WEBVTT 00:00.200 --> 00:03.437 >> Funding for "Overheard" with Evan Smith is provided in part 00:03.437 --> 00:08.041 by MFI Foundation, improving the quality of life within our 00:08.041 --> 00:09.576 community. 00:09.576 --> 00:12.412 And from the Texas Board of Legal Specialization, 00:12.412 --> 00:15.048 board certified attorneys in your community. 00:15.048 --> 00:18.519 Experienced, respected, and tested. 00:18.519 --> 00:22.856 Also by Hillco Partners, a Texas Government Affairs consultancy. 00:22.856 --> 00:26.727 And by the Alice Kleberg Reynolds Foundation. 00:26.727 --> 00:28.762 And viewers like you. 00:28.762 --> 00:30.664 Thank you. 00:30.664 --> 00:31.665 >> I'm Evan Smith. 00:31.665 --> 00:35.469 He's a veteran standup comedian whose IFC series "Maron" is now 00:35.469 --> 00:39.840 in its third season and whose twice-weekly podcast "WTF" has 00:39.840 --> 00:42.409 made him one of the Internet age's household names. 00:42.409 --> 00:44.144 He's Marc Maron. 00:44.144 --> 00:46.146 This is "Overheard." [Applause]. 00:46.146 --> 00:48.815 >> Actually, there are not two sides to every issue. 00:48.815 --> 00:50.817 >> So I guess we can't fire him now. 00:50.817 --> 00:52.819 >> I guess we can't fire him now. 00:52.819 --> 00:56.356 The night that I win the Emmy. 00:56.356 --> 00:59.793 >> Being on the Supreme Court was an improbable dream. 00:59.793 --> 01:01.995 >> It's hard work and it's controversial. 01:01.995 --> 01:04.464 >> Without information there is no freedom and it's journalists 01:04.464 --> 01:06.333 who provide that information. 01:06.333 --> 01:09.836 >> Window rolls down and this guy says, hey, he goes to 11:00. 01:09.836 --> 01:18.078 [Laughter]. 01:18.078 --> 01:18.979 >> Marc Maron, welcome. 01:18.979 --> 01:19.780 >> How are you? 01:19.780 --> 01:20.380 >> Nice to meet you. 01:20.380 --> 01:21.481 >> Nice to meet you. 01:21.481 --> 01:23.016 >> I'm a little intimidated, I have to say. 01:23.016 --> 01:23.784 >> Really? 01:23.784 --> 01:25.252 >> Well, you're a great interviewer, 01:25.252 --> 01:27.888 and for those of us who do this sort of amateur interviewing, 01:27.888 --> 01:30.424 you are a professional, man, whether you know it or not. 01:30.424 --> 01:33.860 And to watch you or to listen to you do it is really inspiring. 01:33.860 --> 01:34.561 >> Well, thank you. 01:34.561 --> 01:35.529 That's very flattering. 01:35.529 --> 01:36.863 I appreciate that. 01:36.863 --> 01:39.566 >> Has it been hard for you to become -- five and a half years 01:39.566 --> 01:41.568 in this program now, 600 episodes. 01:41.568 --> 01:42.569 >> Yeah. 01:42.569 --> 01:44.571 >> I have to believe later episodes you feel more 01:44.571 --> 01:46.573 comfortable than your earlier ones, 01:46.573 --> 01:49.109 but how has that progression gone for you? 01:49.109 --> 01:51.745 >> I don't know that I feel comfortable, necessarily. 01:51.745 --> 01:54.614 I feel more comfortable with myself. 01:54.614 --> 01:55.615 >> Yeah. 01:55.615 --> 01:59.853 >> I think that the first 200 episodes were really thinly 01:59.853 --> 02:04.558 veiled attempts at me to get celebrities to help me with my 02:04.558 --> 02:05.392 problems. 02:05.392 --> 02:06.660 [Laughter]. 02:06.660 --> 02:07.861 >> Look, if it works, right? 02:07.861 --> 02:10.130 >> I don't know that that's really what I planned but I 02:10.130 --> 02:11.965 think that's what was happening. 02:11.965 --> 02:15.102 And I think -- I don't think I have an interview style and I'm 02:15.102 --> 02:17.904 wary to call myself an interviewer. 02:17.904 --> 02:19.373 That's the weird thing. 02:19.373 --> 02:23.443 Like I don't really have questions and sometimes I think 02:23.443 --> 02:25.946 they would help. 02:25.946 --> 02:26.413 >> You know what? 02:26.413 --> 02:28.382 But let me say this, I think it's a conversation. 02:28.382 --> 02:28.982 >> That's right. 02:28.982 --> 02:30.283 >> It's not an interrogation. 02:30.283 --> 02:32.519 >> I can deal with a conversationalist, 02:32.519 --> 02:34.588 a professional conversationalist. 02:34.588 --> 02:35.589 >> That's good. 02:35.589 --> 02:38.558 >> Well, yeah, but interviews, like I've gotten mail from 02:38.558 --> 02:40.894 people who are in journalism and they're like, 02:40.894 --> 02:43.296 you know you break all the rules of journalism but you get this 02:43.296 --> 02:45.298 great stuff out of people, and I'm like, well --. 02:45.298 --> 02:47.300 >> That you wouldn't get if you went through it in a 02:47.300 --> 02:48.301 conventional way. 02:48.301 --> 02:50.303 >> Well, I don't even know what that is. 02:50.303 --> 02:52.305 So maybe, you know, this whole idea of convention needs to be 02:52.305 --> 02:53.306 rethought. 02:53.306 --> 02:54.307 >> Blown up. 02:54.307 --> 02:55.308 >> Something. 02:55.308 --> 02:56.309 What are they? 02:56.309 --> 02:57.310 What are they? 02:57.310 --> 02:58.311 Do you know them? 02:58.311 --> 02:59.312 >> The conventions? 02:59.312 --> 03:00.313 >> Yeah. 03:00.313 --> 03:02.315 >> Well, it's like, you know, preparation, 03:02.315 --> 03:04.284 which you told me before you came out here --. 03:04.284 --> 03:05.285 >> That's it, just preparation? 03:05.285 --> 03:07.287 >> Well, that would be one thing, right, preparation. 03:07.287 --> 03:09.289 Not cursing would be another thing. 03:09.289 --> 03:10.290 [Laughter]. 03:10.290 --> 03:11.291 >> That's, but, yeah. 03:11.291 --> 03:12.292 >> You are awesome at cursing. 03:12.292 --> 03:14.294 Even if you don't think you're awesome at being an interviewer 03:14.294 --> 03:16.296 it's one of the podcast luxuries is you can just say whatever you 03:16.296 --> 03:17.297 want. 03:17.297 --> 03:19.299 >> Yeah, you can say whatever the [bleep] you want. 03:19.299 --> 03:21.301 >> We just lost Abilene and Amarillo, actually. 03:21.301 --> 03:22.302 [Laughter]. 03:22.302 --> 03:24.304 >> Look, this is the thing I want to say --. 03:24.304 --> 03:26.306 >> We lost them a long time ago. 03:26.306 --> 03:27.307 >> Is that what it is? 03:27.307 --> 03:28.308 They were already gone. 03:28.308 --> 03:29.676 This is kind of a thing now. 03:29.676 --> 03:31.311 Celebrities, or people who are not traditional journalists or 03:31.311 --> 03:32.679 interviewers, playing this role. 03:32.679 --> 03:34.347 Alec Baldwin has a podcast. 03:34.347 --> 03:35.615 >> Yeah, that went well, didn't it? 03:35.615 --> 03:36.483 >> Well, it's come back, though, actually. 03:36.483 --> 03:37.451 And I think he's pretty good. 03:37.451 --> 03:38.385 Not the TV program. 03:38.385 --> 03:40.454 That did not go well, but "Here's the Thing" podcast, 03:40.454 --> 03:44.291 like yours, sitting down with other, you know, 03:44.291 --> 03:45.926 celebrities or athletes or comedians. 03:45.926 --> 03:48.261 Jeff Garlin had a podcast for a while. 03:48.261 --> 03:49.496 I guess his has kind of come back too. 03:49.496 --> 03:50.130 >> I don't know. 03:50.130 --> 03:52.966 You know, Jeff has an interesting approach where you'd 03:52.966 --> 03:54.501 sit and listen and Jeff talk. 03:54.501 --> 03:55.202 >> Right. 03:55.202 --> 03:56.703 [Laughter]. 03:56.703 --> 03:57.504 >> I've done that show. 03:57.504 --> 03:58.271 >> For that matter, Baldwin also, 03:58.271 --> 04:01.274 Alec Baldwin is not exactly silent. 04:01.274 --> 04:05.946 >> Yeah, like I do talk but I don't -- it's very odd to me. 04:05.946 --> 04:07.180 Like Carolla does that too. 04:07.180 --> 04:10.217 Like he'll have you on and then you just literally if you do the 04:10.217 --> 04:13.386 Adam Carolla Show it's you just looking for a window. 04:13.386 --> 04:14.688 >> Where do I jump in. 04:14.688 --> 04:16.256 >> There's got to be a place here. 04:16.256 --> 04:18.492 I'm invited into the conversation. 04:18.492 --> 04:20.193 And then you jump in and he'll be like yeah, yeah, yeah, 04:20.193 --> 04:23.530 and then he'll go on with his thing. 04:23.530 --> 04:24.498 It's a hell of a style. 04:24.498 --> 04:27.300 >> I do think that one of the things about your end of it is 04:27.300 --> 04:29.336 we know you better. 04:29.336 --> 04:31.671 Now you said the first 200 the "T" maybe stood for therapy in 04:31.671 --> 04:33.073 "WTF," right? 04:33.073 --> 04:33.974 >> I don't know if it was therapy. 04:33.974 --> 04:35.175 It was conversation. 04:35.175 --> 04:36.710 You know, it was the way I have conversations. 04:36.710 --> 04:37.511 >> But you're a character. 04:37.511 --> 04:39.212 You're present in all these interviews. 04:39.212 --> 04:41.081 >> Yeah, well, I mean I don't know how to do it any other way. 04:41.081 --> 04:42.115 I got to stay engaged. 04:42.115 --> 04:45.819 I think that a lot of my intent is to connect with somebody in a 04:45.819 --> 04:46.853 real way. 04:46.853 --> 04:48.889 You know, a lot of these people come in to the garage or 04:48.889 --> 04:51.958 wherever I do it and I already have a relationship with them --. 04:51.958 --> 04:52.526 >> Right. 04:52.526 --> 04:53.827 >> -- in my mind. 04:53.827 --> 04:56.129 And sometimes it's just them fighting against that 04:56.129 --> 04:57.264 relationship. 04:57.264 --> 04:58.799 Like I've decided who they are. 04:58.799 --> 04:59.566 >> Right. 04:59.566 --> 05:02.402 >> And I will come with those assumptions and then they'll 05:02.402 --> 05:03.570 sort of chip away at them. 05:03.570 --> 05:05.205 And I'll sometimes fight them on it. 05:05.205 --> 05:06.773 I'm like no, no, you're not really like that. 05:06.773 --> 05:09.609 I think you're more like how I think you are --. 05:09.609 --> 05:10.177 >> Yeah. 05:10.177 --> 05:11.411 >> -- and there's no reason to fight me on it. 05:11.411 --> 05:13.013 >> But see, but you asked about convention. 05:13.013 --> 05:14.915 That's another thing about conventions that you don't 05:14.915 --> 05:17.150 follow that I think is admirable and makes this better. 05:17.150 --> 05:19.853 You don't pretend not to have a point of view. 05:19.853 --> 05:20.754 >> No. 05:20.754 --> 05:22.689 I don't -- just anybody I like to meet, 05:22.689 --> 05:23.857 it's like what are you really going to get? 05:23.857 --> 05:24.791 >> Well, Charlie Rose. 05:24.791 --> 05:26.960 Charlie Rose is the consummate, sort of down the middle, 05:26.960 --> 05:28.762 even-tempered. 05:28.762 --> 05:29.763 You know --. 05:29.763 --> 05:30.797 >> But he blathers on too about --. 05:30.797 --> 05:33.300 >> But I guess the point is Charlie Rose would never say to 05:33.300 --> 05:35.936 Henry Winkler, when I was a kid I would dress up as the Fonz for 05:35.936 --> 05:36.937 Halloween. 05:36.937 --> 05:37.470 >> He wouldn't? 05:37.470 --> 05:39.172 >> Not a leather jacket -- no, I don't think he would. 05:39.172 --> 05:41.007 I think that actually your interview of Henry Winkler, 05:41.007 --> 05:42.409 which is one of recent ones that you did. 05:42.409 --> 05:43.376 >> Yeah. 05:43.376 --> 05:46.313 >> Your fan boy aspect of it was actually the thing that made it 05:46.313 --> 05:48.982 all better to me. 05:48.982 --> 05:50.717 >> Yeah, and he's a sweet guy. 05:50.717 --> 05:52.752 Like, he was such a sweet -- it's very interesting, 05:52.752 --> 05:57.123 the idea of Arthur Fonzarelli and the Fonz. 05:57.123 --> 05:59.659 And now, like, he's just Henry Winkler, this very grateful --. 05:59.659 --> 06:00.927 >> Writes kids' books. 06:00.927 --> 06:02.929 >> -- old man, in a way. 06:02.929 --> 06:04.197 Very sweet. 06:04.197 --> 06:06.366 Yeah, it's sort of mind blowing. 06:06.366 --> 06:08.168 It's kind of rewrite your childhood. 06:08.168 --> 06:11.004 >> But the point is you remember him from a time long ago. 06:11.004 --> 06:11.571 >> Right. 06:11.571 --> 06:12.672 And then you meet him in real life and you're like, 06:12.672 --> 06:13.840 you're not Fonzie. 06:13.840 --> 06:14.908 [Laughter]. 06:14.908 --> 06:17.644 >> But see, but this is the part that I love. 06:17.644 --> 06:20.313 You know, conventional -- I mean, I pick on Charlie Rose, 06:20.313 --> 06:22.182 but somebody normally wouldn't, sort of, 06:22.182 --> 06:23.717 cop to that and have that be the --. 06:23.717 --> 06:25.652 >> But I don't know what they're trying to do really then. 06:25.652 --> 06:27.954 You know, I watched Charlie Rose a couple of times and, you know, 06:27.954 --> 06:30.023 I haven't listened to Alec Baldwin. 06:30.023 --> 06:33.460 And that's another reason why I don't categorize myself, really. 06:33.460 --> 06:36.363 Because I don't really listen to that much stuff. 06:36.363 --> 06:37.364 >> Right. 06:37.364 --> 06:39.366 >> And I don't really take in a lot of -- like, 06:39.366 --> 06:41.868 I'll listen passively to MPR. 06:41.868 --> 06:43.870 I don't listen to other podcasts. 06:43.870 --> 06:46.606 I don't compete in that way, like I wonder what Charlie Rose 06:46.606 --> 06:47.607 is up to. 06:47.607 --> 06:50.477 Like I don't sit there at home going, oh, so this is the guy. 06:50.477 --> 06:54.915 You know, like I'm not -- I met him once. 06:54.915 --> 06:57.284 You know, he's on the CBS morning show, isn't he? 06:57.284 --> 06:58.051 >> Right. 06:58.051 --> 06:59.219 >> Right, that was hilarious. 06:59.219 --> 07:00.954 Those interviews are completely useless where --. 07:00.954 --> 07:01.955 [Laughter]. 07:01.955 --> 07:03.657 >> They're ridiculous, man. 07:03.657 --> 07:06.660 You know, you're on a morning show and there's three hosts or 07:06.660 --> 07:09.996 four, and they all have done a little research. 07:09.996 --> 07:12.032 You got four and a half minutes. 07:12.032 --> 07:14.034 And, like, you know, one guy would go, 07:14.034 --> 07:16.036 so this thing you're doing, yeah, that's it. 07:16.036 --> 07:18.004 And then the other one's like, and what about? 07:18.004 --> 07:19.005 Oh, yeah, that's it. 07:19.005 --> 07:20.774 Oh, and then the third one sort of like, but your hair. 07:20.774 --> 07:22.208 And like, I know. And then it's okay we're done. 07:22.208 --> 07:23.376 >> And it's over. That's the end of it, yeah. 07:23.376 --> 07:25.345 [Laughter]. 07:25.345 --> 07:25.879 >> Crazy. 07:25.879 --> 07:27.380 >> That's not your show. 07:27.380 --> 07:29.282 Why are you doing this as a podcast? 07:29.282 --> 07:30.650 Why is this not a radio show? 07:30.650 --> 07:31.751 That's one thing I thought about. 07:31.751 --> 07:33.019 I mean, I know podcasts are very much --. 07:33.019 --> 07:34.421 >> Oh, I don't know if you've heard, but radio's over. 07:34.421 --> 07:35.255 [Laughter]. 07:35.255 --> 07:36.323 >> Well, it is. 07:36.323 --> 07:40.193 It's over-ish. 07:40.193 --> 07:42.729 But, you know, the thing about a podcast is it's not a captive 07:42.729 --> 07:43.363 audience. 07:43.363 --> 07:44.531 And, you know, at least in some ways --. 07:44.531 --> 07:45.465 >> It's the most captive audience. 07:45.465 --> 07:46.333 >> No. 07:46.333 --> 07:47.734 >> They make a decision to listen. 07:47.734 --> 07:49.636 >> Well, I think that the fact that it's self-selecting means 07:49.636 --> 07:52.072 that you have to go find people one at a time. 07:52.072 --> 07:54.274 >> Yeah, but once you have them, it's pretty captive. 07:54.274 --> 07:55.442 You know what I mean? 07:55.442 --> 07:57.577 Like, I can get people to sit in their car and not get out of 07:57.577 --> 07:59.045 their car, even if it's a podcast. 07:59.045 --> 08:00.580 >> well, that's pretty good. 08:00.580 --> 08:01.247 That is pretty good. 08:01.247 --> 08:02.449 >> Well, that's what determines good radio, 08:02.449 --> 08:04.451 I don't want to get out of my car because you were still 08:04.451 --> 08:04.918 talking. 08:04.918 --> 08:06.152 >> The milk spoiled because I didn't want to leave. 08:06.152 --> 08:06.686 >> Right. 08:06.686 --> 08:08.555 Well, I get e-mails like that, I didn't want to get out of my car 08:08.555 --> 08:10.256 and I don't want to write back, like you can pause it. 08:10.256 --> 08:11.224 You know what I mean? 08:11.224 --> 08:13.893 [Laughter]. 08:13.893 --> 08:16.129 >> You want to stay in your car, by all means, there's a reason. 08:16.129 --> 08:16.930 >> Can't pause radio, that's true. 08:16.930 --> 08:18.198 Yeah, right. 08:18.198 --> 08:20.600 Did you think about this seriously being a radio program 08:20.600 --> 08:21.434 or a TV program? 08:21.434 --> 08:22.736 >> No. 08:22.736 --> 08:23.136 I don't. 08:23.136 --> 08:24.204 >> How did it become a podcast? 08:24.204 --> 08:26.306 >> Well, I had done some radio. 08:26.306 --> 08:27.440 >> Right, Air America. 08:27.440 --> 08:28.641 >> Yeah, I have done a bit of radio. 08:28.641 --> 08:31.378 I'm certainly no radio veteran, but I definitely was comfortable 08:31.378 --> 08:32.846 with the medium. 08:32.846 --> 08:33.313 >> Right. 08:33.313 --> 08:35.749 >> And, you know, by the time I started the podcast I'd gone 08:35.749 --> 08:40.320 back a third time to Air America for no reason at all other than 08:40.320 --> 08:42.222 I was broke, I was in the middle of a divorce. 08:42.222 --> 08:45.258 There was a new regime in place and the idiot that fired me 08:45.258 --> 08:46.559 twice was gone. 08:46.559 --> 08:49.396 And it was really kind of a weird situation. 08:49.396 --> 08:54.167 Like, I was in this money-draining divorce and I was 08:54.167 --> 08:55.068 sort of in trouble. 08:55.068 --> 08:56.169 I was about to lose my house. 08:56.169 --> 08:59.072 And one guy from Air America, used to be at Air America when I 08:59.072 --> 09:01.274 was there in the older days, he calls me up, he goes, 09:01.274 --> 09:02.909 there's a new guy with some new money. 09:02.909 --> 09:03.977 I think we should take some. 09:03.977 --> 09:04.911 [Laughter]. 09:04.911 --> 09:06.246 >> It's like robbing a bank, right, yeah. 09:06.246 --> 09:08.648 >> He framed it differently. 09:08.648 --> 09:10.583 As a liberal he said, I think it's a good opportunity for us 09:10.583 --> 09:11.518 to fight the good fight. 09:11.518 --> 09:16.523 [Laughter]. 09:16.523 --> 09:18.191 >> I was like, yeah, I'd like to fight that fight. 09:18.191 --> 09:20.460 If they could give me 50 grand up front to stop this woman from 09:20.460 --> 09:22.362 killing me, that would be awesome. 09:22.362 --> 09:23.630 >> It would be awesome, yeah. 09:23.630 --> 09:24.497 >> So I worked that out. 09:24.497 --> 09:27.734 So the good liberals, they wrote me a check to stop hemorrhaging 09:27.734 --> 09:29.102 the money. 09:29.102 --> 09:31.171 And we did -- it was a streaming video show that I did with 09:31.171 --> 09:33.706 Sam Seder who is the host of "The Majority Report." 09:33.706 --> 09:35.608 He still does political talk. 09:35.608 --> 09:39.546 And I was so devastated because of my divorce going on. 09:39.546 --> 09:41.147 Like, I was emotionally incapacitated. 09:41.147 --> 09:43.550 I didn't think I could be funny at all. 09:43.550 --> 09:44.884 So I was like, we got to get Sam in here. 09:44.884 --> 09:47.420 Because not only do I want to not talk or be funny, 09:47.420 --> 09:49.255 I don't want to talk about politics, certainly. 09:49.255 --> 09:51.157 I need someone in here to watch my back because I might start 09:51.157 --> 09:52.225 crying at any moment. 09:52.225 --> 09:52.759 >> Yeah. 09:52.759 --> 09:55.795 >> So, and me and Sam, we don't get along that great. 09:55.795 --> 09:57.864 It's okay. 09:57.864 --> 09:59.666 It's comedic, but it's difficult. 09:59.666 --> 10:02.168 So we're doing this streaming video show in the break room of 10:02.168 --> 10:04.537 Air America that no one is watching. 10:04.537 --> 10:05.638 And we're doing it daily. 10:05.638 --> 10:06.706 >> It's called "The Breakroom," right? 10:06.706 --> 10:07.373 >> Yeah, "Breakroom Live." 10:07.373 --> 10:07.941 >> Right. 10:07.941 --> 10:09.409 >> We could not get any traction with that thing. 10:09.409 --> 10:10.743 No one cared about that show. 10:10.743 --> 10:11.711 >> Yeah. 10:11.711 --> 10:14.747 >> And we were putting so much into it and it was just stupid. 10:14.747 --> 10:17.951 So -- but it was funny with me and Sam. 10:17.951 --> 10:19.953 So after a year of that they're like, well, 10:19.953 --> 10:22.422 we can't afford to do this anymore and I'm like, okay. 10:22.422 --> 10:25.992 But we still had a month on our contract. 10:25.992 --> 10:27.760 So being good liberals they were like, well, you know, 10:27.760 --> 10:31.798 you're fired, kind of, but you still got a month, 10:31.798 --> 10:33.199 so you can keep your office. 10:33.199 --> 10:35.468 What world and what radio job has that ever happened? 10:35.468 --> 10:36.369 >> Any job. 10:36.369 --> 10:37.070 >> Yeah, any job. 10:37.070 --> 10:38.505 Just hang out, you know. 10:38.505 --> 10:39.739 >> You got a month. 10:39.739 --> 10:41.040 >> Yeah, and we're like, all right. 10:41.040 --> 10:43.910 So I was thinking, like, well I don't know what we're going to 10:43.910 --> 10:45.178 do, let's try this podcasting. 10:45.178 --> 10:46.613 I talk to my producer, Brendan McDonald. 10:46.613 --> 10:47.213 >> Yeah. 10:47.213 --> 10:48.581 >> I said, do you think you can figure out how to post these? 10:48.581 --> 10:50.383 I know there's other people doing it. 10:50.383 --> 10:51.951 Like if Carolla can do it and get some interviews, 10:51.951 --> 10:53.119 certainly we could do it. 10:53.119 --> 10:54.220 >> This is 2009. 10:54.220 --> 10:55.088 >> Yeah, right. 10:55.088 --> 10:56.422 And he's like, all right, let's do it. 10:56.422 --> 10:58.458 So we started doing them and posting them and when I moved 10:58.458 --> 11:01.427 back to my house in L.A., which I didn't lose, 11:01.427 --> 11:04.264 I set up shop in the garage. 11:04.264 --> 11:05.899 And there's no reason for radio. 11:05.899 --> 11:08.034 People always ask me, why don't you want to be on Sirius? 11:08.034 --> 11:08.902 I'm, why? 11:08.902 --> 11:10.703 The thing is shifting now. 11:10.703 --> 11:12.071 We didn't anticipate that. 11:12.071 --> 11:14.774 I mean, we had 1500 listeners at the beginning and as time went 11:14.774 --> 11:16.876 on it sort of built. 11:16.876 --> 11:18.778 >> Can you quantify the audience of the podcast now as we sit 11:18.778 --> 11:19.913 here five and a half years later? 11:19.913 --> 11:21.314 >> Well, that's the difference between radio and podcast. 11:21.314 --> 11:22.615 >> You don't have to? 11:22.615 --> 11:24.250 >> No, I can do it precisely. 11:24.250 --> 11:24.984 >> Okay. 11:24.984 --> 11:26.119 So precisely what is it? 11:26.119 --> 11:29.389 >> For years radio has been spitting these Arbitron books, 11:29.389 --> 11:32.625 like these weird diaries that are based on what? 11:32.625 --> 11:34.761 You know, like, and they're basing their ad rates on, like, 11:34.761 --> 11:37.096 these weird mythical numbers. 11:37.096 --> 11:38.464 >> So what's the number then? 11:38.464 --> 11:40.833 >> Well, I think that most episodes over their life, 11:40.833 --> 11:42.902 some more than others, get at least a half a million 11:42.902 --> 11:44.204 downloads. 11:44.204 --> 11:45.038 >> Amazing. 11:45.038 --> 11:49.676 >> And each one right out of the gate gets 200,000, 300,000. 11:49.676 --> 11:51.311 >> And they have a long tail because people come back to them 11:51.311 --> 11:51.978 much later. 11:51.978 --> 11:54.480 >> The first six months, episodes are available for free 11:54.480 --> 11:56.416 for six months. 11:56.416 --> 11:57.717 >> Right. 11:57.717 --> 11:58.751 >> And then they go behind the app pay wall, 11:58.751 --> 11:59.986 which is only like $7, $8. 11:59.986 --> 12:00.653 >> Right. 12:00.653 --> 12:01.154 Pretty great. 12:01.154 --> 12:03.356 So the people you have on are, in some cases, 12:03.356 --> 12:05.258 people you know well, and in some cases people you respect 12:05.258 --> 12:06.593 but maybe don't know well. 12:06.593 --> 12:07.427 >> Right. 12:07.427 --> 12:08.962 I think I know everybody well, though. 12:08.962 --> 12:10.563 So it's a good place to start. 12:10.563 --> 12:11.130 >> You do? 12:11.130 --> 12:11.998 >> Pretty much. 12:11.998 --> 12:14.834 Like people I know well, like comics I have known for 25 years 12:14.834 --> 12:17.270 even, it's not like we hang out with each other every day. 12:17.270 --> 12:18.771 >> But you know them. 12:18.771 --> 12:20.006 >> Yeah, we're kindred spirits. 12:20.006 --> 12:23.009 >> First show you ever did, first podcast, was Jeff Ross, right? 12:23.009 --> 12:23.943 >> Yeah, that was a phoner. 12:23.943 --> 12:24.410 >> Phoner? 12:24.410 --> 12:25.411 >> Yeah. 12:25.411 --> 12:26.646 At the beginning of the podcast, we didn't even know what the 12:26.646 --> 12:27.380 form was. 12:27.380 --> 12:28.915 There was other people hanging around the studio. 12:28.915 --> 12:31.250 My friend Matt was there. 12:31.250 --> 12:32.652 We were doing phoners. 12:32.652 --> 12:34.721 Sometimes I had two guests on a show. 12:34.721 --> 12:35.388 >> Right. 12:35.388 --> 12:36.689 >> It just kind of -- it was odd. 12:36.689 --> 12:38.358 But, yeah, he was the first guest. 12:38.358 --> 12:38.791 >> Right. 12:38.791 --> 12:40.393 >> And I don't remember what --. 12:40.393 --> 12:41.327 >> But I guess if you roll it forward, 12:41.327 --> 12:42.061 I guess, Marc, the point I'm making is, 12:42.061 --> 12:43.763 if you roll it forward are they people with whom you have some 12:43.763 --> 12:44.631 kind of relationship? 12:44.631 --> 12:46.866 It's not like, you know, oh, hello for the first time, 12:46.866 --> 12:48.034 you know, sitting down with them. 12:48.034 --> 12:49.435 As is the case with most shows. 12:49.435 --> 12:50.536 >> Sometimes it is. 12:50.536 --> 12:51.170 >> It is? 12:51.170 --> 12:52.472 >> Sure. Yeah, yeah. 12:52.472 --> 12:55.441 I mean, a lot of them sort of feel like first dates of sorts. 12:55.441 --> 12:58.411 You know, like the conversation is getting to know each other 12:58.411 --> 12:59.312 conversation. 12:59.312 --> 13:01.314 I have different nerves for different people. 13:01.314 --> 13:03.516 Like sometimes I don't know why I'm talking to somebody. 13:03.516 --> 13:06.953 You know, we get offered people. 13:06.953 --> 13:09.122 Now, like, we were booking on our own for years and then 13:09.122 --> 13:12.258 sometimes we work with a booking agency so then names come up. 13:12.258 --> 13:14.027 Like, that's how Huey Lewis got on. 13:14.027 --> 13:16.396 Like, they were like, do you want to talk to Huey Lewis? 13:16.396 --> 13:17.864 I'm like, yeah, why not? 13:17.864 --> 13:21.334 You know, like everything was Huey Lewis for a year or so. 13:21.334 --> 13:22.168 [Laughter]. 13:22.168 --> 13:25.204 >> Like, what's that guy been doing? 13:25.204 --> 13:27.874 >> Yeah, well, you know what, but that's a show. 13:27.874 --> 13:28.808 >> It turned out to be a great show. 13:28.808 --> 13:29.409 >> That's a show. 13:29.409 --> 13:30.209 >> Yeah, of course it is. 13:30.209 --> 13:30.943 >> But if you look at the people, 13:30.943 --> 13:34.514 if you go back as I did before we sat down today and looked 13:34.514 --> 13:36.282 back at the list of people you've had on --. 13:36.282 --> 13:37.150 >> Yeah. 13:37.150 --> 13:38.484 >> It's an impressive list of people. 13:38.484 --> 13:40.386 And when you think it's just a podcast. 13:40.386 --> 13:42.588 And I guess that's not fair to say, oh, it's just a podcast. 13:42.588 --> 13:44.757 But just a couple of years ago, who could have imagined --. 13:44.757 --> 13:45.458 >> Yeah. 13:45.458 --> 13:46.559 >> -- that would be --. 13:46.559 --> 13:48.928 >> That those people would come to my garage. 13:48.928 --> 13:50.596 >> Well, for all practical purposes, it's a real thing. 13:50.596 --> 13:54.100 >> Yeah, well, no, that shift has happened. 13:54.100 --> 13:54.701 >> It has. 13:54.701 --> 13:57.704 >> At the beginning, you know, people were like coming over and 13:57.704 --> 13:58.571 being like, really? 13:58.571 --> 14:01.641 I'm like, yeah, this is the future of show business. 14:01.641 --> 14:03.576 [Laughter]. 14:03.576 --> 14:04.610 >> But you know what? It is. 14:04.610 --> 14:06.813 It's very -- it's DIY. That's it. 14:06.813 --> 14:07.680 >> I don't know what it is. 14:07.680 --> 14:08.815 It just is what it is. 14:08.815 --> 14:10.883 You know, I guess it's that. 14:10.883 --> 14:11.918 It's going to be a mixture of things. 14:11.918 --> 14:12.385 >> Yeah. 14:12.385 --> 14:14.287 >> I don't know why my show got so popular, 14:14.287 --> 14:18.124 but it was funny when people used to come over -- you know, 14:18.124 --> 14:21.194 like when Bryan Cranston came over, he was like, you know, 14:21.194 --> 14:22.795 I walked him into the back and he's like, really, in here? 14:22.795 --> 14:24.197 And I'm like, yeah. 14:24.197 --> 14:26.599 And I said, you know, Jon Hamm did it. 14:26.599 --> 14:27.867 And he's like, oh, yeah, Hamm was in here? 14:27.867 --> 14:31.137 That somehow solidified it. 14:31.137 --> 14:31.838 >> Paved the way. 14:31.838 --> 14:32.705 >> Yeah. 14:32.705 --> 14:35.508 Like I guess it's okay if Hamm was here. 14:35.508 --> 14:38.144 I swear to God I really wanted to talk to Walter White. 14:38.144 --> 14:40.613 That whole time when Cranston was there, 14:40.613 --> 14:42.415 like I could not separate them. 14:42.415 --> 14:43.649 I have a hard time with actors and I was like, well, 14:43.649 --> 14:45.284 how do you make speed? 14:45.284 --> 14:48.755 [Laughter]. 14:48.755 --> 14:50.156 >> That would be a good show. 14:50.156 --> 14:50.857 >> I don't think he could answer it. 14:50.857 --> 14:52.492 But it was good. 14:52.492 --> 14:55.228 That was a very nerve racking one because that entire show was 14:55.228 --> 14:57.397 shot in Albuquerque and, like, I didn't even ask --. 14:57.397 --> 14:58.331 >> And you're from Albuquerque. 14:58.331 --> 14:59.465 >> I know but I didn't even ask him. 14:59.465 --> 15:00.032 >> Yeah. 15:00.032 --> 15:01.534 >> That was one of those times where I'm like the one 15:01.534 --> 15:02.568 connection I could have had. 15:02.568 --> 15:03.803 >> I could have made the connection. 15:03.803 --> 15:04.504 >> That happens a lot. 15:04.504 --> 15:06.105 >> What are the economics of the show? 15:06.105 --> 15:08.274 So I know you have a bunch of advertisers. 15:08.274 --> 15:10.977 You mention the advertisers on the program. 15:10.977 --> 15:12.411 A lot of podcasts have advertisers. 15:12.411 --> 15:14.213 >> That's called advertising when you mention the advertiser. 15:14.213 --> 15:15.681 >> Well, but it's hard to think --. 15:15.681 --> 15:17.083 >> It's hard to do it without mentioning it. 15:17.083 --> 15:18.284 >> It is hard. 15:18.284 --> 15:20.453 >> Because when you think about it very hard --. 15:20.453 --> 15:21.454 >> And you have to read your mind. 15:21.454 --> 15:22.155 >> Did you guys get that? 15:22.155 --> 15:23.823 Stamps.com. 15:23.823 --> 15:26.959 >> But my point is it's hard to imagine that the revenue that 15:26.959 --> 15:31.097 comes in from these advertisers cover the bills. 15:31.097 --> 15:31.697 >> Is it? 15:31.697 --> 15:32.365 >> It is, yeah. 15:32.365 --> 15:36.135 Because, you know, traditional media have a different economic 15:36.135 --> 15:37.804 imperative than these --. 15:37.804 --> 15:39.071 >> Well, let's think about it. 15:39.071 --> 15:40.273 >> Come on. 15:40.273 --> 15:41.474 Help me understand this. 15:41.474 --> 15:43.676 >> Okay. So I know for a fact 15:43.676 --> 15:46.279 that I get about 300,000 people per episode. 15:46.279 --> 15:48.848 So do you think if you present those hard numbers to an 15:48.848 --> 15:51.317 advertiser they're going to be like, okay we'll give you $5? 15:51.317 --> 15:52.351 >> They're paying you enough? 15:52.351 --> 15:53.085 >> Yeah. 15:53.085 --> 15:54.821 I mean, it took time to build that. 15:54.821 --> 15:56.355 >> If you're making this work --. 15:56.355 --> 15:58.257 >> Look, you're talking to a guy that I was nervous about 15:58.257 --> 15:59.358 advertising. 15:59.358 --> 16:02.228 Like when we had one ad I was like, people are going to leave. 16:02.228 --> 16:05.097 We're sellouts. 16:05.097 --> 16:06.766 >> Let me say, you've leaned in. 16:06.766 --> 16:07.834 >> No, I definitely leaned in. 16:07.834 --> 16:11.270 Because the truth of the matter is is that, unlike radio, again, 16:11.270 --> 16:14.340 you don't like the ads, then don't listen to them. 16:14.340 --> 16:15.441 >> Well, I can always fast forward. 16:15.441 --> 16:16.342 >> Exactly. 16:16.342 --> 16:20.213 And the thing is is that I won't advertise anything that is not 16:20.213 --> 16:21.681 legit on some level. 16:21.681 --> 16:26.319 I used to not advertise things that I couldn't get into myself, 16:26.319 --> 16:27.486 but now I do. 16:27.486 --> 16:30.256 And we worked with -- well, I mean -- like I don't know 16:30.256 --> 16:32.592 anything about baseball but, like, if they want to --. 16:32.592 --> 16:35.261 >> If they want to put the baseball fantasy draft thing. 16:35.261 --> 16:37.830 >> If the fantasy baseball gambling racket wants me to --. 16:37.830 --> 16:39.799 >> Right. 16:39.799 --> 16:42.101 >> Who am I to deny someone their vices? 16:42.101 --> 16:44.570 [Laughter] 16:44.570 --> 16:48.140 I won't advertise liquor because I don't drink anymore and I 16:48.140 --> 16:51.244 can't like -- there's no way as a recovering alcoholic to go, 16:51.244 --> 16:53.579 like, I used to have a real good time with this stuff. 16:53.579 --> 16:55.147 [Laughter]. 16:55.147 --> 16:56.616 >> You feel free. 16:56.616 --> 16:57.917 I'm not going to do it. 16:57.917 --> 16:58.751 But knock yourself out. 16:58.751 --> 17:00.253 >> I hope it doesn't ruin your life. 17:00.253 --> 17:02.488 Enjoy. 17:02.488 --> 17:04.557 >> What I like about it, though, is I like your role as the 17:04.557 --> 17:05.324 pitchman. 17:05.324 --> 17:06.192 It's almost like --. 17:06.192 --> 17:07.793 >> I like doing -- it's old style. 17:07.793 --> 17:09.862 >> It's like Hank Kingsley doing "Garden Weasel" 17:09.862 --> 17:11.364 on "Larry Sanders," right? 17:11.364 --> 17:12.131 >> Kind of. 17:12.131 --> 17:13.099 But it's also older than that. 17:13.099 --> 17:14.800 It's like radio, the old radio in general. 17:14.800 --> 17:15.601 >> Right. 17:15.601 --> 17:19.171 >> Most of radio, when you did terrestrial radio it was driven 17:19.171 --> 17:21.307 towards holding people over those ads. 17:21.307 --> 17:23.442 You know, that was, you know, forward momentum was all about 17:23.442 --> 17:24.377 that. 17:24.377 --> 17:26.879 Keep them here, you know, so we can get them to hold on for six 17:26.879 --> 17:27.947 minutes of this stuff. 17:27.947 --> 17:28.648 >> Yeah. 17:28.648 --> 17:30.049 >> We don't work with that model. 17:30.049 --> 17:31.550 You know, we'll drop the ads when we want to drop them. 17:31.550 --> 17:33.052 It's all us talking. 17:33.052 --> 17:35.321 We're not worried about that momentum people are in. 17:35.321 --> 17:37.123 Like, I remember one time I was doing an interview with some 17:37.123 --> 17:37.924 radio guys. 17:37.924 --> 17:39.892 Or, no, it wasn't an interview, someone told me. 17:39.892 --> 17:43.362 I don't need to mention them, but Bob and Tom up in Indiana --. 17:43.362 --> 17:44.664 [Laughter]. 17:44.664 --> 17:46.399 >> No, but someone was talking to Tom, 17:46.399 --> 17:48.801 I think and Tom was like, these podcasters, 17:48.801 --> 17:49.802 they don't know what they're doing. 17:49.802 --> 17:52.071 They don't even reset the guests. 17:52.071 --> 17:53.639 Why would we have to? 17:53.639 --> 17:55.308 People were listening because of them. 17:55.308 --> 17:57.643 Like, the reset model where you sort of like, 17:57.643 --> 18:00.212 we'll be right back with Marc Maron after this. 18:00.212 --> 18:01.147 Why would I do that? 18:01.147 --> 18:02.214 People download it. 18:02.214 --> 18:03.149 They're not just tuning in. 18:03.149 --> 18:03.816 >> Exactly. 18:03.816 --> 18:05.217 >> They don't need to be reminded who they're listening 18:05.217 --> 18:07.286 to unless they're morons. 18:07.286 --> 18:09.655 By the way, if somehow or another you forgot what we're 18:09.655 --> 18:13.125 doing here --. 18:13.125 --> 18:15.995 >> Well, you're blowing up the model, that's for sure. 18:15.995 --> 18:19.198 >> My point is, over time there was no business model that any 18:19.198 --> 18:20.466 of us had. 18:20.466 --> 18:22.468 None of us knew how to make money and I'm certainly grateful 18:22.468 --> 18:27.206 and humble, you know, and I'm not being -- you know, 18:27.206 --> 18:32.745 I don't want to appear like I'm being pompous or anything, 18:32.745 --> 18:34.447 is that the business model evolved. 18:34.447 --> 18:37.149 Me and my partner knew nothing about business. 18:37.149 --> 18:38.584 I am not a businessman, he is not either. 18:38.584 --> 18:41.420 You know, he was sort of a company guy-minded person and 18:41.420 --> 18:43.389 I'm an entertainer, whatever I do. 18:43.389 --> 18:44.056 >> Right. 18:44.056 --> 18:46.792 >> You know, I keep people listening to something. 18:46.792 --> 18:49.862 So, like, it wasn't business that we got into it for. 18:49.862 --> 18:51.597 So we didn't know how to make money. 18:51.597 --> 18:52.331 >> Yeah. 18:52.331 --> 18:54.166 >> Our first sponsor from the old days was, you know, 18:54.166 --> 18:55.901 Just Coffee, it was a co-op in Madison. 18:55.901 --> 18:57.803 And I still carry them and they don't hardly pay anything, 18:57.803 --> 18:59.038 it's just the loyalty thing. 18:59.038 --> 18:59.705 >> Nostalgia, right. 18:59.705 --> 19:00.539 >> Yeah. 19:00.539 --> 19:01.407 And I just visited their new plants. 19:01.407 --> 19:04.443 And by me plugging them, I helped their business. 19:04.443 --> 19:05.144 >> It helps. 19:05.144 --> 19:06.312 >> It was sort of fascinating. 19:06.312 --> 19:07.813 So the model just kind of evolved. 19:07.813 --> 19:08.914 >> Yep. 19:08.914 --> 19:11.917 >> And it's sort of a thrill in the sense that at some point 19:11.917 --> 19:14.620 both Brendan McDonald my producer and myself realized, 19:14.620 --> 19:17.456 we've got something we've made ourselves from the ground up. 19:17.456 --> 19:18.090 >> Most definitely. 19:18.090 --> 19:20.526 >> And I never understood what entrepreneurial sort of pride 19:20.526 --> 19:21.360 was. 19:21.360 --> 19:23.863 I'm like, we're businessmen and we've got a small business that 19:23.863 --> 19:24.630 we run. 19:24.630 --> 19:26.298 And there is something about that. 19:26.298 --> 19:28.901 But it's not about the weird pride or some sort of American 19:28.901 --> 19:31.804 work ethic or entrepreneurial spirit. 19:31.804 --> 19:34.907 It's like, nobody can tell us what to do. 19:34.907 --> 19:35.841 >> That's the best part, right? 19:35.841 --> 19:36.809 You built from an empty --. 19:36.809 --> 19:37.710 >> That's the only part. 19:37.710 --> 19:38.878 >> And you control it. 19:38.878 --> 19:39.779 >> Beautiful. 19:39.779 --> 19:40.913 Between you and me --. 19:40.913 --> 19:42.882 >> Yeah. 19:42.882 --> 19:44.417 Just forget about them, just tell me. 19:44.417 --> 19:46.252 >> And I hope it happens. 19:46.252 --> 19:49.622 The vice president's office called us and thought that maybe 19:49.622 --> 19:50.690 Biden --. 19:50.690 --> 19:51.390 >> Might come on? 19:51.390 --> 19:52.158 >> Come to the garage. 19:52.158 --> 19:52.992 And I'm like, really? 19:52.992 --> 19:56.495 >> Obama does Galifianakis, you get Biden. 19:56.495 --> 19:58.130 >> Right, we did that thing between two friends. 19:58.130 --> 20:01.367 But, like, we have these weird moments with this thing where 20:01.367 --> 20:04.603 I'm like, like I don't want to talk about politics and I don't 20:04.603 --> 20:07.773 want to, you know, I don't want to be just a policy outlet. 20:08.407 --> 20:09.175 That's why I got out. 20:09.942 --> 20:10.810 I don't talk about politics at all, 20:10.810 --> 20:14.013 really unless it affects me directly or I feel like I have 20:14.013 --> 20:16.248 to, but I won't do that thing. 20:16.248 --> 20:18.050 I will not be a conduit. 20:18.050 --> 20:22.321 So like I said, I'm not going to talk policy and do I need to go 20:22.321 --> 20:23.189 to him? 20:23.189 --> 20:26.692 And Brendan went back to the office and he comes back and 20:26.692 --> 20:28.360 he's like, no, he wants to come to the garage. 20:28.360 --> 20:30.796 I'm like, well that will be amazing. 20:30.796 --> 20:34.166 >> But that's kind of Biden-y isn't it, to come to the garage? 20:34.166 --> 20:37.136 >> But Biden-y or not, you know there's going to be 90 Secret -- 20:37.136 --> 20:38.504 they're going to be scanning the hillside. 20:38.504 --> 20:39.171 >> Oh, right. 20:39.171 --> 20:40.506 Well, there's that problem, right, yeah. 20:40.506 --> 20:41.107 >> You know, like my neighbors --. 20:41.107 --> 20:41.707 >> Snipers. 20:41.707 --> 20:42.975 >> -- what's happening? 20:42.975 --> 20:44.477 And I'm like, yeah, vice president's going to hang out 20:44.477 --> 20:45.177 for a little while. 20:45.911 --> 20:46.579 >> In the garage. 20:47.513 --> 20:49.215 >> But I don't know if it's going to happen. 20:49.215 --> 20:51.083 I don't know what determines that. 20:51.083 --> 20:53.652 >> Is this more fun for you than just doing plain old standup comedy? 20:53.652 --> 20:55.287 >> No, I love doing comedy. 20:55.287 --> 20:56.155 It's a whole different thing. 20:56.155 --> 20:58.557 You know, like the job of doing the podcast, 20:58.557 --> 21:00.226 like I need to talk to people. 21:00.226 --> 21:02.595 Like it becomes sort of this weird thing. 21:02.595 --> 21:06.198 Like I was, like, aggravated the other day and I'd been touring a 21:06.198 --> 21:07.967 lot and I was just like kind of losing my mind. 21:07.967 --> 21:10.236 And then, like, I had an interview, Zach Woods, 21:10.236 --> 21:12.471 who is a comedic actor. 21:12.471 --> 21:14.640 He's from "The Office" and from "Silicon Valley." 21:14.640 --> 21:16.041 >> So like on the "Mike Judge" show, right. 21:16.041 --> 21:16.776 >> Right. 21:16.776 --> 21:17.543 >> Very good. 21:17.543 --> 21:18.611 >> He's a great improviser too. 21:18.611 --> 21:20.679 I seen him -- just by coincidence I brought my nieces 21:20.679 --> 21:23.849 to UCB to see him improvise with a crew. 21:23.849 --> 21:24.884 I didn't know he was in it. 21:24.884 --> 21:27.553 Well, anyways, I didn't know what I was going to talk to him 21:27.553 --> 21:28.754 about, but I was a fan. 21:28.754 --> 21:31.824 And just the act of talking to somebody else is relaxing. 21:31.824 --> 21:33.259 You get out of your own head and I'm kind of, you know, 21:33.259 --> 21:35.761 addicted to it. 21:35.761 --> 21:39.131 And the point is that it's a whole different thing, you know. 21:39.131 --> 21:41.600 Standup is something I've done my whole life. 21:41.600 --> 21:43.269 It was what I did at the beginning. 21:43.269 --> 21:45.871 >> You started in '87 was the first time you did standup? 21:45.871 --> 21:49.141 >> If your research tells you that, then I'll go with that. 21:49.141 --> 21:50.142 >> I'm just picking a number. 21:50.142 --> 21:51.177 I'm picking a year out of the air. 21:51.177 --> 21:52.444 Roughly, right? 21:52.444 --> 21:53.612 >> It seems spontaneous, yeah. 21:53.612 --> 21:54.246 [Laughter]. 21:54.246 --> 21:57.583 >> Preparation, man. 21:57.583 --> 21:58.651 >> That's good, buddy. 21:58.651 --> 22:01.287 Yeah, I think it was about '87 is right. 22:01.287 --> 22:02.955 You know, I did it a couple of times before that. 22:02.955 --> 22:05.858 But I always wanted to just be a comic. 22:05.858 --> 22:08.460 And now finally people were coming to see me. 22:08.460 --> 22:10.596 A lot of people were like, well, I like his podcast, 22:10.596 --> 22:12.064 I don't know if he can do a standup. 22:12.064 --> 22:13.832 And I'm like, it's what I do. 22:13.832 --> 22:15.534 You know, that's always a surprise. 22:15.534 --> 22:17.102 Like, I didn't know how you'd be as a standup. 22:17.102 --> 22:19.605 It's like, I've been living on stage for half my life. 22:19.605 --> 22:21.640 >> Well, but you probably have people who came to the podcast 22:21.640 --> 22:23.375 who really didn't know that that's what you did. 22:23.375 --> 22:25.611 >> Honestly most people don't know me. 22:25.611 --> 22:26.378 >> Yeah. 22:26.378 --> 22:27.980 >> Like, I think that if you were to sort of look at the 22:27.980 --> 22:30.549 numbers of people who know me versus who doesn't know me, 22:30.549 --> 22:31.850 more people don't know me. 22:31.850 --> 22:33.552 Which is exciting, in a way --. 22:33.552 --> 22:34.987 >> It's an opportunity. 22:34.987 --> 22:37.957 >> Well, yeah, kind of like when my show "Maron" went on to 22:37.957 --> 22:40.826 Netflix, you know, I'd get these Tweets and stuff like I had no 22:40.826 --> 22:41.694 idea who you were. 22:41.694 --> 22:44.029 And there's part of you that's like how could you not? 22:44.029 --> 22:45.064 You know, what do I got to do? 22:45.064 --> 22:47.800 You know, or if I'm going to a town, like, 22:47.800 --> 22:48.968 I'll tweet a million times. 22:48.968 --> 22:50.269 I'll talk about it on the podcast for weeks. 22:50.269 --> 22:53.005 And then some idiot will be like I didn't know you were in town. 22:53.005 --> 22:54.373 What did you want me to do, come over? 22:54.373 --> 22:57.910 >> How could I have possibly worked this harder? 22:57.910 --> 22:59.912 >> Yeah, I don't know how to do it but I do know it's nice being 22:59.912 --> 23:01.113 discoverable. 23:01.113 --> 23:02.014 >> Right. 23:02.014 --> 23:03.649 >> Because, like, if you're coming to Netflix and there's 23:03.649 --> 23:06.285 two seasons of that specific show, which is me, 23:06.285 --> 23:07.686 and you're like, oh, this is great. 23:07.686 --> 23:09.021 It must be exciting. 23:09.021 --> 23:10.322 Like, I never knew that guy. 23:10.322 --> 23:13.692 So that's kind of -- everything's pretty good. 23:13.692 --> 23:16.061 >> Has the TV -- we said that the third season of the show is 23:16.061 --> 23:17.863 now on IFC. 23:17.863 --> 23:20.299 Has the TV experience been good for you? 23:20.299 --> 23:22.167 It's a fictionalized version. 23:22.167 --> 23:23.969 It's almost like a reality show based on the character. 23:23.969 --> 23:25.104 >> No. 23:25.104 --> 23:26.805 >> The character is kind of you-ish. 23:26.805 --> 23:28.073 >> It's not a reality show. 23:28.073 --> 23:30.276 It's like oh my God, my hair in Texas is a bit much. 23:30.276 --> 23:33.212 The humidity is really, like --. 23:33.212 --> 23:34.680 >> Even though it's a fictionalized version of you, 23:34.680 --> 23:37.883 it is kind of like you. 23:37.883 --> 23:39.184 I mean, it's you, basically, right? 23:39.184 --> 23:40.185 The character's you. 23:40.185 --> 23:40.986 >> Well, it evolves as me. 23:40.986 --> 23:42.588 You know, some of the stories are based on me, 23:42.588 --> 23:44.723 but it is 22 minutes of scripted material. 23:44.723 --> 23:46.959 And as the seasons went on, like I don't think I was -- I knew 23:46.959 --> 23:49.194 that I was going to take a hit. 23:49.194 --> 23:51.163 You know, the first season I had never done anything like that 23:51.163 --> 23:53.866 before and I knew that my acting was going to be stiff. 23:53.866 --> 23:56.135 And, like, I just knew because I had seen other comics go through 23:56.135 --> 23:57.136 it. 23:57.136 --> 23:58.971 You know, like every comic I know who has had a TV show, 23:58.971 --> 24:02.241 that first season you're like, I hope he figures this out. 24:02.241 --> 24:03.976 >> And not all of them do. 24:03.976 --> 24:05.344 >> No, I know. 24:05.344 --> 24:07.479 But eventually they lock into something --. 24:07.479 --> 24:08.113 >> Right. 24:08.113 --> 24:09.214 >> -- that is them. 24:09.214 --> 24:11.383 They may not be great actors, but I did better second season. 24:11.383 --> 24:12.751 I think this season is even better. 24:12.751 --> 24:13.652 >> Yeah. 24:13.652 --> 24:17.056 >> But it is -- but through that creative process of writing and 24:17.056 --> 24:20.059 you start to realize what part of me lives up there. 24:20.059 --> 24:21.126 That is a character. 24:21.126 --> 24:22.161 >> Right. 24:22.161 --> 24:23.128 >> It is Marc on television. 24:23.128 --> 24:24.963 It is not my regular life because it's only 22 minutes. 24:24.963 --> 24:27.933 You know, I have another 23.5 hours during the day and they're 24:27.933 --> 24:31.070 not all pleasant and some of them are sadder than others. 24:31.070 --> 24:33.672 And a lot of times I'm not doing anything, 24:33.672 --> 24:34.707 which is not great television. 24:34.707 --> 24:35.741 >> Bad television. 24:35.741 --> 24:36.709 [Laughter]. 24:36.709 --> 24:40.379 >> So to figure out what that character is and what parts of 24:40.379 --> 24:41.914 me are coming out and how it works, 24:41.914 --> 24:46.985 like I'm a little crankier, like I think I'm a pretty sensitive, 24:46.985 --> 24:48.454 compassionate person. 24:48.454 --> 24:51.457 And I think the character's a little harder than I am, really. 24:51.457 --> 24:53.659 But it gets pretty dicey this season. 24:53.659 --> 24:58.330 Yeah, this season the undercurrent is really just sort 24:58.330 --> 25:00.032 of, like, what if it had gone wrong? 25:00.032 --> 25:03.335 Like what if I'd gotten all the opportunities I've gotten up to 25:03.335 --> 25:03.902 this point --. 25:03.902 --> 25:04.670 >> Yep. 25:04.670 --> 25:05.904 >> -- and I let the worst of me take over. 25:05.904 --> 25:07.973 So that kind of happens. 25:07.973 --> 25:08.640 >> It's kind of exciting. 25:08.640 --> 25:09.608 >> It is kind of exciting. 25:09.608 --> 25:10.909 I just hope to God it's not prophecy. 25:10.909 --> 25:12.077 [Laughter]. 25:12.077 --> 25:13.145 >> Okay. 25:13.145 --> 25:14.413 Well, that's a good place to end. 25:14.413 --> 25:15.214 We're out of time. 25:15.214 --> 25:16.181 Good luck with the show. 25:16.181 --> 25:17.416 But, really, thanks for the podcast. 25:17.416 --> 25:18.283 It's just so wonderful. 25:18.283 --> 25:19.218 >> Thank you for having me. 25:19.218 --> 25:20.085 >> Marc Maron. 25:20.085 --> 25:20.919 Thank you very much. 25:20.919 --> 25:24.490 [Applause]. 25:24.490 --> 25:26.158 >> We'd love to have you join us in the studio. 25:26.158 --> 25:30.696 Visit our web at klru.org/overheard to find 25:30.696 --> 25:34.166 invitations to interviews, Q&As with our audience and guests, 25:34.166 --> 25:36.835 and an archive of past episodes. 25:36.835 --> 25:41.673 >> The reason I ended up doing Conan so much was I was in New 25:41.673 --> 25:46.412 York and sometimes someone would cancel, like at the last minute. 25:46.412 --> 25:47.980 So Paula, the booker over there, she'd be like, 25:47.980 --> 25:49.281 do you have anything? 25:49.281 --> 25:50.749 And I'm like, well, I've got a few things that aren't quite -- 25:50.749 --> 25:52.084 yeah, I could probably make them work. 25:52.084 --> 25:53.552 And she's like, all right, good, help us. 25:53.552 --> 25:57.489 So I would go on Conan and do bits that later became better 25:57.489 --> 25:58.457 jokes. 25:58.457 --> 26:00.359 Like, I would try them out on Conan. 26:00.359 --> 26:10.436 >> Pretty good. 26:10.436 --> 26:13.372 >> Funding for "Overheard" with Evan Smith is provided in part 26:13.372 --> 26:17.509 by MFI Foundation, improving the quality of life within our 26:17.509 --> 26:19.211 community. 26:19.211 --> 26:22.080 And from the Texas Board of Legal Specialization, 26:22.080 --> 26:24.716 board certified attorneys in your community. 26:24.716 --> 26:27.286 Experienced, respected, and tested. 26:27.286 --> 26:30.622 Also by Hillco Partners, Texas Government Affairs consultancy 26:30.622 --> 26:34.460 and its global healthcare consulting business unit, 26:34.460 --> 26:35.994 Hillco Health. 26:35.994 --> 26:39.031 And by the Alice Kleberg Reynolds Foundation. 26:39.031 --> 26:40.499 And viewers like you. 26:40.499 --> 26:42.267 Thank you.