JUDY WOODRUFF: We return now
to the negotiations over border
security spending and another

looming federal
government shutdown.

For that, I spoke just a short
time ago to Republican Senator
John Thune of South Dakota.

He is the Senate majority
whip, his party's second
highest ranking position.

Senator Thune, thank you
very much for joining us.

So, first of all, how confident
are you that President Trump
is going to seen on to this

agreement?

SEN.

JOHN THUNE (R), South Dakota:
Well, Good evening, Judy.

Pretty confident, but,you know,
of course, until we actually
have the final text, and

the president comes out and
says something definitively,
I think we're just going to

wait and let him make that
announcement himself, but
the indications are positive.

I think that he probably
realizes this is the
best deal he could get
under the circumstances.

And the negotiations
have concluded.

We have got to avoid another
government shutdown, which would
happen at midnight Friday, if

this deal isn't agreed to.

So I'm hopeful that
the president will come
around and at some point
announce his intention

to get behind this, but,
like everybody else, he
wants to see the details.

JUDY WOODRUFF: Well, as we all
know, the president didn't get
as much money as he wanted for

a physical barrier, a wall.

And he's saying he's going
to find that money elsewhere.

How much other money
is available to
him, and from where?

SEN.

JOHN THUNE: I think that what
they're talking about doing
-- and, of course, this would

be not in the context of
an emergency declaration,
which would be a different,
entirely, conversation,

but I think in terms of
unobligated balances,
reprogramming that could
occur, that the administration

could find, the dollars that
they could move around a little
bit, I'm not sure exactly

what that number is.

We have heard estimates, but
I think it would significantly
increase the amount that he

could put toward
border security.

How much would go toward a wall,
I don't know, but I think the
hard number that we know about

is the one that's in there.

And that's the 1.4 or thereabout
billion dollars that he can
use for the physical structure

that would be along the border.

But there's more to it,
obviously, than that.

And I know that he's interested
in getting as much funding
as he can to build as much

of that structure as possible.

JUDY WOODRUFF: Well, we have
been hearing perhaps as much
as a couple of billion dollars

the president would be
trying to find elsewhere.

Do you have any idea where
the money could come from?

SEN.

JOHN THUNE: Well, there are
several accounts that have
been mentioned, and -- but, you

know, I don't know exactly
where they're talking
about going to get it.

There, of course, has been some
talk about Defense Department
dollars and perhaps being

able to reprogram some of those.

I think, in the end, to get
significant amounts of money, he
would probably use the emergency

declaration.

I don't know exactly what he's
going to do at this point.

And I think it's
probably anybody's guess.

But I know that his
administration is looking
carefully at these
various accounts to try

to determine if there are
additional dollars that could be
added to the amount that's going

to be appropriated by Congress.

How much that is and where
exactly it comes from, I hate
to at this point speculate about

that.

JUDY WOODRUFF: Is that
something congressional
Republicans would support?

SEN.

JOHN THUNE: It depends a lot on
where it comes from, and, again,
and which authority he would

use.

A lot of our colleagues
are very sympathetic
to what the president's
trying to accomplish.

They want to ensure that he has
dollars to allocate to border
security and to deal with

the crisis there.

But, at the same time, you
know, what authority gets used,
where the dollars might be moved

around from will have a lot
to do with, I think, the kind
of support that he might enjoy

among Republicans in the Senate.

JUDY WOODRUFF: Separate
question, Senator.

Do you see this agreement
as expanding ICE
detention, Immigration
and Customs Enforcement,

and, if so, by how much?

SEN.

JOHN THUNE: I think -- and, of
course, there have been a lot
of discussion about the numbers,

and both sides have talked
about a slightly different
number, but I think it's all in

the ballpark of the 40,000 to
50,000 bed range, which would
be comparable to what we have

today, with some
flexibility to go up maybe
a little bit beyond that.

I have seen numbers in
the range of 58,000 or so.

I think the flexibility is
important, but I think in terms
of the overall amount that

would be allocated toward
detention of illegals
who are here and criminal
aliens in some cases,

it is comparable to what
we're looking at today.

JUDY WOODRUFF: How
much of a priority is
that for you, Senator?

SEN.

JOHN THUNE: Well, I think it's
important that we not cap it.

I was very concerned about
the proposal the Democrats put
forward that would have, in

law, capped that amount.

I think previous administrations
have had the flexibility,
based upon what the need

is, to be able to move
some money around and
make sure that there's
enough, you know, detention

beds for that population.

And I think it's an issue that's
a part of this discussion.

I think, for a lot of
our members, the physical
structure, the barrier,
is probably the number

one priority, but this
obviously is a close second in
the minds of a lot of people.

JUDY WOODRUFF: And, Senator,
still another subject, and
that is Democrats are saying

they would like to find money
to give back pay to federal
contract employees who were

affected by the
government shutdown.

They are pushing for this.

Where do Republicans,
where do you stand on that?

SEN.

JOHN THUNE: Well, I -- what I
have maintained throughout this
entire process is, when you

have a government shutdown,
nobody wins, and there are a
lot of people who are harmed by

that.

And you want to make sure
that you do everything you
can to make them whole.

And I guess I would include
contractors in that group.

The question, I guess,
is how best to do that.

People who enter into
contracts with the
government aren't always
working, and would they have

been working?

What's the duration of
some of those contracts?

There are a lot of questions
that I think have to be
answered to figure out how you

would reimburse or make
whole government contractors.

There is a reason
they're contractors.

They're not as
federal employees.

They're not full-time
federal workers.

They are working on
contract, and sometimes those
contracts go in spurts.

There may be times when they're
heavily engaged in some activity
on behalf of the federal

government, but at
other times they're not.

So I think making those
determinations makes
this a little bit more
this a little bit more

complicated, but I think there
is an interest certainly among
a lot of members on both sides

of the aisle in seeing that
people who are - - depend upon
the federal government and

were harmed by the shutdown,
that they be taken care of.

JUDY WOODRUFF: So,
Republicans would be open
to the idea, you think?

SEN.

JOHN THUNE: Well, I think
there are -- yes, I think there
are Republicans who are open

to that idea, yes.

JUDY WOODRUFF: And,
finally, when do you
think this could pass the
Congress, if -- assuming

it keeps moving as it is?

SEN.

JOHN THUNE: If we get the
paperwork filed by late this
afternoon or early evening, it

would set up, I think,
potentially votes
tomorrow in the Senate.

We could move first.

The House could move first.

I don't think that's
been determined yet.

But if the Senate did move
first, you know, we have
to have consent to do that.

And if we have consent, we
could move fairly quickly and
send it to the House, and they

could process it
sometime tomorrow.

But that assumes, again, that
the paperwork gets wrapped up,
and that they get the details,

the actual legislative text,
made available to members for
them to have an opportunity

to review.

And, hopefully, that
will happen soon.

JUDY WOODRUFF: And then we wait
to see what the president does.

SEN.

JOHN THUNE: And then
we will wait and see.

JUDY WOODRUFF: All right,
Senator John Thune,
thank you very much.

SEN.

JOHN THUNE: Thanks, Judy.