JUDY WOODRUFF: The partial
government shutdown is
looking more and more
like a personal showdown
tonight between President Trump
and House Speaker Nancy Pelosi.
This afternoon, at the
last minute, Mr. Trump
rescinded approval for
a U.S. military plane
to fly Pelosi and a
congressional delegation
to Afghanistan.
In a letter to the speaker,
he cited the shutdown,
and said -- quote --
"I'm sure you would agree
that postponing this
public relations event
is totally appropriate."
This came a day after Pelosi
called for postponing the
State of the Union address.
She defended that stance today.
REP.
NANCY PELOSI (D-CA), Speaker
of the House: The date of
the State of the Union is not
a sacred date, it's not
constitutionally required,
it's not the president's
birthday, it's not
anything.
It is a date that we agreed to.
It could have been a week
later, and it could be a week
later if government is open.
JUDY WOODRUFF: Meanwhile,
more federal employees are
being called back to work.
The State Department today
ordered U.S. diplomats here and
abroad to return to their jobs.
It said it found money to pay
them, but it gave no details.
Overall, more than 450,000
federal employees are
now working without pay.
Our congressional correspondent,
Lisa Desjardins, joins me now to
help break down today's events.
So, Lisa, first of all, what is
the Congress saying about this
announcement from the State
Department?
LISA DESJARDINS: Right.
So the first thing to think
to say is that there are some
questions about how exactly
this is working.
And we saw from the
leading Democrat on
the Foreign Relations
Committee, Bob Menendez,
he calls it a scheme, and he
said he's not sure that this
funding is actually appropriate.
I think he's also -- he's not
saying he is going to do a
hearing yet, but he says it's
a political move.
And I think the bigger
question here, Judy, is,
this is a new precedent.
This is the president
changing the rules of
a shutdown in a way.
And we still have to figure out
exactly how he's doing this.
Everyone says, yes, we want
people back to work, but is
he changing the rules to his
benefit?
JUDY WOODRUFF: All
right, so now let's talk
about the president's
surprise announcement.
Just before this delegation
was to take off for the Middle
East, the president announced
in a letter to Speaker Pelosi,
which the White House released,
that the trip wasn't going
to happen, that the plane wasn't
going to be allowed to fly.
What are they saying on
Capitol Hill about it?
LISA DESJARDINS: I want to
first show you a picture that
conveys kind of the situation.
The members who were going on
this CODEL were getting onto...
JUDY WOODRUFF: CODEL, the term
for congressional delegation.
Go ahead.
LISA DESJARDINS: That's right.
That's right, exactly, this
trip overseas, exactly.
There you see the members of
Congress had been on the bus,
ready to go to the airport
for this trip overseas.
There you see Adam Schiff.
He's the chairman of the
House Intelligence Committee
getting off the bus.
So this was actually
obviously very late notice.
And what Schiff said is, he
said that it was inappropriate,
first of all, to reveal that
this trip existed.
These are highly secure events.
Another member going on that
trip, Elaine Luria, who is a
Navy veteran from Virginia,
she said it was an insult
that the president called
it a public relations move.
Now, if you talk to Republicans,
like I did on the Senate,
the chairman of the Senate
Armed Services Committee,
Johnny Isakson, said, actually,
the president has this power,
and I do think that she -- the
speaker should not have planned
a trip or should not have
planned to go on this
trip during this time.
But the rest of Republicans,
Judy, they're having real
trouble with this, because, as
I phrased to them, should a
sitting president of any party
be able to cancel a trip for
a leader of Congress
of any party?
I asked Senate Pat Roberts that,
and he said, "I'm not sure."
One other note, Judy.
Those Senate Republicans when
I talked to them had just
come from their retreat today,
which was at a local baseball
park here in Washington.
What did they hear?
They heard from people like
Karl Rove that Republicans'
problem is with suburban women,
especially married women.
We have polling that shows
those suburban women, 73 percent
of them have a more negative
opinion of the president
because of this shutdown.
That is pressure that is
on Republicans right now.
JUDY WOODRUFF: Fascinating.
So, what about, though, whether
this is unprecedented or not?
People were talking
about that today.
Has this ever happened before?
LISA DESJARDINS: We reached
out to the Senate historian's
office and to several other of
the White House historical
office, and no one knows yet
for sure, but Democrats say
- - and one other kind of like
self-acclaimed historian I
spoke to at Congress believes
that this is unprecedented.
That's what Adam Schiff
said, that nothing like
this has happened before.
JUDY WOODRUFF: Finally,
most important thing,
any policy developments
toward reaching agreement
to get the government
back open again?
LISA DESJARDINS: I'm so
glad we're coming back
to that, because that's
the big frustration
here.
There's such a disconnect.
The Capitol is talking
less and less about policy.
In fact, I asked Speaker Pelosi,
just she and I. I asked her
today, do you favor a steel
slat fence, which many
people have thought
that's the endgame here?
He doesn't -- they
don't want a wall.
Call it a fence.
And she said: "It doesn't
matter what I think.
It matters if the president
thinks it's a wall," meaning
she's not even really engaging
in what it is that
Democrats want.
And it's all a bit of
politics and gaming out
the president's thought.
But, meanwhile, Judy,
House Democratic freshmen
- - I spoke to one,
Jahana Hayes -- she says,
yes, we would accept a fence.
So, underneath leadership,
there's discussion of the
reality of the policy.
But at the leadership
level, both at the White
House and at Congress, it
is nothing but politics
now.
JUDY WOODRUFF: And the
horizon shows nothing in
terms of a breakthrough?
LISA DESJARDINS: No.
Right now, we don't expect
Congress back until Tuesday.
JUDY WOODRUFF: Remarkable.
Meanwhile, federal employees,
as we're reporting in
the program, continue to
feel the consequences.
LISA DESJARDINS: That's right.
JUDY WOODRUFF: Lisa
Desjardins, thank you.