1 00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:04,433 JUDY WOODRUFF: This summer will mark the 50th anniversary of Neil Armstrong's first setting 2 00:00:04,433 --> 00:00:07,466 foot on the moon, a moment for the ages. 3 00:00:07,466 --> 00:00:12,233 But ever since the space shuttles were retired, there's been a renewed debate over what NASA's 4 00:00:12,233 --> 00:00:13,633 mission should be. 5 00:00:13,633 --> 00:00:16,733 As it turns out, what's old is new again. 6 00:00:16,733 --> 00:00:20,333 There's a big push to return to the moon. 7 00:00:20,333 --> 00:00:24,666 Miles O'Brien looks at those questions and the man who tasked -- is tasked with overseeing 8 00:00:24,666 --> 00:00:29,666 it for our weekly segment about the Leading Edge of science, technology and health. 9 00:00:31,566 --> 00:00:35,100 MILES O'BRIEN: One year into his tenure as NASA administrator, Jim Bridenstine is a man 10 00:00:36,866 --> 00:00:39,366 on a new mission for the space agency. 11 00:00:39,366 --> 00:00:43,033 MAN: Please join me in welcoming Jim Bridenstine. 12 00:00:43,033 --> 00:00:45,133 (APPLAUSE) 13 00:00:45,133 --> 00:00:49,000 MILES O'BRIEN: It made him a star at the 35th Space Symposium in Colorado Springs, the annual 14 00:00:50,766 --> 00:00:53,266 convening of the cosmic cognoscenti. 15 00:00:53,266 --> 00:00:56,566 JIM BRIDENSTINE, NASA Administrator: So many in this room are familiar that we have been 16 00:00:56,566 --> 00:01:01,533 given now a new charge, that we are going to place humans on the surface of the moon 17 00:01:03,866 --> 00:01:05,900 in five years. 18 00:01:05,900 --> 00:01:09,866 For a number of years at NASA, they weren't really allowed to talk about going to the 19 00:01:09,866 --> 00:01:11,333 moon. 20 00:01:11,333 --> 00:01:13,433 And now they not only can talk about going to the moon. 21 00:01:13,433 --> 00:01:17,033 The idea that we're going to be there in five years has everybody extremely excited. 22 00:01:17,033 --> 00:01:22,033 MILES O'BRIEN: U.S. astronauts on the moon by 2024, Vice President Mike Pence dropped 23 00:01:23,866 --> 00:01:26,000 that gauntlet at the end of March. 24 00:01:26,000 --> 00:01:28,500 MIKE PENCE, Vice President of the United States: Now, make no mistake about it. 25 00:01:28,500 --> 00:01:33,500 We're in a space race today, just as we were in the 1960s, and the stakes are even higher. 26 00:01:35,833 --> 00:01:38,533 MILES O'BRIEN: A space race with whom? 27 00:01:38,533 --> 00:01:43,533 A private mission designed by Elon Musk and SpaceX or also China, which landed on the 28 00:01:45,433 --> 00:01:49,833 far side of the moon in January, and vows to build a permanent encampment there in a 29 00:01:50,333 --> 00:01:52,033 decade. 30 00:01:52,033 --> 00:01:55,633 It's a time frame that invokes another race, another era. 31 00:01:55,633 --> 00:01:59,566 JOHN F. KENNEDY, President of the United States: We choose to go to the moon in this decade 32 00:01:59,566 --> 00:02:04,533 and do the other things, not because they are easy, because they are hard. 33 00:02:04,533 --> 00:02:09,533 MILES O'BRIEN: NASA delivered on President Kennedy's audacious challenge 50 years ago 34 00:02:10,266 --> 00:02:12,300 this July. 35 00:02:12,300 --> 00:02:16,833 That moon race was fueled by rivalry with the Soviets, the desire to honor the wishes 36 00:02:16,833 --> 00:02:20,933 of a martyred leader, and a blank check from taxpayers. 37 00:02:20,933 --> 00:02:24,100 A lot of things just lined up perfectly to make that happen. 38 00:02:24,100 --> 00:02:25,633 JIM BRIDENSTINE: That's right. 39 00:02:25,633 --> 00:02:26,866 MILES O'BRIEN: Do you see the similar ingredients right now? 40 00:02:26,866 --> 00:02:28,600 JIM BRIDENSTINE: So, it's a different era. 41 00:02:28,600 --> 00:02:31,166 That kind of competition doesn't exist right now. 42 00:02:31,166 --> 00:02:36,166 But what does exist now that's unique that didn't happen back then is all of the partnerships 43 00:02:37,033 --> 00:02:39,533 with international players. 44 00:02:39,533 --> 00:02:42,966 MILES O'BRIEN: During the symposium, the former Navy fighter pilot, who wasn't even alive 45 00:02:44,333 --> 00:02:47,533 during Apollo, met with those international partners. 46 00:02:47,533 --> 00:02:49,433 He had some convincing to do. 47 00:02:49,433 --> 00:02:52,700 U.S. space policy has shifted with the political wind. 48 00:02:52,700 --> 00:02:57,666 In 2004, President George W. Bush retired the shuttle program and set his sights on 49 00:03:00,233 --> 00:03:03,933 the moon, a program called Constellation. 50 00:03:03,933 --> 00:03:08,933 But when Barack Obama became president, he made it clear the moon didn't interest him. 51 00:03:10,933 --> 00:03:14,666 So, in 2010, he canceled Constellation after an independent committee determined the NASA 52 00:03:16,133 --> 00:03:19,500 budget fell far short of the ambition. 53 00:03:19,500 --> 00:03:24,500 The agency was left with a vague underfunded notion to go to Mars. 54 00:03:26,533 --> 00:03:29,900 But in December of 2017, President Trump signed Space Policy Directive 1, which put NASA back 55 00:03:32,133 --> 00:03:34,733 on course to the moon. 56 00:03:34,733 --> 00:03:39,733 NASA policy has been as dizzying as the stomach-churning gimbal rig test endured by the first astronauts. 57 00:03:42,800 --> 00:03:47,533 When you talk to your counterparts, as you did earlier today, and you tell them, we're 58 00:03:47,533 --> 00:03:50,866 going to be there in five years, we need your help, are they kind of hanging on to their 59 00:03:50,866 --> 00:03:51,866 wallet a little bit? 60 00:03:51,866 --> 00:03:54,500 Are they a little skeptical? 61 00:03:54,500 --> 00:03:57,466 JIM BRIDENSTINE: We are anxiously anticipating the resources that come from these other countries. 62 00:03:57,466 --> 00:04:01,500 But you're right, not every country will participate at the same level, and we're OK with that. 63 00:04:01,500 --> 00:04:06,500 MILES O'BRIEN: All the big spacefaring nations were here, except China, conspicuous in its 64 00:04:07,900 --> 00:04:09,900 absence. 65 00:04:09,900 --> 00:04:13,233 What are your thoughts on whether China should somehow be brought into this partnership? 66 00:04:13,233 --> 00:04:17,266 JIM BRIDENSTINE: So, that goes above the pay grade of the NASA administrator. 67 00:04:17,266 --> 00:04:21,533 What I will tell you is that we follow the law, and the law says that NASA is not going 68 00:04:21,533 --> 00:04:24,866 to do any bilateral kind of cooperation with China. 69 00:04:24,866 --> 00:04:29,033 MILES O'BRIEN: So what will this international sprint look like? 70 00:04:29,033 --> 00:04:31,100 To be determined, quickly. 71 00:04:31,100 --> 00:04:35,600 MIKE PENCE: The president has directed NASA and Administrator Jim Bridenstine to accomplish 72 00:04:36,766 --> 00:04:40,033 this goal by any means necessary. 73 00:04:40,033 --> 00:04:45,033 You must consider every available option and platform to meet our goals, including industry, 74 00:04:46,500 --> 00:04:48,533 government, and the entire American space enterprise. 75 00:04:48,533 --> 00:04:53,333 MILES O'BRIEN: Pence gave that address at NASA's Marshall Space Flight Center in Huntsville 76 00:04:55,200 --> 00:04:58,633 Alabama, where they designed the Saturn V rocket that carried Apollo astronauts to the 77 00:04:59,100 --> 00:05:01,300 moon. 78 00:05:01,300 --> 00:05:05,400 The even bigger rocket they and Boeing are building now, the Space Launch System, or 79 00:05:06,133 --> 00:05:07,766 SLS, is troubled. 80 00:05:07,766 --> 00:05:10,033 JIM BRIDENSTINE: It's behind schedule. 81 00:05:10,033 --> 00:05:11,633 Yes, it's over cost. 82 00:05:11,633 --> 00:05:13,533 Yes, it's been a challenge. 83 00:05:13,533 --> 00:05:18,466 Every rocket program in history has had those challenges, but we're almost there. 84 00:05:20,466 --> 00:05:22,433 And the problems that it has had historically - - it's been under development now for 10 85 00:05:22,433 --> 00:05:24,500 years -- we're getting those problems fixed. 86 00:05:24,500 --> 00:05:29,466 MILES O'BRIEN: Elon Musk's SpaceX is in early development of a huge rocket for missions 87 00:05:31,566 --> 00:05:35,400 to the moon and Mars, but it is unlikely a commercial alternative to SLS would be ready 88 00:05:36,733 --> 00:05:38,800 in time. 89 00:05:38,800 --> 00:05:43,800 Besides, politics dictates this rocket be at the center of this program. 90 00:05:45,333 --> 00:05:50,000 The powerful delegation from Alabama will have it no other way. 91 00:05:52,266 --> 00:05:55,233 When he came to NASA, Bridenstine was in his third term as a Republican congressman from 92 00:05:55,833 --> 00:05:57,366 Oklahoma. 93 00:05:57,366 --> 00:06:00,800 He understands technology through a political prism. 94 00:06:00,800 --> 00:06:02,433 JIM BRIDENSTINE: There's two kinds of risk. 95 00:06:02,433 --> 00:06:06,000 There's the technical risk and then there's the political risk. 96 00:06:06,000 --> 00:06:08,600 As a member of Congress, I can tell you, I have seen it. 97 00:06:08,600 --> 00:06:12,500 The technical risk is irrelevant if the politics aren't right. 98 00:06:12,500 --> 00:06:17,300 MILES O'BRIEN: Bridenstine has already gotten a taste of the skepticism he is facing among 99 00:06:17,300 --> 00:06:18,500 his former colleagues. 100 00:06:18,500 --> 00:06:20,600 REP. 101 00:06:20,600 --> 00:06:23,133 EDDIE BERNICE JOHNSON (D-TX): The simple truth is, is that we are not in a space race to 102 00:06:23,133 --> 00:06:24,933 get to the moon. 103 00:06:24,933 --> 00:06:27,200 We won that race a half-century ago. 104 00:06:27,200 --> 00:06:31,566 MILES O'BRIEN: Democrat Eddie Bernice Johnson chairs the House Science Committee. 105 00:06:31,566 --> 00:06:33,566 REP. 106 00:06:33,566 --> 00:06:37,366 EDDIE BERNICE JOHNSON: Rhetoric that is not backed by a concrete plan and believable cost 107 00:06:37,366 --> 00:06:41,200 estimates is just hot air. 108 00:06:41,200 --> 00:06:46,200 And hot air might be helpful in ballooning, but it won't get us to the moon or Mars. 109 00:06:48,266 --> 00:06:52,133 MILES O'BRIEN: Even if SLS works, NASA needs a lot more hardware, like the Orion crew capsule 110 00:06:54,933 --> 00:06:59,933 built by Lockheed Martin and its service module built by the European Space Agency. 111 00:07:01,966 --> 00:07:06,233 But the agency also aims to build a small outpost orbiting the moon called the Lunar 112 00:07:06,233 --> 00:07:07,533 Orbital Platform-Gateway. 113 00:07:07,533 --> 00:07:11,833 And, of course, it needs a lander. 114 00:07:11,833 --> 00:07:16,833 Bridenstine is hoping for help from international partners or maybe commercial players. 115 00:07:18,233 --> 00:07:20,833 Why five years? 116 00:07:20,833 --> 00:07:24,033 A lot of people look at it and say, this synchs up with the political calendar perhaps a little 117 00:07:24,033 --> 00:07:25,233 bit suspiciously. 118 00:07:25,233 --> 00:07:26,766 Is there a political motivation to all this? 119 00:07:26,766 --> 00:07:28,400 JIM BRIDENSTINE: I don't think so at all. 120 00:07:28,400 --> 00:07:30,400 If there is, nobody has talked to me about it. 121 00:07:30,400 --> 00:07:32,366 So, I will tell you what I think it is. 122 00:07:32,366 --> 00:07:37,266 The idea that these long timelines allow the agency to be cast to and fro by political 123 00:07:38,400 --> 00:07:40,533 whims, that's what we're trying to avoid. 124 00:07:40,533 --> 00:07:45,533 MILES O'BRIEN: The plan is more than a sprint, followed by flags, footprints and photos. 125 00:07:47,966 --> 00:07:51,300 NASA hopes it will be the beginning of a permanent outpost near the lunar south pole, a base 126 00:07:52,700 --> 00:07:56,533 for science and a proving ground for a mission to Mars. 127 00:07:56,533 --> 00:07:59,933 The concern has always been that, on paper, that's a great idea. 128 00:07:59,933 --> 00:08:01,666 It's a springboard to Mars. 129 00:08:01,666 --> 00:08:03,766 It also could be a cul-de-sac or a dead end. 130 00:08:03,766 --> 00:08:05,266 JIM BRIDENSTINE: Right. 131 00:08:05,266 --> 00:08:06,200 MILES O'BRIEN: Because there's only so much money and interest. 132 00:08:06,200 --> 00:08:07,433 JIM BRIDENSTINE: That's right. 133 00:08:07,433 --> 00:08:08,233 MILES O'BRIEN: And it could lose momentum. 134 00:08:08,233 --> 00:08:08,966 JIM BRIDENSTINE: Yes. 135 00:08:08,966 --> 00:08:10,933 So you're right. 136 00:08:10,933 --> 00:08:14,633 If we get bogged down on the moon and we put all of our resources there, then we're not 137 00:08:14,633 --> 00:08:15,966 going to get to Mars. 138 00:08:15,966 --> 00:08:17,900 So we don't want that to happen. 139 00:08:17,900 --> 00:08:22,200 MILES O'BRIEN: Speed, sustainability and safety all at once will not be cheap. 140 00:08:24,233 --> 00:08:28,166 There is an expression in the space world made popular in the 1983 movie "The Right 141 00:08:28,633 --> 00:08:29,566 Stuff": 142 00:08:29,566 --> 00:08:31,633 ACTOR: No bucks, no Buck Rogers. 143 00:08:31,633 --> 00:08:36,133 MILES O'BRIEN: And in those glory days, NASA had a whole lot of bucks, more than twice 144 00:08:40,100 --> 00:08:42,733 the budget it gets now. 145 00:08:42,733 --> 00:08:47,733 So the administration is poised to ask Congress to up the ante on space. 146 00:08:47,733 --> 00:08:51,100 It will require bipartisan support. 147 00:08:51,100 --> 00:08:56,100 Sure, NASA can send a man to the moon, but politics is not as easy as rocket science. 148 00:08:58,733 --> 00:09:03,400 For the "PBS NewsHour," I'm Miles O'Brien in Colorado Springs.