1 00:00:00,600 --> 00:00:03,133 (bright music) 2 00:00:03,133 --> 00:00:04,600 (upbeat music) 3 00:00:04,600 --> 00:00:06,200 - [Narrator] Welcome back to OTR. 4 00:00:06,200 --> 00:00:07,500 Our guest this week is the Chairperson 5 00:00:07,500 --> 00:00:09,833 of the Oakland County Republican Party, 6 00:00:09,833 --> 00:00:12,500 former state representative Rocky Raczkowski. 7 00:00:12,500 --> 00:00:13,933 On the OTR panel, 8 00:00:13,933 --> 00:00:17,266 MSU journalism majors, Kyle Davidson, Sophia Lada, 9 00:00:17,266 --> 00:00:18,833 and Daniel James. 10 00:00:18,833 --> 00:00:22,166 Sitting with us as we get the inside out, Off the Record. 11 00:00:25,566 --> 00:00:28,400 - Production of Off the Record is made possible 12 00:00:28,400 --> 00:00:30,700 in part by Martin Waymire, 13 00:00:30,700 --> 00:00:33,200 a full service strategic communications agency, 14 00:00:33,200 --> 00:00:35,600 partnering with clients through public relations, 15 00:00:35,600 --> 00:00:38,900 digital marketing, and public policy engagement. 16 00:00:38,900 --> 00:00:42,233 Learn more at martinwaymire.com. 17 00:00:42,233 --> 00:00:45,900 And now this addition of Off the Record with Tim Skubick. 18 00:00:47,366 --> 00:00:48,333 - Thank you very much. 19 00:00:48,333 --> 00:00:49,700 Welcome back to Off the Record. 20 00:00:49,700 --> 00:00:50,966 You've seen these people before. 21 00:00:50,966 --> 00:00:53,133 When did we do this earlier? 22 00:00:53,133 --> 00:00:54,000 What month was that? 23 00:00:54,000 --> 00:00:54,833 - February. 24 00:00:54,833 --> 00:00:55,666 - Was it February? 25 00:00:55,666 --> 00:00:56,933 - Wow! 26 00:00:56,933 --> 00:00:58,466 It seems like eons ago, doesn't it? 27 00:00:58,466 --> 00:01:00,300 Kyle, what have you been up to since we saw you last? 28 00:01:00,300 --> 00:01:02,000 - Oh well, I mean obviously think most 29 00:01:02,000 --> 00:01:03,200 of us here are seniors, 30 00:01:03,200 --> 00:01:04,433 so I've been pushing for graduation, 31 00:01:04,433 --> 00:01:07,100 but I mean in terms of journalism and politics, 32 00:01:07,100 --> 00:01:08,300 I've actually been working 33 00:01:08,300 --> 00:01:11,700 on a media literacy initiative with Pointer, 34 00:01:11,700 --> 00:01:13,300 their media wise initiative. 35 00:01:13,300 --> 00:01:14,933 So that's been really interesting 36 00:01:14,933 --> 00:01:17,133 and I've gotten to learn a lot of interesting skills 37 00:01:17,133 --> 00:01:18,433 about fact checking. 38 00:01:18,433 --> 00:01:20,033 - [Tim] Media literacy? 39 00:01:20,033 --> 00:01:21,066 - Yeah, yeah. 40 00:01:21,066 --> 00:01:22,133 - [Tim] What is that? 41 00:01:22,133 --> 00:01:23,733 - Well it's essentially the best way 42 00:01:23,733 --> 00:01:26,866 I can describe it as just critical thinking skills 43 00:01:26,866 --> 00:01:28,333 to use online when you're scrolling 44 00:01:28,333 --> 00:01:29,600 through social media, 45 00:01:29,600 --> 00:01:31,566 because you're gonna see a lot of misinformation 46 00:01:31,566 --> 00:01:34,466 on there related to a variety of things. 47 00:01:34,466 --> 00:01:36,666 I know one of the things that we've kind of been focusing 48 00:01:36,666 --> 00:01:38,733 on fact checking is, kind of some 49 00:01:38,733 --> 00:01:41,666 of the information you see about the Russia-Ukraine war, 50 00:01:41,666 --> 00:01:44,900 some information you might see about elections, 51 00:01:44,900 --> 00:01:48,033 climate change or things like the COVID-19 vaccine. 52 00:01:48,033 --> 00:01:50,100 - So you're trying to clean up the internet? 53 00:01:50,100 --> 00:01:51,733 - Trying, trying. 54 00:01:51,733 --> 00:01:53,233 It feels like an uphill battle sometimes. 55 00:01:53,233 --> 00:01:55,833 - I mean if you take all the non-informed opinion out of it, 56 00:01:55,833 --> 00:01:56,933 you got nothing. 57 00:01:56,933 --> 00:01:58,066 (Kyle laughs) 58 00:01:58,066 --> 00:02:00,133 You like that or not? 59 00:02:00,133 --> 00:02:03,000 - You know Tim I just kind of gotta work with what I have. 60 00:02:03,000 --> 00:02:04,733 So ultimately we try to stick with things 61 00:02:04,733 --> 00:02:06,966 that are verifiably false. 62 00:02:06,966 --> 00:02:08,466 We're a non-partisan initiative. 63 00:02:08,466 --> 00:02:10,266 So a lot of times we see something, 64 00:02:10,266 --> 00:02:12,166 it's focused on checking things 65 00:02:12,166 --> 00:02:13,866 that you can actually double-check. 66 00:02:13,866 --> 00:02:14,966 - So then when you find that out, 67 00:02:14,966 --> 00:02:16,600 what do you do with that? 68 00:02:16,600 --> 00:02:19,200 - Well, usually what I do when I'm hunting 69 00:02:19,200 --> 00:02:21,566 for misinformation in the wild is I kind of turned around 70 00:02:21,566 --> 00:02:23,400 because part of our initiative is that we go 71 00:02:23,400 --> 00:02:24,600 to college students, 72 00:02:24,600 --> 00:02:26,433 we go to colleges all across the country 73 00:02:26,433 --> 00:02:29,800 and we get presentations, where do you find this stuff? 74 00:02:29,800 --> 00:02:30,966 How do you spot it? 75 00:02:30,966 --> 00:02:32,466 How do you check it? 76 00:02:32,466 --> 00:02:35,966 So I'll generally save those examples for my presentation. 77 00:02:35,966 --> 00:02:36,900 I'll put them in there and I'm like, 78 00:02:36,900 --> 00:02:38,666 "Hey, here's an example of this 79 00:02:38,666 --> 00:02:40,600 "and here's how you can check it out." 80 00:02:40,600 --> 00:02:41,766 - Well good. 81 00:02:41,766 --> 00:02:42,700 It sounds like you're doing good work. 82 00:02:42,700 --> 00:02:43,500 Sophia, what are you up to? 83 00:02:43,500 --> 00:02:44,700 - What am I up to? 84 00:02:44,700 --> 00:02:47,000 Definitely a lot of work and a lot of school 85 00:02:47,000 --> 00:02:50,266 just trying to finish strong and yeah, 86 00:02:50,266 --> 00:02:51,800 still working at the LSJ. 87 00:02:51,800 --> 00:02:54,433 So it's been pretty good for sure since February. 88 00:02:54,433 --> 00:02:55,466 - You're job hunting? 89 00:02:55,466 --> 00:02:56,966 - Job hunting indeed. 90 00:02:56,966 --> 00:03:00,066 Lots of applications out there so we'll see what happens. 91 00:03:00,066 --> 00:03:04,833 - Which one do you want to come back with a yay? 92 00:03:04,833 --> 00:03:07,166 - There are quite a few. 93 00:03:07,166 --> 00:03:09,733 I'm definitely looking at some news places in Detroit 94 00:03:09,733 --> 00:03:11,866 because that's kind of near where I'm from working 95 00:03:11,866 --> 00:03:13,433 so working there would be cool, 96 00:03:13,433 --> 00:03:15,033 but I'm also looking at the Livingston Daily, 97 00:03:15,033 --> 00:03:16,866 which is in the Howell, Brighton area. 98 00:03:16,866 --> 00:03:17,766 - Good luck to you. 99 00:03:17,766 --> 00:03:19,000 - [Sophia] Thank you. 100 00:03:19,000 --> 00:03:19,666 = I know you guys will be successful. 101 00:03:19,666 --> 00:03:20,466 Likewise. 102 00:03:20,466 --> 00:03:21,266 And you got a gig. 103 00:03:21,266 --> 00:03:21,966 You already got one. 104 00:03:21,966 --> 00:03:22,800 - Yep. 105 00:03:22,800 --> 00:03:24,333 I'm really excited. 106 00:03:24,333 --> 00:03:26,466 I'm starting with Mier in June after my study abroad 107 00:03:26,466 --> 00:03:27,733 and I absolutely can't wait. 108 00:03:27,733 --> 00:03:29,200 I think it should be really awesome. 109 00:03:29,200 --> 00:03:30,933 - And so since February, what else have you been doing? 110 00:03:30,933 --> 00:03:32,400 What stories are you working on? 111 00:03:32,400 --> 00:03:33,600 - Oh gosh! 112 00:03:33,600 --> 00:03:36,000 A lot of state politics obviously 113 00:03:36,000 --> 00:03:40,700 ahead of the GOP, the convention in this month actually. 114 00:03:40,700 --> 00:03:42,900 So a lot to do with that. 115 00:03:42,900 --> 00:03:45,966 And then just interviewing candidates. 116 00:03:45,966 --> 00:03:48,900 Miers puts together a series with a lot of the bios. 117 00:03:48,900 --> 00:03:50,600 And so I've been reaching out to a lot 118 00:03:50,600 --> 00:03:52,266 of the candidates in different races, 119 00:03:52,266 --> 00:03:54,266 especially state house and kind of seeing 120 00:03:54,266 --> 00:03:55,800 what they have to say. 121 00:03:55,800 --> 00:03:57,000 - Let me just point out that we are recording this 122 00:03:57,000 --> 00:03:58,400 on the 15th of April 123 00:03:58,400 --> 00:04:00,266 so everything we say that we get wrong, 124 00:04:00,266 --> 00:04:03,933 we'll know after the fact, right? 125 00:04:03,933 --> 00:04:06,300 Let's talk about this governor's race. 126 00:04:06,300 --> 00:04:08,766 Give me some reactions as to what you think's going 127 00:04:08,766 --> 00:04:10,100 on out there. 128 00:04:10,100 --> 00:04:11,500 Sophia? 129 00:04:11,500 --> 00:04:13,100 - I mean, it's definitely very interesting. 130 00:04:13,100 --> 00:04:15,433 There's so many different Republican candidates. 131 00:04:15,433 --> 00:04:18,100 I know Tim in your email to us you said you don't expect us 132 00:04:18,100 --> 00:04:20,433 to know them all because there are so many. 133 00:04:20,433 --> 00:04:21,300 - [Tim] You cannot name them. 134 00:04:21,300 --> 00:04:22,833 - Yeah. 135 00:04:22,833 --> 00:04:24,366 But I know the three of us before the show, 136 00:04:24,366 --> 00:04:26,800 we were just talking a bit about James Craig. 137 00:04:26,800 --> 00:04:30,800 That's one that's definitely pretty well known I'd say. 138 00:04:30,800 --> 00:04:33,000 And I think it'll be really interesting 139 00:04:33,000 --> 00:04:35,266 to see where his support comes from 140 00:04:35,266 --> 00:04:37,433 because he does have a history in Detroit, 141 00:04:37,433 --> 00:04:40,233 but that is also an area that tends to vote blue. 142 00:04:40,233 --> 00:04:42,233 So I think that will just be very interesting 143 00:04:42,233 --> 00:04:44,600 to see what kind of happens with that. 144 00:04:45,800 --> 00:04:46,866 - What do you think? 145 00:04:46,866 --> 00:04:49,033 - Oh gosh! 146 00:04:49,033 --> 00:04:50,600 I've been really interested 147 00:04:50,600 --> 00:04:52,200 in following the Republican Party, 148 00:04:52,200 --> 00:04:54,833 especially because you said there are so many candidates. 149 00:04:54,833 --> 00:04:57,833 Somebody stopped me on my way to the gym yesterday 150 00:04:57,833 --> 00:05:00,133 and asked me about Tudor Dixon and-- 151 00:05:00,133 --> 00:05:00,933 - [Tim] Wait a minute. 152 00:05:00,933 --> 00:05:01,733 Somebody stopped you? 153 00:05:01,733 --> 00:05:02,933 - Yeah. 154 00:05:02,933 --> 00:05:05,033 Collecting signatures for her campaign. 155 00:05:05,033 --> 00:05:05,933 - Whoa! 156 00:05:05,933 --> 00:05:07,133 Goodness. 157 00:05:07,133 --> 00:05:07,966 - Yeah. 158 00:05:07,966 --> 00:05:09,466 Oh, it's like the eight 159 00:05:09,466 --> 00:05:10,633 or ninth time I've been stopped this week I think 160 00:05:10,633 --> 00:05:13,033 in different ballot proposals, 161 00:05:13,033 --> 00:05:14,400 campaigns, things like that. 162 00:05:14,400 --> 00:05:15,266 - [Tim] Fascinating. 163 00:05:15,266 --> 00:05:16,466 - I'm used to it, 164 00:05:16,466 --> 00:05:17,900 but yeah, there's a lot of people on campus. 165 00:05:17,900 --> 00:05:20,400 So she's obviously someone that's on my radar. 166 00:05:20,400 --> 00:05:24,300 I also talk Rebandt yesterday. 167 00:05:24,300 --> 00:05:26,033 I believe I'm pronouncing his name right. 168 00:05:26,033 --> 00:05:28,500 And he had a lot of really interesting things to say too. 169 00:05:28,500 --> 00:05:30,033 I know he just turned in signatures 170 00:05:30,033 --> 00:05:31,633 I wanna say sometime this week. 171 00:05:31,633 --> 00:05:33,900 So getting him in right before the deadline about. 172 00:05:33,900 --> 00:05:36,466 - And what petition people hit you? 173 00:05:36,466 --> 00:05:37,300 - Oh gosh! 174 00:05:37,300 --> 00:05:38,233 There was a few. 175 00:05:38,233 --> 00:05:39,333 There was one for, excuse me, 176 00:05:39,333 --> 00:05:41,100 the governor's abortion ban, 177 00:05:41,100 --> 00:05:44,266 there one on, not ban the opposite, 178 00:05:44,266 --> 00:05:48,866 but I've had a few for lone shark. 179 00:05:48,866 --> 00:05:49,800 Oh gosh! 180 00:05:49,800 --> 00:05:51,266 Everything under the sun really. 181 00:05:51,266 --> 00:05:55,533 All the ballot proposals, the Promote the Vote. 182 00:05:56,700 --> 00:05:58,333 - Which gubernatorial candidate have you heard 183 00:05:58,333 --> 00:05:59,600 the most about? 184 00:05:59,600 --> 00:06:00,566 - Oh gosh! 185 00:06:00,566 --> 00:06:01,433 That's tough. 186 00:06:03,133 --> 00:06:06,600 I mean obviously I would say the governor, 187 00:06:06,600 --> 00:06:08,466 the current governor who we've been doing a lot 188 00:06:08,466 --> 00:06:11,066 of writing about. - Well that's a given. 189 00:06:11,066 --> 00:06:12,333 - But in addition to her, 190 00:06:12,333 --> 00:06:14,800 I would say I've heard a lot about James Craig, 191 00:06:14,800 --> 00:06:16,700 heard a lot about Tudor Dixon, 192 00:06:16,700 --> 00:06:19,000 but I think there are just so many. 193 00:06:19,000 --> 00:06:20,200 It's hard to choose. 194 00:06:20,200 --> 00:06:21,766 - Kyle, what's your take on this? 195 00:06:21,766 --> 00:06:23,033 - Yeah. 196 00:06:23,033 --> 00:06:24,466 I definitely think it's going to be interesting. 197 00:06:24,466 --> 00:06:25,666 As Dani's mentioned, 198 00:06:25,666 --> 00:06:27,600 I mean you hear a lot about James Craig, 199 00:06:27,600 --> 00:06:29,166 you hear a lot about Tudor Dixon. 200 00:06:29,166 --> 00:06:31,533 I'd definitely be interested to see how, 201 00:06:31,533 --> 00:06:34,433 obviously we haven't quite gotten the Trump endorsement yet. 202 00:06:34,433 --> 00:06:38,100 But we did get that brief shout out for Tudor Dixon. 203 00:06:38,100 --> 00:06:39,566 So I'd be interested to see 204 00:06:39,566 --> 00:06:42,566 if that's gonna sway the election in any favor or... 205 00:06:42,566 --> 00:06:44,733 I think a lot of people recognize Craig as one 206 00:06:44,733 --> 00:06:46,933 of the front runners if not the front runner. 207 00:06:46,933 --> 00:06:48,433 So I'd be interested to see, 208 00:06:48,433 --> 00:06:50,633 how things are going to work out between those two 209 00:06:50,633 --> 00:06:52,000 or if we have another candidate 210 00:06:52,000 --> 00:06:55,033 that could end up as the Republican nominee. 211 00:06:55,033 --> 00:06:57,000 - Have you had any chatter with your colleagues, 212 00:06:57,000 --> 00:07:00,466 your peers on the race for governor? 213 00:07:00,466 --> 00:07:01,933 Anybody? 214 00:07:01,933 --> 00:07:04,900 - I mean, I think we always touch on it a little bit 215 00:07:04,900 --> 00:07:06,000 in the Monday meetings but-- 216 00:07:06,000 --> 00:07:07,866 - But those are journals. 217 00:07:07,866 --> 00:07:08,733 (Dani laughs) 218 00:07:08,733 --> 00:07:10,100 They're not real people. 219 00:07:10,100 --> 00:07:12,166 I don't wanna, 220 00:07:12,166 --> 00:07:13,600 you've obviously figured this out 221 00:07:13,600 --> 00:07:15,500 that we're not real people, okay? 222 00:07:15,500 --> 00:07:18,500 But my guess is there's not a lot 223 00:07:18,500 --> 00:07:20,333 of discussion going out there 224 00:07:20,333 --> 00:07:23,633 among folks like you and pick an age group. 225 00:07:23,633 --> 00:07:25,133 They are not following this. 226 00:07:25,133 --> 00:07:26,800 Do you get that sense? 227 00:07:26,800 --> 00:07:28,266 - Yeah, absolutely. 228 00:07:28,266 --> 00:07:31,566 I mean, even with the 2020 presidential election, 229 00:07:31,566 --> 00:07:35,000 a bunch of my peers were not really following it 230 00:07:35,000 --> 00:07:37,366 until after those primaries were over 231 00:07:37,366 --> 00:07:40,200 and after the official nomination was made. 232 00:07:40,200 --> 00:07:42,266 So I could see people becoming more involved 233 00:07:42,266 --> 00:07:43,466 as the election gets closer, 234 00:07:43,466 --> 00:07:44,833 but right now we're in April. 235 00:07:44,833 --> 00:07:46,266 So many months out. 236 00:07:46,266 --> 00:07:50,066 People are just not as interested, young people aren't. 237 00:07:50,066 --> 00:07:52,066 - We ran a story on the program last week 238 00:07:52,066 --> 00:07:54,300 that Donald Trump was going to endorse 239 00:07:54,300 --> 00:07:56,433 in the race for governor, 240 00:07:56,433 --> 00:07:57,500 but get this. 241 00:07:57,500 --> 00:07:58,766 Here's the deal. 242 00:07:58,766 --> 00:08:00,700 He's allegedly made a deal with John Yob 243 00:08:00,700 --> 00:08:02,933 who's a political consultant. 244 00:08:02,933 --> 00:08:05,700 If Yob can deliver the attorney general nomination 245 00:08:05,700 --> 00:08:07,866 for DePerno, okay? 246 00:08:07,866 --> 00:08:09,366 Which Trump wants, 247 00:08:09,366 --> 00:08:11,566 then Perno will deliver the nomination for Yob's candidate 248 00:08:11,566 --> 00:08:13,366 for governor, Perry Johnson. 249 00:08:13,366 --> 00:08:15,066 Welcome to the real world of politics. 250 00:08:15,066 --> 00:08:16,066 Why did you go like that? 251 00:08:16,066 --> 00:08:17,233 You went, mmh. 252 00:08:17,233 --> 00:08:18,566 What do you think of that? 253 00:08:18,566 --> 00:08:20,400 - I think that's definitely interesting. 254 00:08:20,400 --> 00:08:23,000 And that's not something that I'd heard of prior. 255 00:08:23,000 --> 00:08:25,400 So it's obviously, there's a lot of things going on. 256 00:08:25,400 --> 00:08:27,266 There's a lot of moves being made 257 00:08:27,266 --> 00:08:29,733 and obviously I've heard about Perry Johnson, 258 00:08:29,733 --> 00:08:31,833 I've read a few things about his campaign 259 00:08:31,833 --> 00:08:34,000 but when you think of candidates, 260 00:08:34,000 --> 00:08:36,766 that are out there and loud and are available, 261 00:08:36,766 --> 00:08:39,366 Johnson's not one of the immediate people that came to mind 262 00:08:39,366 --> 00:08:42,633 apart from the, what's the thing? 263 00:08:42,633 --> 00:08:43,766 The quality, you know what I'm thinking about, Tim. 264 00:08:47,600 --> 00:08:49,100 - The equality. 265 00:08:49,100 --> 00:08:51,833 - I'm trying to think of the title that he's using. 266 00:08:51,833 --> 00:08:52,766 - Oh! 267 00:08:52,766 --> 00:08:54,733 The quality guru. 268 00:08:54,733 --> 00:08:55,566 - Yeah. 269 00:08:55,566 --> 00:08:56,633 Quality guru. 270 00:08:56,633 --> 00:08:58,100 - Apart from that-- 271 00:08:58,100 --> 00:08:59,200 - Obviously the TV ads haven't worked on you yet. 272 00:08:59,200 --> 00:09:02,266 (Kyle laughs) 273 00:09:02,266 --> 00:09:04,233 They say you've gotta see the ads seven times 274 00:09:04,233 --> 00:09:06,000 before you retain the content. 275 00:09:06,000 --> 00:09:07,400 Maybe if you guys are smarter, 276 00:09:07,400 --> 00:09:08,766 it might be two or three times. 277 00:09:08,766 --> 00:09:12,033 But that really makes a good point. 278 00:09:12,033 --> 00:09:14,866 Okay, here's this guy's running, I'm the guru candidate 279 00:09:14,866 --> 00:09:16,800 and you're struggling to figure out what the heck it was 280 00:09:16,800 --> 00:09:19,100 and you're not alone, obviously. 281 00:09:19,100 --> 00:09:21,900 You did some stuff on the Republican Convention. 282 00:09:23,066 --> 00:09:25,466 What was your takeaway from that? 283 00:09:25,466 --> 00:09:26,666 - Oh gosh! 284 00:09:26,666 --> 00:09:28,100 A lot of what I was most interested 285 00:09:28,100 --> 00:09:29,900 in is how the Republican Party split 286 00:09:29,900 --> 00:09:33,066 ahead of the endorsements. 287 00:09:34,000 --> 00:09:35,533 I think it's going to come down 288 00:09:35,533 --> 00:09:38,133 to how strong the Trump delegation is at the convention, 289 00:09:38,133 --> 00:09:43,100 just because obviously he has his strong pick for DePerno. 290 00:09:43,100 --> 00:09:44,300 But I think there are 291 00:09:44,300 --> 00:09:45,933 a few other really interesting candidates 292 00:09:45,933 --> 00:09:47,433 that may be a little bit more moderate 293 00:09:47,433 --> 00:09:50,133 and may appeal to a greater majority 294 00:09:50,133 --> 00:09:51,100 of the Republican Party. 295 00:09:51,100 --> 00:09:52,366 So we'll see. 296 00:09:52,366 --> 00:09:53,300 - Do you have a take on what's happening? 297 00:09:53,300 --> 00:09:54,900 They meet on the 23rd. 298 00:09:54,900 --> 00:09:57,366 - I mean, it is like Dani said, 299 00:09:57,366 --> 00:09:58,600 very interesting to watch. 300 00:09:58,600 --> 00:10:01,000 It is kind of like a divide right now. 301 00:10:01,000 --> 00:10:06,000 I mean we can see even from the pick for attorney general. 302 00:10:07,300 --> 00:10:09,933 Some Republicans are choosing to favor Tom Leonard 303 00:10:09,933 --> 00:10:12,266 and others are choosing to favor to DePerno 304 00:10:12,266 --> 00:10:15,000 and obviously Trump favors DePerno. 305 00:10:15,000 --> 00:10:17,033 So it's just interesting to see 306 00:10:17,033 --> 00:10:20,333 where is the Republican Party going? 307 00:10:20,333 --> 00:10:23,133 Does this divide come to an end 308 00:10:23,133 --> 00:10:25,433 or is it just gonna continue growing further apart? 309 00:10:25,433 --> 00:10:26,933 - And the good news is after April the 23rd, 310 00:10:26,933 --> 00:10:28,766 we're gonna have a really good sense 311 00:10:28,766 --> 00:10:30,500 as to where this thing is headed. 312 00:10:30,500 --> 00:10:32,600 If Trump ends up getting everybody 313 00:10:32,600 --> 00:10:34,000 that he wants at the convention, 314 00:10:34,000 --> 00:10:36,700 this guy will be invincible going into November. 315 00:10:36,700 --> 00:10:38,333 However, if he takes a hit politically, 316 00:10:38,333 --> 00:10:39,933 people are gonna sit back 317 00:10:39,933 --> 00:10:42,966 and what are they gonna say about Donald Trump? 318 00:10:42,966 --> 00:10:44,533 - Well, if he does take a hit, 319 00:10:44,533 --> 00:10:47,600 that might be a sign that some people 320 00:10:47,600 --> 00:10:49,733 think that Donald Trump's power is fading. 321 00:10:49,733 --> 00:10:51,033 Maybe he might not have 322 00:10:51,033 --> 00:10:53,833 as strong of a hold over Michigan as people say. 323 00:10:53,833 --> 00:10:55,566 I mean obviously it depends, 324 00:10:55,566 --> 00:10:57,600 we'll see nominees come out, 325 00:10:57,600 --> 00:11:00,700 but if you miss one, two, more, 326 00:11:00,700 --> 00:11:03,933 perhaps Donald Trump's influence over Michigan 327 00:11:03,933 --> 00:11:06,000 isn't as strong as some people say it is. 328 00:11:06,000 --> 00:11:07,200 - All right. 329 00:11:07,200 --> 00:11:08,800 Well, let's pursue this issue with our guest 330 00:11:08,800 --> 00:11:11,733 that's called in, Rocky Raczkowski, former state lawmaker. 331 00:11:11,733 --> 00:11:15,666 Now in the private sector and a former Colonel in the army. 332 00:11:15,666 --> 00:11:16,900 Is that right? 333 00:11:16,900 --> 00:11:18,633 What was your MOS representative? 334 00:11:18,633 --> 00:11:20,900 - My MOS was when I was enlisted, I was infantry. 335 00:11:20,900 --> 00:11:23,666 And then I was commissioned as an infantry officer 336 00:11:23,666 --> 00:11:26,600 and a civil military operations officer as well. 337 00:11:26,600 --> 00:11:27,833 - Great. 338 00:11:27,833 --> 00:11:29,300 You're not packing heat on this show, are you? 339 00:11:29,300 --> 00:11:31,566 - Well actually I was told I wasn't allowed 340 00:11:31,566 --> 00:11:34,100 to in my own home by you, Tim. 341 00:11:34,100 --> 00:11:37,333 So I try not to listen to you very much Tim, 342 00:11:37,333 --> 00:11:39,633 but I think a few moments ago 343 00:11:39,633 --> 00:11:41,700 you said that journalists aren't real people. 344 00:11:41,700 --> 00:11:45,700 I think these three are fantastic future of journalism. 345 00:11:45,700 --> 00:11:47,933 And I applaud you for what you're doing 346 00:11:47,933 --> 00:11:51,000 and I encourage you and salute you for the careers 347 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:52,500 that you're gonna move forward. 348 00:11:52,500 --> 00:11:54,433 - Rocky, thank you for that kind words, 349 00:11:54,433 --> 00:11:56,100 because they're absolutely right. 350 00:11:56,100 --> 00:11:57,366 Let me-- 351 00:11:57,366 --> 00:11:58,566 - Now I wasn't speaking to you, Tim. 352 00:11:58,566 --> 00:11:59,566 I was speaking to them. 353 00:11:59,566 --> 00:12:00,633 - I understood. 354 00:12:00,633 --> 00:12:01,866 I got the message. 355 00:12:01,866 --> 00:12:02,700 You're subtle. 356 00:12:02,700 --> 00:12:03,633 Okay. 357 00:12:03,633 --> 00:12:05,133 You are subtle if nothing else. 358 00:12:05,133 --> 00:12:08,233 Look at you, you endorse Tom Leonard for attorney general. 359 00:12:08,233 --> 00:12:11,100 I'm gonna guess that the Trump people are not very happy 360 00:12:11,100 --> 00:12:11,933 with you sir. 361 00:12:13,366 --> 00:12:15,800 - Well I support the President and I supported what he did 362 00:12:15,800 --> 00:12:17,166 when he was in the White House. 363 00:12:17,166 --> 00:12:18,100 - Wait a minute. 364 00:12:18,100 --> 00:12:19,533 If you support the President, 365 00:12:19,533 --> 00:12:21,100 how come you aren't endorsing his guy for AG? 366 00:12:21,100 --> 00:12:22,933 - Tim, can you let me finish my statement? 367 00:12:22,933 --> 00:12:25,533 I think you'd probably get your answer 368 00:12:25,533 --> 00:12:26,766 if you let me finish. 369 00:12:26,766 --> 00:12:28,266 Like I said, 370 00:12:28,266 --> 00:12:29,433 I support the President and I support what he did 371 00:12:29,433 --> 00:12:30,400 when he was in the White House, 372 00:12:30,400 --> 00:12:32,300 but I also support Tom Leonard 373 00:12:32,300 --> 00:12:35,266 as a soldier who fought for people's rights 374 00:12:35,266 --> 00:12:38,933 and most importantly cherish rights. 375 00:12:38,933 --> 00:12:41,200 We believe that every individual has one vote 376 00:12:41,200 --> 00:12:44,766 and every individual has the right to make their own choice. 377 00:12:44,766 --> 00:12:48,566 I support the President, I appreciate what he's done 378 00:12:48,566 --> 00:12:50,833 and I appreciate a lot of things that he does. 379 00:12:50,833 --> 00:12:53,133 The problem that is issued here 380 00:12:53,133 --> 00:12:56,833 is that I have a relationship with Tom Leonard, 381 00:12:56,833 --> 00:12:58,133 I know who Tom Leonard is, 382 00:12:58,133 --> 00:13:00,066 I've evaluated the three candidates. 383 00:13:00,066 --> 00:13:01,566 And as an individual, 384 00:13:01,566 --> 00:13:04,366 that by the way, there's three candidates in this race. 385 00:13:04,366 --> 00:13:05,866 Let's not forget there's Ryan Berman 386 00:13:05,866 --> 00:13:07,900 as well from Oakland County. 387 00:13:07,900 --> 00:13:10,300 And when I looked at who has the best chance 388 00:13:10,300 --> 00:13:11,500 to challenge Dana Nessel, 389 00:13:11,500 --> 00:13:14,200 who's the best for conservative policies 390 00:13:14,200 --> 00:13:15,700 and American First policies 391 00:13:15,700 --> 00:13:18,300 and actually has a record of ethics and integrity, 392 00:13:18,300 --> 00:13:20,966 I looked at Ryan Berman and Tom Leonard 393 00:13:20,966 --> 00:13:21,900 and Matt DePerno 394 00:13:21,900 --> 00:13:23,833 and I said Tom Leonard's the one 395 00:13:23,833 --> 00:13:25,400 that's gonna earn my support. 396 00:13:25,400 --> 00:13:27,366 - In fact, if DePerno gets the nomination, 397 00:13:27,366 --> 00:13:30,100 the Republicans will lose the AG race, right? 398 00:13:30,100 --> 00:13:31,333 - No. 399 00:13:31,333 --> 00:13:32,366 Not true at all. 400 00:13:32,366 --> 00:13:33,600 Not true at all. 401 00:13:33,600 --> 00:13:35,533 If Matt DePerno wins the AG race, 402 00:13:35,533 --> 00:13:38,800 I'm gonna support DePerno for attorney general. 403 00:13:38,800 --> 00:13:40,966 Anyone is better than the embarrassment that gets drunk 404 00:13:40,966 --> 00:13:44,366 at MSU U of M football games than this attorney general. 405 00:13:44,366 --> 00:13:47,900 - Isn't that a cheap shot representative? 406 00:13:47,900 --> 00:13:50,600 - Well, it would be a cheap shot if it wasn't true. 407 00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:52,333 It is true so it's not a cheap shot. 408 00:13:52,333 --> 00:13:54,966 This Attorney General puts politics 409 00:13:54,966 --> 00:13:57,733 above her job and that's not cheap shot. 410 00:13:57,733 --> 00:13:59,633 I'll take that all the way to the bank 411 00:13:59,633 --> 00:14:01,600 because it's absolutely fact. 412 00:14:01,600 --> 00:14:04,700 - Jamie, question? 413 00:14:04,700 --> 00:14:07,000 - I guess my question for you is going 414 00:14:07,000 --> 00:14:09,900 into the convention, are you concerned about-- 415 00:14:09,900 --> 00:14:10,700 - Did I say Jamie? 416 00:14:10,700 --> 00:14:11,766 I mean, Dani. 417 00:14:11,766 --> 00:14:12,600 - You're totally fine. 418 00:14:12,600 --> 00:14:13,400 - [Rocky] Dani. 419 00:14:13,400 --> 00:14:14,666 Dani, Tim. 420 00:14:14,666 --> 00:14:15,933 - [Tim] There you go. 421 00:14:15,933 --> 00:14:16,766 Yeah, right. 422 00:14:16,766 --> 00:14:17,966 There you go. 423 00:14:17,966 --> 00:14:19,166 - Are you concerned about the split, 424 00:14:19,166 --> 00:14:20,833 between the two, I guess, there are three, 425 00:14:20,833 --> 00:14:22,433 but the two bigger candidates 426 00:14:22,433 --> 00:14:24,500 and your endorsement and some 427 00:14:24,500 --> 00:14:27,333 of the more moderate Republican Party's endorsement 428 00:14:27,333 --> 00:14:29,266 versus Donald Trump's? 429 00:14:29,266 --> 00:14:30,733 - No, I'm really not. 430 00:14:30,733 --> 00:14:33,133 And the interesting thing here is that this also happened 431 00:14:33,133 --> 00:14:34,566 to the Democratic Primary 432 00:14:34,566 --> 00:14:38,300 or the Democratic Caucus back in 20, what is it? 433 00:14:38,300 --> 00:14:40,933 2018 when Dana Nessel was not supposed 434 00:14:40,933 --> 00:14:42,700 to be the candidate of choice. 435 00:14:42,700 --> 00:14:45,300 And she got elected in November. 436 00:14:45,300 --> 00:14:46,966 So when we look at this, 437 00:14:46,966 --> 00:14:49,566 people get heated over elections. 438 00:14:49,566 --> 00:14:52,300 Obviously before the primaries 439 00:14:52,300 --> 00:14:54,200 or before a party picks a candidate, 440 00:14:54,200 --> 00:14:55,600 there's gonna be an internal battle. 441 00:14:55,600 --> 00:14:58,433 But in the end we come together and we fight 442 00:14:58,433 --> 00:15:01,633 for the candidate that will do the best 443 00:15:01,633 --> 00:15:02,900 for what we believe in. 444 00:15:02,900 --> 00:15:05,966 And I truly believe that we will win in November. 445 00:15:07,800 --> 00:15:09,000 - Yeah. 446 00:15:09,000 --> 00:15:11,200 So you've talked a lot about Dana Nessel. 447 00:15:11,200 --> 00:15:12,766 This is kind of a two part question, 448 00:15:12,766 --> 00:15:15,300 but what do you think is something 449 00:15:15,300 --> 00:15:17,466 that she's done really well during her time? 450 00:15:17,466 --> 00:15:20,466 And then what are some things that you think your pick 451 00:15:20,466 --> 00:15:22,666 Tom Leonard could do a really good job of 452 00:15:22,666 --> 00:15:27,600 or better during his term if he were to be elected? 453 00:15:27,600 --> 00:15:28,766 - Well, what's interesting 454 00:15:28,766 --> 00:15:31,766 Sophia is the nominating convention is held 455 00:15:31,766 --> 00:15:35,800 on Saturday, tomorrow in Grand Rapids for the Republicans. 456 00:15:35,800 --> 00:15:37,600 And you ask a very interesting question, 457 00:15:37,600 --> 00:15:40,133 what do I think Dana Nessel has done well. 458 00:15:40,133 --> 00:15:42,266 I think she's done well performing 459 00:15:42,266 --> 00:15:45,900 as a humorist clown as the attorney general. 460 00:15:45,900 --> 00:15:47,333 I don't mean this in a negative way. 461 00:15:47,333 --> 00:15:51,333 I truly try not to attack anyone individually, 462 00:15:51,333 --> 00:15:56,333 but she has made a art of putting out jokes on her Twitter 463 00:15:57,800 --> 00:15:59,800 and on her Facebook page, which aren't always funny, 464 00:15:59,800 --> 00:16:02,166 but she's tried to be funny. 465 00:16:02,166 --> 00:16:05,533 I guess she's done a fairly decent job at that. 466 00:16:05,533 --> 00:16:07,000 As far as attorney general, 467 00:16:07,000 --> 00:16:10,166 I don't think she's done very many things very well. 468 00:16:11,300 --> 00:16:12,600 By the way I do applaud her 469 00:16:12,600 --> 00:16:16,500 for actually bringing charges forward. 470 00:16:16,500 --> 00:16:18,500 I believe she brought the charges forward 471 00:16:18,500 --> 00:16:22,300 on the Southfield City Clerk who was brought forward 472 00:16:22,300 --> 00:16:23,800 on election integrity charges 473 00:16:23,800 --> 00:16:26,900 or switching absentee ballots. 474 00:16:26,900 --> 00:16:28,500 I also believe 475 00:16:28,500 --> 00:16:32,366 she brought some charges forward on a couple individuals 476 00:16:32,366 --> 00:16:36,533 that were charged with election ballot tampering 477 00:16:36,533 --> 00:16:41,533 or ballot fraud in 2020. 478 00:16:42,400 --> 00:16:43,633 So there are a few things 479 00:16:43,633 --> 00:16:46,433 that she's done or her office has done. 480 00:16:46,433 --> 00:16:49,533 But I think that Tom Leonard brings number one, 481 00:16:49,533 --> 00:16:53,266 a understanding of how to serve people. 482 00:16:53,266 --> 00:16:56,800 Not just Democrats, but all people. 483 00:16:56,800 --> 00:17:00,833 Tom Leonard won't put his political agenda above the law. 484 00:17:00,833 --> 00:17:04,366 If the law says something, he will enforce that law. 485 00:17:04,366 --> 00:17:06,066 Tom Leonard has a level of culture. 486 00:17:06,066 --> 00:17:10,566 He's not gonna go to a MSU or U of M football game 487 00:17:10,566 --> 00:17:12,500 and act improperly. 488 00:17:12,500 --> 00:17:14,400 He won't find that amongst Tom Leonard. 489 00:17:14,400 --> 00:17:18,433 And he's definitely a solid individual 490 00:17:18,433 --> 00:17:20,233 that will put all men and women 491 00:17:20,233 --> 00:17:23,933 on an equal playing field and defend our rights as citizens 492 00:17:23,933 --> 00:17:26,500 and will fight for the state of Michigan 493 00:17:26,500 --> 00:17:28,966 when we're basically being challenged 494 00:17:28,966 --> 00:17:30,266 by the federal government. 495 00:17:31,466 --> 00:17:33,100 - Now Rocky, I have a question. 496 00:17:33,100 --> 00:17:34,433 So I was just wondering, 497 00:17:34,433 --> 00:17:36,200 what's kind of your view of the landscape here, 498 00:17:36,200 --> 00:17:38,533 especially related to kind of the power 499 00:17:38,533 --> 00:17:40,066 of that Trump endorsement. 500 00:17:40,066 --> 00:17:43,133 I mean, do you think that this could be concerning 501 00:17:43,133 --> 00:17:44,566 for Leonard or do you think 502 00:17:44,566 --> 00:17:46,333 that Leonard has a strong enough base to kind 503 00:17:46,333 --> 00:17:50,866 of overcome this presidential endorsement? 504 00:17:52,333 --> 00:17:54,266 - Well, let's be honest that the President's endorsement 505 00:17:54,266 --> 00:17:58,166 is very strong and a lot of people are still, 506 00:17:58,166 --> 00:17:59,733 if the election were held today, 507 00:17:59,733 --> 00:18:01,166 let me backtrack and say this, 508 00:18:01,166 --> 00:18:04,933 that Kyle if the election were held today, 509 00:18:04,933 --> 00:18:08,800 President Trump would overwhelmingly win Michigan. 510 00:18:08,800 --> 00:18:12,100 If people could take back their votes from 2020 511 00:18:12,100 --> 00:18:14,533 or whatever happened in 2020 and look forward 512 00:18:14,533 --> 00:18:17,100 and see what Biden and Harris have done 513 00:18:17,100 --> 00:18:18,366 to the United States, 514 00:18:18,366 --> 00:18:20,600 they'd say "We want President Trump back 515 00:18:20,600 --> 00:18:24,433 "because Michigan was on a better footing a while back." 516 00:18:24,433 --> 00:18:27,000 But getting back to that endorsement, 517 00:18:27,000 --> 00:18:28,566 that endorsement is very strong. 518 00:18:28,566 --> 00:18:29,833 It's very strong. 519 00:18:29,833 --> 00:18:31,633 A lot of people still have a lot of respect 520 00:18:31,633 --> 00:18:32,900 for the president, 521 00:18:32,900 --> 00:18:35,766 but at the same time we know Tom Leonard, 522 00:18:35,766 --> 00:18:37,933 we know Ryan Berman, we know Matt DePerno 523 00:18:37,933 --> 00:18:41,833 and allow people to make their decision. 524 00:18:41,833 --> 00:18:44,300 Allow people who know these individuals 525 00:18:44,300 --> 00:18:46,300 and who have had an interaction with them 526 00:18:46,300 --> 00:18:47,966 to make up their own minds. 527 00:18:47,966 --> 00:18:51,133 An endorsement means that President Trump supports him. 528 00:18:51,133 --> 00:18:53,466 That doesn't mean that I blindly follow everything 529 00:18:53,466 --> 00:18:55,133 that someone does 530 00:18:55,133 --> 00:18:56,866 because I may have a different perspective. 531 00:18:56,866 --> 00:18:59,566 And as an individual and as a Republican, 532 00:18:59,566 --> 00:19:03,166 I believe in the freedom of thought, freedom of expression. 533 00:19:03,166 --> 00:19:07,333 We're not blindly following every single comment 534 00:19:07,333 --> 00:19:10,866 of every single leader, be it from the state party 535 00:19:10,866 --> 00:19:12,600 or whoever else. 536 00:19:12,600 --> 00:19:14,100 That's what the Democrats do. 537 00:19:14,100 --> 00:19:14,933 We're Republicans. 538 00:19:14,933 --> 00:19:16,200 We think for ourselves. 539 00:19:16,200 --> 00:19:17,700 - Well aren't there some people that say 540 00:19:17,700 --> 00:19:20,700 that Trump supporters do blindly follow this gentleman. 541 00:19:20,700 --> 00:19:22,100 Regardless of what he does, 542 00:19:22,100 --> 00:19:23,400 they still love him. 543 00:19:24,566 --> 00:19:26,800 - Well, I love him, but that doesn't mean 544 00:19:26,800 --> 00:19:28,400 that on this one issue... 545 00:19:28,400 --> 00:19:31,800 Listen, Tim, I've been married now 12 years. 546 00:19:31,800 --> 00:19:34,300 I just celebrated my 12th anniversary with my wife. 547 00:19:34,300 --> 00:19:35,266 - Congratulations. 548 00:19:35,266 --> 00:19:36,200 - And I should tell you that, 549 00:19:36,200 --> 00:19:37,400 thank you very much by the way. 550 00:19:37,400 --> 00:19:38,400 And by the way, also congratulations 551 00:19:38,400 --> 00:19:41,233 on 50 years of Off the Record. 552 00:19:41,233 --> 00:19:44,866 You have been on air as long as I've been alive but... 553 00:19:46,000 --> 00:19:48,833 - I say thank you. 554 00:19:48,833 --> 00:19:50,166 - You're welcome. 555 00:19:50,166 --> 00:19:51,400 You're welcome. 556 00:19:51,400 --> 00:19:52,500 I just wanted to share that my wife 557 00:19:52,500 --> 00:19:54,133 and I have a great relationship 558 00:19:54,133 --> 00:19:57,933 and we respect each other, 559 00:19:57,933 --> 00:19:59,933 we're equals to each other, we listen to each other, 560 00:19:59,933 --> 00:20:03,533 but we don't agree on every single issue. 561 00:20:03,533 --> 00:20:05,766 We may agree on 95% of the issues. 562 00:20:05,766 --> 00:20:08,233 That doesn't mean that we're gonna have a divorce, 563 00:20:08,233 --> 00:20:11,933 or that doesn't mean that I suddenly I'm anti my wife. 564 00:20:11,933 --> 00:20:14,233 And that's what a party is. 565 00:20:14,233 --> 00:20:16,300 It doesn't mean that we blindly follow 566 00:20:16,300 --> 00:20:19,366 every single individual from leadership. 567 00:20:19,366 --> 00:20:21,833 We vote for our leaders to lead us, 568 00:20:21,833 --> 00:20:24,100 but not to dictate to us. 569 00:20:24,100 --> 00:20:26,100 And as much as I support the president 570 00:20:26,100 --> 00:20:27,600 and I support his endorsement, 571 00:20:27,600 --> 00:20:31,766 it's not that I feel that same way on that specific issue. 572 00:20:31,766 --> 00:20:34,000 I support endorsement for Cristina Coelho 573 00:20:34,000 --> 00:20:36,800 for Secretary of State, an outstanding individual. 574 00:20:36,800 --> 00:20:39,400 I support his endorsement in other individuals as well. 575 00:20:39,400 --> 00:20:40,800 But on this specific one, 576 00:20:40,800 --> 00:20:43,666 I've looked at all the candidates and I've stayed quiet 577 00:20:43,666 --> 00:20:45,533 until after our county convention. 578 00:20:45,533 --> 00:20:47,933 And after our county convention, I came out and I said, 579 00:20:47,933 --> 00:20:49,200 "You know what? 580 00:20:49,200 --> 00:20:51,233 "As an individual, I support Tom Leonard." 581 00:20:51,233 --> 00:20:52,766 - Dani? 582 00:20:52,766 --> 00:20:55,600 - Yeah, I think when talking about Leonard versus DePerno, 583 00:20:55,600 --> 00:20:57,800 one of the biggest things that I've seen in terms 584 00:20:57,800 --> 00:21:02,300 of DePerno's platform is the 2020 election fraud. 585 00:21:02,300 --> 00:21:04,666 And that's something that I know not everyone 586 00:21:04,666 --> 00:21:06,533 in the Republican Party agrees on 587 00:21:06,533 --> 00:21:08,466 but I was curious as to your position 588 00:21:08,466 --> 00:21:12,966 and what you think about that element of his platform. 589 00:21:14,100 --> 00:21:15,566 - I actually support it. 590 00:21:15,566 --> 00:21:18,400 I think when you think about this whole process, 591 00:21:18,400 --> 00:21:22,333 in 2016 I couldn't find a Democrat 592 00:21:22,333 --> 00:21:24,700 that didn't believe that the election was tampered. 593 00:21:24,700 --> 00:21:25,966 They were shocked 594 00:21:25,966 --> 00:21:29,266 that Hillary Clinton and lost to Donald Trump, 595 00:21:29,266 --> 00:21:30,500 which is ridiculous. 596 00:21:30,500 --> 00:21:32,000 They should have just seen the tea leaves 597 00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:34,333 of how people were feeling on the ground. 598 00:21:34,333 --> 00:21:37,300 And in 2020, the Republicans feel the same way. 599 00:21:37,300 --> 00:21:38,766 And there is evidence of, 600 00:21:38,766 --> 00:21:41,633 when you see the Secretary of State break the law 601 00:21:41,633 --> 00:21:44,966 and send out absentee applications, 602 00:21:44,966 --> 00:21:48,600 not just once, but multiple times to individuals, 603 00:21:48,600 --> 00:21:52,200 instead of by the law the local clerk should be doing it, 604 00:21:52,200 --> 00:21:53,666 or should be requested. 605 00:21:53,666 --> 00:21:55,366 When you see ballot harvesting. 606 00:21:55,366 --> 00:21:57,433 And what I think I mentioned a little bit earlier 607 00:21:57,433 --> 00:22:00,166 with Attorney General Nessel talking about 608 00:22:00,166 --> 00:22:04,066 or Attorney General Nessel's Office bringing charges 609 00:22:04,066 --> 00:22:06,533 against individuals that were ballot harvesting from, 610 00:22:06,533 --> 00:22:07,933 I believe it was nursing homes. 611 00:22:07,933 --> 00:22:09,166 I'm not sure 612 00:22:09,166 --> 00:22:10,400 if I've got all the facts straight there, 613 00:22:10,400 --> 00:22:11,833 but I believe it was nursing homes. 614 00:22:11,833 --> 00:22:14,333 And then you see clerks like the one 615 00:22:14,333 --> 00:22:18,000 in Southfield changing absentee ballots. 616 00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:20,500 There is fraud. 617 00:22:20,500 --> 00:22:23,833 And one of the best ways we could potentially put this 618 00:22:23,833 --> 00:22:27,633 to bed is by doing a full recount 619 00:22:27,633 --> 00:22:31,033 or a full audit or whatever people come together 620 00:22:31,033 --> 00:22:32,600 and believe should be done 621 00:22:32,600 --> 00:22:33,833 so that we can once 622 00:22:33,833 --> 00:22:36,133 and for all put the Democratic accusations 623 00:22:36,133 --> 00:22:38,333 and the Republican accusations to bed 624 00:22:38,333 --> 00:22:41,333 and find out if there was fraud or if there wasn't fraud. 625 00:22:41,333 --> 00:22:43,600 What harm would come to that? 626 00:22:43,600 --> 00:22:47,000 So if Matt DePerno wants to leave that, God bless him. 627 00:22:47,000 --> 00:22:48,200 I support him on that. 628 00:22:48,200 --> 00:22:49,566 If Tom Leonard wants to do that, 629 00:22:49,566 --> 00:22:50,600 I support him on that. 630 00:22:50,600 --> 00:22:52,166 If Daniel Nessel were to do that, 631 00:22:52,166 --> 00:22:53,366 I would support her on that. 632 00:22:53,366 --> 00:22:55,900 Whatever brings election integrity forward 633 00:22:55,900 --> 00:22:59,700 and brings a common belief between republicans, 634 00:22:59,700 --> 00:23:01,800 democrats, independents, libertarians, 635 00:23:01,800 --> 00:23:03,333 vegetarians, whatever you wanna be 636 00:23:03,333 --> 00:23:07,866 to have faith and transparency in electorate system, 637 00:23:07,866 --> 00:23:09,900 I'm 100% for. 638 00:23:09,900 --> 00:23:11,133 - Sophia. 639 00:23:11,133 --> 00:23:12,366 - Yeah. 640 00:23:12,366 --> 00:23:13,833 So on the topic of election fraud, 641 00:23:13,833 --> 00:23:16,900 I know this was something widely talked about at the end 642 00:23:16,900 --> 00:23:19,833 of 2020, as well as the beginning of 2021, 643 00:23:19,833 --> 00:23:21,800 a lot of the policies 644 00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:24,900 that have come forward regarding election integrity, 645 00:23:24,900 --> 00:23:27,133 some people from the left have said, 646 00:23:27,133 --> 00:23:30,400 that's discriminatory towards certain of people. 647 00:23:30,400 --> 00:23:33,400 So what do you think is a good path forward 648 00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:35,333 that doesn't discriminate against people 649 00:23:35,333 --> 00:23:38,266 who are eligible to vote? 650 00:23:38,266 --> 00:23:39,833 - Sophia I apologize, 651 00:23:39,833 --> 00:23:42,966 but I have no idea what is discriminatory. 652 00:23:42,966 --> 00:23:45,166 If you can give me a perfect example of something 653 00:23:45,166 --> 00:23:46,433 that is discriminatory, 654 00:23:46,433 --> 00:23:48,300 I'd be more than happy to address it. 655 00:23:49,166 --> 00:23:52,033 - Are you talking about IDs 656 00:23:52,033 --> 00:23:54,500 or having an ID when you vote? 657 00:23:54,500 --> 00:23:55,733 - Yes. 658 00:23:55,733 --> 00:23:58,566 I saw that on a show similar to this actually 659 00:23:58,566 --> 00:24:00,166 in 2020 about IDs. 660 00:24:00,166 --> 00:24:01,366 - Sure. 661 00:24:01,366 --> 00:24:03,666 And if you're talking about a voter ID, 662 00:24:03,666 --> 00:24:05,200 I don't think that's discriminatory at all. 663 00:24:05,200 --> 00:24:08,100 When you look at a majority of poll that was done, 664 00:24:08,100 --> 00:24:11,433 not a long time ago, I believe what six, seven months ago, 665 00:24:11,433 --> 00:24:14,666 amongst African Americans in the state of Michigan, 666 00:24:14,666 --> 00:24:17,633 I believe 70% of them believed in voter ID. 667 00:24:17,633 --> 00:24:19,100 If that were the case, 668 00:24:19,100 --> 00:24:24,100 then going on a flight would be discriminatory 669 00:24:25,033 --> 00:24:26,633 because you have to show your ID, 670 00:24:26,633 --> 00:24:29,900 buying alcohol at a convenience store 671 00:24:29,900 --> 00:24:31,133 would be discriminatory. 672 00:24:31,133 --> 00:24:34,066 This is one of the most sacred honors we have, 673 00:24:34,066 --> 00:24:37,100 and you should have an ID. 674 00:24:37,100 --> 00:24:38,533 And by the way, 675 00:24:38,533 --> 00:24:40,533 it would be discriminatory if we had some type 676 00:24:40,533 --> 00:24:44,600 of discriminatory markings on an ID, but we don't. 677 00:24:44,600 --> 00:24:45,833 And we shouldn't. 678 00:24:45,833 --> 00:24:48,133 I believe that no matter who you are, 679 00:24:48,133 --> 00:24:50,600 black, white, Christian, Jew, Muslim, 680 00:24:50,600 --> 00:24:52,333 you should have the right to vote 681 00:24:52,333 --> 00:24:55,166 and it should be equal to all. 682 00:24:55,166 --> 00:24:59,400 I was raised in a family that believed in equality 683 00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:02,366 across the board, gender equality and racial equality. 684 00:25:02,366 --> 00:25:05,966 I was raised to Polish immigrants that came here legally 685 00:25:05,966 --> 00:25:09,200 that taught me very well that everyone should be respected. 686 00:25:09,200 --> 00:25:13,133 And when you look at that, the law should be the law. 687 00:25:13,133 --> 00:25:16,033 We should have voter IDs so that you can prove 688 00:25:16,033 --> 00:25:18,066 that you are the individual who's voting. 689 00:25:18,066 --> 00:25:19,266 By the way, 690 00:25:19,266 --> 00:25:22,666 how is it discriminatory when getting an ID, 691 00:25:22,666 --> 00:25:25,333 you can get an ID for free. 692 00:25:25,333 --> 00:25:28,066 And even cities were issuing IDs. 693 00:25:28,066 --> 00:25:31,033 The Secretary of State was issuing state IDs. 694 00:25:31,033 --> 00:25:33,500 You don't need a driver's license to vote. 695 00:25:33,500 --> 00:25:35,666 You need an ID, a governmental ID. 696 00:25:37,066 --> 00:25:38,500 - Representative, we have to put a cap on this, 697 00:25:38,500 --> 00:25:42,233 but very quickly, I did not hear you say, 698 00:25:42,233 --> 00:25:47,200 do you believe the election was stolen from Donald Trump? 699 00:25:47,200 --> 00:25:48,866 - I believe the election was rigged. 700 00:25:48,866 --> 00:25:52,433 Again, we will never know unless we look at the election 701 00:25:52,433 --> 00:25:54,866 from what happened with the Secretary of State, 702 00:25:54,866 --> 00:25:57,800 what happened with ballot harvesting. 703 00:25:57,800 --> 00:25:58,966 - But based on what you know now. 704 00:25:58,966 --> 00:25:59,800 Based on what you know now. 705 00:25:59,800 --> 00:26:00,800 (soft music) 706 00:26:00,800 --> 00:26:02,233 - None of us will never know. 707 00:26:02,233 --> 00:26:03,833 And that's why it's important for us to audit 708 00:26:03,833 --> 00:26:06,300 or hand recount the ballot. 709 00:26:06,300 --> 00:26:07,533 - Okay. 710 00:26:07,533 --> 00:26:09,100 So the answer is you don't know. 711 00:26:09,100 --> 00:26:10,033 - I think I've made it very clear 712 00:26:10,033 --> 00:26:11,866 that like Democrats believe 713 00:26:11,866 --> 00:26:13,266 that the election was stole in 2016, 714 00:26:13,266 --> 00:26:16,233 Republicans felt the election was stolen in 2020. 715 00:26:16,233 --> 00:26:17,733 The only best way we can put this 716 00:26:17,733 --> 00:26:19,866 to bed is by doing a full recount 717 00:26:19,866 --> 00:26:21,966 or full audit of all the elections 718 00:26:21,966 --> 00:26:24,666 and having everyone review it and abide by the law. 719 00:26:24,666 --> 00:26:25,966 - Representative, good to see you again. 720 00:26:25,966 --> 00:26:27,200 Thank you much for doing our broadcast 721 00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:29,533 and thanks to our student journalists. 722 00:26:29,533 --> 00:26:30,766 We're gonna have you guys back 723 00:26:30,766 --> 00:26:31,700 so stay tuned, okay? 724 00:26:31,700 --> 00:26:32,833 Thank you Rocky. 725 00:26:32,833 --> 00:26:34,100 Catch you later. 726 00:26:34,100 --> 00:26:36,066 See you next week right here on Off the Record. 727 00:26:36,066 --> 00:26:37,933 - [Narrator] Production of Off the Record 728 00:26:37,933 --> 00:26:41,066 is made possible in part by Martin Waymire, 729 00:26:41,066 --> 00:26:43,300 a full service strategic communications agency, 730 00:26:43,300 --> 00:26:45,766 partnering with clients through public relations, 731 00:26:45,766 --> 00:26:49,233 digital marketing, and public policy engagement. 732 00:26:49,233 --> 00:26:52,166 Learn more at martinwaymire.com. 733 00:26:52,166 --> 00:26:56,400 For more Off the Record, visit wkar.org. 734 00:26:56,400 --> 00:26:58,733 Michigan public television stations have contributed 735 00:26:58,733 --> 00:27:00,866 to the production costs of Off the Record. 736 00:27:35,000 --> 00:27:37,600 (bright music)