WEBVTT 00:02.500 --> 00:05.200 align:left position:10% line:71% size:80% AMNA NAWAZ: Now let's discuss this with one of Weinstein's defense attorneys, Donna Rotunno. 00:05.200 --> 00:06.433 align:left position:10% line:89% size:80% She joins us from New York. 00:06.433 --> 00:08.500 align:left position:20% line:83% size:70% Donna, welcome to the "NewsHour." 00:08.500 --> 00:12.300 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% In response to the verdict, you said in a statement there are issues in the trial that 00:12.300 --> 00:17.300 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% - - quote -- "prejudiced" your client's ability to have his case fairly judged. 00:19.333 --> 00:21.000 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% You are taking this up with a higher court, we should point out. But in what way do you 00:21.000 --> 00:23.733 align:left position:20% line:77% size:70% think this jury or this court were prejudiced towards Mr. Weinstein? 00:23.733 --> 00:27.200 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% DONNA ROTUNNO, Attorney For Harvey Weinstein: Well, I don't know if Mr. Weinstein could 00:27.200 --> 00:31.866 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% have found a fair jury anywhere, frankly, with the media coverage that has happened 00:31.866 --> 00:36.800 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% for the last two years, with the fact that, especially in New York, every day, he's a 00:36.800 --> 00:38.833 align:left position:30% line:89% size:60% headline. 00:38.833 --> 00:41.966 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% He's on the cover of The Post. He's a headline in The New York Times, The Daily News, The 00:41.966 --> 00:46.466 align:left position:10% line:83% size:80% Daily Beast, BuzzFeed. So, I think it was very difficult. 00:46.466 --> 00:51.433 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% When we questioned jurors, not one of the jurors had not heard of Mr. Weinstein out 00:53.400 --> 00:57.400 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% of the weeks of jury selection. So I think we were just put in a difficult position from 00:58.266 --> 01:00.366 align:left position:40% line:89% size:50% day one. 01:00.366 --> 01:02.400 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% AMNA NAWAZ: But he was convicted on two charges. They also acquitted him on two charges. 01:02.400 --> 01:05.300 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% So, is it fair to say that they prejudged him, when they did end up acquitting him on 01:05.300 --> 01:07.300 align:left position:20% line:89% size:70% two of those charges? 01:07.300 --> 01:09.900 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% DONNA ROTUNNO: Well, they acquitted him on three charges, actually, and acquitted (sic) 01:09.900 --> 01:11.833 align:left position:30% line:89% size:60% him on two. 01:11.833 --> 01:15.200 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% I think that, really, what this was about was, the evidence wasn't there to support 01:15.200 --> 01:18.633 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% a conviction. I have said that from the very beginning. I know, when I first got involved 01:18.633 --> 01:22.433 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% in this case, everyone thought that that was a crazy statement to make, but I think, once 01:22.433 --> 01:27.433 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% the trial did play out and the witnesses did testify, I think that became a little more 01:28.566 --> 01:30.633 align:left position:20% line:83% size:70% clearer -- a little more clear, I should say. 01:30.633 --> 01:35.633 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% But, in this case, the pressure, I think, on the jury made them look at this case and 01:37.633 --> 01:41.800 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% not worry about the lack of evidence, and they worried more about the court of public 01:41.800 --> 01:43.900 align:left position:40% line:89% size:50% opinion. 01:43.900 --> 01:46.600 align:left position:20% line:71% size:70% And what I found most interesting was, as the jurors were walking out, they didn't look 01:46.600 --> 01:50.266 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% at Harvey, they didn't look at the prosecutors. They looked at the press. And that really 01:50.266 --> 01:54.800 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% told me a lot. I think they were concerned about coming back with a finding of not guilty 01:54.800 --> 01:56.833 align:left position:30% line:89% size:60% on all counts. 01:56.833 --> 02:00.766 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% I do think that the sort of split verdict shows us that there was definitely some doubt 02:01.366 --> 02:03.366 align:left position:30% line:89% size:60% back there. 02:03.366 --> 02:05.933 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% AMNA NAWAZ: Well, there was a lot of attention paid. You're right about that. 02:05.933 --> 02:08.433 align:left position:10% line:71% size:80% I want to ask you about some of the reports that came out midtrial, because you were criticized 02:08.433 --> 02:11.366 align:left position:10% line:71% size:80% about the way that you were questioning some of those witnesses. People said that you went 02:11.366 --> 02:16.033 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% very, very hard, in particular after Jessica Mann. At one point, she was crying so hard, 02:16.033 --> 02:18.100 align:left position:20% line:83% size:70% the proceedings in the courtroom had to stop. 02:18.100 --> 02:21.600 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% You were questioning really about why she continued to be in touch with Mr. Weinstein 02:21.600 --> 02:26.000 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% even after the rape, asking him for professional help and staying in touch with him. 02:26.000 --> 02:29.433 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% Why did you think that was an important line of questioning? How did that help your defense? 02:29.433 --> 02:32.466 align:left position:10% line:83% size:80% DONNA ROTUNNO: Well, I don't know how it is not important. 02:32.466 --> 02:37.433 align:left position:10% line:71% size:80% Of course, none of us know what happened -- what happens in those rooms. And we have no idea. 02:37.433 --> 02:40.366 align:left position:20% line:77% size:70% We're not there. I'm not there. You're not there, the judge, the jury. 02:40.366 --> 02:45.166 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% But what we do know is every piece of evidence that we had documented after the fact. And 02:45.166 --> 02:50.166 align:left position:10% line:71% size:80% so to not look at the totality of the circumstances to determine what really took place in that 02:51.766 --> 02:54.366 align:left position:20% line:89% size:70% room seems remiss. 02:54.366 --> 02:59.000 align:left position:10% line:71% size:80% And, you know, as a criminal defense attorney, I go into court, and I have to defend my client. 03:01.566 --> 03:04.133 align:left position:10% line:71% size:80% I have to ask questions that have not been asked. I have to ask questions that are difficult. 03:04.133 --> 03:06.633 align:left position:10% line:83% size:80% I have to present evidence that wasn't presented. 03:06.633 --> 03:11.633 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% And when you look at how these cases get to the point of going to trial, there's a grand 03:11.633 --> 03:13.666 align:left position:30% line:89% size:60% jury process. 03:13.666 --> 03:16.666 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% And when the prosecutors brought Jessica Mann before the grand jury, she didn't tell those 03:16.666 --> 03:21.666 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% grand jurors that she had had sexual relations with him after the fact that were consensual 03:23.300 --> 03:25.500 align:left position:20% line:77% size:70% in 2016. She didn't tell the grand jury about the e-mail communications. 03:25.500 --> 03:29.633 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% So, you know, they told this story in a vacuum. And the first time we were really able to 03:29.633 --> 03:33.933 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% bring the full picture to light was the trial. And, at that point, so much had already been 03:33.933 --> 03:36.700 align:left position:10% line:83% size:80% written on it, it was almost as if it was an afterthought. 03:36.700 --> 03:40.666 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% AMNA NAWAZ: Donna, you mentioned the things that we know. We also know, statistically, 03:40.666 --> 03:44.800 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% that most sexual assault survivors know their attacker in some way. We also know that you 03:44.800 --> 03:49.466 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% can have a consensual sexual relationship with someone and still be raped by them. 03:49.466 --> 03:53.633 align:left position:10% line:71% size:80% What is, do you think, the appropriate level of contact between someone like Jessica Mann 03:53.633 --> 03:55.766 align:left position:20% line:89% size:70% and Mr. Weinstein? 03:55.766 --> 03:58.900 align:left position:20% line:71% size:70% DONNA ROTUNNO: Well, I don't know who can say what's appropriate and what isn't appropriate. 03:58.900 --> 04:03.800 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% But we have a five-year period of communication that continued after the fact. And this is 04:03.800 --> 04:08.200 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% not something where -- you know, we talk about domestic abuse situations, which don't equate 04:08.200 --> 04:13.066 align:left position:20% line:71% size:70% in any way to this. That's someone who lives in a home with somebody, that maybe has children 04:13.066 --> 04:16.233 align:left position:20% line:77% size:70% with somebody, that may be financially dependent on somebody. 04:16.233 --> 04:20.666 align:left position:20% line:71% size:70% That's not the case here. Jessica Mann, you know, benefited from Mr. Weinstein in certain 04:20.666 --> 04:25.666 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% ways, but definitely not in ways that affected her ability to live a life or have a job. 04:27.566 --> 04:32.233 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% You know, she asked him for help in multiple different avenues, whether it was, help me 04:33.833 --> 04:38.333 align:left position:20% line:77% size:70% get a job or help me get into a private club or help me with my car. 04:40.300 --> 04:44.166 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% And so, you know, the continued contact, seeking out, the way she spoke about him to other 04:46.166 --> 04:50.333 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% people, the way she spoke about him to therapists, the way she defended him to her boyfriend, 04:50.333 --> 04:55.033 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% this wasn't incidental contact that someone has because they feel like they need to maintain 04:55.033 --> 04:58.133 align:left position:20% line:83% size:70% a decent relationship. This far surpassed that. 04:58.133 --> 05:01.366 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% AMNA NAWAZ: Donna, related to the trial, but not directly, you got a lot of attention for 05:01.366 --> 05:04.200 align:left position:10% line:83% size:80% an interview you gave to Megan Twohey of The New York Times. 05:04.200 --> 05:08.200 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% It was about the case, but -- and about the trial, but then she ended the interview by 05:08.200 --> 05:11.400 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% asking you if you had ever been a victim of sexual assault. And you said, "No, I have 05:11.400 --> 05:13.400 align:left position:40% line:89% size:50% not." 05:13.400 --> 05:16.133 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% And then you said -- quote -- "Because I would never put myself in that position." 05:16.133 --> 05:20.666 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% I have to ask you, do you believe that these women, who a jury now decided were raped and 05:20.666 --> 05:25.666 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% assaulted by Harvey Weinstein, put themselves in a situation for that to happen? 05:27.700 --> 05:30.800 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% DONNA ROTUNNO: Well, I have to say, that question was asked to me solely. That question wasn't 05:32.800 --> 05:35.833 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% asked to me about other people. It wasn't a commentary on anyone else. It wasn't a commentary 05:35.833 --> 05:39.100 align:left position:20% line:83% size:70% on, you know, specific victims in any way. 05:39.100 --> 05:43.400 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% So, that was a question asked to me. And, you know, for me, I would rather fight to 05:43.400 --> 05:47.666 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% my death than be put in a circumstance where somebody was going to sexually assault me. 05:47.666 --> 05:52.666 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% But that's my -- that's an answer from me, you know, having nothing to do with anyone 05:53.133 --> 05:55.100 align:left position:40% line:89% size:50% else. 05:55.100 --> 05:57.133 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% AMNA NAWAZ: Let me ask you about what Manhattan district attorney Cy Vance said. 05:57.133 --> 05:59.433 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% He did say that, today, in this day and age, things are different when it comes to how 05:59.433 --> 06:03.933 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% the court views some of these allegations of sexual crimes, that things have changed 06:03.933 --> 06:06.333 align:left position:10% line:83% size:80% in some way over the last three or four years. 06:06.333 --> 06:09.733 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% Do you believe that this verdict today -- and I ask you because you have defended a number 06:09.733 --> 06:14.066 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% of people who are accused of sexual misconduct over the years -- do you believe this verdict 06:14.066 --> 06:17.566 align:left position:20% line:77% size:70% changes how sex crimes are viewed and handled in our legal system? 06:17.566 --> 06:22.566 align:left position:10% line:71% size:80% DONNA ROTUNNO: I hope not. I hope not, because, if we don't look at individual cases on their 06:25.033 --> 06:28.100 align:left position:10% line:71% size:80% merits, and we don't look at evidence particular to a specific defendant and a specific case, 06:30.533 --> 06:32.700 align:left position:10% line:71% size:80% and we start putting things under some umbrella of the way we should do things, I think that 06:32.700 --> 06:37.200 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% would be scary for you, scary for me, and scary for anyone charged with a crime in this 06:37.200 --> 06:39.266 align:left position:40% line:89% size:50% country. 06:39.266 --> 06:41.600 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% AMNA NAWAZ: At the same time, we also know that allegations of rape and sexual crimes, 06:41.600 --> 06:45.766 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% they are vastly underreported and very difficult to prove in a court of law. 06:45.766 --> 06:49.100 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% Don't you believe there should be some weight given to the credibility of women when they 06:49.100 --> 06:51.266 align:left position:20% line:83% size:70% come forward with these allegations? 06:51.266 --> 06:54.233 align:left position:20% line:71% size:70% DONNA ROTUNNO: Well, you know, you have -- we have a presumption of independence in our 06:54.233 --> 06:56.333 align:left position:40% line:89% size:50% country. 06:56.333 --> 06:58.966 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% And the presumption of innocence is that someone charged with a crime has the right to be viewed 06:58.966 --> 07:03.300 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% as an innocent person. There is not a presumption that someone is telling the truth. 07:03.300 --> 07:08.266 align:left position:20% line:71% size:70% So, I think that to say that we should just walk into a courtroom, let someone tell their 07:08.266 --> 07:13.266 align:left position:10% line:71% size:80% story or their version of the events, without questioning that version, puts us all in jeopardy. 07:15.200 --> 07:18.600 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% I don't think that we should be able to give more credibility -- credibility to someone 07:20.000 --> 07:22.066 align:left position:10% line:83% size:80% just because they say that they were sexually assaulted. 07:22.066 --> 07:26.433 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% And I will always refer back to the Duke lacrosse team. And if we did that in that case, you 07:26.433 --> 07:31.333 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% would have that whole entire group of young men at the time sitting in the penitentiary. 07:31.333 --> 07:33.933 align:left position:10% line:83% size:80% So, I think we have to be very careful. It's a slippery slope. 07:33.933 --> 07:37.300 align:left position:10% line:77% size:80% AMNA NAWAZ: Donna Rotunno, defense attorney for Harvey Weinstein, joining us from New 07:37.300 --> 07:39.033 align:left position:20% line:83% size:70% York, thank you for being with us. 07:39.033 --> 07:44.033 align:left position:10% line:83% size:80% DONNA ROTUNNO: I appreciate it. Thank you.