♪

WELCOME BACK THE OTR GUEST THIS

WEEK IS FORMER REPRESENTATIVE

DAVE AGAMA PART TO PASS A PART

TIME LEGISLATURE PROBLEMS WITH

PIPELINE FIVE AND 7 GROUPS READY

TO PROTEST ON THE CAPITOL STEPS

ON THE OTR PANEL ZACHARY GORCHOW

ZOE CLARK AND BILL BALLENGER SIT

IN WITH US AS WE GET THE INSIDE

OUT "OFF THE RECORD."

PRODUCTION OF "OFF THE RECORD"

IS MADE POSSIBLE IN PART BY A

GRANT FROM TRUSCOTT-ROSSMAN,

MICHIGAN'S ONLY BIPARTISAN

STRATEGIC COMMUNICATIONS FIRM

SERVING STATE INTERNATIONAL AND

NATIONAL OFFICES FROM THEIR

OFFICES IN LANSING DETROIT AND

GRAND RAPIDS

TRUSCOTT-ROSSMAN.COM HAGER FOX

HEATING AND AIR CONDITIONING

SERVING THE GREATER LANSING AREA

SINCE 1941 PROVIDING SOLUTIONS

AND CHOICES FOR HOME COMFORT

DURING ALL MICHIGAN SEASONS

HAGER FOX AND BRYANT.COM AND BY

MSU COLLEGE OF AGRICULTURAL AND

NATURAL RESOURCES MICHIGAN STATE

UNIVERSITY WANTS TO BE A TRUSTED

PARTNER IN CONVERSATIONS ABOUT

FOOD AND WHERE IT COMES FROM

INCLUDING ITS IMPACT ON THE

HEALTH AND PLANET LEARN MORE AT

MSU.EDU AND NOW THIS EDITION OF

"OFF THE RECORD" WITH TIM

SKUBICK.

>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH AND

WELCOME BACK TO "OFF THE RECORD"

AND WE ARE RECORDING HERE ON

FRIDAY NOVEMBER 17TH BREAKING

NEWS FRED UPTON IS NOT RUNNING

FOR THE U.S. SENATE.

WHAT HAPPENED?

>> WELL THAT IS A VERY GOOD

QUESTION.

>> ARE YOU SURPRISED?

>> NO.

HAS THIS HAPPENED A MONTH AND A

HALF AGO I WOULD HAVE BEEN VERY

SURPRISED.

PRIOR TO THE MACKINAC CONFERENCE

THE REPUBLICAN PARTY HAD IN MID

SEPTEMBER ALL THE SIGNALS FROM

REPUBLICANS AND SORT OF INNER

WORKINGS OF THE PARTY IS FRED

UPTON IS GETTING IN THE RACE

IT'S IMMINENT HE HAD A PRESENCE

ON THE ISLAND UNLIKE ANY I HAVE

SEEN HIM HAVE BEFORE AND MAKING

THE ROUNDS AT EVENTS OUTSIDE OF

HIS DISTRICT IN SOUTHWEST

MICHIGAN THEN NOTHING HAPPENED

AND HE DIDN'T GET IN THE RACE

AND TIME KEPT GOING ON AND ON

AND YOU SAW THINGS HAPPENING

LIKE STEVE BANNON GOING OUT AND

RECRUITING THE MOST

UNESTABLISHMENT CANDIDATES YOU

CAN FIND TO STOP ESTABLISHMENT

CANDIDS AND NOT JUST STOP THEM

BUT DISRATE THEM IN REPUBLICAN

PRIMARIES FRED UPTON IS AN

ESTABLISHED REPUBLICAN

CANDIDATE.

THE ENVIRONMENT RIGHT NOW

DOESN'T LOOK GREAT FOR

REPUBLICANS HEADING INTO 2018.

IT'S ALREADY GOING TO BE

CHALLENGING TO BEAT DEBBIE STAB

NOW IF IT GOES SOUTH AND FRED

UPTON SAID REELECTION IS THE

BETTER BET.

>> ZACHARY PUT IT PERFECTLY

THREE MONTHS AGO IT WOULD HAVE

BEEN A MUCH MORE OF A SHOCKER

HEARING FROM FOLKS HE WAS CLOSE

TO 90% SURE HE WAS GOING TO BE

IN IT AND REMINDS ME OF DAN

KILDEE THIS YEAR ASSUMING HE WAS

GOING TO RUN FOR GOVERNOR AND

SORT OF GOT TO BE JANUARY AND

SHOULDN'T HE ANNOUNCE AND

FEBRUARY AND IT WAS LIKE HUM AND

MARCH THEN WHEN HE FINALLY DID

YEAH THAT KIND OF MAKES SENSE

AND SORT OF WHERE WE ARE AT NOW

BUT IT IS GOING TO BE VERY

INTERESTING FOR THE FIELD GOING

FORWARD NOW YOU KNOW WILL THERE

BE A DIFFERENT KIND OF

ESTABLISHMENT CANDIDATE THAT

JUMPS IN OR IS THE FIELD SET.

>> I NEVER THOUGHT HE WOULD RUN.

HE FLIRTED WITH IT 20 YEARS AGO.

HE HAS FLIRTED WITH IT.

>> A LOT OF STUFF SEVERAL TIMES

BEFORE STATEWIDE OFFICE.

>> ONE THING IS INTERESTING IN

CONNECTION WITH THE ANNOUNCEMENT

HE SAYS HE WILL RUN FOR

REELECTION TO THE HOUSE.

WELL A LOT OF PEOPLE THOUGHT YOU

KNOW HE DECIDED IT'S TIME TO GET

OUT OF THE HOUSE.

>> KEY LEADS ARE STARTING TO

LINE UP A LITTLE BIT AGAINST HIM

IN THE DISTRICT AND COMING AFTER

HIM.

>> WELL THAT AND PLUS THE FACT

HE HAS BEEN THERE FOR SO LONG HE

HAS LOST HIS PRIME COMMITTEE

CHAIRMANSHIP BECAUSE OF THE TERM

LIMIT FACTOR.

>> IT GETS IN YOUR BLOOD

WILLIAM.

>> IT DOES BUT MY POINT IS HE IS

RUNNING AGAIN AND NOT GOING TO

RETIRE.

HE IS NOT SAYING I HAVE TAKEN

ONE LOOK AT THE SENATE NO I'M

NOT GOING TO DO IT I'M OUT OF

HERE NO HE SAYS I'M GOING TO

CONTINUE ON SO I THOUGHT THAT

WAS INTERESTING BUT I NEVER

REALLY THOUGHT HE WOULD RUN.

>> ALL RIGHT ENOUGH OF FRED

UPTON AND HE IS HISTORY, RIGHT

LET'S TALK ABOUT PIPELINE FIVE,

THIS STORY REFUSES TO GO AWAY

BILLY AND THE GOVERNOR STRONG

LANGUAGE THIS WEEK DOESN'T LIKE

WHAT IS GOING ON HOW COME?

>> WELL, OBVIOUSLY IT'S YOU KNOW

AN ACCIDENT WAITING TO HAPPEN.

IT'S A POTENTIAL DISASTER OF

CATASTROPHIC PROPORTIONS.

>> RAW STEEL IS NOW EXPOSED.

>> HEARD OF EMBRIDGE ENERGY AND

DON'T WANT TO SAY CHANGE THE

TUNE AND SAY ONE THING AND WEEKS

OR MONTHS LATER IT SEEMS TO BE

WORSE AND THERE IS A SENSE OF

SORT OF IMPENDING LOOK EITHER

TELL US WHAT IS GOING ON GIVE US

THE FACTS OR YOU KNOW LET'S

FIGURE SOMETHING ELSE OUT AND

THE IRWAS INITIALLY THEY SAID

THEY WERE INCHES OF PIPELINE

CORROSION AND NOW THERE ARE

SURPRISES THAT ARE MUCH BIGGER.

>> PUBLIC RELATIONS AND

MESSAGING HAS BEEN INEPT FROM

THE BEGINNING AND CONTINUES TO

BE THAT WAY AND THE WAY THINGS

ARE GOING SOMETHING SERIOUS

COULD HAPPEN COMING FROM THE

STATE WHETHER IT'S THE GOVERNOR

OR BILL SCHUETTE OR SOMEBODY

ELSE THIS NEXT YEAR.

>> WHAT POINT DOES THE GOVERNOR

AND THE ATTORNEY GENERAL DECIDE

THAT WORDS ARE NOT ENOUGH?

IT'S GONE FROM BEING WORKING

WITH EMBRIDGE AND MAKE SURE

EVERYTHING IS SAFE AND CLEARLY

ARE UP SET WITH THEM AND FEEL

THEY ARE MISLED AND NOBODY IS

GOING IN COURT.

>> NOBODY SAID PULL THE TRIGGER

AND SHUT IT DOWN.

>> THERE IS AN EASEMENT THAT THE

STATE OF MICHIGAN GRANTED

EMBRIDGE IN 1953 TO PUT THE

PIPELINE AT THE BOTTOM OF THE

STRAITS OF MACKINAC AND THEY ARE

IN VIOLATION OF THAT EASEMENT

RIGHT NOW BECAUSE OF THE LACK OF

ANCHOR SUPPORTS.

>> THEY ARE SEEKING PERMITS IN

ORDER TO CORRECT IT.

>> THEY ARE BUT I'M JUST SAYING

THEY HAVE GROUNDS TO GO INTO

COURT IF THEY WANTED TO TO TRY

TO STOP THIS.

BUT THEY HAVEN'T DONE THAT YET

AND YOU'RE STARTING TO SEE NOW

THE CRITICS OF EMBRIDGE ARE

SAYING WAIT A MINUTE IT'S GREAT

THAT YOU ARE NOW WHERE WE WERE

IN TERMS OF BEING CRITICAL AND

WORRIED ABOUT THE DANGERS BUT

YOU ARE THE ONES WITH THE ACTUAL

POWER TO DO SOMETHING SO THE

QUESTION IS WHEN DO THEY DECIDE

OKAY WORDS ARE NOT ENOUGH WE

HAVE TO DO MORE.

>> THE COMPANY SAID WE REPAIRED

SOME OF THE PROBLEMS AND WE MADE

A RUN AT THAT AND DOING WELL AND

BASICALLY SAYING WE ARE ON TOP

OF THIS BUT PEOPLE ARE

INCREASINGLY SAYING WE ARE NOT

SO SURE.

>> DANIEL OF THE DETROIT NEWS

WROTE A COLUMN FOR MICHIGAN

RADIO MY OUT LET THIS PAST

WEEKEND WHERE HE CALLED IT

TRUMPONIAN FOR THEM TO KEEP

SAYING ONE THING AND DOING

ANOTHER OR NOT QUITE FULLY

GIVING ALL OF THE FACTS AT ONCE.

YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE THINGS HE

IS TALKING ABOUT IS THIS IDEA

THAT BUSINESSES ARE STARTING TO

COME OUT PATRICK ANDERSON OF

EAST LANSING CONSULTING FIRM

SAYING BUSINESS NEEDS TO START

DOING SOMETHING ABOUT THIS

BECAUSE IT'S NOT JUST QUOTE

UNQUOTE THE ENVIRONMENTALISTS

WHO ARE INTERRUPTING PUBLIC

MEETINGS AND SUCH BUT THAT THIS

ACTUALLY COULD HAVE REALLY HUGE

ECONOMIC FACTORS ON THE STATE

AND IT'S BUSINESS GET IN FRONT

OF IT AS WELL.

>> EMBRIDGE LOST PUBLIC

RELATIONS BATTLE ON THIS AND IT

WAS NOT SOMETHING THEY WERE

FATED TO LOSE.

I RECALL A SHOW WE DID A YEAR

AGO, A YEAR AND A HALF AGO AND

WENT AROUND THE TABLE, ASKED

SHOULD PEOPLE THINK THAT THE

LINE FIVE IS AN IMMINENT THREAT

AND WE SLUGGED OUR SHOULDERS AND

NO REASON THERE IS A PROBLEM BUT

THEY MANAGED TO TRIP OVER

THEMSELVES AS WELL AS YOU KNOW

NOT GET ALL OF THE INFORMATION

OUT TO THE PUBLIC AND NOW THEY

HAVE LOST CREDIBILITY AND THEY

ARE IN A POSITION WHERE THEY

HAVE DUG A BIG HOLE FOR

THEMSELVES AND YOU KNOW THEY HAD

THIS BRIEFING THIS WEEK FOR

REPORTERS WHERE THEY SAID WELL

WE WANT TO UPDATE YOU ON WHERE

THINGS ARE.

NO WHERE IN THIS BRIEFING DID

THEY SAY THERE WERE DOZENS OF

CODING GAPS ON THE PIPELINE.

WELL, LATER IN THE DAY THE STATE

COMES OUT AND SAYS EMBRIDGE

INFORMED US TODAY THAT THERE ARE

DOZENS OF CODING GAPS THERE ARE

48 LOCATIONS THAT HAVE BEEN

CHECKED BY DIVERS SO FAR AND

MAJORITY AND WE DON'T KNOW

EXACTLY HOW MANY HAD GAPS WHERE

THE COATING WASN'T THERE AND IT

WAS BARE STEEL WOULDN'T THAT BE

THE THING IF YOU WANT

CREDIBILITY WOULDN'T YOU CALL A

NEWS CONFERENCE BRING EVERYBODY

IN AND SAY LOOK THIS IS WHAT WE

FOUND AND THIS IS WHAT WE ARE

DOING ABOUT IT AND WE ARE ON IT

BUT WHEN YOU OMIT THIS KIND OF

STUFF THAT IS WHAT REALLY

DAMAGES YOUR CREDIBILITY.

>> LOOMING ALL OF THIS OF COURSE

IS WHAT IS THE END GAME IF LINE

FIVE IS EVENTUALLY SHUT DOWN.

>> ATTORNEY GENERAL HIS DAYS ARE

NUMBERED.

>> WELL OKAY.

>> HOW MANY DAYS MR. ATTORNEY

GENERAL?

>> THAT IS ULTIMATELY WE HAVE TO

DECIDE WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN

IF THERE IS NO MORE LINE FIVE.

I HATE TO BE POLITICAL ABOUT IT

BUT THE CURRENT CLIMATE IN AN

ELECTION YEAR DO YOU WANT A

BREAK DOWN OF PIPELINE FIVE ON

YOUR RESUME AS YOU ARE RUNNING

FOR GOVERNOR?

>> WELL OBVIOUSLY NO.

NO OBVIOUSLY SO THAT IS WHY I'M

SAYING IN THIS NEXT YEAR COMING

PARTICULARLY FROM SCHUETTE THE

ATTORNEY GENERAL WHO WILL BE

RUNNING THERE COULD BE SOME

ACTION OF REALLY SPECIFIC AND

CONCRETE SORT THAT COULD MAKE A

DIFFERENCE IN THIS WHOLE ESPAID.

>> WHAT I FIND INTERESTING YOU

ARE BRINGING UP POLITICS AND

CONTINUE DOWN THE THREAD WHEN

YOU GO UP NORTH AND DRIVING

THERE THERE ARE YARD SIGNS THAT

ARE PRO-TRUMP YARD SIGNS AND

SHUT DOWN LINE FIVE IN THE SAME

LAWN AND I THINK THAT'S JUST THE

SORT OF FASCINATING DYNAMIC

WHERE IT REALLY DOES FEEL

SOMETHING THAT BOTH REPUBLICANS

AND DEMOCRATS CAN AGREE ON BUT

WHAT IS NEXT.

>> MONDAY THE MARIJUANA PEOPLE

SAY THEY HAVE ENOUGH NAMES TO

PUT IT ON THE BALLOT AND WHAT IS

THE IMPLICATION OF THAT VICE

VISIT THE ELECTION WILLIAM.

>> I THINK IT'S GOING TO DRAW A

BIG TURN OUT PROBABLY FROM THE

LEFT BUT MAYBE MORE ACROSS THE

BOARD THAN MOST PEOPLE THINK, I

THINK IT'S GOING TO PASS IF IT

GETS ON THE BALLOT.

AND IT'S VERY INTERESTING.

FIVE CANDIDATES FOR GOVERNOR

HAVE ALREADY COME OUT AND

ENDORSED THIS.

WELL, ONE REPUBLICAN AND THE

REST WERE DEMOCRATS.

>> WHO IS THE REPUBLICAN?

>> A MINOR CANDIDATE.

>> ALL RIGHT.

NOT A MAJOR ONE.

BUT THE POINT IS CAN YOU IMAGINE

FIVE, 10, 15 YEARS AGO THESE

PEOPLE COMING OUT AND OBVIOUS

IT'S PHENOMENAL EVERYTHING IS

MOVING VERY FAST IN THE

DIRECTION OF A YES VOTE ON THIS

WHICH YOU WOULDN'T HAVE THOUGHT

POSSIBLE JUST A COUPLE YEARS

AGO.

>> BILL IS CORRECT IN

YIPSILANTE AND FOR LEGALIZATION

OF MARIJUANA AND TEN YEARS

EARLIER IT WAS THE MEDICAL

MARIJUANA PROPOSAL THAT IS SORT

OF CREATED A LOT OF CONFUSION IN

THE STATE I THINK IT'S FAIR TO

SAY BUT NO NOW THEY HAVE THESE

SIGNATURES APPARENTLY IT LOOKS

LIKE THEY HAVE DEALT WITH

EVERYTHING AND THERE WAS SOME

MONEY ISSUES POSSIBLY 30,000 BUT

NOW THAT IT LOOKS LIKE A

NATIONAL ORGANIZATION IS COMING

IN AND HELPING TAKE CARE OF

THAT.

>> OPPOSITION DO THE CHIEFS OF

POLICE AND THE MIKE BUCHARDS OF

THE WORLD NOW LAUNCH AN EFFORT

TO KILL THIS?

>> THERE WILL BE AN ORGANIZED

OPPOSITION LAUNCHED BY LAW

ENFORCEMENT.

WILL THEY BE MORE SUCCESSFUL

THAN THEY WERE AGAINST MEDICAL

MARIJUANA, THIS INVOLVES

RECREATION USE.

>> THIS IS DIFFERENT.

>> NOT THE SYMPATHETIC PATIENT

SAYING YOU KNOW I'M IN AGONY AND

PAIN AND THIS HELPS ME THIS IS

RECREATION USE AND YOU KNOW THE

IDEA THAT WE PEOPLE WHO USE

MARIJUANA SHOULDN'T BE PUT

THROUGH THE CRIMINAL JUSTICE

SYSTEM.

I THINK BILL IS PROBABLY RIGHT

THAT THE ODDS START OUT IN FAVOR

OF THIS AND I DON'T THINK IT'S A

LOCK BUT YOU KNOW THERE WILL

NEED TO BE SOME MONEY SPENT ON

THE YES SIDE BECAUSE THERE WILL

BE A NO CAMPAIGN WAGE AND AS WE

ALWAYS SAY THE NO CAMPAIGN

ALWAYS START OUT WITH AN EDGE.

>> HEARING A LOT ABOUT COLORADO

AND WASHINGTON AND WHAT HAS

HAPPENED OUT THERE.

>> ALSO FOLKS ON THE PRO SIDE

SAYING THIS IS GOING TO HELP THE

STATE BUDGET AND SEE ALL THE

DIFFERENT ARGUMENTS FOR AND

AGAINST IT ALMOST DON'T HAVE TO

DEAL WITH THE IDEA OF MARIJUANA

BUT ECONOMIC ISSUES AS WELL.

I THINK IT'S GOING TO BE

INTERESTING TO WATCH 2018 AND WE

HAVE BEEN TALKING OF COURSE

ABOUT THE REDISTRICTING

PREVAILING WAGE AND WE HAVE

LEGALIZATION OF MARIJUANA AND

WHAT THE BALLOT IS GOING TO LOOK

LIKE IN 2018.

IT WAS 2012 WHEN WE HAD SORT OF

BALLOT PALOOZA AND SIX QUESTIONS

WILL WE GET CLOSE TO THAT AND

WHAT WILL IT DO FOR TURN OUT

BILL.

>> QUICKLY WE ARE HEARING THE

SENATE ORGANIZED LABOR GROUPS

RESERVED TIME ON CAPITOL LAWN

AND THEY ARE CONCERNED THAT

HOUSE REPUBLICANS ARE GOING TO

TRY TO TAKE AWAY RETIREMENT

HEALTHCARE BENEFITS OF RETIREES.

>> MUNICIPAL AND GOVERNMENT

WORKERS.

>> FIREFIGHTERS, COPS CIVIL

SERVANTS.

>> SO FORTH.

>> IT APPEARS THAT THERE IS A

FRAMEWORK THAT HAS BEEN PUT

TOGETHER OF A PROPOSAL THAT THE

HOUSE REPUBLICANS ARE INTERESTED

IN MOVING IT, ALMOST MOVED

BEFORE THE BREAK BUT.

>> IT ALMOST MOVED A YEAR AGO

REMEMBER DURING LAME DUCK AND

THE FIREFIGHTERS AND THE COPS

CAME OUT.

>> IT HAS BEEN ABOUT A YEAR'S

WORK OF WORKGROUP ON IT WITH ALL

THE STAKEHOLDERS INVOLVED AND

APPEARS THE PUBLIC SAFETY

OFFICERS POLICE AND FIRE ARE NOT

HAPPY WITH THE PRODUCT THAT HAS

COME OUT BECAUSE IT INCLUDES A

PROVISION THAT COULD LEAD TO

EFFECTIVELY THE STATE COMING IN

AND FORCING CHANGES, CURBS IN

PENSION BENEFITS.

>> IT'S A FIVE PERSON PANEL AT

STEP FIVE OF THE PROCESS THAT IF

NEGOTIATIONS WITH THE LOCAL

FOLKS RETIREES DON'T WORKOUT

THEY CAN IMPOSE A SETTLEMENT AND

THAT IS WHAT GOT EVERYBODY UP IN

ARMS.

>> AND I THINK WE ARE ALL

ENVISIONING TOO IT WAS EXACTLY

FIVE YEARS AGO COME THIS

DECEMBER THAT RIGHT TO WORK WAS

PASSED SO IF WE ARE THINKING OF

FOLKS OUTSIDE OF THE CAPITOL IT

WOULD BE AN INTERESTING FIVE

YEAR ANNIVERSARY.

>> SEE WHAT HAPPENS AND LET'S

CALL IN DAVE AGAMA AND TALK

ABOUT THE PART TIME LEGISLATURE.

DAVE AGAMA IS A FORMER MEMBER OF

THE MICHIGAN HOUSE ELECTED IN

2007 THE WEST MICHIGAN REPRESENT

IS A FORMER COMMERCIAL AIRLINE

PILOT AND BUSINESS CONSULTANT

AND HOLDS AN UNDER GRADUATE FROM

CALVIN COLLEGE AND MASTERS FROM

CENTRAL MICHIGAN HE IS NOW PART

OF THE EFFORT TO PASS A PART

TIME LEGISLATURE.

GOOD TO SEE YOU AGAIN, MAN.

>> FIRST QUESTION.

>> YOU ARE PARTLY PART OF THE

PART TIME LEGISLATURE PUSH

INITIATIVE AND YET YOU WERE PART

OF THE LEGISLATURE AT ONE POINT

TELL ME WHY YOU THINK IT NEEDS

TO GO PART TIME WHEN YOU

YOURSELF TOOK PART IN A FULL

TIME LEGISLATURE.

>> LET'S GO BACK WHEN I FIRST

GOT ELECTED IN THE LEGISLATURE I

PUT IN THE BILL FOR PART TIME

LEGISLATURE SITTING NEXT TO ME

WAS LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR CALLEY

HE MYSELF MCMILLAN I THINK

JUSTIN AMASH WERE THE ONLY FOUR

THAT SIGNED ON THE BILL AND WENT

NO WHERE BECAUSE THE PEOPLE IN

LANSING WANT A FULL TIME

LEGISLATURE BECAUSE THAT IS

THEIR LIVELIHOOD AND THINK ABOUT

THIS A MOMENT WHEN YOU FIRST GET

IN THE FIRST MONTH YOU ARE

ALLOWED TO PUT TEN BILLS IN YOU

HAVE 110 REPRESENTATIVES, YOU

GET 38 SENATORS.

IF THEY ALL PUT 10 IN THAT IS

1400 ROUGHLY 80 BILLS THAT COULD

BE PUT IN THE FIRST MONTH.

EVERY MONTH THERE AFTER THEY

HAVE THE ABILITY TO PUT FIVE

BILLS IN AND MULTIPLY THAT ALL

OUT FIVE BILLS TIMES 148 TIMES

11 MONTHS AND POSSIBILITY OF

9,000 BILLS BEING PUT IN THAT IS

THE PROBLEM WE HAVE BEEN OVER

REGULATED OVER TAXED OVER

EVERYTHING BECAUSE WE HAVE A

FULL TIME LEGISLATURE, MICHIGAN,

PENNSYLVANIA, NEW YORK, AND

CALIFORNIA ALL HAVE HARD CORE

FULL TIME LEGISLATURES.

NOW I REALIZE THAT LIVENGOOD WAS

IN IT FOR MISSOURI AND GOOD

REASON IT DIDN'T WORK AND IF IT

DID NOT WORK WHY DID THEY

CONTINUE TO HAVE A PART TIME

LEGISLATURE BECAUSE IT DOES

WORK.

>> ARE YOU GOING TO BE ON THE

BALLOT?

>> ON THE BALLOT.

>> HOW DO YOU KNOW?

>> WE ARE HALFWAY RIGHT NOW AND

HAD 90,000 AND HAD 150,000 LEFT

AFTER THEY JUST ANNOUNCED POWER

AND SINCE THEN MUCH MONEY HAS

COME IN.

>> WHERE DID IT COME FROM?

>> I CAN'T TELL YOU THAT.

>> WHY?

>> PEOPLE THAT HAVE GIVEN MONEY

AND 501C4 WANT THEIR NAMES OUT

OF IT IT'S LEGAL.

>> OH, THAT IS ABSOLUTELY LEGAL

NO ONE IS NOT SAYING IT'S NOT

LEGAL BUT FOR AN AVERAGE CITIZEN

WHO YOU KNOW MIGHT SAY YES DO

YOU KNOW WHAT I BELIEVE

LAWMAKERS NEED TO WORK PART TIME

WHAT DO YOU SAY TO THEM WHO ARE

SAYING WELL WHO IS FUNDING THIS

WHO IS BEHIND IT AND YOU SAY YOU

DON'T NEED TO KNOW THAT DON'T

WORRY YOUR PRETTY LITTLE HEAD.

>> I GOT IN IT IN THE LAST TWO,

THREE WEEKS AND ASK BRIAN CALLEY

WITH THIS.

HE IS NOT CONNECTED WITH IT AND

NOT TALKING.

>> HE KIND OF BAILED OUT.

>> DO YOU KNOW WHAT IS BEHIND

IT.

>> I DON'T CARE BECAUSE IN MY

OPINION IS I HAVE BEEN AFTER

THIS FOR TEN YEARS AND I THINK

IT'S SO NECESSARY.

I WAS A MILITARY OFFICER.

I WAS A FIGHTER PILOT AND AN

AIRLINE PILOT SENIOR CAPTAIN

WITH AMERICAN AIRLINES WHAT I

LEARNED WHEN I GOT THERE I'M

GOING TO GET TO LANSING AND DEAL

WITH PEOPLE THAT ARE REALLY

SMART AND KNOW WHAT THEY ARE

DOING AND I DISCOVERED THEY ARE

NOT SMART AND A LOT OF THEM

DON'T HAVE DEGREES AND MEEKHOFF

IS ONE AND CAN'T LOOK AT A

BUDGET WHAT IS REQUIRED BY OUR

STATE CONSTITUTION?

>> PASS A BUDGET.

>> HOW MANY PEOPLE WORK ON THE

BUDGET?

25%.

WHAT IS THE OTHER 75% DO FOR 365

DAYS A YEAR TAXES FINES FEES

REGIONS REGULATIONS AND SO

FORTH.

>> YOU KNOW WE HAD A PART TIME

LEGISLATURE FOR 130 yEARS AND

YOU COULD HAVE ONE RIGHT NOW.

I MEAN IN OTHER WORDS THERE IS

NOTHING THAT MANDATES THAT WE

HAVE A FULL TIME LEGISLATURE,

THE LEGISLATURE WILL CORRECT

ITSELF.

>> THEY WON'T.

>> WHY NOT?

>> THEY LOVE THE JOB.

>> ALL YOU LOVE THE FULL TIME

JOB.

>> I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY PEOPLE

WHO ARE THERE THAT LOVE IT OR

DON'T LOVE IT BUT LET'S FACE IT

MOST OF THE PEOPLE IT'S THE BEST

JOB THEY EVER HAD.

I WAS A RETIRED AIRLINE PILOT

AND RETIRED COLONEL IN THE

AIRFORCE AND DIDN'T NEED THE JOB

THAT IS THE KIND OF PEOPLE I

WANT IN THE POSITIONS SOMEBODY

LIKE YOU WITH GRAY HAIR ON THEIR

HEAD WITH A LIFETIME EXPERIENCE

CAN GET IN THAT POSITION AND

VOTE TOTALLY DIFFERENT THAN A

YOUNG PERSON THAT GETS INTO THAT

DOESN'T HAVE LIFE EXPERIENCE SO

I'M JUST SAYING I KNOW IT'S

NECESSARY, I'VE BEEN THERE AND I

WAS CAUCUS CHAIR AND KNOWS WHAT

GOES ON AND SHOOK MY HEAD THIS

IS CRAZY AND NEVER FORGET THE

FIRST TIME ON THE FLOOR WITH OUR

FIRST VOTE WITH LIEUTENANT

GOVERNOR SITTING NEXT TO ME, WE

HAD A VOTE.

AND THERE WERE 109 YES VOTES AND

ONE NO VOTE AGE LIMIT AND ALL

LOOKED AT ME WHAT IS THIS GUY

THINKING THIS IS A DUMB BILL,

WHY ARE WE EVEN VOTING ON THIS

BILL BECAUSE BUSINESSES CAN

FIGURE THIS OUT ON THEIR OWN WE

DON'T HAVE TO TELL THEM HOW TO

DO IT THEN I KEPT A LIST FOR A

LONG TIME OF DUMB BILLS.

I WISH I WOULD HAVE KEPT THAT

LIST.

I'LL GIVE YOU ONE EXAMPLE.

THIS IS HOW STUPID IT CAN GET IN

LANSING AND THIS IS WHY THEY

HAVE TOO MUCH TIME IN LANSING.

THE BILL WAS PUT ON BY COLEMAN

YOUNG THE THIRD THAT PEOPLE

WORKING ON THE ROAD FOR EVERY 10

PEOPLE YOU HAVE TO HAVE A PORTA

POTTY AND WE HAVE TO MANDATE

PORTA POTTIES AND I LOOKED ON

THE HOUSE FLOOR THERE ARE SOME

WOMEN THERE BUT WE HAVE THREE

TOILETS IN THE BACK FOR THE MEN

AND WE NEED SOME PORTA POTTIES

ON THE HOUSE FLOOR BECAUSE THERE

IS MORE THAN TEN FOR A PORTA

POTTY AND BILLS ARE UNNECESSARY

AND QUITE FRANKLY NOT IN SESSION

BUSINESS IS SAFEST.

>> DO YOU HAVE A PROBLEM CALLED

THE CLEAN MICHIGAN CAMPAIGN AND

CLEANUP GOVERNMENT AND NOBODY

KNOWS WHO IS FUNDING IT HOW DO

YOU EXPLAIN THAT HOW IS IT

CLEANING UP GOVERNMENT WHEN YOU

HAVE UNKNOWN FUNDERS PAYING FOR

A CHANGE?

>> WHAT IS A 501C4 FOR?

YOU CAN FIGURE THAT OUT ON YOUR

OWN.

FOR ME I KNOW IT'S NECESSARY

BEEN THERE DONE IT.

>> ON THE BILLS YOU ARE TALKING

ABOUT GRANTED THERE ARE

THOUSANDS OF BILLS INTRODUCED

BUT THERE IS ONLY ABOUT ONLY

RELATIVE TERM MAYBE 800 PUBLIC

ACTS EVERY TWO YEARS AND MAY

HAVE THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS OF

BILLS AND 148 PEOPLE WHO MAKE

THE DECISION THEY ARE ELECTED IS

THIS GOOD OR BAD.

>> BAD.

>> IF THEY DECIDE IT'S GOOD

POLICY HOW DO YOU SAY THAT IS A

BAD THING?

>> FIRST OF ALL LET'S GO BACK

FOR EVERY BILL THAT PASSES THE

LEGISLATURE SERVICE BUREAU AND

GO TO COMMITTEE IT COSTS A HALF

A MILLION DOLLARS.

THAT IS JUST ROUGHLY WHAT IT

COSTS SO YOU LOOK AT ALL THESE

BILLS THAT ARE PUT IN AND YOU

LOOK AT THE STATES THAT ARE PART

TIME THEY PUT IN LESS BILLS.

THEY DO.

LOOK AT TEXAS THEY MEET EVERY

OTHER YEAR, THEY HAVE AN ECONOMY

BIGGER THAN A LOT OF THE

COUNTRIES.

>> LET'S DO NUMBERS TOM MCMILLAN

COCHAIRING SAID YOU HAVE 180,000

NAMES IS THAT CORRECT.

>> MORE THAN HALF.

>> YOU NEED ANOTHER 180,000

NAMES BY MID JANUARY SO IN OTHER

WORDS.

>> NO WE DON'T NEED IT BY MID

JANUARY.

>> WHAT IS THE NEW DATE?

>> IN FEBRUARY OR MARCH WE CAN

DO APRIL OR MAY AND PUT IT IN

JUNE.

>> DID YOU MOVE THE CLOCK DOWN.

>> 180 WINDOW.

>> I UNDERSTAND AS YOU MOVE THE

WINDOW YOU LOSE NAMES ON THE

OTHER END.

>> YOU DO HOWEVER AND AGAIN I'M

NOT AUTHORIZED TO TELL YOU WHAT

WE ARE ABOUT TO DO BUT YOU WILL

KNOW IN THE NEXT TWO WEEKS

SOMETHING THAT WILL BE VERY

EFFECTIVE TO GET NAMES IF WE

DISCOVER WE ARE GETTING A WHOLE

BUNCH OF NEW NAMES HERE IN THE

NEXT TWO THREE MONTHS WE WILL

BACK OFF.

>> YOU WILL PICK UP THE PACE.

>> YES.

>> GET SIGNATURES MUST FASTER.

>> WHAT IS THE REASON THAT FOLKS

WHO MAY BE FRUSTRATED WITH

LANSING OR BELIEVE THAT THERE

SHOULD BE FEWER BILLS BUT ARE

NOT FOR A PART TIME LEGISLATURE

IS THE WAY THAT IT'S WRITTEN A

LOT OF FOLKS SAY IT WOULD KEEP

PEOPLE WHO HAVE FULL TIME JOBS

OUT OF THE LEGISLATURE LIKE A

TEACHER RIGHT FOR THAT PERSON

THEY CAN'T JUST LEAVE THREE

MONTHS OUT OF THE YEAR OUT OF

THE SCHOOL YEAR AND COME UP TO

LANSING.

IS THERE CONCERN FOR YOU OR

SOMEONE WHO IS SIGNING ON TO

THIS PETITION YOU ARE BASICALLY

SAYING ONLY A CERTAIN GROUP OF

PEOPLE MAYBE INDEPENDENTLY

WEALTHY WHO DON'T HAVE FULL TIME

JOBS OR ARE ABLE TO BE BUSINESS

OPENERS AND THEY CAN SET THEIR

OWN SCHEDULES ARE THEY THE ONLY

ONES THAT CAN SUDDENLY BECOME

LAWMAKERS BECAUSE IT WORKS WITH

THEIR SCHEDULE BUT A CAR

MECHANIC AND WANTED TO RUN HE

CAN'T LEAVE HIS JOB FOR THREE

MONTHS AT A TIME.

>> THE LEGISLATURE CAN DECIDE

HOW TO DO IT HOW THEY WISH TO

AND IF THEY START JANUARY 15 AND

GO TO APRIL 15, 90 DAYS IN BY

THE WAY HOW MANY DAYS ARE THEY

IN SESSION NOW?

FOLKS IF YOU ARE LISTENING THEY

ARE ONLY IN 85-95 DAYS ON

AVERAGE AND YOU HAVE PART TIME

TUESDAY, WEDNESDAY, THURSDAY AND

OFF FOR DEER HUNTING SEASON AND

OFF FOR CHRISTMAS AND BENEFITS

AND 75 A DAY FOR EVERY DAY THEY

ARE NOT IN SESSION AND CAN

WRITE-OFF INCOME TAX AND DON'T

TALK ABOUT THAT THAT IS FRIDAY,

SATURDAY, SUNDAY MONDAY.

>> SUCH A HOT SHOT IDEA HOW COME

PARTS OF THE BUSINESS COMMUNITY

ARE LOATHE TO SUPPORT IT.

>> CHAMBER OF COMMERCE TOLD NORM

AND I GOT HIM INVOLVED WITH IT I

APPROACHED HIM AND SAID WE ARE

NOT GOING TO GET INVOLVED WITH

IT BECAUSE THEY COULDN'T SEE HOW

WE CAN PASS IT NOW WE ARE CLOSE

TO PASSING IT THEY ARE AGAINST

IT BECAUSE THEY DON'T WANT IT

PASSED, WHY BECAUSE LOBBYING

WOULD BE LESS EFFECTIVE AND

QUITE FRANKLY YOU PEOPLE SITTING

HERE ARE A LITTLE PREJUDICE ON

THIS ISSUE I WOULD SAY BECAUSE

IF THEY ARE ONLY IN SESSION

JANUARY, FEBRUARY MARCH OR 90

DAYS WHAT ARE YOU GUYS GOING TO

DO THE OTHER 90 DAYS.

>> BUREAUCRACY.

>> PLENTY OF STORIES IN LANSING

THAT DO NOT HAVE TO DO WITH THE

LAWMAKER.

>> MANY PEOPLE ARE TALKING.

>> BUSINESS COMMUNITY SAYING

THIS IS A BAD IDEA.

>> WHICH BUSINESS COMMUNITY SOME

BUSINESSES LOVE THE IDEA OF A

PART TIME LEGISLATURE.

>> I SUPPORT CALLEY FOR PUTTING

IT IN AND I'M NOT SUPPORTING HIM

FOR GOVERNOR.

>> HOW MUCH ARE YOU PAYING FOR

SIGNATURE.

>> BETWEEN 1-2 BUT WE HAVE 9,000

PEOPLE AND GRASS ROOTS BESIDES

THAT AND DO HAVE ENOUGH MONEY

PRESENTLY TO COVER THAT.

>> REPRESENTATIVE IS IT FAIR TO

ASSUME YOU'RE NOT A FAN OF THE

EXECUTIVE BRANCH ISSUING

ADMINISTRATIVE RULES AND

REGULATIONS AND SO FORTH?

>> IT'S FAIR FOR ME TO SAY I

THINK IT'S A FALSE ASSUMPTION

WHEN YOU SAY THAT THE EXECUTIVE

WILL HAVE MORE POWER.

IN FACT, THE MARGARET FERGUSON

FROM THE INDIANA UNIVERSITY

POLITICAL SCIENCE DID A STUDY ON

THAT AND SAID IT'S THE OPPOSITE

WHETHER OR NOT YOU HAVE FULL

TIME LEGISLATURE TWO OR THREE

PEOPLE HAVE A LOT OF POWER TO

DECIDE WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO DO,

ONE THE GOVERNOR CANNOT SIGN IT

IN LAW UNLESS THE LEGISLATURE

MAKES THE LAW BECAUSE HE DOESN'T

HAVE AUTHORITY TO MAKE LAW AND

HE BASICALLY SAID WHEN OR SHE

BASICALLY SAID WHEN THOSE PEOPLE

ARE IN SESSION ALL THE TIME THE

GOVERNOR HAS MORE POWER TO SWAY

THEIR VOTES BY TWISTING ARMS NOW

YOU KNOW AS WELL AS I DO

ESPECIALLY YOU TIM YOU KNOW THE

POWER OF THE SPEAKER AND YOU

SERVE AT THE POWER OF THE

SPEAKER I USED TO SAY REALLY I

SERVE AT THE POWER OF THE 95,000

PEOPLE THAT ELECTED ME NOT THE

SPEAKER THE SPEAKER CAN TAKE

YOUR CHAIR AWAY AND GIVE YOU

NOTHING BUT A COMPUTER AND TAKE

YOUR STAFF AWAY I HIRE MY OWN

STAFF.

WHAT HAPPENS FOR EXAMPLE LIKE

COLBECK WHEN MEEKHOFF TOOK

LEADERSHIP POSITIONS AWAY AND

THREATENING TO TAKE AWAY HIS

OFFICE PEOPLE YOU ARE BASICALLY

TAKEN AWAY HE HAS THE POWER TO

TAKE AWAY THE PEOPLE FROM 95,000

PEOPLE IN THE CASE OF A SENATOR

MANY MORE THEIR LEGISLATURE THEY

PUT IN OFFICE FROM DOING THEIR

JOB.

MY POINT WHEN I WAS THERE THE

HOUSE SPEAKER AND SENATE LEADER

HAVE TOO MUCH POWER AND HAS TO

BE REDUCED IN THE FUTURE.

>> REPRESENTATIVE DO YOU LIVE IN

SENATOR MEEKHOFF'S DISTRICT NOW?

>> NO.

>> WHICH DISTRICT DO YOU LIVE

IN, WHY WOULDN'T YOU WANT TO BE

PART OF THE SENATE YOU COULD

REALLY BE FIGHTING THIS FIGHT ON

THE INSIDE.

>> IF THIS GOES PART TIME I

MIGHT VERY WELL DO SOMETHING

LIKE THAT.

>> ARE YOU GETTING PAID TO BE

PART OF THIS?

>> THIS HAS BEEN AN ISSUE OF

MINE SINCE 2007 WHEN I GOT IN

THERE AND SAT DOWN AND SAW THE

INCOMPETENCE WITHIN THIS BRANCH

I THOUGHT THIS IS WHY WE ARE IN

TROUBLE EXCESSIVE LAW TAXES

FINES FEES RULES AND REGULATIONS

THESE PEOPLE ARE PUTTING OUT

DAILY.

>> CONFIDENT THIS WILL BE ON THE

BALLOT.

>> CONFIDENT IT WILL BE ON THE

BALLOT AND CONFIDENT IF IT GETS

ON THE BALLOT IT'S GOING TO PASS

PEOPLE ARE FED UP WITH WHAT THEY

SEE IN LANSING WE SAID NO.

>> GOT TO GET OUT.

>> THANK YOU SIR GOOD TO SEE YOU

AGAIN NEXT WEEK CORRESPONDENCE

EDITION AND LOOK AT THE GOVERNOR

AND U.S. SENATE RACE AND

EVERYTHING SEE YOU THEN.

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♪