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>> Thompson: JOINING ME NOW FOR

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MORE ON THIS DEVELOPING STORY IS

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ZOLAN KANNO-YOUNGS, HOMELAND

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SECURITY REPORTER FOR THE "NEW

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YORK TIMES."

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I WANTED TO THANK YOU VERY MUCH

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FOR BEING WITH US.

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>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

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>> Thompson: I WANTED TO FIRST

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ASK YOU ABOUT McALEENAN'S

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TENURE, HIS ACCOMPLISHMENTS.

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I MEAN, DURING HIS SIX MONTHS ON

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THE JOB, HE LARGELY DELIVERED

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WHAT PRESIDENT TRUMP WANTED DOWN

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AT THE SOUTHERN BORDER, RIGHT?

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>> YES, I MEAN, YOU HAVE TO

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REMEMBER THE TIME IN WHICH KEVIN

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McALEENAN ASSUMED THE POSITION

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AS THE HEAD OF THE DEPARTMENT OF

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HOMELAND SECURITY.

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HOMELAND SECURITY SECRETARY

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KIRSTEN NEILSEN HAD JUST BEEN

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FORCED OUT OF THE POSITION BY

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THE PRESIDENT, WHO WAS

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INFURIATED OVER THE NUMBER OF

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BORDER CROSSINGS OCCURRING AT

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THE SOUTHWEST BORDER.

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IN MAY, THERE WERE ABOUT 144...

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MORE THAN 144,000 ENFORCEMENT

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ACTIONS AT THE SOUTHWEST BORDER.

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NOW LOOK AT WHERE WE ARE.

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THOSE APPREHENSIONS HAVE

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DECLINED BY MORE THAN 60%.

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THINGS HAVE RELATIVELY CALMED

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DOWN AT THE BORDER.

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BUT, AT THE SAME TIME, THERE WAS

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FRICTION BETWEEN HIM AND THE

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PRESIDENT AND WHITE HOUSE

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ADVISER STEPHEN MILLER, KNOWN AS

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THE ARCHITECT OF THE PRESIDENT'S

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IMMIGRATION AGENDA.

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IN THE END, KEVIN McALEENAN,

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WHILE HE DID BRING BORDER

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CROSSINGS DOWN, HE DID HAVE-- HE

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DID TAKE ISSUE WITH SOME OF THE

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INITIATIVES THAT OTHERS AROUND

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HIM WANTED TO PUSH.

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>> Thompson: CAN YOU TALK A

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LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT THAT?

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I MEAN, WHAT ARE SOME OF THOSE

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INITIATIVES THAT HE WAS A LITTLE

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BIT MORE RESISTANT TO DURING HIS

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TIME?

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>> WELL, YOU MAY REMEMBER THAT

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EARLIER THIS YEAR THERE WAS A

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PUSH BY-- PARTICULARLY THE WHITE

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HOUSE, AS WELL AS MARK MORGAN,

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WHO WAS LEADING ICE AT THE TIME,

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IS NOW LEADING CUSTOMS AND

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BORDER PROTECTION-- TO LAUNCH A

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NATIONWIDE SWEEP-UP OF MIGRANT

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FAMILIES WHO HAD RECENTLY

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CROSSED THE BORDER, THE ICE

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RAIDS THAT-- AS THEY WERE CALLED

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AT THAT TIME.

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BEHIND CLOSED DOORS, KEVIN

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McALEENAN DIDN'T WANT THAT TO

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HAPPEN.

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THE IDEA THAT THE PRESIDENT

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WOULD CUT STATE DEPARTMENT AID

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TO CENTRAL AMERICAN COUNTRIES,

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THIS WAS SOMEBODY-- KEVIN

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McALEENAN-- WHO BELIEVED IN

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ADDRESSING THE ROOT CAUSES OF

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THE REASONS OF WHICH PEOPLE

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LEAVE CENTRAL AMERICAN

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COUNTRIES.

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HE BELIEVED IN STATE DEPARTMENT

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AID AND WAS DISAPPOINTED WHEN

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THAT WAS CUT.

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AT THE SAME TIME, KEVIN

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McALEENAN DID OVERSEE THE

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DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY

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WHEN SOME OF THE MORE AGGRESSIVE

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INITIATIVES WERE IMPLEMENTED AND

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EXPANDED.

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>> Thompson: HE WAS AN ACTING

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SECRETARY.

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HE WAS NEVER NOMINATED FOR FULL

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CONFIRMATION.

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I MEAN, WHAT'S THE IMPACT ON THE

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DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY

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TO BE WITHOUT A PERMANENT HEAD

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FOR SO LONG?

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>> NOT JUST HIM, EITHER.

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YOU HAVE TO LOOK.

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SO, THE HEAD OF THE DEPARTMENT

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OF HOMELAND SECURITY: HIM,

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ACTING POSITION.

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HEAD OF U.S.C.I.S.: KEN

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CUCCINELLI, ACTING POSITION.

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MARK MORGAN: THE HEAD OF CUSTOMS

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AND BORDER PROTECTION, ACTING

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POSITION.

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HEAD OF ICE RIGHT NOW: MATT

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ALBERT, ACTING POSITION.

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WHAT THAT HAS DONE TO THE AGENCY

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IF YOU TALK TO CAREER

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OFFICIALS IN THE AGENCY, IT HAS

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CREATED A SENSE WHERE THERE IS

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AN INSTABILITY OF LEADERSHIP

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RIGHT NOW.

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AND, REMEMBER, WE'RE ALSO

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TALKING ABOUT D.H.S.

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AND D.H.S. WAS CREATED IN THE

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WAKE OF THE SEPTEMBER 11

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ATTACKS, AND IT WAS NOT CREATED

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TO BE SOLELY A IMMIGRATION

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ENFORCEMENT AGENCY, WHICH MANY

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WOULD SAY IS WHAT IT HAS BECOME

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UNDER PRESIDENT TRUMP.

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AND IT IS RESPONSIBLE FOR MANY

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THINGS OUTSIDE OF THAT, WHETHER

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IT BE CYBER-SECURITY, DISASTER

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RELIEF, AS WELL AS SECURING THE

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COUNTRY AND INFORMATION SHARING

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IN REGARDS TO TERRORISM.

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>> Thompson: ANY IDEAS ABOUT WHO

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MIGHT BE TAPPED NEXT FOR THE

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HOMELAND SECURITY JOB?

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>> THERE'S A LOT OF NAMES THAT

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HAVE BEEN FLOATED.

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I MEAN, IT'S WELL KNOWN THAT

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INDIVIDUALS LIKE KEN CUCCINELLI

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AND MARK MORGAN DISPLAY THE

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RHETORIC THAT PLEASES THE

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PRESIDENT.

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LET'S REMEMBER HOW THEY GOT THE

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JOB.

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THEY WENT ON FOX NEWS AND

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ADVOCATED FOR THE PRESIDENT'S

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POLICIES.

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I MEAN, PREVIOUSLY, A VACANCY

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ACT THAT WE THOUGHT WOULD BE

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STRICTLY FOLLOWED.

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HOWEVER, WE'VE BEEN TOLD THAT

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THERE WERE RULES CHANGED BY THE

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WHITE HOUSE WITH THE COOPERATION

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OF SENIOR HOMELAND SECURITY

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OFFICIALS TO MAKE IT SO THAT IT

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WOULD NOT NEED TO GO TO THE NEXT

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PERSON IN LINE.

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THAT WOULD BE, RIGHT NOW, DAVID

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PEKOSKE, WHO IS THE DEPUTY

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SECRETARY, WHO IS IN AN ACTING

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POSITION.

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THE PRESIDENT IS GOING TO CHOOSE

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WHO HE IS GOING TO CHOOSE.

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I CAN TELL YOU, THOUGH, WHOEVER

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HE DOES CHOOSE, I THINK IT WILL

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BE A WHILE BEFORE THAT PERSON IS

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NOMINATED, IF THEY'RE NOMINATED

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AT ALL.

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>> Thompson: ZOLAN

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KANNO-YOUNGS WITH THE "NEW YORK

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TIMES," THANK YOU SO MUCH

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FOR BEING WITH US.

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>> THANK YOU.