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GEOFF BENNETT: In addition
to the moral and political
debates over abortion access,

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there is an economic argument
to for people living in states
without access to abortions,

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the financial consequences
can be long lasting. my
colleague Ali Rogin has more.

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ALI ROGIN: The legalization
of abortion in the
1970s had a dramatic
effect on when and under

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what circumstances women
become mothers. A large
body of research over the
50 years since has shown

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how unwanted pregnancies
can affect women's
education, employment
and earning prospects.

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Caitlin Knowles Myers, an
economist at Middlebury
College joins us to

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discuss what we know about
the economic effects of
limiting access to abortion.

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Caitlin, thank you so
much for joining us.
A lot of the costs of

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having a child seem
self-evident. I think
to a lot of people,
it's obviously a very

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expensive undertaking. But there
is empirical data that shows
how being denied and abortion

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can transform a person's
financial well-being.
Tell us about that data.

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CAITLIN KNOWLES MYERS,
Middlebury College: Sure.
So economists know that
whether and when to have a

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child is one of the most
economically significant
decisions that a woman
will make in her lifetime.

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And we also know that women
who are seeking abortions tend
to be disproportionately at

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vulnerable moments in
their lives. They are
disproportionately low income,

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most of them are already
parenting. Many of
them are experiencing
disruptive life events

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like being behind on the
rent or losing a job.

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One really influential study,
the turn away study followed
hundreds of women who were

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seeking abortions. And some
of these women were arriving
at abortion providers just

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half the gestational age cut
off to obtain the abortion,
and were turned away from

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the provider as a result. And
they saw that for the months and
years leading up to that pivotal

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moment in their lives. All of
these women had very similar
financial circumstances.

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But at this moment, when
a group of them was turned
away from the abortion they

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wanted to have they experienced
about an 80 percent increase
in adverse credit events

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like bankruptcies compared
to the women who received the
abortions that they want it.

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ALI ROGIN: Now on the flip
side, of course, it seems
that the way that this

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ruling came down means
that access to people in
certain socio economics,

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certainly certain racial
subgroups are going to be
able to maintain access,

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even if restrictions
in the state in which
they live tighten.

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So, I'd love to ask, is
that access really going
to become stratified

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depending on what socio
economic and what racial
groups people fall into?

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CAITLIN KNOWLES MYERS: Yes, we
have a lot of empirical evidence
to suggest that the answer is

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yes that the Dobb's
decision and the overturning
of Roe isn't going to
eliminate abortion access

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for all American women,
but rather it's going to
create really substantial
in inequality in access.

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What we've seen suggests
that about three quarters
of the women who live

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in areas where access is about
to decline are still going to
find a way. They are going to

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scrimp, they're going to
struggle, but they are going to
find a way to make those trips

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to the states where
abortion remains legal.

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But about a quarter of women
based on what we know, are
likely to end up trapped,

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trapped by poverty, trapped by
their personal circumstances,

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like being in abusive
relationships, and are unlikely
to be able to get out. And

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perhaps not surprisingly,
the women who end up trapped
are disproportionately poor,

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they're disproportionately
young, are disproportionately
women of color.

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ALI ROGIN: And to that,
there are some abortion funds
that have said, you know,

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there are organizations that say
they're going to help support
women to make sure that they can

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afford the abortions. But they
don't necessarily mention some
of those hidden costs that you

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mentioned the cost of
child care, while pursuing
an abortion, the cost of
travel, do you anticipate

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that those hidden costs
are going to be things
that prevent some people
from pursuing abortions?

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CAITLIN KNOWLES MYERS:
Yes, we've seen it before,

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even with the presence of
these types of funds in
these types of access. And

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I don't mean to imply they
won't make a difference to
people's lives, these funds,

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absolutely, are going
to end up helping women
who otherwise could not
travel, find a way out.

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But it's also the case that
making trips like these, these
will be trips for many women

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have hundreds or even
thousands of miles round trip.

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And many of these are women
who have a hard time often
taking time off work, who are

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living on the financial margins,
who are having trouble finding
childcare for their children.

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And so there are so many of
these hidden costs that it seems
quite likely that a large number

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of women will despite access to
these types of resources, still
struggle to find a way out.

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ALI ROGIN: And very
quickly, I want to ask
you, in the Dobbs case,

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lawyers for the state of
Mississippi argued that policies
like parental leave and

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childcare which weren't
as prevalent when Roe was
initially decided, quote,

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facilitate the ability of women
to pursue both career success
and a rich family life. Putting

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aside the fact that not
everybody wants both
of those things. What's
your response to that?

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CAITLIN KNOWLES MYERS: The
reality is, most American
women still don't have

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access to paid family leave,
particularly poor women,
particularly low income women

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who are seeking abortions.
And even if they find a way to
subsidize or pay for childcare,

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many of these women work in
what's called shift work.
They have very unpredictable

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schedules, which make
it really difficult to
schedule, childcare.

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So I'm not denying that all
sorts of policy advances have
facilitated work life balance.

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But I also think that parents
still face substantial
logistical and financial

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challenges and that there's
they're even greater
for low income families.

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ALI ROGIN: Caitlin
Knowles Myers,

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economist at Middlebury College,
thank you so much for your time.

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CAITLIN KNOWLES MYERS:
Thank you for having me.