1 00:00:02,466 --> 00:00:04,733 AMNA NAWAZ: Hundreds of thousands of Sudanese are fleeing to neighboring countries to escape 2 00:00:04,733 --> 00:00:08,566 violence that's killed more than 400 people in the last week-and-a-half. 3 00:00:08,566 --> 00:00:13,566 And, as Nick Schifrin tells us, aid agencies are warning, the humanitarian situation is 4 00:00:15,533 --> 00:00:18,533 increasingly dire because of a political fight that's been brewing for years. 5 00:00:18,533 --> 00:00:22,966 NICK SCHIFRIN: Today, the U.N. agency that coordinates humanitarian affairs 6 00:00:22,966 --> 00:00:26,433 warned that it had to pull back from parts of Sudan, as a country 7 00:00:26,433 --> 00:00:31,233 of 45 million copes with shortages of water, food and access to medicine. 8 00:00:31,233 --> 00:00:36,233 The U.S. and others are trying to end the fighting between General Abdel Fattah al-Burhan, 9 00:00:38,233 --> 00:00:41,166 the head of the armed forces, and Mohamed Hamdan Dagalo, known as Hemedti, the leader 10 00:00:41,166 --> 00:00:46,133 of the paramilitary Rapid Support Forces, or RSF, comprised of former militias that 11 00:00:48,700 --> 00:00:51,533 committed the genocide in Western Sudan's Darfur region that killed more than two million people. 12 00:00:53,000 --> 00:00:54,966 The two men were supposed to help return the country to 13 00:00:54,966 --> 00:00:59,933 civilian rule demanded by the 2019 pro-democracy popular uprising. 14 00:01:01,733 --> 00:01:04,533 One of those who participated in that uprising is writer Muzan Alneel, 15 00:01:04,533 --> 00:01:06,633 who joins me now from Khartoum. 16 00:01:06,633 --> 00:01:09,533 Muzan Alneel, thank you very much. Welcome back to the "NewsHour." 17 00:01:09,533 --> 00:01:13,600 As we just said, there's a humanitarian crisis. What are the conditions that you, 18 00:01:13,600 --> 00:01:16,266 your neighbors, and millions of Sudanese face today? 19 00:01:16,266 --> 00:01:18,766 MUZAN ALNEEL, Sudanese Researcher and Writer: The situation right now is that, for 11 days, 20 00:01:18,766 --> 00:01:23,766 we have been under heavy fighting, and there are around 10 million people living in this city, 21 00:01:26,333 --> 00:01:29,033 most of them under the poverty line, most of them without any stable access to electricity or water. 22 00:01:30,900 --> 00:01:33,700 The electricity network is followed by the e-banking system that many depend on to get 23 00:01:33,700 --> 00:01:38,700 food or be able to evacuate their families from Khartoum. It has also fell apart. The 24 00:01:40,633 --> 00:01:44,300 telecommunication has fell apart. People are just trying to survive this. We see 25 00:01:44,300 --> 00:01:49,266 Sudanese people restoring to popular and mutual aid, which is the only thing that they have. 26 00:01:49,266 --> 00:01:54,233 And the street is being used now by the people to form networks in their 27 00:01:56,266 --> 00:01:59,633 neighborhoods to know where the water is, to be able even to run some of the health centers, 28 00:02:01,566 --> 00:02:03,566 instead of those hospitals that are impossible to reach right now. 29 00:02:03,566 --> 00:02:06,933 NICK SCHIFRIN: And those popular efforts, they're led by the resistance committees, 30 00:02:06,933 --> 00:02:11,333 right, the same committees that helped the revolution in 2019, 31 00:02:11,333 --> 00:02:15,333 sustain it through the coup in 2021 up until today, right? 32 00:02:15,333 --> 00:02:18,933 MUZAN ALNEEL: The tactics that we learned from the resistance committees that we are using to 33 00:02:18,933 --> 00:02:23,933 network, to have mutual aid, to be able to evacuate ourselves and evacuate our families 34 00:02:23,933 --> 00:02:28,933 and our loved ones, and even help evacuate and help provide food and medicine to people. 35 00:02:30,933 --> 00:02:33,100 The concept of mutual aid mutual is what sustaining the people, not the international 36 00:02:35,100 --> 00:02:39,433 aid diplomats who called for a realistic approach by partnering with the -- with the criminals 37 00:02:41,966 --> 00:02:44,433 NICK SCHIFRIN: Well, let me ask about the politics of this moment. 38 00:02:44,433 --> 00:02:48,633 The last time we spoke a few years ago, our segment was followed by an interview I did 39 00:02:48,633 --> 00:02:53,600 with the then-U.S. special envoy to the region, who argued that the generals who are fighting in 40 00:02:56,100 --> 00:02:59,600 the streets right now had to be at the table, part of the negotiation process. Do you think that the 41 00:03:02,166 --> 00:03:05,433 U.S., the international community accommodated them, helping lead to the violence we see today? 42 00:03:05,433 --> 00:03:08,566 MUZAN ALNEEL: That was definitely accommodating them, legitimizing them, 43 00:03:08,566 --> 00:03:11,700 giving them the platform that they needed to have 44 00:03:11,700 --> 00:03:16,700 all their international deals and their stronger ties with the within the region. 45 00:03:19,133 --> 00:03:22,066 We were asked to be realistic after a massacre and accept those war criminals. We were asked 46 00:03:22,066 --> 00:03:26,400 to be realistic after a coup. And we are even, I think, will be asked to be realistic after a war, 47 00:03:26,400 --> 00:03:30,900 because I'm hearing news of some sort of negotiation, that they want to bring them back 48 00:03:30,900 --> 00:03:35,900 into -- into ruling or bring back whatever kind of political process they called it, that, basically, 49 00:03:38,333 --> 00:03:41,366 to bring back the same old agreement that brought us all that we are going through right now. 50 00:03:41,366 --> 00:03:43,966 NICK SCHIFRIN: What's been your response, 51 00:03:43,966 --> 00:03:47,700 as you have seen U.S. special operations forces fly into the capital to evacuate U.S. diplomats? 52 00:03:49,666 --> 00:03:52,066 We have seen the U.N. have to pull back, 53 00:03:52,066 --> 00:03:57,066 other countries spend time at the airport with their militaries trying to pull out civilians, 54 00:03:58,533 --> 00:04:01,733 as millions in Sudan face these dire humanitarian conditions. 55 00:04:01,733 --> 00:04:04,800 MUZAN ALNEEL: My priority are the people most in need. And 56 00:04:04,800 --> 00:04:06,833 those are the poorer of the Sudanese people. 57 00:04:06,833 --> 00:04:10,733 And they are getting help from themselves and from mutual aid, from resistance committees, 58 00:04:10,733 --> 00:04:14,033 and from neighborhood networks that are forming themselves to 59 00:04:14,033 --> 00:04:16,966 govern themselves and somehow provide for themselves. That's what I focus on. 60 00:04:16,966 --> 00:04:21,100 So, when I think about whatever evacuation efforts that are happening, 61 00:04:21,100 --> 00:04:24,700 good for them. Flee out of a war zone. It's not good to be out in a war zone. 62 00:04:24,700 --> 00:04:28,500 It's not good if your country is turned into a war zone, and you have nowhere else to run. 63 00:04:28,500 --> 00:04:33,500 But the fact that they didn't even consider to bring any sort of medical support with them, 64 00:04:35,066 --> 00:04:38,933 any sort of medical equipment or medicines that are in -- we're in 65 00:04:38,933 --> 00:04:42,600 dire need. They were sending airplanes and not even sending medicines to us. Like, 66 00:04:44,533 --> 00:04:47,500 it's absurd to even follow what they're doing. There isn't one place that will tell you, 67 00:04:47,500 --> 00:04:50,333 these are the needs and here's where you can, like, send your donation. 68 00:04:50,333 --> 00:04:54,900 No, it's a -- it's decentralized. And everyone's trying to figure out what's 69 00:04:54,900 --> 00:04:57,900 happening in their neighborhood. And that is what's working for us 70 00:04:57,900 --> 00:05:02,033 right now. There is no U.N. agency that is here to support. There is no 71 00:05:02,033 --> 00:05:05,400 international organization that is here to support. We are supporting ourselves. 72 00:05:05,400 --> 00:05:08,566 So, try to support us, but please use all the meeting 73 00:05:08,566 --> 00:05:10,466 rooms you have to get them to stop the war zone. 74 00:05:10,466 --> 00:05:12,900 NICK SCHIFRIN: Muzan Alneel, thank you very much. 75 00:05:12,900 --> 00:05:14,266 MUZAN ALNEEL: Thank you.