[FEMALE NARRATOR] Funding for
"Overheard with Evan Smith"
is provided in part by
Hillco Partners,
a Texas government
affairs consultancy,
Claire and Carl Stuart,
and by Laura and John Beckworth,
The Hobby Family Foundation.
[EVAN SMITH] I'm Evan Smith.
He's a four-time Grammy
Award-winning blues musician
whose latest album
is "Oklahoma."
He's Keb' Mo'.
This is "Overheard."
(upbeat electronic music)
(audience applauds)
Let's be honest.
Is this about the
ability to learn,
or is this about the experience
of not having been
taught properly?
How have you avoided
what has befallen other
nations in Africa?
You could say that
he made his own bed,
but you caused him
to sleep in it.
You know, you saw a problem
and, over time, took it on.
Let's start with the sizzle
before we get to the steak.
Are you gonna run for president?
I think I just got an
F from you, actually.
(audience laughs)
This is "Overheard."
(audience applauds)
[SMITH] Keb' Mo', welcome.
[KEB' MO'] Thank you, Evan.
[SMITH] Good to be with you.
[MO'] It's good to be here.
[SMITH] May I say,
I don't believe
I've had a two-apostrophe
guest in 17 years?
(laughs)
First time for
everything, right?
[MO'] Yes.
[SMITH] For the record,
it's Kevin Moore.
[MO'] Yes, that's my birth name.
[SMITH] Birth name
is Kevin Moore.
[MO'] Kevin Roosevelt Moore.
[SMITH] Kevin Roosevelt Moore.
We have a former
drummer of yours
to thank for christening you
or coining Keb' Mo', right?
[MO'] Yes.
[SMITH] Tell that story.
[MO'] Well, there was a band
called The Billy Mitchell Trio,
and Quentin Dennard was
the drummer in that band.
They played at a club
called the Nucleus Nuance
in L.A., durin' the
late '80s and '90s.
They didn't have a guitar player
because it was a jazz trio.
So I would go in
and play for free.
My job was to play
along with the band.
It wasn't really a job,
It was just kinda, I
would just come in--
[SMITH] It was a gig.
[MO'] Whenever I felt like it.
And I would play the blues.
When it was blues
time, I was on.
So then, they'd go,
"Keb' Mo', all right!"
So with Kevin,
you can't go like,
"Kevin Moore and the blues."
(laughs)
[SMITH] Kevin Moore is
not much of a blues name.
It's more like an accountant.
[MO'] Yes.
[SMITH] Right, I get that.
(audience laughs)
So, Keb' Mo', that's it.
[MO'] Keb' Mo'.
[SMITH] And it stuck.
[MO'] Yeah.
[SMITH] Let's start
about Los Angeles.
I wanna start, actually,
in the reverse order I
would ordinarily start.
I'd want to talk about
the record first,
and we'll get to the
record, eventually.
But I wanna talk about the
origin story here of Keb' Mo'.
So you grew up in Los Angeles?
[MO'] Los Angeles, in
the City of Compton.
[SMITH] City of Compton.
Your parents, actually,
were not from Los Angeles.
They were from the
Deep South, right?
[MO'] Yes, they were from,
my mother was from Hooks, Texas,
and my father was from
Heflin, Louisiana.
[SMITH] Yeah, do you remember
listening to music as a kid,
in the house or?
[MO'] We had some
records in the house.
I remember like, the
first record we had,
not the first record we had,
but the record that I
would listen to a lot
was not what you think the
record I'd be listening to.
I listened to Johnny
Mathis' "Greatest Hits."
[SMITH] Well, nothing wrong.
(audience laughs and applauds)
If we agree on nothing else,
let's agree, nothing wrong
with Johnny Mathis, right?
[MO'] Johnny Mathis' "Greatest
Hits" was a great album.
[SMITH] That's a great record.
[MO'] It stayed on
the charts forever,
not unlike "Tapestry" or
"Dark Side of the Moon."
It was a great record with great
songs and great production.
So that was part of my
introduction into music.
[SMITH] Did you know
from an early age
that this is what
you wanted to do?
Did you think, I wanna?
I know there are a
lot of stories about
you as a young kid,
you know, going to
get your first guitar.
I've heard, in fact, you
interviewed on the subject
of buying your first
acoustic guitar
and then, buying your
first electric guitar,
I think in a pawn shop, right?
[MO'] Yes.
[SMITH] In Compton, right?
I've heard that story.
I know that you
kinda kicked around
and played at a young age
with some other people.
But I wonder what
got you to think,
this is something I wanna do?
[MO'] Hmm, that's
a long decision.
Because I wasn't
one of these guys
that was like, "That's
what I'm gonna do!"
[SMITH] Yeah, you didn't
have a moment of revelation,
right, and that was it.
[MO'] But it was in my late 30s.
(audience murmurs)
[SMITH] In your late 30s?
[MO'] When the actual
moment of revelation came.
[SMITH] Right, so you
were just doing this
for the time being.
[MO'] I started out,
and I was always coaxed
into playing music.
[SMITH] Coaxed, really?
[MO'] Yeah, invited,
so to speak.
"Hey, you wanna come play?"
My first experience
was playing the trumpet
in the fifth grade at General
Rosecrans Elementary School.
My mother said, "Do you wanna
try for the band at school?
"You wanna play music?"
I said, "No."
(audience chuckles)
And I said,
she looked and she,
you didn't say no to my mother.
[SMITH] Right.
(audience laughs)
I'm not asking.
I'm telling, right?
[MO'] She says, she
says, she says, "Oh!
"Well, you gonna
play something."
(laughs)
[SMITH] Your mother
was everybody's
mother, I have to say.
We've all had a
version of that story.
[MO'] So I went.
They tried me out, and I
ended up on the trumpet.
The following year we moved,
and I went to a new school.
They kicked me out of the band
'cause my grades
weren't good enough.
They were good at
the other school,
but the next school was
kinda like, different deal.
So I got kicked out of the band.
So then, we moved again.
And that's the house that
we stayed in for the next,
that house is,
I still, I own that
house right now.
[SMITH] Still?
[MO'] Yeah, that house,
I bought that house
when I was in Compton.
So we stayed there,
and on that block
was Chuck Count T.
He had a steel band,
playing music from
Trinidad, calypso music.
[SMITH] Calypso
music, right, yeah.
[MO'] And his son, Carlos, who
is still my good buddy today,
who lives in the neighborhood,
he says, "Hey, come down.
"I wanna show you these drums."
Meanwhile, I just got
kicked out of the band.
He started playin' these drums,
and he said, "Look
at this," he says.
He played somethin',"
da da da da da da da da.
And I just played
it right after,
daga daga daga
daga daga. (laughs)
And so, I guess his dad
got wind of that I could,
you know, could do that.
[SMITH] We need you to
come play with us, right?
Yeah!
[MO'] Yeah, so next thing,
I'm in there, playin'
a steel band now.
[SMITH] Right, it's
interesting to me, you know,
Johnny Mathis, and the
steel band, calypso music.
Over time you've played blues.
You've played what
I think of really,
as almost something
like rock 'n' roll.
You've had jazz, elements of
jazz in your music, over time.
It's really hard to
put you in a bucket
or one category, right?
That you're this kind, I mean,
I called you a blues musician
in the introduction to
our conversation today.
That's true, but not accurate.
Really, you're a
lot more than just--
[MO'] Well, there's
not really such thing
as a blues musician--
[SMITH] Right.
[MO'] --or jazz musician.
[SMITH] How do you
talk about yourself,
or how do you want
people to think
about the work that you do?
[MO'] I'm a musician,
but I don't think of myself
as a master musician.
I know music.
I'm not a virtuoso on any
particular instrument,
but I know music.
I know how it's built.
I know the theory.
I know the math of it.
I have a reasonable amount
of dexterity on a guitar
and a banjo, or a
mandolin, things like that.
[SMITH] Right, you're
being very modest.
You have more than a
reasonable amount of dexterity.
(laughs)
[MO'] Clearly, you haven't
heard Tommy Emmanuel. (chuckles)
[SMITH] Well look, I
think that if you go back,
[MO'] (chuckles)
[SMITH] As we sit here now,
25 years since
your first record,
we go back and listen
to that record today.
There is more than just a
reasonable amount of dexterity.
And that was then, right?
Over time, obviously,
you're a different musician
than you were back then.
[MO'] What I love
is songwriting.
You know, I think the
songwriting factor,
all that leads up to there.
Like I say, I was always
coaxed into things.
I could tell you
story after story,
but just know that I
wasn't the impetus for the
goin' in there, you know.
But I loved music.
I always loved music.
I'm really thankful
for those people
who did invite and coax
me into musical situations
because I wouldn't be standing
here now without them.
[SMITH] Well, no
success is your success.
It's everyone's success.
All of us feel that way, right?
Everybody contributed to it.
[MO'] Yeah, so I
played the steel drums,
and then in high school,
I played French horn.
So I was in the Compton
Community Youth or Compton.
Actually, when I was
in Compton, we had,
there was a symphony in Compton.
It was a junior symphony
in the 60s, in Compton,
and I was in it,
playin' the French horn.
'Cause I was very first French
horn at the high school,
and the first French horn person
got to go play in the orchestra.
[SMITH] It's
amazing, French horn.
[MO'] Yeah (chuckles)
[SMITH] Probably all over
the country, there are
kids who are thinking,
I'm playing the
French horn in school.
This is going to
amount to nothing.
This is like being a math major.
[MO'] Yeah, and it
didn't amount to much,
but I was in the band.
It wasn't about the--
[SMITH] Well, if you're around
the stuff, that's
what happens, right?
[MO'] It's about
being in the band.
I met these two guys,
and they were in the
band, playing French horn.
I was hangin' with them.
They said, "Why don't you come?
"They may need another
French horn player.
"Why don't you play it?"
It was not glamorous.
French horn was not glamorous.
[SMITH] Yeah, I can imagine.
It's not glamorous, right, yeah.
It's the French horn.
[MO'] I hadn't been playing
trumpet for years, and that was.
The teacher said, "Okay, here!
"It's the French horn.
"Get in line!"
(audience chuckles)
And I was in the marching band.
[SMITH] That's pretty great.
[MO'] (laughs)
[SMITH] What was your way,
Keb', into the business,
into the music business?
You started out not
actually as a performer.
You started out working
in the business,
but not performing, right?
[MO'] I was performing.
The steel band had gigs.
[SMITH] But I'm
talking about the real,
like honest-to-goodness
music business,
recording business, right.
[MO'] Oh, that started
in Dallas, Texas,
when I was in a
play called "Spunk"
at the Dallas Repertory Theater.
I was a guitar
man in that thing.
I was playing
acoustic, you know,
country blues part and singing.
A woman came up and asked
if I had anything to sell.
Her name was Vicky.
She said, "Do you have
anything to sell?"
I said, "No."
She said, "Why don't you
have anything to sell?
"What do you mean, you don't
have anything to sell?"
She just like, just
reamed my you-know-what
about not having
anything to sell.
So I got somethin' to sell.
I took some of my tapes
that I had brought with me,
and I put them together--
[SMITH] Put it together.
[MO'] --and went to
a studio in Dallas.
Had 'em run off a
hundred cassettes.
I had a guy draw up a
little character of me.
I went to Kinkos, put
it on a piece of paper,
(audience laughs)
put it in there,
folded it up and
put it in there,
cut it just right and then--
[SMITH] Total DIY
deal, right, yeah.
[MO'] I did a hundred of those--
[SMITH] Hundred of those--
[MO'] and put 'em up.
[SMITH] and started
selling them.
[MO'] And I sold all of them.
I made $1,000!
[SMITH] Did you?
(audience laughs)
You probably never thought
in a million years, right?
[MO'] And that's the point when
I was in the music business!
(laughs)
(audience applauds)
[SMITH] $1,000 is
real money, right?
[MO'] That's right.
[SMITH] That's real money.
So you've just had your
first studio album,
solo studio album come
out in the summer of 2019,
in five years, right?
First studio album in five
years, right, "Oklahoma"?
[MO'] No, I have a solo one
called "Blues Americana."
[SMITH] But that was 2014.
[MO'] Oh yeah,
yeah, you're right.
[SMITH] So it's five years.
[MO'] You're better
at math than I am.
(audience laughs)
[SMITH] There's a lotta things
you can do that I can't do,
beginning with the French horn.
But I know that it's been five
years since the last record,
and I think people were waiting
around to see what this was.
This is a really
pretty terrific record,
this record "Oklahoma."
[MO'] Oh, thank you so much.
[SMITH] There are
so many songs on it.
I mentioned to you,
before we came out here,
that when I've
listened to the record,
they've stuck in my head.
I find myself thinking
about the songs
when I'm not listening to it.
Would you talk a little bit
about how this
record came to pass?
I mean, there are a lot
of interesting stories
about this record.
One thing is that it's
dedicated to your mom.
Your mom passed away last year--
[MO'] Yeah.
[SMITH] --right?
It's got personal aspects
to it, I understand.
But talk about this record and
why it's called "Oklahoma."
[MO'] Okay well, it started out,
I called my friend Colin Linden.
I said, "Man, I'm tired.
"Come help me make this record."
"Come, you know, help me."
So he coproduced with me.
I sent him the songs.
I went through all my computer
and looked at all these
things that I had written.
I said, "Aw."
I'm thinking, I'm
gonna have to write
a whole album in two weeks.
Colin calls me back.
He says, "I don't know, man.
"I think you got a record here."
You know?
[SMITH] That's how this works
for those of us who are
not in this line of work.
You have a file on your computer
where you just keep things
that you're working on, ideas.
[MO'] Throughout the year,
there'll be writing sessions.
You work with these
people, everything.
[SMITH] So you don't just write
when you have an
album coming out.
You just write when you write,
and you just save it.
[MO'] All the time,
you always write.
You're always writin',
and then you have it.
[SMITH] You're puttin'
it in a pipeline--
[MO'] Mm-hmm.
[SMITH] --right?
[MO'] So the story
about "Oklahoma," to me,
is the most interesting
thing about the album.
Why is it called "Oklahoma"?
So it was originally gonna
be called "This Is My Home."
But "Oklahoma" came up.
The way it happened is, I
had this idea, this riff,
goin' dang dang dang adanga
adanga da blanga da blanga.
I'm just playin'
it over and over
about two weeks
around Christmas time.
I'm goin', "I like playing this.
"It just feels good to play it.
"I know it needs a hook."
I'm goin', "Okay."
I was in L.A. at
my sister's house.
I'm goin',
♪ Oklahoma ♪
I was like, "Oh that's crap!"
(laughs)
[SMITH] You have no
connection personally
to the state of Oklahoma, right?
[MO'] Yeah, I do have.
I'll get to that.
[SMITH] Okay.
I thought the fact
that it was "Oklahoma"
was kind of this odd
thing for that reason.
[MO'] I'll get into that.
[SMITH] Okay, good.
[MO'] I'll get into that.
So I got this idea.
New Year's Day, I have a party.
My wife and I have a party
at the house every year,
and we invite everybody over.
We got food, liquor,
music, everything.
Everybody just comes over.
Bring anybody you want
and, you know, like that.
My drummer, Marcus Finnie,
when I do have a band,
he says, "I want you to
meet this lady, Dara Tucker.
"You should write with her."
You know what I mean?
And I'm goin', "Okay, now
that I got this record,
"I don't have any songs."
So, I give it to her, and she
comes over like the next day.
I say, "Where are you from?"
She says, "Oklahoma."
(audience chuckles)
Bing! (chuckles)
[SMITH] Right,
that's divine intervention.
[MO'] So I've got an
idea now, "Oklahoma."
What about this?
Let's just work on this.
I explained to her that I didn't
have much of a connection.
So we on the Wikipedia
(audience chuckles)
and started lookin' at
stuff and thinkin' about,
what's happenin' in Oklahoma?
I knew,
I had been to Oklahoma
and seen a tornado.
Aftermath now of a
tornado, that's a big one.
I went there with
Kenny Wayne Shepherd.
We did a benefit.
[SMITH] Did a benefit concert.
I remember that, right.
[MO'] Kenny Wayne Shepherd,
Robert Randolph.
Like I said, we did a benefit.
So I got to go look at this.
I was like, "Oh, a tornado
is no joke." (chuckles)
That thing grinds
like a meat grinder,
but it's not meat.
It's wood and steel and
just all this stuff.
[SMITH] Destruction
left's so bad.
[MO'] It's so bad, definitely.
Also, I became friends
with Garth Brooks
and Vince Gill,
guys from Oklahoma.
I started meetin' all
these people from Oklahoma.
I started really
lookin' at the people
that are from Oklahoma.
Even my favorite guitar
player that I grew up with,
David T. Walker, was
born in Oklahoma,
Timmy B. Schmit from the Eagles.
Oklahoma is a state
of great things.
[SMITH] So you have a
connection to Oklahoma-ish.
[MO'] It's a connection,
but I kinda like
had to dig and build it. [SMITH]
Right, I'm a little worried
you wrote the song based on
what you read on Wikipedia.
(audience laughs)
This is actually,
this has stuck with me.
[MO'] No, no I know people.
And the people were in the
area, I'm thinkin' like.
Garth Brooks is
like, and Vince Gill,
those are some of the
most down-to-earth,
shameless, good
people I've ever met.
You know, Oklahoma, you know?
So I go,
we write the song.
And there's also, The Gap
Band is from Oklahoma too,
just so you know that.
♪ You dropped a
bomb on me baby ♪
(laughs) So there's
all that good stuff.
[SMITH] There's good
things in Oklahoma.
I agree.
[MO'] Uncle Charlie's
from Oklahoma.
[SMITH] I get it.
I get it.
[MO'] Uncle Charlie.
[SMITH] So this is a
record that actually,
I don't think of
you as a political--
[MO'] Oh, I'm political.
- But I don't think of
you as a political--
But you're not an expressly.
Oh look, you're not
Ani DiFranco, right?
You're not a political artist
in the sense of that you wear
your politics on your sleeve--
[MO'] No, I hide it.
[SMITH] You hide it.
But you know, but there is a,
I detected, I thought, a subtle
but unmistakable political
vibe on this record.
[MO'] Yeah.
[SMITH] A little bit
about the environment, a
little bit about feminism
and the place of women
in society today.
You have a great
collaboration on this record
with Rosanne Cash--
[MO'] Rosanne Cash.
[SMITH] --a song called "Put
A Woman In Charge," right?
It's a really interesting
and good song.
And there's actually
a discussion
of immigration--
[MO'] Immigration, yeah.
[SMITH] And the
fact that you said,
which I did not know
until you said it,
that you had intended
the record to be called
"This Is"--
[MO'] "My Home."
[SMITH] "This Is My Home."
You actually have a
perspective on what's happening
now, out in the world--
[MO'] Yeah.
[SMITH] --about
immigration as a subject.
I think it's subtly visible.
Talk about that.
I think that's
really interesting.
[MO'] That's right.
I put the subject of
immigration as a love story,
not as a talk about
people who come here,
not goin' right at the issue.
I wanted to humanize
immigration, in a sense.
[SMITH] But you
get there, though.
I think you walk away from it--
[MO'] Even in "Oklahoma,"
there's a big political thing
in there too that
everybody misses.
[SMITH] Well, help us,
give us the Easter egg.
Show us the Easter
egg in the song.
[MO'] It's the bridge
where I go like,
"And over on Greenwood,
Archer and Pine."
In the '20s,
one of the biggest race riots
in Oklahoma,
back then, it was called
Black Wall Street.
And there was this
community in Wall Street
where these ex-slaves, you
know, African Americans
had figured out
how to do business.
They had a community.
Probably a lot of it was
because of segregation.
And like people, you had
to have your own stuff.
But word has it that
a dollar would go
around the community 30 times.
And the community
became very prosperous.
And then on the other
side of the tracks,
in another part of
Tulsa, Oklahoma,
you think about racial
tension back then.
This is the '20s.
So...
Some black men got accused of,
you know, usually the
thing of inappropriately
something with a white woman.
[SMITH] Right.
[MO'] They got wind of it, and
it was already probably hot.
And the white community
literally came over
and burnt and bombed
the place down.
[SMITH] Wow, so
that's the reference.
[MO'] Yeah, and it's like.
It was squashed down in
history for a few years,
not in any history books.
It was very quiet,
but it was the biggest
race riot there ever was.
[SMITH] Well, this record,
whether you are interested
in the politics of it or not,
is a really great
record to listen to.
I wish you a lot
of success with it.
Can I completely pivot away
from music for a second
and ask you about
your love of hats?
(audience chuckles)
[MO'] Yeah, man.
Well, back in--
[SMITH] That's a nice hat.
I like that hat.
[MO'] I started
goin' bald in, um,
1970.
[SMITH] Is that right?
[MO'] Yeah,
and I went bald very slowly.
[SMITH] I was about to say,
you have been successful
in the getting bald department.
[MO'] Yeah, no.
[SMITH] You are
successfully bald now.
[MO'] But it was
like really slow.
I mean, I had hair 'til
my mid-30s and late 40s,
not late, my 40s.
And it gradually,
it finally just got.
I just kept lower, cuttin'
it lower and lower and lower.
Finally got to the
point where I was,
"Oh, this is ridiculous, dude."
Just shave it all off.
And then, it looks
like this now.
(audience chuckles)
[SMITH] Great, yeah.
(audience applauds)
[MO'] I just need somethin',
I just need somethin'
to block out the light
from my head, shinin'.
(audience laughs)
[SMITH] But you said to me
again, before we came out today,
this kinda really caught my ear.
I wanted to ask you about this.
You said, "Buying a hat
is an arduous task."
[MO'] Yes.
[SMITH] We could do
30 minutes on this.
Why don't you do a
shorter version of it?
[MO'] Well, my friend, Colin
Linden, he always says.
He's very, you know,
manly like I am,
you know, on the
top of the head.
[SMITH] Quite bald.
[MO'] He says,
"A hat is not a toy."
(audience laughs)
So I mean, when you go
lookin' for your hat,
this becomes your haircut.
[SMITH] Right well,
that's interesting.
[MO'] This is like, you know.
This becomes your,
you know, either
you can wear this.
This is cool too.
Or you can wear this.
But this is like a haircut now.
If you've ever had a
bad haircut, you know--
[SMITH] You know what it's like.
[MO'] Yeah. (chuckles)
[SMITH] Sometimes, the
answer to a bad haircut
is a hat, actually.
[MO'] Yeah.
(chuckles)
[SMITH] As the case may be.
[MO'] Just wait
and just see 'em.
So it's like that.
So buyin' a hat the
right shape, brim.
[SMITH] Well, it's
become a signature piece
of your own style.
We don't associate you
with anything other than
having a fine hat on.
[MO'] And you can't find 'em,
I can't find a bunch of hats
'cause I have a
really long head, too.
Because there's some
of 'em, they said,
"Here come Kevin with
the ol' football head."
(audience laughs)
[SMITH] I wouldn't have made the
football head reference myself,
but now I'm not gonna be
able, not be able to--
[MO'] (laughs)
[SMITH] Let's talk about
a couple of things on
you as we wrap here.
The first thing is, you are no
longer livin' in Los Angeles,
right, full-time?
You have--
[MO'] I have a house in,
not full-time but part-time,
'cause I have a
house in Compton.
[SMITH] But you're living
primarily in Tennessee?
[MO'] Tennessee.
Franklin, Tennessee.
[SMITH] Why did
you decide to move?
This is again, you know.
It's not the Deep South in the
sense that your parents were.
But it's the South though.
[MO'] Well, my wife
is from Wisconsin.
We have a 12-year-old son.
I was, um,
She didn't like the attitude
of Los Angeles, whatever.
She didn't like somethin',
somethin' she didn't like.
She's, "Well, it's too
crowded," whatever.
And she tells me one day
with teary eyes, she goes,
"I don't wanna
raise my son here."
(audience chuckles)
And I went, oh snap.
(laughs)
Okay, honey.
[SMITH] 'Cause you've
been in that situation.
[MO'] I know.
[SMITH] Where are we goin'?
[MO'] I saw the movin'
trucks, comin'. (chuckles)
[SMITH] But you're in
Franklin, Tennessee.
[MO'] Yeah. [SMITH] But
does being in Tennessee,
which is obviously a
rich musical tradition
in the state of Tennessee.
[MO'] Well, there was
nowhere else for us to
go 'cause of Nashville.
[SMITH] How does it affect
your thinking about music,
about your own performance
or your own collaborations?
[MO'] It was like a fresh start.
[SMITH] It was.
[MO'] It didn't change
my work style.
It didn't change
who I was, anything.
But I found a whole fresh
bunch of writers to
collaborate with,
musicians to collaborate with
and a fresh perspective
in doin' it there.
It was like I just
moved to a new school.
[SMITH] So the work
product, will we see,
will we see a different work
product as a result of there
than we would have, had you
not left the West Coast?
[MO'] Yes, I believe so.
But I don't see it
as much different
because I was already rooted
in country and R&B and blues.
Nothin' really changed.
[SMITH] The physical location
is not going to affect that.
[MO'] No, but the people around.
But also, you can always
find a really good
pedal steel player in Nashville.
[SMITH] Well, it's a little
easier to find it there.
[MO'] You can find
great mandolin players.
You can find guys that
are really masterful.
I mean, the musicianship
and the songwriting skill
is just masterful.
[SMITH] Right, they have
reasonable dexterity--
[MO'] Yes. (chuckles)
[SMITH] as you like to say,
(audience chuckles)
in Nashville.
So you're on the road, touring.
You tour a lot, right?
You're on the road all the time.
[MO'] Yeah, I do.
[SMITH] And you enjoy it.
This is one of the things
that I always ask musicians.
Do you prefer recording,
or do you prefer touring?
[MO'] It's all the same thing.
[SMITH] It's all the same thing.
Two sides of the
same coin, isn't it?
[MO'] Yes.
[SMITH] Right.
Do you tour to support records,
or do you make records so
you have something to tour?
[MO'] It's all the same thing.
[SMITH] Again, the same thing.
It's not one side
or another side.
[MO'] You tour to
support the record.
You make the record
to support the tour.
You play the music to
connect to the people
that will come to the--
[SMITH] Well, fortunately,
you have something to sell now.
You don't have to
go to Kinkos anymore
and fold up paper, right?
(laughs)
You've already got a product.
[MO'] I would do it
though. (chuckles)
(audience laughs)
[SMITH] I get a sense.
The gleam in your eye,
reporting that you made $1,000
tells me that if you had to
go back to Kinkos again--
[MO'] The thing is, I wanted
to, after a long time,
'cause I had a record in
1980 called "Rainmaker"
by Kevin Moore, the
accountant Kevin Moore.
[SMITH] Yeah, right.
(audience laughs)
That was a harrowing
experience of like,
gettin' kicked out of
the record business.
I knew that if I wanted to
be in the record business,
I had to go in on my own.
I didn't go ask
for a record deal.
Because when they said no,
it would've crushed me.
I'm a sensitive guy.
I'm not a big,
strong, tough guy.
[SMITH] You'd rather
have your control, also,
of your own deal, right?
[MO'] My own destiny.
I want to determine,
I, not want to, but I
decided to decide what
was gonna happen for me.
It wasn't about numbers.
It wasn't about how many
people I could reach,
how much money I could make.
It was about, this
is where next,
that aha moment that
you asked about earlier
in the interview.
That was the aha
moment when I'm goin',
"Okay, now you're 39, sucker."
And so, there's no
goin' back on that.
[SMITH] That's great.
[MO'] You know, so it was like,
I could've quit and done
somethin' else, right then.
[SMITH] Yeah well,
thank God you didn't.
[MO'] I decided to keep goin'.
[SMITH] It's a great story.
You're a very charming guy.
It's nice to see people who
deserve to succeed, succeed.
[MO'] Well, thank you. [SMITH]
You've had a great career.
Let's hope that you continue to.
You have a Christmas
record coming out?
[MO'] Yes, I do.
[SMITH] What was the,
we have like 30 seconds.
What's the short
version of that story?
[MO'] It's a Christmas
record, and it's,
the title is "Moonlight,
Mistletoe And You."
(audience chuckles)
[SMITH] New songs?
[MO'] Yeah, new songs,
classic songs, you know.
And it, I love it.
There's this one
non-Christmas song on there.
[SMITH] How great.
[MO'] It's just,
I can't wait for
the Christmas tour
because I got this record now.
[SMITH] Okay good.
[MO'] Listen to the song,
"Christmas Is Annoying."
(audience laughs)
[SMITH] Christmas may be
annoying, but you are not.
Keb' Mo', thank you so
much, really enjoyed it.
Give him a hand.
(audience applauds)
Keb' Mo', thank you.
We'd love to have you
join us in the studio.
Visit our website at
klru.org/overheard
to find invitations
to interviews,
Q&As with our
audience and guests
and an archive of past episodes.
(upbeat band music)
[MO'] Some people
will practice all day.
Some people will
practice once a week.
Some people will practice
for 15 or 10 minutes a day.
For me, I was not one of the,
I was the 10 minute a
day, maybe one hour.
Maybe one day, I played all day.
I was very inconsistent.
But I was consistent in
the fact that I kept going,
and I never gave up.
[ANNOUNCER] Funding for
Overheard with Evan Smith
is provided in part by
Hillco Partners, a Texas
government affairs consultancy,
Claire and Carl Stuart,
and by Laura and John Beckworth,
The Hobby Family Foundation.
(tinkling electronic music)