1 00:00:04,779 --> 00:00:06,069 JUDY WOODRUFF: Good evening. I'm Judy Woodruff. 2 00:00:06,069 --> 00:00:11,069 On the "NewsHour" tonight: stalemate. President Biden's agenda stalls in Congress amid disagreements 3 00:00:12,769 --> 00:00:17,769 among Democrats over his $3.5 trillion spending plan. 4 00:00:18,119 --> 00:00:23,119 Then: the end of an era. Angela Merkel's 16 years as chancellor draws to a close, with 5 00:00:25,259 --> 00:00:28,759 German voters uncertain about the country's future. 6 00:00:28,759 --> 00:00:33,759 MAN: Angela Merkel was -- I think she did a good job overall, but we need to do something 7 00:00:33,879 --> 00:00:34,879 different. 8 00:00:34,879 --> 00:00:35,879 JUDY WOODRUFF: And it's Friday. 9 00:00:35,879 --> 00:00:37,890 JIM LEHRER, Co-Founder and Former Anchor, "PBS NewsHour": The official debut of Shields 10 00:00:37,890 --> 00:00:38,890 and Brooks. 11 00:00:38,890 --> 00:00:43,710 JUDY WOODRUFF: We celebrate David Brooks' 20 years on the program, as he and Jonathan 12 00:00:43,710 --> 00:00:48,710 Capehart consider the divide among Democrats and the looming debt ceiling deadline. 13 00:00:49,839 --> 00:00:53,023 All that and more on tonight's "PBS NewsHour." 14 00:00:53,023 --> 00:00:58,023 (BREAK) 15 00:02:39,002 --> 00:02:44,002 JUDY WOODRUFF: Major pieces of President Biden's ambitious domestic agenda are at risk tonight, 16 00:02:44,700 --> 00:02:48,340 amid infighting among members of his own Democratic Party. 17 00:02:48,340 --> 00:02:53,340 Hanging in the balance, the bipartisan infrastructure bill and his $3.5 trillion spending package 18 00:02:55,640 --> 00:03:00,640 to address health care, child care, the environment, and more. The president spoke about the status 19 00:03:01,019 --> 00:03:03,000 of negotiations earlier today. 20 00:03:03,000 --> 00:03:06,769 JOE BIDEN, President of the United States: We're at this stalemate at the moment. And 21 00:03:06,769 --> 00:03:11,769 we're going to have to get these two pieces of legislation passed. Both need to be passed. 22 00:03:12,760 --> 00:03:15,920 JUDY WOODRUFF: And Amna Nawaz joins me now. 23 00:03:15,920 --> 00:03:19,470 So, Amna, what -- tell us more about the stalemate the president is referring to. 24 00:03:19,470 --> 00:03:22,659 AMNA NAWAZ: Judy, it's a big acknowledge, but he's sort of been building his language 25 00:03:22,659 --> 00:03:23,659 towards this. 26 00:03:23,659 --> 00:03:27,120 And it is very descriptive and indicative of where they are right now. You're talking 27 00:03:27,120 --> 00:03:32,120 about two major bills, both central to the president's economic agenda, that $1 trillion 28 00:03:32,519 --> 00:03:37,130 bipartisan infrastructure bill, the larger $3.5 trillion reconciliation bill. They are 29 00:03:37,130 --> 00:03:40,000 locked up in an intra-Democratic Party battle right now. 30 00:03:40,000 --> 00:03:44,079 So, we know, of course, centrists want that bipartisan bill to move forward through, first 31 00:03:44,079 --> 00:03:47,520 alone. It's already passed the Senate. They have some sticker shock when it comes to the 32 00:03:47,520 --> 00:03:51,849 reconciliation bill. And progressives want both tracked, moving through together. They 33 00:03:51,849 --> 00:03:55,550 have even threatened to tank the infrastructure bill if they don't move through together. 34 00:03:55,550 --> 00:03:59,170 So, look, President Biden, we know this week has been working to unite both sides, figure 35 00:03:59,170 --> 00:04:03,230 out where the common ground is. His language today is very reflective of where they are 36 00:04:03,230 --> 00:04:07,360 right now. He ended with that little bit of hope and optimism. They both need to be passed. 37 00:04:07,360 --> 00:04:09,470 It's not clear where the common ground is moving forward. 38 00:04:09,470 --> 00:04:12,270 JUDY WOODRUFF: So, given all that, where does it go from here? 39 00:04:12,270 --> 00:04:15,390 AMNA NAWAZ: So here's where we are today. You have got the leader of the House Congressional 40 00:04:15,390 --> 00:04:19,940 - - the Congressional Progressive Caucus, Pramila Jayapal, basically doubling down and saying, 41 00:04:19,940 --> 00:04:23,520 we are not going to leave behind the things that we fought so hard for, child care and 42 00:04:23,520 --> 00:04:26,370 education and climate and so on, the human infrastructure bill. 43 00:04:26,370 --> 00:04:31,100 And she had some tough words for those moderate centrists, for Joe Manchin and Kyrsten Sinema, 44 00:04:31,100 --> 00:04:34,830 saying, you drafted the infrastructure bill without input from us. We have drafted the 45 00:04:34,830 --> 00:04:37,389 reconciliation bill. You now need to come along. 46 00:04:37,389 --> 00:04:40,741 Now, Senator Manchin has said this week that President Biden asked him for a number. He 47 00:04:40,741 --> 00:04:44,370 said, tell me what you would support. What would it take to get your support on this 48 00:04:44,370 --> 00:04:48,100 bill? Please just continue to work on this. That's where we could see some agreement, 49 00:04:48,100 --> 00:04:50,669 if they can come to some kind of compromise on the number. 50 00:04:50,669 --> 00:04:53,750 But the House, meanwhile, it's going to continue to work through the weekend. Speaker Pelosi's 51 00:04:53,750 --> 00:04:58,530 office today told us the Budget Committee is going to continue to mark up that reconciliation 52 00:04:58,530 --> 00:05:02,840 bill tomorrow. It then goes to the Rules Committee. A source in her office says they are very 53 00:05:02,840 --> 00:05:03,930 much moving forward. 54 00:05:03,930 --> 00:05:08,000 But in her latest letter to her Democratic colleagues, she did have some careful language. 55 00:05:08,000 --> 00:05:12,910 She said: "As negotiations continue, there may be changes," so maybe bracing some members 56 00:05:12,910 --> 00:05:16,430 of her caucus that some of the details or the contours of the bill could change. 57 00:05:16,430 --> 00:05:20,750 It does end with a plan, though. Speaker Pelosi announced she does plan to move forward next 58 00:05:20,750 --> 00:05:25,750 week with two bills, both infrastructure and reconciliation. And we should say she pledged 59 00:05:26,050 --> 00:05:28,860 to bring the infrastructure bill to a vote on Monday, when, by the way, Judy, the Senate 60 00:05:28,860 --> 00:05:32,990 is also likely voting on continuing government funding and raising the debt ceiling. 61 00:05:32,990 --> 00:05:34,990 So, just all of the things happening on Monday. 62 00:05:34,990 --> 00:05:39,280 JUDY WOODRUFF: All of it's happening all at one time. And we will see what happens. It 63 00:05:39,280 --> 00:05:40,440 is going to be a full weekend. 64 00:05:40,440 --> 00:05:41,520 AMNA NAWAZ: We will see. 65 00:05:41,520 --> 00:05:44,410 JUDY WOODRUFF: Amna Nawaz, thanks very much. 66 00:05:44,410 --> 00:05:49,410 AMNA NAWAZ: Thanks, Judy. 67 00:05:51,400 --> 00:05:56,400 JUDY WOODRUFF: In the day's other news: Millions of Americans who got Pfizer's COVID-19 vaccine 68 00:05:59,389 --> 00:06:04,389 are now eligible to receive a booster shot. That's after the CDC's director, Dr. Rochelle 69 00:06:05,300 --> 00:06:10,300 Walensky, signed off on her agency's advisory panel recommendations for extra doses for 70 00:06:11,340 --> 00:06:14,070 older and high-risk Americans. 71 00:06:14,070 --> 00:06:19,070 She also overruled her advisers to expand eligibility to include front-line workers, 72 00:06:19,860 --> 00:06:23,560 to side with the FDA's recommendation. 73 00:06:23,560 --> 00:06:28,199 President Biden praised the decision and pleaded with Americans who have yet to receive their 74 00:06:28,199 --> 00:06:29,199 first dose. 75 00:06:29,199 --> 00:06:33,850 JOE BIDEN, President of the United States: Listen to the voices of the unvaccinated Americans 76 00:06:33,850 --> 00:06:37,560 who are lying in hospital beds, taking their final breaths, saying -- and, literally, we 77 00:06:37,560 --> 00:06:42,560 have seen this on television -- "If only I had gotten vaccinated." 78 00:06:42,590 --> 00:06:47,590 Please don't let this become your tragedy. Get vaccinated. It can save your live -- your 79 00:06:49,169 --> 00:06:51,720 life. It can save the lives of those around you. 80 00:06:51,720 --> 00:06:56,720 JUDY WOODRUFF: Vice President Harris had her own COVID scare today, just moments before 81 00:06:56,729 --> 00:07:01,729 an interview with ABC's "The View." Two of the show's hosts, Sunny Hostin and Ana Navarro, 82 00:07:03,449 --> 00:07:08,449 tested positive for COVID. They were pulled from the set in front of a live audience. 83 00:07:08,570 --> 00:07:13,110 The vice president, who was later interviewed remotely from another room, did not have any 84 00:07:13,110 --> 00:07:15,240 contact with them. 85 00:07:15,240 --> 00:07:20,240 A migrant encampment in Del Rio, Texas, where thousands of Haitian migrants had converged 86 00:07:20,530 --> 00:07:22,980 this week has now been cleared. 87 00:07:22,980 --> 00:07:27,980 Homeland Security Secretary Alejandro Mayorkas said some 12, 400 were allowed into the U.S. 88 00:07:30,360 --> 00:07:35,360 to seek asylum. He also expressed outrage over scenes of Border Patrol agents whipping 89 00:07:36,330 --> 00:07:37,360 at migrants. 90 00:07:37,360 --> 00:07:41,230 ALEJANDRO MAYORKAS, U.S. Secretary of Homeland Security: The images horrified us in terms 91 00:07:41,230 --> 00:07:46,230 of what they suggest and what they conjure up, in terms of not only our nation's history, 92 00:07:47,160 --> 00:07:52,160 but, unfortunately, the fact that that page of history has not been turned entirely. And 93 00:07:52,620 --> 00:07:56,880 that means that there is much work to do, and we are very focused on doing it. 94 00:07:56,880 --> 00:08:01,880 JUDY WOODRUFF: Mayorkas said about 2,000 migrants have been flown back to Haiti since Sunday, 95 00:08:02,540 --> 00:08:05,990 and more could be expelled in the coming days. 96 00:08:05,990 --> 00:08:10,990 The U.N. now says the death toll from the Syrian civil war is far higher than it previously 97 00:08:11,960 --> 00:08:16,960 believed. Its human rights office has documented more than 350,000 civilian and combatant deaths 98 00:08:19,600 --> 00:08:22,430 during the decade-long conflict. 99 00:08:22,430 --> 00:08:25,650 But it acknowledged the true toll is likely much greater. 100 00:08:25,650 --> 00:08:30,611 MICHELLE BACHELET, U.N. Human Rights Commissioner: It is not and should be not seen as a complete 101 00:08:30,611 --> 00:08:35,140 number of conflict-related killings in Syria during this period. 102 00:08:35,140 --> 00:08:40,140 It indicates a minimum verifiable number and is certainly an undercount of the actual number 103 00:08:41,410 --> 00:08:46,410 of killings. Tragically, there are also many other victims who left behind no witnesses 104 00:08:46,740 --> 00:08:49,250 or documentation as to their death. 105 00:08:49,250 --> 00:08:54,250 JUDY WOODRUFF: The U.N.'s death toll numbers are still far lower than the tally from the 106 00:08:54,660 --> 00:08:59,660 Syrian Observatory of Human Rights, which estimates more than 606,000 people have died. 107 00:09:02,050 --> 00:09:07,050 Ex-Minneapolis police officer Derek Chauvin plans to appeal his convictions and his 22.5-year 108 00:09:09,370 --> 00:09:14,370 sentence for the murder of George Floyd. In documents filed Thursday, he argued the judge 109 00:09:14,800 --> 00:09:19,800 abused his discretion and erred multiple times during the trial. Chauvin is representing 110 00:09:20,910 --> 00:09:25,910 himself in the appeals process after he was denied a public defender. 111 00:09:26,640 --> 00:09:31,460 President Biden will not invoke executive privilege to shield former President Trump's 112 00:09:31,460 --> 00:09:36,460 records from the House committee investigating the January 6 insurrection. White House Press 113 00:09:37,440 --> 00:09:42,410 Secretary Jen Psaki said that they will cooperate with Congress to help get to the bottom of 114 00:09:42,410 --> 00:09:44,590 what happened that day. 115 00:09:44,590 --> 00:09:49,590 The GOP audit of 2020 election results in Arizona's largest county has confirmed President 116 00:09:52,280 --> 00:09:57,280 Biden won the state. The findings released today further discredit former President Trump's 117 00:09:57,670 --> 00:09:59,860 claims of election fraud. 118 00:09:59,860 --> 00:10:04,860 Meanwhile, Texas is launching its own election audit in four counties, under pressure from 119 00:10:05,280 --> 00:10:06,280 Mr. Trump. 120 00:10:06,280 --> 00:10:09,950 We will return to Arizona's audit after the news summary. 121 00:10:09,950 --> 00:10:14,660 The U.S. House of Representatives approved a bill to protect a woman's right to an abortion. 122 00:10:14,660 --> 00:10:19,500 It was in response to a highly restrictive Texas law that went into effect earlier this 123 00:10:19,500 --> 00:10:23,690 month that has the effect of banning most abortions. 124 00:10:23,690 --> 00:10:26,280 House Speaker Nancy Pelosi celebrated today's vote. 125 00:10:26,280 --> 00:10:31,280 REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA): This is about women's right to choose, yes, but it's about freedom, 126 00:10:32,090 --> 00:10:37,090 freedom of that choice, and freedom from the vigilantes, the bounty hunters that the Texas 127 00:10:38,790 --> 00:10:42,710 government has -- legislature has set in motion. 128 00:10:42,710 --> 00:10:47,640 JUDY WOODRUFF: The bill's passage in the House is largely symbolic, since it's not likely 129 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:50,930 to get the support it needs to advance in the Senate. 130 00:10:50,930 --> 00:10:55,930 The Senate's oldest Republican, Chuck Grassley of Iowa, announced today that he will run 131 00:10:56,220 --> 00:11:01,220 for reelection next year. The 88-year-old has held his seat for four decades. His announcement 132 00:11:02,860 --> 00:11:07,430 gives Senate Republicans more hope that they will be able to hold onto his seat in next 133 00:11:07,430 --> 00:11:10,160 year's midterm elections. 134 00:11:10,160 --> 00:11:15,160 The chief financial officer of Huawei has reached a deal with the U.S. Justice Department 135 00:11:15,570 --> 00:11:20,570 to resolve criminal charges against her and allow her to return to China. Meng Wanzhou 136 00:11:21,810 --> 00:11:26,810 admitted to misleading a bank about the Chinese communications giant's business with Iran. 137 00:11:28,220 --> 00:11:33,220 She's been in Canada since her 2018 arrest on a U.S. warrant. 138 00:11:33,630 --> 00:11:38,310 And trading was light on Wall Street today, after a volatile week. The Dow Jones industrial 139 00:11:38,310 --> 00:11:43,310 average gained 33 points to close at 34798. The Nasdaq fell four points, and the S&P 500 140 00:11:47,370 --> 00:11:48,370 added six. 141 00:11:48,370 --> 00:11:53,370 Still to come on the "NewsHour": a controversial Republican-led election audit in Arizona confirms 142 00:11:54,860 --> 00:11:59,860 Biden won the state in 2020; German voters chart a new future, as the Angela Merkel era 143 00:12:01,920 --> 00:12:06,920 draws to a close; the jury begins deliberations in the trial of embattled singer R. Kelly; 144 00:12:19,150 --> 00:12:21,120 and much more. 145 00:12:21,120 --> 00:12:26,120 The widely discredited election review in Arizona 146 00:12:30,730 --> 00:12:32,240 is over. 147 00:12:32,240 --> 00:12:37,240 But more than 10 months after the 2020 election, there is growing alarm about other efforts 148 00:12:38,200 --> 00:12:43,200 launched with no credible justification to sow doubt about elections past, present and 149 00:12:44,570 --> 00:12:45,570 future. 150 00:12:45,570 --> 00:12:46,610 William Brangham explains. 151 00:12:46,610 --> 00:12:48,330 WILLIAM BRANGHAM: That's right, Judy. 152 00:12:48,330 --> 00:12:53,000 It was Republicans in the Arizona state Senate who commissioned this review of ballots in 153 00:12:53,000 --> 00:12:57,870 Maricopa County, even though election officials in the state said there was no large-scale 154 00:12:57,870 --> 00:13:00,520 fraud in the 2020 election. 155 00:13:00,520 --> 00:13:05,520 But a partisan group called Cyber Ninjas undertook a controversial review of the vote, and they 156 00:13:06,131 --> 00:13:10,790 affirmed that Joe Biden in fact won Maricopa County and Arizona. 157 00:13:10,790 --> 00:13:15,560 And here with us to look at the larger context is Nate Persily, a scholar of election law 158 00:13:15,560 --> 00:13:18,510 at Stanford University Law School. 159 00:13:18,510 --> 00:13:21,300 Nate, great to see you back on the "NewsHour." 160 00:13:21,300 --> 00:13:26,300 I hesitate to call this an actual audit, what this organization did in Arizona. But they 161 00:13:28,681 --> 00:13:32,891 affirmed what we already knew, that Joe Biden won Maricopa County and he won Arizona. But 162 00:13:32,891 --> 00:13:34,970 what do you make of this when you look at this process? 163 00:13:34,970 --> 00:13:39,150 NATE PERSILY, Stanford Law School: Well, you're right to hesitate in calling it an audit. 164 00:13:39,150 --> 00:13:43,480 Audits are good things. We know how to do election audits. Every state should audit 165 00:13:43,480 --> 00:13:48,480 its elections. But that is not what this was. This really was part of a coordinated disinformation 166 00:13:48,760 --> 00:13:53,100 campaign to try to undermine the legitimacy of the election. And we should not put too 167 00:13:53,100 --> 00:13:58,100 fine a point on it, that the whole goal here after the fact, many months after the fact, 168 00:13:59,200 --> 00:14:04,200 now almost a year after the election, was to cast doubt on the basic machinery of this 169 00:14:04,400 --> 00:14:05,400 election. 170 00:14:05,400 --> 00:14:10,400 And, as we have seen, even in the sort of public reception of this draft report, the 171 00:14:10,840 --> 00:14:15,840 fact that Cyber Ninjas did not find that it affected the outcome hasn't sort of decreased 172 00:14:17,090 --> 00:14:21,220 speculation or this lack of confidence that the whole audit process has generated. 173 00:14:21,220 --> 00:14:25,070 WILLIAM BRANGHAM: And for people who haven't been following this rather circuitous process 174 00:14:25,070 --> 00:14:28,411 they took, I mean, this was a very bizarre process, the way they went about this. These 175 00:14:28,411 --> 00:14:30,870 people had no experience in election law. 176 00:14:30,870 --> 00:14:35,650 They spent a period of time searching for bamboo fibers, allegedly looking for counterfeit 177 00:14:35,650 --> 00:14:40,650 Chinese ballots. I mean, the whole process seems -- bizarre is the official term, I think, 178 00:14:41,890 --> 00:14:42,890 for this. 179 00:14:42,890 --> 00:14:47,890 NATE PERSILY: Well, one of the problems is that we don't really know what the basic allegation 180 00:14:48,230 --> 00:14:50,600 was as to why there might have been fraud, whether in Arizona or elsewhere. 181 00:14:50,600 --> 00:14:55,600 Throughout the last 10, 12 months, what we have seen are allegations, again, of Chinese 182 00:14:58,560 --> 00:15:03,520 ballots, as you were saying, in Arizona, of Italian satellites as having manipulated voting 183 00:15:03,520 --> 00:15:08,520 machines, or of Dominion voting machines not being secure, of dead people voting and the 184 00:15:09,010 --> 00:15:10,010 like. 185 00:15:10,010 --> 00:15:15,010 There's this very heterogeneous set of complaints. And so what Cyber Ninjas was doing was going 186 00:15:15,760 --> 00:15:20,760 on a fishing expedition to find out if there was anything that implicated the outcome. 187 00:15:21,980 --> 00:15:24,570 Now, they didn't find that the results would have been different. In fact, they had -- from 188 00:15:24,570 --> 00:15:28,830 their results, they suggest that Joe Biden actually increased his vote totals through 189 00:15:28,830 --> 00:15:31,830 their audit than what was found on Election Day. 190 00:15:31,830 --> 00:15:36,830 But the fact that it may have sort of confirmed the result should not be any solace to those 191 00:15:37,110 --> 00:15:42,110 of us who worry about the lack of confidence that this type of process has engendered among 192 00:15:42,710 --> 00:15:43,710 the mass public. 193 00:15:43,710 --> 00:15:48,051 WILLIAM BRANGHAM: And, as you say, if this were just Arizona, that might be one thing. 194 00:15:48,051 --> 00:15:51,870 We might be able to put this behind us, but this is going on in multiple other states 195 00:15:51,870 --> 00:15:52,870 now. 196 00:15:52,870 --> 00:15:53,870 NATE PERSILY: That's right. 197 00:15:53,870 --> 00:15:58,870 This is now a playbook for other states. If you are a sort of disgruntled politician or 198 00:15:59,460 --> 00:16:04,460 one trying to make a name for yourself, then, whether it's in Pennsylvania or Wisconsin 199 00:16:04,750 --> 00:16:09,750 or some other states, Georgia, now that this is a pathway that they have chosen. 200 00:16:11,500 --> 00:16:15,460 Now, again, recounts and audits are part of our process. We want to encourage that in 201 00:16:15,460 --> 00:16:18,760 the month or so after an election, because we want to know that the election machinery 202 00:16:18,760 --> 00:16:23,760 is working as intended. But a year after an election, right, all this is trying to do 203 00:16:23,940 --> 00:16:26,160 is to undermine confidence in the result. 204 00:16:26,160 --> 00:16:29,980 WILLIAM BRANGHAM: And it sounds like, on some level, that perpetual argument that is made 205 00:16:29,980 --> 00:16:34,980 is having an effect, there was a Monmouth University poll out a month or two ago that 206 00:16:34,980 --> 00:16:39,980 showed that a third of Americans believe that President Biden was elected only because of 207 00:16:40,000 --> 00:16:43,430 fraud and that Donald Trump should have properly won the election. 208 00:16:43,430 --> 00:16:48,320 I mean, from an election administrator standpoint, if a third of the country thinks that you're 209 00:16:48,320 --> 00:16:53,320 engaged in a widespread fraud, what does that do to their ability to run elections safely 210 00:16:53,790 --> 00:16:54,790 and soundly? 211 00:16:54,790 --> 00:16:59,340 NATE PERSILY: Well, this is a very dangerous period, I think, for our democracy, that we 212 00:16:59,340 --> 00:17:04,340 have not seen this erosion of confidence in the basic infrastructure America, of the elections, 213 00:17:06,100 --> 00:17:08,120 in our history. 214 00:17:08,120 --> 00:17:12,830 We see lots of retirements among these veteran election officials. We see that many of them 215 00:17:12,830 --> 00:17:16,940 feel that they're taking their lives in their own hands because of death threats and the 216 00:17:16,940 --> 00:17:17,940 like. 217 00:17:17,940 --> 00:17:22,470 And so these are challenges we have not faced before, and they're a direct result of the 218 00:17:22,470 --> 00:17:27,180 concerted disinformation campaign that's trying to undermine the legitimacy the outcome. 219 00:17:27,180 --> 00:17:29,250 But these folks are heroes. 220 00:17:29,250 --> 00:17:32,760 WILLIAM BRANGHAM: Nate Persily of Stanford University Law School, thanks so much for 221 00:17:32,760 --> 00:17:34,870 being here. 222 00:17:34,870 --> 00:17:39,870 NATE PERSILY: Thank you. 223 00:17:41,600 --> 00:17:46,600 JUDY WOODRUFF: Germany is one of America's most important allies, and nearly every American 224 00:17:49,350 --> 00:17:54,350 president since George W. Bush has worked closely with German Chancellor Angela Merkel. 225 00:17:55,020 --> 00:18:00,020 But for the first time since 2005, she will not be a candidate when Germans head to the 226 00:18:00,390 --> 00:18:03,560 polls this Sunday to vote for her successor. 227 00:18:03,560 --> 00:18:08,560 Special correspondent Malcolm Brabant is in Berlin with a preview of the upcoming election. 228 00:18:09,010 --> 00:18:12,140 MALCOLM BRABANT: Judy, this is the end of an era. 229 00:18:12,140 --> 00:18:16,820 Angela Merkel is slipping away from the political stage with minimal fanfare, which is entirely 230 00:18:16,820 --> 00:18:21,820 consistent with her modest, understated style. She's leaving behind huge shoes to fill, and 231 00:18:22,420 --> 00:18:25,370 there's a very tight race to replace her as chancellor. 232 00:18:25,370 --> 00:18:30,370 For 16 years, Angela Merkel has led Germany and been Europe's most dominant politician. 233 00:18:30,990 --> 00:18:35,990 They call her Mutti, or Mom. Now, as Mutti is leaving the chancellery, Germany is out 234 00:18:36,640 --> 00:18:37,640 of its comfort zone. 235 00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:41,040 PETER NEUMANN, Christian Democratic Union: I think she will be remembered as a very important 236 00:18:41,040 --> 00:18:42,770 statesperson who kept Europe together. 237 00:18:42,770 --> 00:18:47,470 MALCOLM BRABANT: Peter Neumann is a senior adviser to Merkel's center-right Christian 238 00:18:47,470 --> 00:18:48,470 Democrat Party. 239 00:18:48,470 --> 00:18:53,470 PETER NEUMANN: History will remember her as a successful chancellor, as a popular chancellor, 240 00:18:54,280 --> 00:18:59,280 as a chancellor that brought Germans a great deal of prosperity 241 00:18:59,520 --> 00:19:04,520 MALCOLM BRABANT: President Biden saluted the shy research scientist who became the first 242 00:19:04,570 --> 00:19:08,590 East German to assume her nation's highest office since reunification. 243 00:19:08,590 --> 00:19:13,590 JOE BIDEN, President of the United States: On behalf of the United States, thank you, 244 00:19:13,770 --> 00:19:16,540 Angela, for your career of strong, principled leadership. 245 00:19:16,540 --> 00:19:21,540 And I want to thank you for your continued support for the longstanding goal of Europe 246 00:19:23,130 --> 00:19:26,500 whole, free and at peace. 247 00:19:26,500 --> 00:19:31,500 MALCOLM BRABANT: In 2010, Merkel saved the euro currency by coordinating a financial 248 00:19:31,780 --> 00:19:36,780 bailout for Greece when it went bust. There were fears that other weak European economies 249 00:19:37,130 --> 00:19:39,460 would collapse and the euro would tank. 250 00:19:39,460 --> 00:19:44,010 ANGELA MERKEL, German Chancellor (through translator): Europe fails when the euro fails. 251 00:19:44,010 --> 00:19:45,960 Europe wins when the euro wins. 252 00:19:45,960 --> 00:19:50,260 MALCOLM BRABANT: Merkel's most controversial unilateral act was to throw open Germany's 253 00:19:50,260 --> 00:19:55,260 borders to Syrian refugees in 2015. In all, Germany granted asylum to over a million in 254 00:19:57,230 --> 00:20:00,250 that first year of Europe's migration crisis. 255 00:20:00,250 --> 00:20:04,860 ANGELA MERKEL (through translator): And I have to say quite honestly, if we now start 256 00:20:04,860 --> 00:20:09,860 having to apologize even for showing a friendly face in emergency situations, then this is 257 00:20:10,270 --> 00:20:11,570 not my country. 258 00:20:11,570 --> 00:20:16,570 MALCOLM BRABANT: People across the developing world saw this as an invitation to enter Europe. 259 00:20:17,300 --> 00:20:22,300 Only Sweden emulated Germany. Partner nations resented being pressured. Hungary erected 260 00:20:23,160 --> 00:20:28,160 a border fence, wrecking the E.U.'s commitment to open internal frontiers. 261 00:20:28,750 --> 00:20:32,900 Six years on, the flow of asylum seekers into Europe is still strong. 262 00:20:32,900 --> 00:20:37,680 Sonya Sceats runs a London-based pro refugee nonprofit. She thinks Merkel was right. 263 00:20:37,680 --> 00:20:39,920 SONYA SCEATS, Chief Executive, Freedom From Torture: Germany and Sweden tried to start 264 00:20:39,920 --> 00:20:43,860 a grownup conversation with other European states, and other European states weren't 265 00:20:43,860 --> 00:20:46,090 willing to step up to the plate. 266 00:20:46,090 --> 00:20:50,780 MALCOLM BRABANT: The influx caused a backlash at home, and, as Peter Neumann explains, led 267 00:20:50,780 --> 00:20:53,330 to a resurgence of the far right in East Germany. 268 00:20:53,330 --> 00:20:58,330 PETER NEUMANN: Significant parts of the electorate didn't like it at all and especially the East, 269 00:20:58,880 --> 00:21:03,880 where she's coming from was very aggrieved about it and still holds it against her. I 270 00:21:04,711 --> 00:21:07,980 think that's the point where she lost the former East Germany. 271 00:21:07,980 --> 00:21:12,980 MALCOLM BRABANT: Since Merkel opened Germany's borders in 2015. European right-wingers like 272 00:21:13,350 --> 00:21:18,350 French presidential candidate Marine Le Pen have secured a stronger footing with their 273 00:21:18,780 --> 00:21:19,780 anti-immigration rhetoric. 274 00:21:19,780 --> 00:21:23,370 MARINE LE PEN, President, National Rally Party (through translator): All of the migrants 275 00:21:23,370 --> 00:21:28,300 who didn't stay in Germany went off amusing themselves in other European countries without 276 00:21:28,300 --> 00:21:33,300 asking for our permission. Those who didn't remain in Germany went to Sweden, Italy, France, 277 00:21:34,550 --> 00:21:38,650 weighing heavily on our finances, and creating conditions for conflict. 278 00:21:38,650 --> 00:21:43,650 MALCOLM BRABANT: Unlike last time, when immigration dominated, climate change is this election's 279 00:21:44,820 --> 00:21:49,550 hot issue. Polls suggest that Germany is steering to the left. 280 00:21:49,550 --> 00:21:54,550 Most Germans expect Social Democrat Olaf Scholz to replace Merkel. As finance minister in 281 00:21:55,310 --> 00:22:00,310 Merkel's coalition government, Scholz is a known quantity, if a little dull. His main 282 00:22:01,420 --> 00:22:06,420 rival, Armin Laschet, who replaced Merkel as head of the center-right Christian Democrats, 283 00:22:06,550 --> 00:22:08,720 is also charisma-challenged. 284 00:22:08,720 --> 00:22:13,720 But that's not a disadvantage in Germany. The main outsider, Annalena Baerbock of the 285 00:22:14,131 --> 00:22:19,131 environmentalist Greens, is predicted to be kingmaker in the next inevitable coalition. 286 00:22:19,670 --> 00:22:22,770 OLAF SCHOLZ, Social Democratic Party (through translator): Many citizens can see me as the 287 00:22:22,770 --> 00:22:27,770 next head of government, the next chancellor. And I make no secret that, above all, I would 288 00:22:27,910 --> 00:22:30,260 like to create a government in alliance with the Greens. 289 00:22:30,260 --> 00:22:34,000 MALCOLM BRABANT: Laschet is promising Merkel-like stability. 290 00:22:34,000 --> 00:22:36,520 ARMIN LASCHET, Christian Democratic Union (through translator): I stand for the cohesion 291 00:22:36,520 --> 00:22:41,520 of Europe in these difficult times, a climate-neutral industry and strong economy, and a clear course 292 00:22:42,370 --> 00:22:43,960 for national security. 293 00:22:43,960 --> 00:22:47,870 MALCOLM BRABANT: Baerbock wants to force the Christian Democrats into opposition. 294 00:22:47,870 --> 00:22:50,430 ANNALENA BAERBOCK, Leader, German Green Party (through translator): I stand for no longer 295 00:22:50,430 --> 00:22:55,430 using half-measures to protect the climate, a policy that finally brings children and 296 00:22:55,600 --> 00:23:00,600 families to its core and a human rights-led foreign policy in the heart of Europe. 297 00:23:00,860 --> 00:23:05,690 MALCOLM BRABANT: Devastating floods caused by unnaturally heavy summer rain pushed climate 298 00:23:05,690 --> 00:23:10,690 change onto the election agenda. The death toll is still unclear, but could be as high 299 00:23:11,510 --> 00:23:16,310 as 300. Restoration could cost $30 billion. 300 00:23:16,310 --> 00:23:20,880 Activist Jacob Heinze has gone without food for three weeks to highlight climate change. 301 00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:25,870 At the hunger striker'S camp, spokeswoman Helen Luebbert had harsh words for the greens. 302 00:23:25,870 --> 00:23:29,230 HELEN LUEBBERT, Climate Change Activist: They are not the solution. Even their program is 303 00:23:29,230 --> 00:23:32,940 not enough. And, therefore, I think it's important that they are part of the coalition, they 304 00:23:32,940 --> 00:23:36,900 do everything they can within the political spectrum, within the Parliament, and then 305 00:23:36,900 --> 00:23:40,250 we definitely need opposition from without the Parliament. 306 00:23:40,250 --> 00:23:45,250 MALCOLM BRABANT: Facing possible defeat, center-right parliamentary candidate Klaus-Dieter Grohler 307 00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:48,290 was trying to woo votes with bratwurst and beer. 308 00:23:48,290 --> 00:23:51,240 KLAUS-DIETER GROHLER, Christian Democratic Union (through translator): People are asking 309 00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:55,121 critical questions, but I'm not getting the sense that they are really interested in a 310 00:23:55,121 --> 00:23:56,121 change of government. 311 00:23:56,121 --> 00:24:01,070 MALCOLM BRABANT: That's not what the polls say. This voter won't be swayed by a sausage. 312 00:24:01,070 --> 00:24:05,390 MAN: Angela Merkel was -- I think she did a good job overall, but we need to do something 313 00:24:05,390 --> 00:24:06,390 different. 314 00:24:06,390 --> 00:24:10,470 MALCOLM BRABANT: As Election Day approaches, the party of Angela Merkel is hoping Germans 315 00:24:10,470 --> 00:24:15,470 will avoid change, and play safe, as they have done so often in the past. 316 00:24:15,550 --> 00:24:20,550 For the "PBS NewsHour," I'm Malcolm Brabant in Berlin. 317 00:24:21,670 --> 00:24:26,670 JUDY WOODRUFF: A jury began deliberations today in the of federal trial of singer R. 318 00:24:35,470 --> 00:24:40,470 Kelly. The R&B artist is accused of kidnapping, bribery, sex trafficking, and racketeering, 319 00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:43,620 among other charges. 320 00:24:43,620 --> 00:24:46,680 Amna Nawaz is back with our look at the case. 321 00:24:46,680 --> 00:24:51,680 And a warning for some viewers: This story deals with explicit references to sexual assault. 322 00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:57,520 AMNA NAWAZ: Judy, R. Kelly has faced allegations of sexual abuse for more than two decades 323 00:24:58,110 --> 00:25:00,110 and has settled multiple cases. 324 00:25:00,110 --> 00:25:04,020 But this is the first criminal trial he's faced since being acquitted of child pornography 325 00:25:04,020 --> 00:25:09,020 charges back in 2008. Over this trial, prosecutors brought 45 witnesses to prove racketeering 326 00:25:10,240 --> 00:25:15,240 charges. They argue that Kelly oversaw a criminal enterprise, with associates helping to lure 327 00:25:15,300 --> 00:25:20,300 underage girls, boys, and young women, whom he sexually assaulted and imprisoned. 328 00:25:20,440 --> 00:25:21,720 Kelly pled not guilty. 329 00:25:21,720 --> 00:25:25,540 Emily Palmer is covering this for The New York Times. And she joins me now. 330 00:25:25,540 --> 00:25:27,260 Emily, welcome to the "NewsHour." 331 00:25:27,260 --> 00:25:31,620 You have been listening to those witnesses as they're shared their testimony, horrifying 332 00:25:31,620 --> 00:25:35,160 details. Tell us a little bit about who we have heard from and what they have said. 333 00:25:35,160 --> 00:25:40,160 EMILY PALMER, The New York Times: This case is built on the stories of six women. Five 334 00:25:41,100 --> 00:25:42,600 of them testified. 335 00:25:42,600 --> 00:25:47,540 And the first woman to take the stand, the first woman to ever actually take the stand 336 00:25:47,540 --> 00:25:52,410 and testify against R. Kelly was a woman named Jerhonda Pace. She was nine months' pregnant 337 00:25:52,410 --> 00:25:54,910 at the time. And she took the stand. 338 00:25:54,910 --> 00:25:59,910 And, over the course of two days, she delineated what she says was a system of abuse that began 339 00:26:01,190 --> 00:26:05,040 upon her first meeting with R. Kelly when she was just 14 years old and attended his 340 00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:10,040 child pornography trial in Chicago. Two years later, she met up with the singer again, and 341 00:26:11,520 --> 00:26:14,440 he began having sex with her almost from the get-go. 342 00:26:14,440 --> 00:26:19,440 She outlined horrific details of sexual, as well as physical abuse. And from there, the 343 00:26:23,350 --> 00:26:28,350 trial just sort of pushed forward. We heard also from a woman named Stephanie, Sonya, 344 00:26:29,110 --> 00:26:31,950 a woman who testified under the name of Jane, and another Faith. 345 00:26:31,950 --> 00:26:36,950 They all came forward, and they talked about the same thing. They had testimony that actually 346 00:26:37,200 --> 00:26:41,950 stretched all the way back into the 1990s, all the way into just a few years ago. And 347 00:26:41,950 --> 00:26:44,790 they were saying the same story over and over again. 348 00:26:44,790 --> 00:26:47,850 AMNA NAWAZ: And, Emily, as prosecutors say, it wasn't just about the predatory actions 349 00:26:47,850 --> 00:26:51,590 of one man, that there was an entire network of enablers around him. Tell me a little bit 350 00:26:51,590 --> 00:26:52,930 about how they made that case. 351 00:26:52,930 --> 00:26:53,930 EMILY PALMER: Absolutely. 352 00:26:53,930 --> 00:26:58,400 And that network of enablers is actually the whole reason that we're in federal court right 353 00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:03,400 now. The racketeering charge that they have put against R. Kelly allows them to go stretch 354 00:27:04,550 --> 00:27:09,550 all the way back into the 1990s and bring these stories of horrible things that happen 355 00:27:10,640 --> 00:27:15,640 to women like the R&B singer Aaliyah that would normally be too old to actually prosecute. 356 00:27:17,380 --> 00:27:21,730 But by charging him with racketeering, something that's usually used against mobsters, they 357 00:27:21,730 --> 00:27:26,130 have been able to establish that we're not talking about a successful music company, 358 00:27:26,130 --> 00:27:28,490 prosecutors say. We're talking about an enterprise designed specifically to allow R. Kelly to 359 00:27:28,490 --> 00:27:29,490 switch up his -- sorry. 360 00:27:29,490 --> 00:27:32,510 We are talking about an enterprise that allows R. Kelly to cash in his fame and stardom to 361 00:27:32,510 --> 00:27:35,920 have sex with underage women, girls, and even boys. 362 00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:40,760 AMNA NAWAZ: So, Emily, R. Kelly has pled not guilty. He's denied all the accusations against 363 00:27:40,760 --> 00:27:42,390 him. Tell me about his defense team. 364 00:27:42,390 --> 00:27:45,330 How do they answer some of these allegations and handle the witnesses? 365 00:27:45,330 --> 00:27:50,330 EMILY PALMER: His defense, from opening arguments through cross-examination of 45 witnesses, 366 00:27:52,610 --> 00:27:56,770 through their own five witnesses that came and testified earlier this week, through closing 367 00:27:56,770 --> 00:28:00,530 statements, have kept to a very specific story. 368 00:28:00,530 --> 00:28:05,530 They say this is a complete conspiracy to undermine a successful R&B artist who enjoyed 369 00:28:10,830 --> 00:28:15,830 younger women, but there was nothing illegal about it, they say. They say that these sexual 370 00:28:15,920 --> 00:28:20,920 acts were completely -- they say that the women were happy to indulge R. Kelly, were 371 00:28:25,790 --> 00:28:30,790 fans, even super stalkers at times, that they wanted into the relationships, and then they 372 00:28:30,980 --> 00:28:34,400 became jealous and hurt and upset, and they were coming after his money. 373 00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:38,179 AMNA NAWAZ: Emily, I think a lot of people will listen to this and wonder, how? How did 374 00:28:38,179 --> 00:28:42,240 this go on for so long without charges of this kind being brought? 375 00:28:42,240 --> 00:28:47,240 EMILY PALMER: It's really important to look at the people who are accusing R. Kelly. 376 00:28:48,040 --> 00:28:51,940 And most of the people who have taken -- a majority of the people who have taken the 377 00:28:51,940 --> 00:28:56,940 stand are Black women who have historically not been heard, especially in cases like this. 378 00:28:59,790 --> 00:29:03,770 And this is really a huge moment in the MeToo movement. 379 00:29:03,770 --> 00:29:08,170 We have had other trials. We have had Bill Cosby. We have had Harvey Weinstein. But this 380 00:29:08,170 --> 00:29:13,170 is the first big high-profile case where a majority of the accusers are Black women. 381 00:29:14,530 --> 00:29:19,530 And it's really going to be interesting as the jury continues to deliberate, because, 382 00:29:21,150 --> 00:29:26,150 for many years, people knew what was going on. His employees knew. Even, to a certain 383 00:29:28,340 --> 00:29:31,400 extent, the public knew, and yet nobody did anything. 384 00:29:31,400 --> 00:29:34,100 AMNA NAWAZ: And we will be waiting and watching for that verdict. 385 00:29:34,100 --> 00:29:38,010 That is Emily Palmer of The New York Times covering the trial of R. Kelly and joining 386 00:29:38,010 --> 00:29:39,960 us tonight. 387 00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:44,270 Thank you, Emily. 388 00:29:44,270 --> 00:29:49,270 EMILY PALMER: Thank you. 389 00:29:50,010 --> 00:29:55,010 JUDY WOODRUFF: As President Biden's legislative agenda stalls in Congress, he has run into 390 00:29:57,310 --> 00:30:02,310 yet another issue, or, we should say, continues to run into the issue of turmoil on the Southern 391 00:30:03,710 --> 00:30:04,710 border. 392 00:30:04,710 --> 00:30:09,420 For a look at this busy week and what it all means, we're joined by Brooks and Capehart. 393 00:30:09,420 --> 00:30:14,420 That is New York Times columnist David Brooks and Jonathan Capehart, columnist for The Washington 394 00:30:14,470 --> 00:30:15,470 Post. 395 00:30:15,470 --> 00:30:16,470 Hello to both of you. 396 00:30:16,470 --> 00:30:17,470 JONATHAN CAPEHART: You too, Judy. 397 00:30:17,470 --> 00:30:18,470 JUDY WOODRUFF: Very good to see you... 398 00:30:18,470 --> 00:30:19,470 JONATHAN CAPEHART: You too. 399 00:30:19,470 --> 00:30:20,470 JUDY WOODRUFF: ... on this Friday. 400 00:30:20,470 --> 00:30:21,470 And there is so much to talk about. 401 00:30:21,470 --> 00:30:26,470 So, David, it does look like there's real trouble for President Biden's domestic agenda. 402 00:30:26,800 --> 00:30:31,800 And it's not the Republicans this time, at least on the part that he's run into, headwinds 403 00:30:32,880 --> 00:30:37,160 this week. It's his own Democratic colleagues. What is behind this? 404 00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:39,270 DAVID BROOKS: Yes, it's just an intellectual difference. 405 00:30:39,270 --> 00:30:44,010 The -- and what strikes me is how so many people are drawing red lines. The progressives 406 00:30:44,010 --> 00:30:49,010 are saying, we want $3.5 trillion. We're not going under. Manchin and others say $1.5 trillion, 407 00:30:49,470 --> 00:30:50,830 we're not going over. 408 00:30:50,830 --> 00:30:55,210 And so that's a gigantic gap. They can't even agree on when to vote on what. And so I think 409 00:30:55,210 --> 00:30:59,929 what they need to do is look at, what is the key insight of each side? The progressives 410 00:30:59,929 --> 00:31:04,540 are right that we need something big. We're a nation in decline. We're a nation -- because 411 00:31:04,540 --> 00:31:08,799 of disunity. Lots of people have been left behind by this economy. And they're right 412 00:31:08,799 --> 00:31:11,929 to do something big to try to jolt us back to unity. 413 00:31:11,929 --> 00:31:16,010 The moderates, in my view, are right that we're not going to have a European-style welfare 414 00:31:16,010 --> 00:31:19,790 state. We're just not that kind of country. We're an individualistic country. We like 415 00:31:19,790 --> 00:31:24,679 to tie benefits to work and have a work obligation. We're never going to give away as much money 416 00:31:24,679 --> 00:31:29,679 in taxes as the Europeans do. The Norwegians give away about 46 percent of their GDP to 417 00:31:29,680 --> 00:31:32,360 taxes. If this passed, it would get us up to 19. 418 00:31:32,360 --> 00:31:36,920 We're just not that kind of country. So, if you take the scope of the progressives and 419 00:31:36,920 --> 00:31:41,720 the values of the moderates, I think you can get a deal, but they're pretty far away from 420 00:31:41,720 --> 00:31:42,720 it right now. 421 00:31:42,720 --> 00:31:47,010 JUDY WOODRUFF: Well, they both may have a point, Jonathan, but the president's -- the 422 00:31:47,010 --> 00:31:50,600 future of his of his term in office could be in the balance here. 423 00:31:50,600 --> 00:31:53,440 JONATHAN CAPEHART: Well, sure, it could be in the balance, but we don't know. 424 00:31:53,440 --> 00:31:58,440 And I look at this as being the storm before the calm. David's right. A lot of red lines 425 00:31:58,630 --> 00:32:03,630 are being drawn. And they seem to be being drawn since Wednesday, since they all went 426 00:32:04,990 --> 00:32:08,670 to the White House and had their respective meetings with the president. And then they 427 00:32:08,670 --> 00:32:11,040 come out and then they state their positions again. 428 00:32:11,040 --> 00:32:15,010 But I have been paying close attention to the language that they're using. They're being 429 00:32:15,010 --> 00:32:20,010 very firm about what they're for and what they're not for. But they're not attacking 430 00:32:20,240 --> 00:32:23,960 each other, the way they were during the summer. 431 00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:28,960 And so I wonder if this is the usual Washington theatrics of just doing all of this performance, 432 00:32:33,340 --> 00:32:38,140 and then, at some point, when we're -- when we least expect it, breaking news announcement, 433 00:32:38,140 --> 00:32:39,559 here's the deal. 434 00:32:39,559 --> 00:32:44,559 Now, this is a different Washington. Who knows if that moment is going to come? I pray that 435 00:32:44,620 --> 00:32:49,440 it does, one, because what they're arguing over is very important for the American people. 436 00:32:49,440 --> 00:32:54,440 Two, if they don't come to some sort of deal, the president's agenda goes from being stalled 437 00:32:54,460 --> 00:32:59,460 to dead. And then, three, it means finally that Washington is completely broken if they 438 00:33:01,540 --> 00:33:03,340 can't come to some agreement here. 439 00:33:03,340 --> 00:33:08,340 JUDY WOODRUFF: Well, it's a different -- and then, meantime, there's another massive headache 440 00:33:08,700 --> 00:33:12,810 the president has. And I don't know whether it's another Washington performance, but it's 441 00:33:12,810 --> 00:33:14,460 over the debt limit, David. 442 00:33:14,460 --> 00:33:17,880 And this one is between the Democrats and the Republicans. The Republicans are saying 443 00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:18,880 no way. 444 00:33:18,880 --> 00:33:19,880 DAVID BROOKS: Yes. 445 00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:23,140 And when the shoe was on the other foot, they wanted the Republicans, when they were controlling 446 00:33:23,140 --> 00:33:27,490 things, to take it. It's -- what's changed is that, 10 years ago, people really used 447 00:33:27,490 --> 00:33:32,049 to care about debts and deficits. It was ranked as a major issue by a lot of Americans. Now, 448 00:33:32,049 --> 00:33:36,820 for whatever reason, some maybe dubious reasons, nobody cares, maybe just low interest rates. 449 00:33:36,820 --> 00:33:41,480 So now there's much greater tolerance among both Republicans and Democrats to run up the 450 00:33:41,480 --> 00:33:46,290 debt. And so voting to raise the limit is not as politically costly as it used to be. 451 00:33:46,290 --> 00:33:49,360 I wish they would just get away with -- do away with the whole thing. 452 00:33:49,360 --> 00:33:50,360 We have committed to spend. 453 00:33:50,360 --> 00:33:51,360 JUDY WOODRUFF: The debt limit, yes. Yes. 454 00:33:51,360 --> 00:33:52,360 DAVID BROOKS: Yes. 455 00:33:52,360 --> 00:33:54,250 We have committed to spend the money. The debt limit just says, yes, we're going to 456 00:33:54,250 --> 00:33:57,429 borrow the money to spend the money we already committed to. So they should raise it to a 457 00:33:57,429 --> 00:34:00,910 gazillion dollars. And then we never approach the limit, hopefully. 458 00:34:00,910 --> 00:34:01,910 (LAUGHTER) 459 00:34:01,910 --> 00:34:05,370 DAVID BROOKS: And then they should move forward. It's a bit of ballet that we don't need. 460 00:34:05,370 --> 00:34:07,679 JUDY WOODRUFF: Gazillion? What do you think? 461 00:34:07,679 --> 00:34:08,679 (LAUGHTER) 462 00:34:08,679 --> 00:34:11,040 JONATHAN CAPEHART: Sure. Gazillion is a great numerator. 463 00:34:11,040 --> 00:34:16,040 But this is sort of a wonky thing, but it's super important for the American people to 464 00:34:17,660 --> 00:34:22,660 understand that raising the debt ceiling is not giving Washington a blank check. It is 465 00:34:23,919 --> 00:34:28,919 allowing Washington to pay for the things that they have already bought. 466 00:34:29,490 --> 00:34:34,290 If the government does not raise the debt ceiling, the Bipartisan Policy Center this 467 00:34:34,290 --> 00:34:39,290 morning put out their charts, and they have turned me into a huge debt ceiling nerd. Started 468 00:34:39,391 --> 00:34:44,391 back in 2011, when Jay Powell, who was with Bipartisan Policy Center then, put this together. 469 00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:47,090 He is now the Fed chairman. 470 00:34:47,090 --> 00:34:52,090 I just want the American people to understand this. If the debt ceiling is not raised and 471 00:34:52,679 --> 00:34:57,679 the government can't borrow any money, it has to use the cash it has on hand. And I 472 00:34:58,280 --> 00:35:01,470 have this chart here. I don't know if the camera can get it, but I will just talk it 473 00:35:01,470 --> 00:35:06,470 through, that, on October 15, which they think might be the first day that we reach that 474 00:35:06,890 --> 00:35:11,890 X-date, the government will bring in $27 billion in revenues, but will have $43 billion in 475 00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:14,840 expenses. 476 00:35:14,840 --> 00:35:19,490 And that's just on that first day. All that debt that -- all those things that aren't 477 00:35:19,490 --> 00:35:24,140 paid carries over to the next day. I can't - - we don't -- I don't even have enough time 478 00:35:24,140 --> 00:35:29,140 to tell you the avalanche of harm that would come to the American people, to the federal 479 00:35:29,860 --> 00:35:33,060 government and to the global economy if that debt ceiling isn't raised. 480 00:35:33,060 --> 00:35:37,670 JUDY WOODRUFF: And not to mention that, government shutdown and all the all the consequences 481 00:35:37,670 --> 00:35:38,670 of that, David. 482 00:35:38,670 --> 00:35:39,670 DAVID BROOKS: Yes. 483 00:35:39,670 --> 00:35:42,859 And both the topics we have talked about so far that, the consequences of failure are 484 00:35:42,859 --> 00:35:47,070 cataclysmic. And so I presume, in a normal, functioning democracy, that we don't walk 485 00:35:47,070 --> 00:35:50,110 over those cliffs, but who knows? 486 00:35:50,110 --> 00:35:53,820 JUDY WOODRUFF: I'm just taking a deep breath here. 487 00:35:53,820 --> 00:35:54,820 (LAUGHTER) 488 00:35:54,820 --> 00:35:59,330 JUDY WOODRUFF: Another, of course, major issue the president had to deal with this week, 489 00:35:59,330 --> 00:36:02,540 again, Jonathan, was the Southern border. 490 00:36:02,540 --> 00:36:07,500 In addition to what's already been happening there, and the Haitian migrants were starting 491 00:36:07,500 --> 00:36:12,500 to gather, in the past week, these images of Border Patrol using reins or other -- whatever, 492 00:36:16,230 --> 00:36:19,740 belts to go after the migrants. 493 00:36:19,740 --> 00:36:24,670 President Biden has come in from enormous criticism from fellow Democrats over this. 494 00:36:24,670 --> 00:36:28,410 And here's how he commented this morning on what happened. 495 00:36:28,410 --> 00:36:32,069 JOE BIDEN, President of the United States: Of course I take responsibility. I'm President. 496 00:36:32,069 --> 00:36:36,990 But it was horrible what -- to see, as you saw -- to see people treated like they did, 497 00:36:36,990 --> 00:36:40,850 horses nearly running them over and people being strapped. It's outrageous. 498 00:36:40,850 --> 00:36:45,850 I promise you, those people will pay. They will be -- an investigation under way now, 499 00:36:46,230 --> 00:36:47,400 and there will be consequences. 500 00:36:47,400 --> 00:36:52,400 JUDY WOODRUFF: And, today, we reported there are no Haitian migrants at that particular 501 00:36:53,530 --> 00:36:55,830 place. We don't know whether more will be coming. 502 00:36:55,830 --> 00:37:00,830 But, Jonathan, how is the president handling this? And how much of a of a political hit 503 00:37:02,359 --> 00:37:03,359 is it for him? 504 00:37:03,359 --> 00:37:07,170 JONATHAN CAPEHART: I will take the political hit first. It's a huge hit. 505 00:37:07,170 --> 00:37:12,170 And it's a huge hit. One, with immigration, the president was already on squishy ground 506 00:37:13,270 --> 00:37:18,270 with the American people. But those images that came out of the men on horseback and 507 00:37:20,060 --> 00:37:25,060 Black people running, it was just -- is a little too close to home for a lot of us. 508 00:37:28,100 --> 00:37:33,100 And for a president who campaigned on a more humane immigration policy, for a president 509 00:37:33,422 --> 00:37:38,422 who, on election night, said to African Americans, you brought me here and I will not forget 510 00:37:39,590 --> 00:37:44,590 it, that's why you had a lot of Democrats, particularly African American Democrats, saying 511 00:37:45,650 --> 00:37:50,650 to the president, what is going on here? You must -- you must do something about this. 512 00:37:51,630 --> 00:37:56,630 And then, on top of it, what made it even more inhumane is that the president or the 513 00:37:57,800 --> 00:38:02,800 administration deported Haitians who had not lived in Haiti for more than 10 years to a 514 00:38:03,921 --> 00:38:08,921 country that is still dealing with an earthquake that happened and a presidential assassination. 515 00:38:11,390 --> 00:38:16,390 JUDY WOODRUFF: How can -- immigration, every president counting back as far as we can count, 516 00:38:18,930 --> 00:38:21,800 this has been a tough issue. Where do you see this going? 517 00:38:21,800 --> 00:38:22,800 DAVID BROOKS: Yes. 518 00:38:22,800 --> 00:38:27,010 Well, we had our last successful immigration bill, comprehensive one, under Ronald Reagan. 519 00:38:27,010 --> 00:38:32,010 That was a long time ago. And, so, he's inherited a gigantic mess that nobody has had the solution 520 00:38:32,780 --> 00:38:35,270 for. I think Biden did make it worse. 521 00:38:35,270 --> 00:38:39,680 And part of the problem was, they promised, on day one, they would reverse all the Trump 522 00:38:39,680 --> 00:38:44,680 rules. Reversing the Trump rules was a good idea. But doing it all at once, on day one, 523 00:38:45,210 --> 00:38:48,420 people in the transition, in the White House were warning about that. They were saying, 524 00:38:48,420 --> 00:38:53,420 we will be overwhelmed. It'll be a big open door signal. And we don't have the facilities 525 00:38:53,460 --> 00:38:55,240 to handle what's about to hit us. 526 00:38:55,240 --> 00:38:59,180 And that turned out to be true. And I think what bothers me, aside from what Jonathan 527 00:38:59,180 --> 00:39:04,180 was just expressing, was, it seems to be arbitrary, like who gets sent where. It seems like it's 528 00:39:04,869 --> 00:39:09,500 just like, who knows who's being decided? There's no methodology. There's no procedure 529 00:39:09,500 --> 00:39:11,040 for a lot of people. 530 00:39:11,040 --> 00:39:15,650 And so we're just overwhelmed right now. And it's disturbing that we're overwhelmed after 531 00:39:15,650 --> 00:39:18,450 basically 40 years of this mess. 532 00:39:18,450 --> 00:39:23,450 JUDY WOODRUFF: It's hard to see how this is an issue that gets resolved any time in the 533 00:39:25,240 --> 00:39:26,330 near term. 534 00:39:26,330 --> 00:39:31,330 So, the last thing we want to bring up is, it was September 21, 2001, just a week-and-a-half 535 00:39:34,680 --> 00:39:39,680 after the 9/11 attacks, and here was the beginning of the "NewsHour" that night with Jim Lehrer. 536 00:39:40,140 --> 00:39:43,850 JIM LEHRER, Co-Founder and Former Anchor, "PBS NewsHour": And that brings us to Shields 537 00:39:43,850 --> 00:39:48,850 and Brooks, syndicated columnist Mark Shields, joined tonight by his new regular partner, 538 00:39:49,010 --> 00:39:50,550 David Brooks of The Weekly Standard. 539 00:39:50,550 --> 00:39:51,550 Welcome, David. 540 00:39:51,550 --> 00:39:52,550 DAVID BROOKS: Thank you. 541 00:39:52,550 --> 00:39:55,430 JIM LEHRER: Formally, welcome. You have been here many, many times before. 542 00:39:55,430 --> 00:39:59,630 JUDY WOODRUFF: And that man has not changed one iota since September... 543 00:39:59,630 --> 00:40:00,630 (LAUGHTER) 544 00:40:00,630 --> 00:40:03,240 DAVID BROOKS: Yes, I wanted to point out I was 12 at that time. 545 00:40:03,240 --> 00:40:04,240 (LAUGHTER) 546 00:40:04,240 --> 00:40:06,510 DAVID BROOKS: So, I'm -- I don't know how old I am now. 547 00:40:06,510 --> 00:40:09,100 JUDY WOODRUFF: So, David, you joined -- I mean, you had been on the "NewsHour," but 548 00:40:09,100 --> 00:40:14,100 you joined this program at a very sobering, difficult moment for this country. 549 00:40:15,109 --> 00:40:20,109 It was, what, 10 days after 9/11. And you have been through a lot of ups and downs with 550 00:40:21,170 --> 00:40:22,840 the country ever since. 551 00:40:22,840 --> 00:40:27,840 But just talk a little bit about what it's meant to you to be here at this table every 552 00:40:28,170 --> 00:40:29,170 Friday night. 553 00:40:29,170 --> 00:40:30,170 DAVID BROOKS: Yes, I will tell you what it's been like. 554 00:40:30,170 --> 00:40:33,530 Like, it's the end of the week. And, often, I'm tired. Sometimes, I'm under the weather. 555 00:40:33,530 --> 00:40:37,240 Sometimes, I'm stressed. I come in here a little low. I walk out of here an hour later 556 00:40:37,240 --> 00:40:42,240 super charged up and super happy, because I get to work with the people I have worked 557 00:40:42,330 --> 00:40:46,590 with, and not only the people on set, but Leah (ph) in the makeup room. Charlie's back 558 00:40:46,590 --> 00:40:47,670 there, our lighting guy. 559 00:40:47,670 --> 00:40:48,670 (LAUGHTER) 560 00:40:48,670 --> 00:40:51,080 DAVID BROOKS: And so it's just -- you feel uplifted when you walk out. 561 00:40:51,080 --> 00:40:55,641 And then, when you think about 20 years, I think about the time and about '04, '05. Mark 562 00:40:55,641 --> 00:41:00,641 and I were on with Jim. And we showed a Marine funeral just before our segment. And Jim started 563 00:41:01,360 --> 00:41:06,360 crying. And Mark and I gave like 10 minute answers, so Jim could compose itself. 564 00:41:06,380 --> 00:41:11,020 And so that -- that was just like -- that's something we're going through together. 565 00:41:11,020 --> 00:41:16,020 I think about sitting with Mark and Jim when Barack Obama gave his 2004 speech, that first 566 00:41:16,450 --> 00:41:21,210 big speech, which was watching a star appear, but it was also about a version of America 567 00:41:21,210 --> 00:41:22,730 that he was describing. 568 00:41:22,730 --> 00:41:27,290 I think about the day Gwen died. And I go through all the e-mails that she sent me over 569 00:41:27,290 --> 00:41:31,510 the years, and some were just about our friendship. But a lot were tough. Like, Gwen demanded 570 00:41:31,510 --> 00:41:32,510 excellence. 571 00:41:32,510 --> 00:41:33,510 (LAUGHTER) 572 00:41:33,510 --> 00:41:36,410 DAVID BROOKS: And if you didn't show up, Gwen was like, show up. 573 00:41:36,410 --> 00:41:37,410 (LAUGHTER) 574 00:41:37,410 --> 00:41:41,000 DAVID BROOKS: And then with you, I mean, you're the hardest-working woman in show business. 575 00:41:41,000 --> 00:41:45,890 Like, I -- you have not had a day where you don't completely show up for this thing. 576 00:41:45,890 --> 00:41:50,890 And so you get a sense of people who respect their job and mostly respect the audience. 577 00:41:51,610 --> 00:41:54,960 And out of that derives a kind of patriotism. 578 00:41:54,960 --> 00:41:59,960 And other networks talk a lot about patriotism, but I think we -- we try to serve a certain 579 00:42:00,150 --> 00:42:05,150 kind of America. And we try to exemplify that service in a way we do things, in the culture 580 00:42:05,710 --> 00:42:06,710 around here. 581 00:42:06,710 --> 00:42:11,680 And it's just been an honor to be part of that for 20 years. And my next 60 years will 582 00:42:11,680 --> 00:42:13,000 be just as good. 583 00:42:13,000 --> 00:42:14,000 (LAUGHTER) 584 00:42:14,000 --> 00:42:15,000 JUDY WOODRUFF: Next 60. 585 00:42:15,000 --> 00:42:20,000 I mean, the "NewsHour" has been just incredibly fortunate and honored to have you with us 586 00:42:20,240 --> 00:42:24,410 and, of course, Mark for all those years. And then Jonathan joined us almost a year 587 00:42:24,410 --> 00:42:25,410 ago. 588 00:42:25,410 --> 00:42:29,330 And, Jonathan, you get to sit next to David on Friday nights. It's not exactly like every 589 00:42:29,330 --> 00:42:30,390 other television show. 590 00:42:30,390 --> 00:42:33,200 JONATHAN CAPEHART: No, it's not like every other television show. 591 00:42:33,200 --> 00:42:38,200 And I knew that this was an important job to get, succeeding Mark Shields, the e-mails 592 00:42:40,349 --> 00:42:45,349 that came in from people saying: Oh, my God, Mark Shields is gone. I'm so upset. I'm so 593 00:42:46,000 --> 00:42:48,180 sad. We miss him. But I'm glad you're there. 594 00:42:48,180 --> 00:42:53,180 It was then that I realized how important this job is, how important it is, what we 595 00:42:54,609 --> 00:42:55,609 do. 596 00:42:55,609 --> 00:43:00,530 But what makes this so much fun and why it's so wonderful to celebrate David is, we have 597 00:43:00,530 --> 00:43:05,530 been doing this in other venues for a few years now. And I always look forward to being 598 00:43:06,460 --> 00:43:11,460 with David, because you're to the right of me. I'm to the left of you, completely different 599 00:43:13,369 --> 00:43:14,369 backgrounds. 600 00:43:14,369 --> 00:43:19,369 And yet, when I sit with David and talk with David, I feel like I have learned something. 601 00:43:21,010 --> 00:43:22,420 I'm smarter. 602 00:43:22,420 --> 00:43:27,420 The way David speaks about all the issues, it's inviting. And that's what makes Brooks 603 00:43:29,190 --> 00:43:34,190 and Capehart, Shields and Brooks and all the other iterations of this so wonderful. We 604 00:43:35,610 --> 00:43:40,610 come to the table to bring news, educate the audience on the inside, but then to do it 605 00:43:41,430 --> 00:43:43,760 in a way that invites the audience in. 606 00:43:43,760 --> 00:43:46,380 JUDY WOODRUFF: There's clearly some magic that happens here. 607 00:43:46,380 --> 00:43:47,380 DAVID BROOKS: Thank you, Jonathan. Thank you. 608 00:43:47,380 --> 00:43:50,720 JUDY WOODRUFF: And we are grateful to both of you, to Jonathan Capehart and to David 609 00:43:50,720 --> 00:43:51,720 Brooks. 610 00:43:51,720 --> 00:43:52,720 Congratulations on 20 years. 611 00:43:52,720 --> 00:43:56,520 Twenty years more, 40 years more coming up. 612 00:43:56,520 --> 00:44:01,520 DAVID BROOKS: Shoot me. 613 00:44:05,650 --> 00:44:07,930 (LAUGHTER) 614 00:44:07,930 --> 00:44:12,930 JUDY WOODRUFF: Whether teaching NYU marketing students or co-hosting the podcast "Pivot," 615 00:44:18,040 --> 00:44:22,500 Scott Galloway rarely misses an opportunity to share his insight on the effects of big 616 00:44:22,500 --> 00:44:23,500 tech. 617 00:44:23,500 --> 00:44:28,500 Tonight, he shares his Brief But Spectacular take on this country's response to the pandemic. 618 00:44:28,700 --> 00:44:33,619 It is also the subject of his latest book, "Post Corona: From Crisis to Opportunity." 619 00:44:33,619 --> 00:44:36,220 SCOTT GALLOWAY, Author, "Post Corona: From Crisis to Opportunity": Within seven days 620 00:44:36,220 --> 00:44:41,220 of Pearl Harbor, Chrysler converted its largest factory to a factory punching out M1 Bradley 621 00:44:41,850 --> 00:44:43,050 tanks. 622 00:44:43,050 --> 00:44:48,050 What company has totally pivoted to fighting this virus? If Walmart stock had been down 623 00:44:49,630 --> 00:44:54,630 30 percent and if Amazon stock had been down 60 percent, instead of up 30 percent and up 624 00:44:54,830 --> 00:44:59,830 60 percent, that van with a smile rolling into my driveway delivering my espresso pods 625 00:45:00,030 --> 00:45:05,030 would have had someone jump out and jab me and my family. This virus has not seen what 626 00:45:05,200 --> 00:45:10,200 America is capable of when it has a full-throated capitalist response. 627 00:45:10,440 --> 00:45:15,380 The bottom line is, if you're in the top 1 percent, you are living your best life. That 628 00:45:15,380 --> 00:45:19,150 is the dirty secret of this pandemic. This pandemic for the shareholder class has meant 629 00:45:19,150 --> 00:45:23,270 more time with Netflix, more time with family, and your wealth has skyrocketed. 630 00:45:23,270 --> 00:45:28,270 And so, for the wealthy, this has been stop, stop, it hurts so good. 631 00:45:33,170 --> 00:45:37,490 This has disproportionately impacted people of color who live in food deserts. This has 632 00:45:37,490 --> 00:45:42,490 been an enormous tragedy across senior citizens in nursing homes. What we have is the worst 633 00:45:43,190 --> 00:45:48,190 of both worlds, capitalism on the way up, socialism on the way down. That's not capitalism. 634 00:45:48,760 --> 00:45:50,130 That's cronyism. 635 00:45:50,130 --> 00:45:55,130 We need to be more heavy-handed with corporations and more empathetic and loving with individuals. 636 00:45:55,630 --> 00:46:00,030 The biggest mistake we made in this pandemic was, we should have been protecting people, 637 00:46:00,030 --> 00:46:02,080 not American airlines. 638 00:46:02,080 --> 00:46:06,540 There is a danger here, and that is the dispersion of headquarters to our homes. The ugly stepchild 639 00:46:06,540 --> 00:46:10,540 of dispersion is segregation. When you don't see the homeless veteran on the on-ramp or 640 00:46:10,540 --> 00:46:14,730 the off-ramp to work, when you don't see people of different ethnic groups and different income 641 00:46:14,730 --> 00:46:16,910 classes, you begin to resent them. 642 00:46:16,910 --> 00:46:21,910 So, the enduring feature of COVID-19, it will be seen as an accelerant more than a change 643 00:46:22,510 --> 00:46:27,510 agent. Online grocery delivery accelerated eight years. Work from home accelerated six 644 00:46:29,270 --> 00:46:33,750 years. Income inequality took an economy that was dysfunctional and turned it dystopic. 645 00:46:33,750 --> 00:46:38,660 So, take any trend in your life personally or professionally, take it out 10 years, and 646 00:46:38,660 --> 00:46:42,190 there's a decent chance that we're here, there, now. 647 00:46:42,190 --> 00:46:46,200 I worry that today's youth doesn't have the connective tissue that some of our leaders 648 00:46:46,200 --> 00:46:49,810 had in the past. They were Americans first before they were red or blue. And a way to 649 00:46:49,810 --> 00:46:54,810 get that back might be some sort of mandatory national service. It might be building housing 650 00:46:54,849 --> 00:46:59,240 or a corona corps that helps people, where kids get a chance to meet other kids from 651 00:46:59,240 --> 00:47:03,590 different backgrounds and feel like they have a shared experience, such that maybe there's 652 00:47:03,590 --> 00:47:06,840 more cooperation as they get into positions of power. 653 00:47:06,840 --> 00:47:11,510 Some of the greatest periods of prosperity have come out of crisis. And that's the opportunity 654 00:47:11,510 --> 00:47:16,510 here. So, ask yourself three questions. One, is this an opportunity for you to become a 655 00:47:16,660 --> 00:47:21,120 caretaker for someone? Do you have the relationship with your siblings that you want, if you were 656 00:47:21,120 --> 00:47:24,420 forced to say goodbye to someone over FaceTime? 657 00:47:24,420 --> 00:47:28,460 Have you made the requisite investments in friendships to ensure that you maintain those 658 00:47:28,460 --> 00:47:33,460 relationships? Are you willing to show the type of grace, and courage, and forgiveness, 659 00:47:33,690 --> 00:47:38,380 such that you can cement and repair the most important thing in respect to our happiness? 660 00:47:38,380 --> 00:47:40,109 And that is your relationships. 661 00:47:40,109 --> 00:47:44,030 This is either going to be the best year in the history of America, or it could be the 662 00:47:44,030 --> 00:47:45,349 worst. It's up to us. 663 00:47:45,349 --> 00:47:50,349 My name is Scott Galloway, and this is my Brief But Spectacular take on post-corona, 664 00:47:51,339 --> 00:47:56,339 from crisis to opportunity. 665 00:47:57,810 --> 00:48:02,810 JUDY WOODRUFF: Now an artist straddling worlds and using her art to examine how we see the 666 00:48:14,240 --> 00:48:17,910 past and present, East and West. 667 00:48:17,910 --> 00:48:22,320 Jeffrey Brown has the story from New York for our arts and culture series, Canvas. 668 00:48:22,320 --> 00:48:27,320 JEFFREY BROWN: Dancing women from a South Asian painting tradition, a headless Western-style 669 00:48:28,910 --> 00:48:33,480 Venus, and what's a fighter jet doing there? 670 00:48:33,480 --> 00:48:37,750 Ask the woman with the ornate ram's horns, the artist herself, 671 00:48:37,750 --> 00:48:38,750 Shahzia Sikander. 672 00:48:38,750 --> 00:48:43,240 SHAHZIA SIKANDER, Artist: I see myself as somebody who's interested, like a detective, 673 00:48:43,240 --> 00:48:48,240 to look at the -- how to connect the dots, how to find where the material is, and to 674 00:48:50,990 --> 00:48:55,990 also examine my own relationship with it, but also how some of the stories. What are 675 00:48:57,330 --> 00:49:00,740 the archetypal stories within the medium itself? 676 00:49:00,740 --> 00:49:05,740 JEFFREY BROWN: Sikander, born in Pakistan and living in the U.S. since 1993, is known 677 00:49:06,930 --> 00:49:11,930 for examining and breaking down familiar archetypes and stereotypes of art history, and questioning 678 00:49:13,220 --> 00:49:18,220 the assigned roles of women and simplistic notions of an East-West divide. 679 00:49:18,830 --> 00:49:23,830 She began in art school in Lahore, studying the refined tradition of Persian and Indian 680 00:49:24,330 --> 00:49:29,330 manuscript, or miniature, painting, dating to the 16th century, and then began to play 681 00:49:30,370 --> 00:49:34,080 with it and make it her own, adding the image of a friend, for example. 682 00:49:34,080 --> 00:49:36,290 SHAHZIA SIKANDER: This took me almost two years. 683 00:49:36,290 --> 00:49:37,290 JEFFREY BROWN: Oh, really? 684 00:49:37,290 --> 00:49:38,290 SHAHZIA SIKANDER: Yes. 685 00:49:38,290 --> 00:49:41,690 JEFFREY BROWN: In her most renowned early work, called The Scroll, she captured her 686 00:49:41,690 --> 00:49:46,690 own life within this history. That's her, a ghostlike presence throughout the scene, 687 00:49:47,020 --> 00:49:48,850 which can be read left to right. 688 00:49:48,850 --> 00:49:53,830 SHAHZIA SIKANDER: At the end you also see her. She's painting herself, but you never 689 00:49:53,830 --> 00:49:58,080 really get to see her face. So there's always this level of mystery. 690 00:49:58,080 --> 00:50:03,080 JEFFREY BROWN: In fact, the entire exhibition, titled Extraordinary Realities and starting 691 00:50:03,540 --> 00:50:08,540 at the Morgan Library and Museum in New York, is a kind of portrait of the young artist, 692 00:50:08,710 --> 00:50:13,710 mostly paintings from Sikander's first two decades of work in the 1990s and early 2000s, 693 00:50:14,470 --> 00:50:19,470 a chance for us and her, now 52, to look back, but also see continuing connections. 694 00:50:20,859 --> 00:50:25,859 SHAHZIA SIKANDER: I was interested in examining some of those projections. Like, what is tradition? 695 00:50:27,290 --> 00:50:32,290 How do we define tradition? How is tradition performed? And those ideas captured my imagination 696 00:50:35,200 --> 00:50:40,200 as a young artist that who dictated when and what in time is old, and what is avant garde? 697 00:50:45,770 --> 00:50:50,770 And the more I examined it, the more I felt like there was room to reexamine, to reimagine. 698 00:50:51,369 --> 00:50:56,369 JEFFREY BROWN: She began to layer image upon image, sometimes adding fantastical creatures 699 00:50:57,839 --> 00:51:02,839 and abstraction over refined details. She packed different kinds of information into 700 00:51:03,359 --> 00:51:08,359 small paintings, often using humor and wit angels, American flags for wings, in a reference 701 00:51:10,221 --> 00:51:14,270 to U.S. military interventions in the Muslim world. 702 00:51:14,270 --> 00:51:19,270 In 1999, she did a painting titled The Faces of Islam for "The New York Times Magazine." 703 00:51:20,400 --> 00:51:25,400 What is the role of art that you see for addressing or responding to those kind of stereotypes? 704 00:51:27,120 --> 00:51:32,120 SHAHZIA SIKANDER: The work was always resisting that type of fetishization, especially about 705 00:51:33,190 --> 00:51:38,190 the Muslim woman as needing to be saved, especially in how it gets played up in Hollywood, in 706 00:51:41,660 --> 00:51:43,720 media, in TV, in this. 707 00:51:43,720 --> 00:51:48,720 And it has a deeper history of the representation of the veil in European colonial imperial 708 00:51:50,810 --> 00:51:55,810 history. And it counters it with other types of narratives, where the joyousness of the 709 00:51:56,480 --> 00:52:01,480 feminine, the inherent female agency, autonomy, ability to be creative, where its inner beauty, 710 00:52:05,150 --> 00:52:06,770 its inner strength is very present. 711 00:52:06,770 --> 00:52:11,770 JEFFREY BROWN: That shows itself especially in Sikander's first sculpture, two women intertwined, 712 00:52:12,780 --> 00:52:17,780 a classical Venus and Hindu devata, both, she says, in a position of power. 713 00:52:19,440 --> 00:52:24,440 In recent years, Sikander has worked in new forms and larger formats, including massive 714 00:52:24,599 --> 00:52:29,599 billboard projections in Times Square and a 66-foot glass and ceramic scroll for Princeton 715 00:52:31,119 --> 00:52:32,119 University. 716 00:52:32,119 --> 00:52:36,500 SHAHZIA SIKANDER: So, I made this here. I basically took elements from some of the paintings. 717 00:52:36,500 --> 00:52:41,210 JEFFREY BROWN: She created a new installation for this exhibition, long strips of paper 718 00:52:41,210 --> 00:52:46,210 that bring her small painting and imagery to three-dimensional life and draw in the 719 00:52:46,480 --> 00:52:48,080 viewer. 720 00:52:48,080 --> 00:52:53,080 Regularly defined herself as South Asian, Pakistani, Muslim, and more, she's been determined 721 00:52:54,530 --> 00:52:55,910 to break out of the boxes. 722 00:52:55,910 --> 00:53:00,910 SHAHZIA SIKANDER: The more categories, the merrier. If the work can speak to Asian American-ness, 723 00:53:01,790 --> 00:53:06,790 fine, Muslim American-ness, fine, female artist, fine, artist, great. 724 00:53:07,300 --> 00:53:12,300 All those categories and boxes are fine, as long as one is not restricted to operate within 725 00:53:16,730 --> 00:53:21,730 one or two. And I think, when we talk about that, we are talking about the agency of imagination, 726 00:53:23,290 --> 00:53:27,670 and that's the best part of being an artist, is that you can really soar. 727 00:53:27,670 --> 00:53:32,670 JEFFREY BROWN: Shahzia Sikander's exhibition, Extraordinary Realities, moves next to the 728 00:53:33,380 --> 00:53:38,380 Rhode Island School of Design Museum in providence, and then to the Museum of Fine Arts, Houston. 729 00:53:39,220 --> 00:53:44,220 For the "PBS NewsHour," I'm Jeffrey Brown at the Morgan Library and Museum in New York. 730 00:53:44,280 --> 00:53:47,869 JUDY WOODRUFF: Some soaring art there. 731 00:53:47,869 --> 00:53:52,869 And a new app to help people overcome fear of spiders, the plan to train to cows to protect 732 00:53:54,099 --> 00:53:59,099 the environment and an invasive bug threatening America's trees, those are among the five 733 00:53:59,510 --> 00:54:04,280 stories you may have missed this week we are highlighting online. You can find all that 734 00:54:04,280 --> 00:54:07,390 and more on our Web site at PBS.org/NewsHour. 735 00:54:07,390 --> 00:54:12,390 And be sure to join my colleague moderator Yamiche Alcindor tonight on "Washington Week." 736 00:54:13,840 --> 00:54:18,840 She will get insight and analysis of the week's big stories from an all-star panel including 737 00:54:19,180 --> 00:54:24,180 Bob Woodward and Robert Costa, authors of the bestselling book "Peril." 738 00:54:24,589 --> 00:54:27,240 And that is the "NewsHour" for tonight. I'm Judy Woodruff. 739 00:54:27,240 --> 00:54:30,160 Join us online and again here on Monday evening. 740 00:54:30,160 --> 00:54:35,160 For all of us at the "PBS NewsHour," thank you, please stay safe, and have a good weekend.