their souls.

41:51.000 --> 41:53.000
But there's a way to honor

41:53.000 --> 41:55.000
soldiers without falling into

41:55.000 --> 41:57.000
the trappings of militaristic

41:57.000 --> 41:59.000
nationalism.

41:59.000 --> 42:01.000
That's something that, in my

42:01.000 --> 42:03.000
opinion, this university's most

42:03.000 --> 42:05.000
brilliant history professor

42:05.000 --> 42:07.000
ever, George Mosse, wrote about

42:07.000 --> 42:09.000
so powerfully.

42:09.000 --> 42:11.000
It was an essay he wrote that I

42:11.000 --> 42:12.000
found, and it's in my book,

42:12.000 --> 42:15.000
about military cemeteries.

42:15.000 --> 42:17.000
He wrote, "What then are the

42:17.000 --> 42:19.000
ways in which the tragic reality

42:19.000 --> 42:22.000
of war was made manageable and

42:22.000 --> 42:23.000
acceptable.

42:23.000 --> 42:25.000
Central to the confrontation

42:25.000 --> 42:28.000
with mass death, was the cult of

42:28.000 --> 42:30.000
the fallen soldier.

42:30.000 --> 42:32.000
And like all the sacred in our

42:32.000 --> 42:34.000
civilization, it was not

42:34.000 --> 42:35.000
something new or invented for

42:35.000 --> 42:37.000
the purpose, but based upon

42:37.000 --> 42:39.000
ancient religious feeling, the

42:39.000 --> 42:41.000
adaptation of Christian piety to

42:41.000 --> 42:43.000
the war experience.

42:43.000 --> 42:45.000
The death of the fallen, their

42:45.000 --> 42:47.000
sacrifices for the nation, was

42:47.000 --> 42:49.000
often linked to the passion and

42:49.000 --> 42:50.000
resurrection of Christ.

42:50.000 --> 42:52.000
This was symbolized, for example

42:52.000 --> 42:54.000
by the design of English war

42:54.000 --> 42:55.000
cemeteries, all of which contain

42:55.000 --> 42:57.000
the cross of sacrifice, the

42:57.000 --> 42:59.000
cross upon which a sword was

42:59.000 --> 43:01.000
superimposed.

43:01.000 --> 43:04.000
Sometimes, such a cross faced a

43:04.000 --> 43:06.000
chapel of resurrection.

43:06.000 --> 43:07.000
Such linking of national

43:07.000 --> 43:09.000
sacrifice and Christian

43:09.000 --> 43:11.000
sacrifice no doubt made it

43:11.000 --> 43:12.000
easier to come to terms with the

43:12.000 --> 43:15.000
tragedy of war.

43:15.000 --> 43:17.000
Military cemeteries symbolized

43:17.000 --> 43:18.000
this confrontation with mass

43:18.000 --> 43:20.000
death.

43:20.000 --> 43:21.000
As places of national and

43:21.000 --> 43:22.000
Christian worship, they made it

43:22.000 --> 43:24.000
easier to accept death by

43:24.000 --> 43:25.000
transcending it.

43:25.000 --> 43:27.000
But even while continuing to

43:27.000 --> 43:29.000
honor the memory of the fallen,

43:29.000 --> 43:32.000
we must never lose our horror,

43:32.000 --> 43:35.000
never try to integrate war and

43:35.000 --> 43:36.000
its consequences into our

43:36.000 --> 43:38.000
longing for the sacred.

43:38.000 --> 43:40.000
If we confront mass death

43:40.000 --> 43:42.000
naked," as these dances do and

43:42.000 --> 43:46.000
will, "stripped of all myth, we

43:46.000 --> 43:48.000
may finally have more of a

43:48.000 --> 43:49.000
chance to avoid making the

43:49.000 --> 43:51.000
devil's pact with that

43:51.000 --> 43:53.000
aggressive nationalism, whose

43:53.000 --> 43:57.000
blood trail marked our century."

43:57.000 --> 43:58.000
That was George Mosse

43:58.000 --> 44:01.000
writing in the 1960s.

44:01.000 --> 44:04.000
And it still prevails today.

44:04.000 --> 44:05.000
So blessed are the peacemakers

44:05.000 --> 44:07.000
and the dancers.

44:07.000 --> 44:09.000
Thank you very much.

44:09.000 --> 44:13.000
(applause)