San Antonio is a fast growing

fast moving community with

something new happening every

day.

That's why each week we go on

the ride with the newsmakers who

are driving this change.

Then we gather at the reporters

roundtable to talk about the

latest news stories with the

journalists behind those

stories.

Join us now as we go on.

Welcome to a special edition

full hour on the record.

I'm PJ made over the past week

San Antonio has seen two

protests turned violent.

The intention of the gatherings

to protest racial injustice and

to elicit change after the

murder of George Floyd an

unarmed black man by a police

officer in Minneapolis.

Locally the protests have

started peacefully but then

turned violent with looting and

vandalism downtown.

Mayor Ron Nurenberg joins us.

Mayor what is your main concern

right now.

Well my main concern is that the

message of reform and justice

that people are peacefully

demonstrating for across the

across the country is lost amid

instigation and in devolving

into violence which really

detracts from the message.

You know we have a number of

underlying conditions in this

country that have exacerbated

the frustrations that we're

seeing in all aspects of society

and racism and institutional

racism is one of them.

And so that's an issue that we

have to focus a generation on.

And you know when when we see

demonstrations of movement

across the country like this we

want to take advantage of that

and create change.

And that's what I hope happens.

What does change look like from

the city's perspective.

To me that is a pursuit of

racial equity and of course that

has a lot to do with every

aspect of society from how we

deal with issues of access to

education and workforce how we

deal with services and equitable

delivery of services but it also

deals with police community

relations and that's what you're

seeing the focus of this on and

obviously that is a an issue

that has been unsolved for so

many years across every urban

city in the country.

What are your interactions been

like with the police department

and city management as they're

trying to respond to this tense

situation.

You know I have to give a lot of

credit to our city management

our San Antonio Police

Department Chief McManus but

also the community around us.

I mean if you look at across San

Antonio with the organizations

the social justice organizations

that are marching that are

organizing that are calling for

reform.

They are working together in

over the last 20 years after

over the last 15 years that the

police department under Chief

McManus is really focused on

community relations and building

community through policing by

addressing some of these issues

whether it's diversity among the

workforce of the police

department whether it's use of

force policies this

de-escalation training

sensitivity training implicit

bias all these things are being

incorporated.

But you know one of the

challenges is if you see

something so egregious as we saw

with the murder of George Floyd

with which adds to adds another

life to a long and growing list

of people who have been murdered

black Americans mainly it it it

leads to the frustration.

And it also takes several steps

back from the great community

relations that and progress

progress that we've we've been

able to to see here in San

Antonio.

I understand that the organizers

of the protest and the police

department have pretty good

lines of communication.

There's a concern that people

from outside or agitators are

kind of causing the vandalism.

Do you have a sense of that what

are you hearing about that.

You know it's unclear it's

unclear.

There are obviously instigators

that are trying to take selfish

advantage of the situation and

make this evolve into something

it's not.

And we see them in all kinds of

political stripes.

You know there is a known

organization that we've heard of

now called the boogaloo boys.

There's other organizations that

are affiliated with white

supremacist groups and other

racist organizations that are

taking advantage of this

situation because it's volatile

and trying to instigate violence

that is an element we have to be

aware of and we have to use

intelligence to weeded out.

But I would say that San Antonio

has an extraordinary history of

dealing with the march to civil

rights and reforms of of all

kinds and we've done in a

peaceful way when we saw the

marches in San Antonio on

Saturday and throughout the week

they're peaceful and they're

overwhelmingly people from our

community that are families of

all ages coming out to march in

unison.

What we have to do is figure out

a way that we can keep that the

main the main driving force of

these marches and be able to you

know if they're from San Antonio

or not the instigators that are

trying to change the message

into something that's far beyond

and not in any way related to

the march for justice on the

police side.

We've seen videos of rubber

bullets wooden bullets tear gas.

What do you asking the police

department about what their

policies are about de-escalation

or escalation.

That's a great question.

I think that the theme for these

has to always be discussed

de-escalation the use of force

policy obviously is an extremely

important part of how we do

that.

And so those are the questions

I'm asking and also I'm asking

are we making it clear when and

how use of force is executed.

You know crowd control devices

people in crowds need to know

when that's going to happen and

how it happens.

And so that's a lot of the

conversation we're we're having

now.

Use of force whether it's you

know crowd disperse or any other

kind of non-lethal is extremely

important it needs to be done in

a transparent manner.

All your council colleagues and

engage in this topic of police

reform and do you see there

being an ongoing conversation

about that after this kind of

tense situation dies down.

Yeah I do.

I think you know unfortunately

it kind of ebbs and flows but we

we reconstituted the Public

Safety Commission or the Public

Safety Committee of the city

council headed by Melissa bear

hovered it was a council member

in District 6.

She's very anxious to get

involved and make sure that

we're doing everything we need

to do to continue to enhance

police community relations which

has been a hallmark of our

community.

So this is going to be an

ongoing ongoing conversation.

One of the elements of challenge

for us though is that there are

certain things that are the

domain of the local community

through contract through

executive authority that is

executed by the chief.

There are certain things that

are the domain of the state and

federal government as well.

There are a lot of things that

are through statute at the state

level that take a lot of that

can kind of control and process

out of the hands of the local

government.

And so we've got to go through

those things as well.

So I understand that police in

the past 15 years after 9/11

started getting riot gear and

kind of military kind of

equipment I'm sure you've seen

that in your time on council.

Your thoughts on the

militarization of police forces

and sort of how we should view

that moving forward.

Yeah.

Well certainly the police

protection and personal

protection of our police force

is important but at the same

time military style gear also

sends a signal to the community.

And we have to be very careful

when when any kind of vehicle or

equipment is deployed that it's

done in the appropriate manner.

Militarization of the police by

and large has only served to

escalate the feelings of people

that that they're being that

they're being monitored and

controlled.

And that is part of part of the

problem with with what's going

on now is that these marches for

justice are springing from years

decades generations of

frustration that communities of

color have had with the criminal

justice system in general.

You know this has been an

underlying brewing issue that

has been left unaddressed for so

long.

And the more that we create that

disconnect whether it's through

equipment or you know again the

policies and procedures of

controlling crowds that can

create a gulf that detracts from

the progress that we're trying

to seek.

So this protest situation is

there's an underlying condition

which is we have a pandemic that

disproportionately affects

people of color.

We have an economic crisis that

disproportionately affects

people of color.

Then you have this video that's

viral that's really disturbing.

Can you talk about that and sort

of the conditions that have led

to this powder keg of a moment.

That's why I always go back to

equity equity in all senses and

that's why you know back when I

was elected we made equity the

agenda.

Economic mobility is a issue of

racial equity as well policing

and how we manage public safety

in our communities is is an

issue of equity and race equity

as well.

So all of these go back to how

it shouldn't matter what the

color of your skin is what side

of town you live on where you

were born in what your last name

is you should deserve equity

delivered at basic opportunity

services within our community

just like everyone else.

And so it's going to continue to

go back to this notion that

equity has to be our agenda our

focus and that's been the theme

of how we're going to be moving

forward through this pandemic as

well.

Has this protest and response

changed our city.

And if so how.

You know I think it it has

changed our city in the sense

that we are now in a moment

where where we are clearly

connected with urban communities

around the country that maybe we

we thought we weren't.

You know D.C. Austin Chicago

these cities are really gripped

with issues of how do we control

unrest.

And we thought we were immune to

that.

And I think maybe we we are much

better off than most communities

in the sense that we are so

close knit and weak and we work

together through challenges like

this but it does show these are

broad issues across the country

that we have to be cognizant of

and that we have to participate

in.

On the other hand what San

Antonio has always been is a

city that cares for one another.

And what we saw on Sunday

morning I think should hold

everyone in close and he should

have this in your heart.

We saw throngs of people descend

upon downtown not with signs

this time but with brooms and

trash bags to help clean up.

That's the same kind of peaceful

assembly except they had

different things in their hands

that we saw on Saturday.

So this city has a remarkable

tradition of being a leader in

civil rights and peaceful

non-violent protests.

That is going to continue.

This city also has a tradition

of being close knit and taking

care of one another that is

going to continue.

But we are participating in a

national dialogue now a hopeful

message from Mayor Ron

Nuremburg.

Thank you for joining us.

Thanks.

Joining us now is San Antonio

Police Department Chief William

Magnus.

That Chief again thank you for

joining us.

Appreciate it.

Thank you.

So what are the policies and

procedures for the essay APD for

the use of force or any kind of

projectile to disperse the

crowd.

We will never ever use chemical

agents or any kind of munitions

on a peaceful crowd crowd that's

peacefully demonstrating that

those are the rules.

When the crowd becomes

threatening to a point where

we're concerned that there's

gonna be assaultive behavior

when there's property

destruction gonna be property

structure that could be property

destruction.

We will.

If if time and situation permits

we will ask the crowd to

disperse.

If the crowd won't disperse then

we will warn them that we are

going to deploy chemical agents

and if they continue to stand

their ground then we will deploy

those agents.

So it's after a warning when at

least it usually two to three

warnings that are given.

So we've had a couple of these

instances in the last week with

a protest in downtown San

Antonio.

Is there an after incident

review internally the next day

or the week after or something

where you go through that kind

of tick tock play by play of

what happened.

Yes there's a there's an action

after action report that will be

done and we'll review everything

from top to bottom from a

desire.

And I know that we live in an

age now where there are cameras

all over the place with people

with their cell phones.

How much of that is kind of

incorporated into the review.

We have body cams as well.

As you well know and as

everybody well knows if there's

an if there's a complaint made

or an allegation made of any

type of misconduct or excessive

force we will review any video

we can get our hands on to

include the body cam video of

the the any officer that's in

the area where the complaint is

made.

So it's a comprehensive review

and anytime there's a complaint.

Yes the body cams have been

around for four or five years

now for the LAPD.

Do you think that they've

fulfilled their purpose of de

escalating situations overall.

I do.

It actually changes behavior on

both sides of the camera.

And oftentimes that you know the

officers fears when we first

started wearing them was that

you know they were going to get

in trouble.

You know it was going to be

difficult for them but more

often than not when a complaint

is made we will we will review

the body cam video and it will

it will unfound the complaint.

And oftentimes when we were

being when there's a complaint

being made will advise the

complainant that OK we're going

to review the body cam video.

And oftentimes they just

withdraw their complaint right

away.

I see.

So at the protests the other

night there were some reporters

who posted some video.

My understanding is there's a

safe zone option for reporters

who are covering these protests.

What is the protocol for that.

We offer that we offer.

We offered I think was Saturday

night.

We offered a a an area behind

the lines where reporters could

could muster up and some did.

And obviously some didn't.

But if you're in a crowd who's

ever in that crowd when those

warnings are given to disperse

or if if you know anyone in that

crowd who is peacefully

protesting and being hijacked by

the people who are bent on

violence and property

destruction if you see that

happening it's probably best to

leave.

And when the warnings are given

it is definitely best to leave

because we're telling you that

hey this either has to stop or

we're going to disperse the

crowd.

Right.

I on Saturday at the Alamo there

was this really compelling

picture of officers like a blue

wall of officers between a group

quote unquote defending the

Alamo and people protesting what

was going through the mind of an

officer who said who's sitting

there in this tense and volatile

situation.

Well I can tell you from from

years of experience it is very

tense and you're just waiting

and you're you're standing there

in the throes of insults.

People were spitting on you.

Not not everyone the peaceful

protesters are not doing this

but there are some that are

doing it and they're throwing

water bottles but the water

bottles don't always have water

in them.

They've got urine in them.

They've got chemical agents in

them cleaning agents in them.

So they're filled up sometimes

with sand or pebbles.

I heard a remark or read

something on social media that

which the big deal with a water

bottle being thrown.

Well it's not always water

bottles.

It's not always water in those

bottles.

We had three officers injured

Saturday night two were hit in

the head with bottles one had to

be transported to the hospital.

One was treated on the scene by

M.S. and a third officer who was

hit in the knee with a brick.

So you know it's it's tense when

you're on the front line and it

requires patients.

It requires a lot of training

and understanding you know what

your role is on that line.

But when when it gets violent

and when there's proper

destruction were there to

protect people's health and

safety protect their lives.

And we are also there to protect

property and people who own

those properties and people who

are not involved in the violence

expect us to protect them and

their property.

That makes absolute sense on

Saturday it was a tense standoff

and it's pretty long tense

standoff.

There was a build up throughout

the day people were announcing

on social media they're going to

have the protests and the

counter protests.

How do you approach those days

where you know there could be a

tense situation brewing.

Well let me let me start from

how we approach any protest at

all.

So we try to meet with the

organizers which I did on

Saturday at 430 at Travis church

and they they did exactly what

they said they were going to do

which was commence at 5:00 and

at six thirty at public safety

headquarters after a vigil and

then they would disperse.

And what I told them was our

protocol is our M.O. is that we

are not going to hover around

the protesters or be in their

midst.

We don't want them to feel like

we're there waiting for them to

do something or feel pressure

from the police.

So the only time we're going to

show up is if we get a call is

we have to protect them from

traffic.

If they if they decide to march

and to protect them from counter

protesters.

And that's what we did on

Saturday night.

And I got some very nice text

messages from the organizers

that I met with saying thank

you.

You know you all did a great job

and I thank them for for doing

what they said they were going

to do.

But it's it's typically after

dark and it and it builds the

tension builds and the and the

threats build.

And that's kind of that's how it

all develops.

When you talk about the tension

building I have two questions.

The first is there's a curfew

kind of try to address that.

Is that one of the reasons we

consider a curfew and that's

sort of my main question.

Right.

The curfew helps in this way.

You know we're not we're not out

to run everybody down that's on

the street after curfew is in

effect last night.

We had about 130 people or so in

Travis Park after the curfew.

So we went up and we advised

them reminded them that there is

a curfew.

Many of them left.

Many of them stayed but they

were just they were just in the

park.

They weren't causing any

problems.

And we left them alone.

But but the curfew helps when

you've got roving bands of

individuals who are who are

destroying property and I'll use

Commerce Street as an example.

You've got bands of individuals

who are destroying property.

If if we're if we're riding up

Commerce Street and we're trying

to prevent property destruction

after the reports of windows

being broken and businesses

being broken into.

If we see someone on the street

we're able to stop them because

of that curfew.

If there's no curfew we can't

stop them unless we see them

actually breaking the windows or

breaking into the buildings.

We're we're pretty much

powerless as far as a legal

option goes to stop them.

It's a tool in the toolbox to

prevent yes looting.

That's exactly right.

So since 9/11 I understand that

the Department of Homeland

Security the Justice Department

have given local governments

more money for a kind of more

advanced equipment for police

departments.

Is that accurate.

And do you think that that tends

to escalate situations and what

is your philosophy on that.

You have to be careful what

tactics you use what tactics you

display because it doesn't cite

my fact.

We've made several adjustments

during during the past few days

to try and de-escalate.

And I won't say what they are

but we've made several

adjustments to try to

de-escalate.

Our goal is to two to allow

people to exercise their First

Amendment rights.

Any constitutional right for

that matter.

And do it in a way that that

we're not interfering or we're

not causing concern to the

protesters.

But once there's there's danger

to to life and limb or danger to

property then we're bound to

intervene.

So these protests kind of arose

out of a long time where people

felt like police officers maybe

inappropriate force weren't

being held accountable.

I know that you and your job

have to deal with these

complaints all the time.

What are some constraints you

face in trying to discipline

officers.

Well there's there's laws and

and rules contractual and state

law that that we're that we

abide by that we have to abide

by contractual laws that are

that are that are founded on

some of them founded on state

law.

For example the right to

arbitrate.

So that's that's in Chapter 143

and it's also in in the the

police contract with Chief Bill

McManus.

Thank you so much for joining us

and thanks for working to keep

our community safe.

You're welcome.

Thank you.

The fourth century quest for

racial justice continues.

Joining us is in a factory who

helped organize the George Floyd

vigil at Travis Park.

Thank you for being here.

Thank you for having me.

What was the goal of the vigil

on Saturday.

The goal of the vigil was to

stand in solidarity with the

rest of the country concerning

George Floyd and a lot of other

black lives that have been lost.

I know that George Floyd gets

all the attention but just the

latest in a long list of lives

who have been lost some of them

high profile but a lot of them

behind closed doors.

Can you talk about that a little

bit.

Yeah absolutely.

George Floyd I'm an arbitrary

before him.

Brianna Taylor It's been a

month.

I mean there have been

executions of black people on

live television streaming

through the media.

And it's sickening.

And as a black community we just

we can't take it anymore.

So you helped organize the

vigil.

I know that you were out there

giving bottles of water to

people and everything.

What was it like logistically to

get a vigil like that going.

It was fast and moves very fast.

The community came through.

Cars were pulling up after each

other.

Donating oranges granola bars.

The community really made sure

that the protesters had what

they needed to stay hydrated.

I mean that was important for me

as an organizer to make sure

that the people who came out

were safe.

Safety was my biggest concern.

And that's why I emphasized a

peaceful protest because I

wanted people to be safe.

In the end because Black Lives

was what we were there to come

together for.

So you had like hundreds of

people show up right and you

marched around downtown.

Is that correct.

Thousands and thousands of

people shouted.

It was a big was a big number I

knew that.

And then it broke up at Travis

park and then what gets all the

attention is the standoff at the

Alamo and then what happened on

Houston Street later in the

night.

Is there a concern that those

kind of bad actors are going to

divert away from the message

you're trying to spread in our

community.

I think throughout history they

always have.

There are always people who who

do things you know.

But I think that the emphasis is

once again on black lives.

Our intent was very pure and it

was very vocal.

We went out there with pure

intentions.

So I don't give credence to

troublemakers necessarily but do

I think that the country has a

right to be outraged.

Absolutely.

Do I think that rage is

beautiful for black folk.

Absolutely and I think that it's

justified that people are angry.

But I I know that my intention

was a peaceful protest for San

Antonio.

But I'm not going to talk down

on folks who feel enraged in

their actions and the actions

that come after that.

So the protests have continued

since Saturday.

We've seen some disturbing

videos of escalation of force

with wooden bullets rubber

bullets tear gas I believe.

What do you think about the

escalation of police force and

do you think that that hurts

maintain the peace.

Absolutely I think that's very

disappointing.

It is our First Amendment right

to assemble and to protest

peacefully.

And I think that that's being

violated with excessive force

when it's clear that people are

out there fighting for their

rights.

I think that Texas as a whole we

can come together and we can

definitely do better when it

comes to legislation.

I mean communicating with the

community.

I think that we have to stay

safe and for organizers like me

I now have to switch up the game

I have to figure out how to keep

organizing and keeping people

safe because you know law

enforcement seems to have an

agenda.

Yeah.

So you have to define an agenda

to counteract that right.

What do you kind of besides the

de-escalation of force.

Well what are you thinking about

are the top priorities of the

agenda right now the top

priorities of the agenda are

doing interviews like this

keeping the conversation going

being open with the media having

a black activist come out on the

record because a lot of black

activists are scared to speak up

on camera because our lives are

in danger for what we do the

community the Latino community

everybody coming together to

stand in solidarity is super

important.

I could have absolutely not done

any of this without the Brown

Berets without the community.

So I'm very grateful but I'm I'm

just getting another black life

will be lost and other black

lives have been lost protesting.

So what happens a lot to your

point is we have these videos

that come out and people are

outraged by them and there's

some protest and then a few

weeks goes by and it kind of

dies down and then there's

another incident just for

centuries of that right it seems

like.

And so my question for you is

you're interested in keeping

this on top of the agenda.

What are you going to do to keep

it on top of the agenda.

You said media.

Is there anything else you have

in mind.

Absolutely I'm going to keep

organizing I'm working on

projects in the community where

the community can come together

and really just kind of debrief

and actually you know mourn the

loss of the lives lost.

I'm working on a painting a

mural painting that the

community can come and paint.

I'm I'm working on just

different strategies.

I definitely am not done

protesting I'm not done

exercising my right I just have

to go about it a different way

now with all of the legal

ramifications that I could face.

So speaking of the history of

protest you made some headlines

when you were UTSA student

talking about the sexual assault

policies on campus.

I think there are some changes

result of your activism can you

talk about that activism and the

change that came about.

Yes yes.

A year ago at UTSA I started to

move called Hashtag change rape

culture and I fought for these

these survivors.

I mean for the rights of

survivors on campus pertaining

to sexual assault and violence I

challenged UTSA as Title 9

policies I had questions about

investigations about Survivor

representation on campus and so

I pushed and I pushed and I

pushed and I never expected to

make headlines.

I just really wanted a

conversation to start on campus

but from there I was not

satisfied with the response and

I really just kept my foot on

UTSA as NEC per say and I move

around to other institutions

around San Antonio and do the

same thing I question their

Title 9 and their policies.

Do you feel like that was a

worthwhile cause of course

because you're continuing to

your line of advocacy right.

Absolutely.

Do you feel like you're the

voice of a generation.

I mean a lot of young people get

a bad rap for not being engaged

enough but you are changing rape

culture of the Black Lives

Matter.

I mean do you feel like you're

you're a voice for a lot of

people.

I feel like I could be but I do

know that I could not be where I

am without my ancestors.

I know that I could not be where

I am without the people who

marched before me.

So because they marched I can

continue to march and I always

want to give credence to that.

So you know there's this history

of activism.

What's what's new for you what's

new for me.

We'll see.

I'm just kind of going wherever

the wind blows me.

But I do know that speaking up

for these things it's almost

like a calling for myself and

for others it's the 21st century

it's 20 20 and people are still

getting shot in the street and

executed publicly.

So what's the one message you'd

want our viewers to take away

from this.

I want people to take away that

hashtag black lives matter and

that San Antonio cares about

black lives.

And I care about black lives and

we need to keep this

conversation going.

Can be a factor.

Thank you for your advocacy and

thank you for joining us.

Thank you the protests and the

aftermath have been particularly

difficult for downtown

businesses.

Joining us uk and Christian Oba

with a cool public relations.

What is the impact of the

protests in the aftermath on

your business.

Business has been good.

You know we've had a nice little

reprieve in the two months of

Colvin we've been able to

reconnect and with our brand as

well as reconnect with our

community.

But since the devastating tragic

loss of great of Judge Floyd

we've been really active in just

connecting and connecting and

connecting with our community by

way of our brands that we work

for.

So business has been unscathed.

That's good news.

Your business headquarters is

located at Alamo and Houston I

understand or Broadway and

Houston who's struggling in

Houston.

That's near the Alamo.

You were near the protests.

Yes I understand that you've

provided some refuge and you

were kind of involved with that.

What was that.

So prior to the protest starting

we had a few friends of ours

actually stopped by our office

and we just organized got

ourselves together and then we

took the walk to Travis and then

walked with the peaceful

protests after the protest

ended.

We all walked back to Travis

office over in a bar in Houston

right in the middle.

Our office is right there on

Broadway right before you turned

the corner down commerce.

It was just reasonable to stop

and get some water meet up with

some friends kind of watch just

people watch for a moment and

just experience it.

So I know that there was some

vandalism and stuff that

happened in the evening with

some agitators who did that.

Did your business get affected

by that.

No.

Of this business were affected

by that.

That's great.

Then the cleanup the next day

Sunday that was an inspiring

message I know that you probably

had some friends and clients out

there what would you think about

that.

We loved the cleanup the way the

scientific community came

together and helped out.

We even had a prior business

owner who had a store next to

us.

He came from came back into the

town and actually assisted a few

of the other folks that were

affected by the looting.

So what do you see moving

forward.

I know that we've we're in about

a week of protests and I know

that people are still angry and

understandably so.

What do you wear where do you

see it going.

I see a lot of people gaining a

new voice.

I see everyday folks on the

march was just everyday people

using their everyday voices.

I see everyday people speaking

up against discrimination

speaking up against anti

blackness and then speaking up

against speaking up for

accountability within our

decision makers.

And so I see more people taking

a stance and that's the future

of the movement.

That's something that we haven't

been able to to get to in past

years sadly.

But now there's a lot of you

know this is it this is we're

tired of it we're watching

people who've been on the

sidelines to take a stand.

You are do you see that

happening.

Yes we do see that happening.

And I think it's very important

that people need to take a

stand.

If you don't take a stand and

you're not able to speak truth

to power all you have is just a

system that will keep demonizing

or putting people down and we

don't need that anymore

especially in 21st century

society.

So that's.

That seems like a positive

outcome it's been tragic

circumstances all the way

around.

You said you represent the

hospitality industry.

I know that they've been have a

lot of trouble with the code in

the shut down.

What has been the reaction in

the hospitality industry to the

corona virus and how you've

you've responded to that.

Our clients have had a very

tumultuous experience in terms

of making sure that they can

keep employees making sure that

they can voice to their

communities their open hours and

close hours of course.

We've been able to work with a

local favorite called The Joke

check and they've created these

bundles is watching these

business owners create these

pivots in how they offer their

services especially the

restaurant industry.

They've opened up their doors to

become supermarkets for their

community to do food drives to

drop our food in the front lines

of code that first responders

and then now you see different

restaurants offering to assist

marchers by dropping off water

and paying it forward.

The amount of care and

compassion that came to these

owners during the course of it

pandemic and that we're still in

the middle of they are paying it

for it to the community and it's

really becoming very very

inspirational absolutely

inspirational.

Speaking of inspirational I know

that you were involved with

organizing a processional for

George Floyd on Saturday morning

I think seventy five cars.

Can you talk about that.

I was joined with Katherine

Pruitt.

She is the editor of ethical

sales.

And Celeste a lot of brown.

She's a local policy changer

influencer and we got together

and we wanted to both respect

show some respect to these lost

souls.

So we were marching we decided

that marching would be a little

bit hard for the entire

community to participate in and

a processional in a place like

San Antonio that respects things

like life as well as death and

the family ties.

It was it was something that

that was transitional for our

movement.

It caught the eyes and the

attention of our network and we

were able to do that.

And it became a very personal

experience.

Afterwards we socially distance

in a large parking lot and we

shared words and you to see

black women standing up in front

of these crowds of black brown

and white neighbors good people.

It was definitely something I

had never seen in San Antonio

before and something I look

forward to definitely seeing

again very soon.

When you said that words were

exchanged what kinds of words.

What was the message.

The message was was of course

solidarity making sure our

community understands how hurt

we are as black Americans.

How how this affects the way we

raise our boys the way we

introduce our daughters to the

community.

We shared messages of how to

create the change that we want

to see in terms of reaching out

to policymakers and ensuring

that we educate ourselves on

what these policies and

securities me especially in our

law enforcement.

And then I shared a story of my

brother who was detained over

the over a insufficient claim.

And it led to his downward

spiral.

And so we created a great sense

of community that that that

provided comfort and compassion.

And then at the same time really

hopefully created some change.

Hope to hear more of those

stories to create that change.

Speaking of change downtown has

been changed a lot.

We went from being dead from the

cold and shut down.

Now we've had these these

protests and it's been kind of

strange.

Y'all have been downtown

supporters and activists for

quite some time would say What

do you what do you think is the

future downtown.

Well I think the future of

downtown is very very good.

I do believe that there is an

opportunity for us to have more

diverse community business

owners being part of downtown.

And for you know other business

owners or people of color to see

downtown as an opportunity to

grow themselves grow their

network grow their family wealth

and at the same time grow their

passion.

So you know we always see

stories of folks that when they

start a business they go out to

stonewall or they go down to the

south side and understand that

economically sometimes that can

be better.

But in order to have a thriving

San Antonio really fully in the

the mayor's mandate of focusing

on downtown growing the urban

core is something that everyone

should get behind.

Well sad to say but Christian

read us but thank you all for

joining us and thanks for all

you're doing in our community.

Thank you for having us.

Now for the reporters roundtable

joining us is join Pelosi as

local government reporter Texas

Public Radio and Emily Eaton

criminal justice reporter San

Antonio Express News.

Emily what's been going on the

last week.

Well for the last five days

we've seen demonstrations and

protests in San Antonio and on

two occasions both on Saturday

and Tuesday.

We saw police use force on the

demonstrators in an effort to

sort of disperse the crowd.

They say although that has

obviously gotten some attention

from the demonstrators and they

say that wasn't justified.

So both of you were at the event

on Tuesday when there was sort

of a an intense interaction.

Can you describe your

perspective.

Absolutely.

So for it started around 5:00

p.m. at the courthouse and it

was a rather weird demonstration

in that there was no one

organizer.

And so at times it seemed rather

aimless it would they would go

to the police department that

they would come back.

Then they would go to the police

department then they would come

back.

And so that went on for about

three or four hours and finally

they ended up at Travis park and

then they decided to go to Alamo

Plaza which of course was closed

to try to curtail any type of

demonstrations there or any type

of unrest.

And so once they arrived there

they were greeted by a line of

police officers and more police

officers came in and the

traditional riot gear including

the helmet and the face shields

and the body body armor and some

had gas masks.

And from my perspective I was

standing right near Ripley's

Believe It Or Not.

And I was actually right next to

Joey and we were both taking

video of the demonstrators and

one demonstrator threw a plastic

water bottle at the police

officers.

It bounced off his chest sort

of.

He sort of just shrugged.

He sort of just flinched

shrugged and it went on the

ground and then all of a couple

of demonstrators said you know

hey cut it out that's not what

we're here for.

We're here for peace.

And it was about maybe a a

minute in 30 seconds or two

minutes.

And at that point the police

officers started using pepper

bullets and smoke to try to

disperse the crowd.

There was a separate incident

that was going on away from us

that we didn't see that other

video captured.

I see.

So what kind of projectiles were

used.

Joey I mean rubber bullets.

Well what else.

Right.

So when police started firing we

didn't know what was being shot.

So Emily and I we were standing

right next to each other.

And personally I was not going

to wait to find out.

So I started running and when I

started running the entire crowd

of people just started going up

Latoya street.

There was this smell in the air

afterwards.

It was really caustic it was

really it was really it kind of

burned to breathe.

Don't think it was tear gas.

My my guess then it was pepper

pellets but it didn't start

really smelling it until we got

to the end of last Sawyer Street

over near forget which street

exactly it is before we got to

commerce.

In an interview that I did with

CPD spokesman a little bit

around midnight or so early

Wednesday they had said that

they had used tear gas that they

had used pepper pellets they had

used rubber bullets and that

they had used wooden pellets as

well which if I'm not mistaken

Mark dumpling with the express

news was actually hit with one

of those and he tweeted it out

that it had made contact with

him.

As I was going up commerce

towards La soya this is video

that I had shared on Twitter.

Afterwards there were two or

three people running up the

street and two of them were hit

by the spark and whatever it was

fell to the ground and started

smoking and the two the two guys

continued running.

Not sure what that was.

I was probably maybe some type

of smoke grenade.

I didn't smell of like tear gas

but once it hit I started

running towards Commerce Street

too.

So you're describing a pretty

effective crowd dispersal

techniques where people were

running.

Do we know exactly what caused

them to fire.

Those have been kind of

identified in the other videos

you mentioned.

Emily Yes and no.

So the police say that anytime

water bottles are used that it

has the potential to get really

bad really fast.

And so I think as soon as that

first water bottle was thrown

they decided they were going to

disperse the crowd separately.

There is a video captured by

someone a journalist from Metro

News Service I believe is the

organization and that video

shows a couple of demonstrators

as the riot police officers are

lining up.

They're sort of they're a ways

away from the police officers

but they're going back and forth

they're being a little

confrontational.

They're getting up a little in

their face and then coming back

cursing a little bit and the

officers are doing a little bit

of the same.

You know they're sort of like

getting back to pushing on that

standoff.

It is.

And and it's a little unclear

because the video is a little

shaky but at that point sort of

someone lunges for the police

officer launches forward pushes

the guy then stands back and

then several shots were fired.

Jody have a sense of what the

review is after an incident like

this internally at CPD.

Have they shared that with you.

Do they do an internal audit so

to speak of this.

Well I afterwards after my video

was posted online I did get a

couple of calls from the city

one from city city spokeswoman

who was just checking to make

sure it was OK.

And then also after I made a

request to LAPD Lieutenant Jesse

Solomon called me as well and

that's when I did the interview

and he had said what what was

what was used.

I would imagine that there's

there's a review I was expecting

as a party to have some type of

press conference the next day

but rather the chief put out a

lengthy statement about the

actions that were taken.

Some of the results they even

think of the chief's statement

even mentioned that two

journalists were hit earlier

today or very early this

morning.

No I'm sorry later in the day or

later in the morning LAPD had

said how many arrests were made

and I think there were a total

of eight they actually listed

six charges that people had had

gotten to like maybe inciting a

riot.

Was one of them I think one

person was even crossing against

a a crossing against the signal

I think which I thought was an

interesting charge to put

against somebody.

And I don't know how much what

else we will we will get from

SIPC.

I can't recall all of what the

chief's statement was it was

extensive it was it was a very

very long statement.

But the police department is

receiving a lot of criticism a

lot of people had said that they

don't believe that the use of

force that LAPD used was

justified in a question that I

had asked Lieutenant Solomon.

He had said that the department

did believe it was justified

because of the they don't know

what the contents of those

bottles can be.

He he had alluded to you know

sometimes they could be filled

with bleach sometimes it could

be filled with urine but we have

no way of what note was knowing.

And we have no way of knowing

what was in that at least that

one bottle that we saw was

thrown.

I think there was also I

mentioned that you know there

was a glass bottle thrown.

I don't remember seeing a glass

bottle or hearing any glass

break.

So you know I'm hoping we'll

hear more from CPD soon.

So this is a highly tense

situation.

Not a lot of information about

what's going on from the video

it seems a little bit like a war

zone almost.

Emily did you get any training

on how to cover stuff like this

in journalism school or any kind

of certification or do you just

kind of show up to the front

lines and there you are.

Yes and no I think the best

training you can have is to have

experience.

And so I too I did a number of

internships and I had experience

tear gas before.

I also separate from this had

witnessed a murder while on the

job.

So that prepared me for this.

But there also is no

preparation.

I mean there state things that

you can do to make sure that

you're in buddy systems you know

a lot of the reporters so you

can sort of check in on each

other.

But then at the end of the day

you just you have to be smart.

Emily Eaton So Antonio Express

News Joy blocks to Texas Public

Radio thank you for joining us.

For our last segment the

Reporters Roundtable we have

Gilbert Garcia metro columnist

San Antonio Express News.

Thank you for being here.

Thank you.

So it's been quite the Newsweek.

What was your read on the

situation.

Well I think one of things

that's been interesting has been

that there has been a lot of

talk about the media coverage of

the protests in San Antonio and

other cities.

And on the one hand you have

people I think fairly making the

point.

These are people who are

supportive of the protesters

saying that most of the people

protesting have been doing so

peacefully and are trying to

make a serious point about

police reform.

And they probably feel that

there's been too much coverage

of you know the the bad actors

and the people who've been you

know committed acts of vandalism

and so on.

On the other hand you have I've

heard people say that you know

there's not enough on the other

side of the aisle saying that

there has been enough coverage

of some of the the acts of

violence.

I think I am often critical of

24 hour news channels because I

think that there's a tendency to

try to fill up a lot of time

with conjecture and

pontificating and not so much

not as much reporting.

I think this is one of those

instances though where the 24

hour news channels have been

able to do what they are there

they can often do well which is

there.

They have so much time that

they've had reporters out there

on the ground in various cities

and we're able to see over a

long period of time how some of

these protests are developing

and I think what we've seen and

the thing is this was certainly

true Saturday night in San

Antonio that we had a really

peaceful protest and after it it

basically disbanded you had

people like you East Houston

Street for example just smashing

windows and doing a lot of

damage.

And I think they were loosely

affiliated affiliated at all

with what the protests were.

So you had thousands of people

at the protest at Travis park

and then it devolves into just a

few people running around on

Houston Street breaking windows

and you know that we have a

history of a situation where

there will be people who will

exploit you know protest

movements you know I mean if we

go back historically with Martin

Luther King was in Memphis when

he was shot because he was he

was his second attempt to try to

lead a march in support of

garbage workers who were on

strike.

And the first one had devolved

into this into chaos where you

had destruction on Beale Street

and that sort of thing.

And he was so dismayed by what

happened.

Felt I need to go back and we

need to do it right.

And so when you have the you

know the the foremost civil

rights leader of his time and

maybe of all time even he was

not able to control what was

going on in that situation.

So you know there were there

will be you get a big crowd of

people together at night and

this this will happen.

And there is also we've also had

situations where police officers

in some situations have maybe

overreacted because of the

tension of the situation and

that's been a problem too.

You wrote a column that I

thought was great recently where

you talked about the underlying

issues the underlying tension

with the protests.

So we have a pandemic

disproportionately affecting

certain communities.

We have an economic crisis this

report that Fortunately

Americans are committed to this

long list of people being

basically murdered by bad

actors.

Can you talk about that a little

bit.

Yeah I mean this is I mean we

were really looking at a

situation in this country where

we're we're having the worst

public health crises we've had

in more than a hundred years.

We're having the worst economic

crisis that we've had in more

than 80 years.

And on top of that the issues

that have really been bubbling

under the surface in American

society for four decades I think

they've just really intensified

and people have asked Well what

is it about George Boyd killing

in Minneapolis that has it seems

you've had a different effect.

We've seen protests over other

acts of police brutality.

But I think the just the nature

of this the fact that you had a

police officer who had his knee

on his neck for nine minutes and

people got to see this play out

over such a long period.

I mean when you have Rush

Limbaugh for example you know

has been you know popular

conservative talk show host for

30 plus years saying Oh I think

the police officer should get

this should be a first degree

murder case.

I mean he's basically you're not

you're not really having

disputes.

The truth is self-evident.

That's right.

We've had some instances Trayvon

Martin some other situations

where young black men have been

killed and there has been some

dispute about the facts or what.

Whether justice was served or

not.

I don't think we really have a

dispute now that maybe there's

been a difference in focus.

Maybe the protesters are

focusing more on that killing

and maybe people on the right

are focusing more on what they

think has been an improper

response to it or you know acts

of violence.

But there's not a lot of dispute

about right now about what

happened and that it was wrong.

And so I think that it is

intensified these these these

feelings that we've just in our

society for a long time that

that we don't have that for

African-Americans in this

country.

There is one type of justice

there.

The police approach people of

color in different ways than

they do others.

So you have a lot of colleagues

who are reporters at the Express

News and other outlets who are

kind of in the trenches for

these protests.

What are you hearing from them

and what is your sense of what

it's like to cover this sort of

as a as a reporter in the

protest.

Well I think it's a stressful

thing and I mean you know we had

we've had Tuesday night.

We had you know tear gas and we

had rubber bullets being fired

into a crowd.

We had we had reporters there in

the middle of that.

And it's it's really a very

stressful tough situation.

And you know the sad thing about

it is that I think that the

great majority of people are

trying I think to do the right

thing and they're trying to

approach the police with with

respect they want to see police

reform but they're poaching

individual officers they

encounter with respect and I

think that there are police

officers who are also trying to

to to do the right thing.

But it seems that you know one

one incident of someone throwing

a bottle or one police officer

maybe you know getting getting

stressed out by the situation

just leads to all kinds of

problems.

So switching gears a little bit

the Republican Party chair here

in Bear County you've been

covering that race for a while.

Well she kind of posted some

conspiracy theories about the

George Floyd murder what's going

on there.

Yeah.

This week Cynthia Braham posted

a face had a Facebook post in

which she threw out the theory

that the killing of George Floyd

may have been staged and did not

say that she believed this to be

true but kind of asked the

question Is it possible that

this is what happened and the

popular rhetorical device.

Right.

What do you think staged.

And so you know the the I think

the theory at work was that she

she found some some aspects of

the story suspicious and and she

suggested and I don't know that

there's data to back this up.

But she suggested that President

Trump is seeking greater

approval among African-American

voters than he has in the past

and that this may have been a

staged event to try to undermine

that and create racial tension

or increase racial tension in

the United States.

And I think you know some of the

people who were her Facebook

friends responded you know they

took it seriously and that which

I find kind of bizarre.

I don't think you know chief.

She has a tough runoff race with

a man named John Austin who is a

real estate appraiser and has

been involved in the Republican

Party and you know I think that

one of the things we're holding

you have to reckon with is the

fact that this person who's been

in charge the party has just in

the last three months has thrown

out the theory that George Floyd

and Kelly may have staged that

the corona virus may have been a

hoax promulgated by Democrats to

bring down President Trump and

also has accused the Bear County

Elections Department of vote

tampering and almost pulled out

of the joint primary that we

haven't Bear County.

So I think Republican voters are

going to have to decide who do

they what's what is going to

help them try to help me win

elections in November and just

run run the organization or do

they want someone who's going to

be putting these theories out so

that's good.

You're describing a post truth

politician you're really

interested in the truth.

I know that your colleagues

these rescues are too.

Do you think they're going to be

able to continue to cover this

with its level of intensity and

fairness if this story continues

to play out the way they are

talking about the brand.

I know I'm sorry that the Black

Lives Matter protests and the

George Floyd.

Yeah I think so.

I mean I really think I know

that the press gets a lot of

criticism in this country from

from from all angles.

But I really do think that we've

seen people trying to deal with

the nuance of of the protests

and what happened in this case

and there is a lot of nuance to

it.

There are I mean I saw the

footage and in Nashville for

example of a middle aged

African-American man scolding a

young white kid who was

committing an act of vandalism

saying you know you're going to

you we're going to get blamed

for this and you're going to be

making us look.

So there's that there's all

kinds of complexity to what's

going on here.

Where do we look at it.

You know we look at the issue of

police reform or we look at the

racial issues and it certainly

really demands some coverage

that's going to approach it with

that nuance requires a

discerning eye over Garcia.

Thank you for joining us so

much.

I thank you for joining us for

this special edition of On The

Record as always go to Kayla

encore for this episode of

previous episodes and video

podcast form.

We'll see you next week.

Thank you.