JUDY WOODRUFF: With
nearly 15 million members,
the Southern Baptist
Convention is the largest

Protestant denomination
in the United States.

Now it is facing a reckoning
of its own over sexual abuse.

A Houston Chronicle
investigation found
hundreds of clergy or staff
allegedly committed abuse

or misconduct over two decades.

This week, delegates of
Southern Baptist churches
approved changes for
the first time to make

it easier to expel churches that
cover up sexual abuse cases.

Rachael Denhollander was
the first woman to publicly
accuse Larry Nassar.

He's the former sports doctor
at Michigan State University
who was convicted of assaulting

multiple girls and women.

Denhollander spoke at
the convention on a
panel with fellow sexual
abuse survivors and

is on the denomination's
sex abuse study group.

She is also the author of "What
Is a Girl Worth?: My Story
of Breaking the Silence and

Exposing the Truth about Larry
Nassar and USA Gymnastics."

Rachael Denhollander, thank you
very much for being with us.

So, you -- we know now that the
church has made these changes.

You have been talking to
a number of survivors.

I want to understand what
your sense is of just how
widespread this abuse was.

RACHAEL DENHOLLANDER,
Advocate and Survivor;
You know, unfortunately,
the Houston Chronicle

article didn't reveal anything
that survivors and advocates
haven't known for a long time.

And that is that we have a
severe problem in Protestant
circles with sexual abuse, not

just by pastors, but by
members of the church,
and a severe problem with
how churches frequently

handle disclosures of abuse.

The top Protestant insurance
companies receive more claims
of sexual abuse by clergy than

even the Catholic insurance
companies receive.

And the number one reason that
Protestant organizations have
been held liable in federal

court for more than a
decade is with -- is for
the issue of sexual abuse.

So this has not come
as a surprise to
survivors and advocates.

JUDY WOODRUFF: You have said on
your own that you believe that
the church, in your experience,

has not provided the kind of
support, the relief to survivors
of sexual abuse that it

could.

What do you base that belief on?

RACHAEL DENHOLLANDER: Well,
again, we see the numbers in
terms of the rate of abuse.

We see the numbers in
terms of how many churches
are found liable for
mishandling sexual assault

claims.

And, in addition to that,
the survivor community has
repeatedly said that the
church has, unfortunately,

been one of the
worst places to go.

In a recent survey that asked
survivors what they thought
would be the most helpful vs.

what actually ended up being
the most helpful, churches were
listed as one of the things

- - one of the institutions
thought to be the most helpful,
until survivors went for help.

And when survivors actually
went for help, unfortunately,
churches ranked dead last behind

the option of other.

And so, unfortunately -- again,
this is not a problem that is
new to survivors and advocates.

JUDY WOODRUFF: In your
own experience, has
that been the case?

RACHAEL DENHOLLANDER:
I have received both
ends of the spectrum.

I was abused in a church
setting when I was 7 years old.

And I have -- I have had
very negative experiences
with the church.

I have also had very positive
experiences with the church.

And so my hope is that, as the
SBC is moving forward with these
reforms, and with a growing

awareness of the problem, that
more and more survivors will
be able to experience the help

and the comfort and the
community that I experienced
for one of my churches.

JUDY WOODRUFF: And so these
changes that were voted on by
the Southern Baptist Convention,

the SBC, to require churches to
-- in effect, to require more
disclosure, to ask the churches

to step up, to do more, are
these the kinds of changes that
you think are going to make

a difference?

RACHAEL DENHOLLANDER: I think
these are absolutely the first
steps that need to be taken.

One of -- one of the critical
steps that the SBC took was
to amend the constitution to

create a credentialing committee
who can examine claims of abuse
and of churches mishandling

abuse.

And this is critical,
because that provides
greater transparency,
greater accountability,

and it puts the framework
in place as we have
never had before for
being able to deal with

these claims.

The curriculum that has been
put together to help equip
churches on the journey towards

understanding abuse and being
able to both prevent and respond
to it is a critical first

step.

That being said, again,
survivors and advocates
are aware that this
is a first step only.

The frame and the foundation
is going to be only as good
as what's built upon it.

And so my hope is that, as the
SBC moves forward, they will
build upon this solid frame and

foundation.

JUDY WOODRUFF: It's my
understanding that, at the same
time, you have said that some

in the Southern Baptist
Convention are undermining
these changes, that
they were clearing some

of the local churches that
should have been punished,
should have been reprimanded.

Why did you make that statement?

RACHAEL DENHOLLANDER: Well,
unfortunately, that's a
matter of public record.

The SBC president, J.D.
Greear, had put forward
a list of churches that
he believed merited

closer scrutiny for how they
had handled sexual abuse claims.

But, within a matter of days,
the SBC's Executive Committee,
who was in charge of doing that

investigation, cleared seven
out of those 10 churches,
without talking to survivors,

and, unfortunately, did so on
a four-pronged basis that was
almost useless in evaluating

whether churches
mishandle abuse.

And advocates and survivors
and experts in the field of
abuse could have explained to

the Executive committee that
those four prongs that they
were using to evaluate were not

the correct standards
to be using.

They were not helpful
guidelines to be using.

But, unfortunately, expert
advice wasn't sought.

And so why that was done,
I think is something
that the Executive
Committee needs to wrestle

with.

I believe there are some in
the Executive Committee that
made those decisions out of

ignorance.

They simply didn't know.

And there were some that made
those decisions knowing that
those criteria they established

were not helpful
and useful criteria.

So, unfortunately, we have
seen efforts to undermine
what is being done in the SBC.

That being said, the steps
that were taken today by the
majority of SBC messengers, I

think, are very positive.

And so I am hopeful.

JUDY WOODRUFF: And that's what
I wanted to ask you, if you
overall still have confidence

that it's moving in
the right direction.

I do want to bring us back
to Michigan State University,
because today, as we reported

earlier, the former dean,
who was also the boss of Dr.
Larry Nassar, was convicted.

He himself has now been
convicted of criminal
conduct, neglect of duty,
acquitted of criminal

sexual misconduct, though, but
he could still face up to years
-- up to five years in prison.

What's your reaction
to all this?

RACHAEL DENHOLLANDER:
You know, Dean Strampel's
negligence in supervising
Larry, his deliberate

return, putting Larry back
in the office, when he was
under police investigation, is

something that we have
known for quite a long time.

So I am grateful to see the
conviction for that conduct.

I think it is necessary
and I think it is just.

I am disappointed and
discouraged to see that
the survivors who reported
assault by Strampel,

by Dean Strampel himself,
were not believed by the jury,
because we know, we understand

what Dr. Strampel's conduct was.

His personnel file was
full of warnings about
his predatory behavior.

And so I am disappointed to see
a jury acquittal on that count.

JUDY WOODRUFF: More broadly
speaking, Rachael Denhollander,
we know that a lot has happened

since you initially came
forward to be the first
person to accuse Dr. Nassar.

We know that a number of
institutions have made changes
as a result of the disclosures

by you and so many other
-- so many other women
who suffered sexual abuse.

What do you think
it all adds up to?

Do you think things
have changed enough?

What do you think has been
done right, and what more do
you think needs to be done?

RACHAEL DENHOLLANDER: I think
there is an extent to which
we overestimate the change

that has been made, honestly,
because where the -- where
the real test comes is how we

respond when it's in
our own community.

How do we respond when
it's our university,
when it's our favorite
sports team, our favorite

coach, when it's in our
religious institution,
or it's our political
candidate, when it would

cost something to care?

And, by and large, we are still
seeing a circling of the wagons.

The statistics on the
ability to convict sex
offenders have not shifted.

We see an excellent case of
this with the University of
Southern California, USC, where

a gynecologist at USC, Dr.
George Tyndall, has had over
500 women report sexual abuse.

There are decades of evidence of
nurses reporting Dr. Tyndall's
conduct, and yet there has not

been a single criminal
charge filed in his case.

So, the idea that we have had
a massive cultural shift that
makes it easy for survivors to

speak up and easy to
get justice, that's
simply not accurate.

We have a great deal
of work left to do.

And it starts with how
we respond when it's
in our own community.

JUDY WOODRUFF: Very
discouraging, but very
important to hear.

Rachael Denhollander,
thank you very much.

RACHAEL DENHOLLANDER: Thank you.

JUDY WOODRUFF: And, for
the record, we invited
J.D. Greear, who's the
president of the Southern

Baptist Convention, to
join us for an interview.

He declined our
request at this time.

And, tonight, U.S. Roman
Catholic bishops voted to create
a new national hot line for

reporting sex abuse allegations.

It would be run by an
independent group, who
would relay claims of abuse
to regional supervisory

bishops.

The service is supposed to
begin operating within a year.