>> Jon Schwantes: THE RIGHT

TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS IS

ENSHRINED, OF COURSE, IN THE

SECOND AMENDMENT, BUT THE ISSUE

IS SECOND TO NONE, IT SEEMS, IN

ITS ABILITY TO SPARK PASSIONATE

DEBATE.

IN THE WAKE OF THE DECEMBER 14

SCHOOL SHOOTING THAT CLAIMED THE

LIVES OF 20 CHILDREN AND 6

ADULTS IN NEWTOWN, CONNECTICUT,

GUN CONTROL AND SCHOOL SAFETY

HAVE DOMINATED THE NATIONAL

CONVERSATION.

THE PRESIDENT AND THE VICE

PRESIDENT, BOTH HOUSES OF

CONGRESS, GOVERNORS AND STATE

LEGISLATORS, MAYORS AND LOCAL

OFFICIALS, COUNTLESS

SPECIAL-INTEREST GROUPS...

THEY'VE ALL GOTTEN IN ON THE

DISCUSSION.

THIS WEEK, PBS WEIGHED IN WITH

"AFTER NEWTOWN," FIVE DAYS OF

SPECIAL PROGRAMMING, INCLUDING

GUN-THEMED INSTALLMENTS OF

NEWSHOUR, FRONTLINE, WASHINGTON

WEEK, EVEN NOVA.

NOW, IT'S OUR TURN.

HI. I'M JON

SCHWANTES, AND ON THIS

EDITION OF "INDIANA LAWMAKERS,"

WE'LL EXPLORE THE ISSUE WITH A

PANEL OF HOOSIER EXPERTS AND

ADVOCATES.

LET'S START WITH A LEGISLATIVE

UPDATE FROM BRITTANY MUNCY OF

THESTATEHOUSEFILE-DOT-COM, A

SERVICE OF FRANKLIN COLLEGE'S

>> PRESIDENT BARACK OBAMA AND

SOME STATES ARE LOOKING TOWARD

GUN CONTROL AS A REACTION TO THE

DEADLY SHOOTING AT SANDY HOOK

ELEMENTARY SCHOOL IN

CONNECTICUT.

BUT THERE'S NO SUCH DISCUSSION

IN INDIANA, WHERE THE STATE

CONSTITUTION SAYS MORE CLEARLY

THAT HOOSIERS CAN CARRY GUNS.

SO LAWMAKERS ARE FOCUSING ON

OTHER WAYS TO PROTECT STUDENTS.

SENATE BILL1 WOULD GIVE SCHOOLS

$50,000 ANNUAL GRANTS TO PAY FOR

A RESOURCE OFFICER AND TO

PURCHASE SAFETY EQUIPMENT AND

TECHNOLOGY.

WE'VE DONE A NEEDS ASSESSMENT.

I THINK THERE WERE 1,200 PEOPLE

THAT WERE INTERVIEWED - SO IT'S

PARENTS AND TEACHERS,

PRINCIPALS, SCHOOL

SUPERINTENDENTS, LAW

ENFORCEMENT, EVEN SOME OF THE

SCHOOL RESOURCE OFFICERS.

AND WHAT WE'VE IDENTIFIED - AND

THIS WAS BEFORE THE SHOOTINGS IN

CONNECTICUT - SO THIS REALLY

RECOGNIZES WHAT THE NEEDS ARE

OUT IN THE SCHOOLS WITH THE

LOCAL LAW ENFORCEMENT SO THEY'VE

THOUGHT WHAT THEY'D REALLY LIKE

TO SEE.

I'M SURE AFTER THE TREMENDOUS

TRAGEDY THAT THEY REEVALUATED

OUR PROCEDURES FOR ALLOWING

VISITORS IN, THE PROCEDURES FOR

HAVING DOORS AVAILABLE, UNLOCKED

AT THE BEGINNING OF THE SCHOOL,

AS WELL AS HOW ARE WE CONNECTED

WITH OUR LOCAL AGENCIES.

FOR "INDIANA LAWMAKERS" AND

THESTATEHOUSEFILE.COM, I'M

BACK IN A MOMENT WITH OUR

ROUNDTABLE DISCUSSION.

"INDIANA LAWMAKERS"...

FROM THE STATEHOUSE...

>> Jon Schwantes: AS I NOTED AT

THE TOP OF THE PROGRAM, THE

NEWTOWN SCHOOL SHOOTING PROMPTED

THE WHITE HOUSE TO DECLARE WAR

ON GUN VIOLENCE.

UNDER THE RALLYING CRY "NOW IS

THE TIME," PRESIDENT BARACK

OBAMA HAS BEEN CRISSCROSSING THE

COUNTRY, DRUMMING UP SUPPORT FOR

THE MULTIFACETED PLAN HE

UNVEILED LAST MONTH.

AMONG OTHER THINGS, THE

PRESIDENT WANTS CONGRESS TO

CLOSE BACKGROUND-CHECK

LOOPHOLES, BAN MILITARY-STYLE

ASSAULT WEAPONS AND

HIGH-CAPACITY MAGAZINES, STIFFEN

FEDERAL GUN-TRAFFICKING LAWS AND

FUND THE HIRING OF ADDITIONAL

SCHOOL-RESOURCE OFFICERS.

ALTHOUGH CONGRESS IS LIKELY TO

DEBATE AT LEAST SOME OF THE

ADMINISTRATION'S PROPOSALS, IT'S

BECOMING INCREASINGLY CLEAR THAT

THE REAL BATTLE IS GOING TO BE

FOUGHT IN STATE CAPITALS ACROSS

THE COUNTRY, INCLUDING

INDIANAPOLIS.

NATIONWIDE, ACCORDING TO

CONGRESSIONAL QUARTERLY, STATE

LEGISLATORS HAVE INTRODUCED MORE

THAN 23-HUNDRED GUN-RELATED

BILLS AND ENACTED MORE THAN 130

OF THEM ... SINCE JANUARY 1 ST,

BARELY SEVEN WEEKS AGO.

JOINING ME FOR A CLOSER LOOK AT

GUN VIOLENCE AND SCHOOL SAFETY

HERE IN INDIANA ARE ...

REPUBLICAN SENATOR BRENT WALTZ

OF GREENWOOD, WHO DESCRIBES

HIMSELF AS A "CARD-CARRYING LIFE

MEMBER OF THE NATIONAL RIFLE

ASSOCIATION AND A STRONG

ADVOCATE OF GUN RIGHTS"...

DEMOCRATIC SENATOR GREG TAYLOR

OF INDIANAPOLIS, WHO IN RECENT

YEARS HAS OPPOSED ATTEMPTS TO

EASE RESTRICTIONS ON CONCEALED

WEAPONS, PARTICULARLY IN PLACES

SUCH AS LIBRARIES, PUBLIC

HOSPITALS AND GOVERNMENT MEETING

ROOMS...PROFESSOR THOMAS STUCKY,

DIRECTOR OF CRIMINAL JUSTICE AND

PUBLIC-SAFETY PROGRAMS IN THE

SCHOOL OF PUBLIC AND

ENVIRONMENTAL AFFAIRS AT INDIANA

UNIVERSITY-PURDUE UNIVERSITY AT

INDIANAPOLIS...

AND STEVE GARNER, CHIEF OF

POLICE FOR INDIANAPOLIS PUBLIC

SCHOOLS, ONE OF THE STATE'S

LARGEST SCHOOL DISTRICTS, WITH

MORE THAN 30,000 STUDENTS, 60

SCHOOLS, AND 65 FULL-TIME POLICE

AND I THANK YOU ALL FOR BEING

HERE TO TAKE PART IN THIS

DISCUSSION. WHY DO YOU THINK

IT IS THAT ANY DISCUSSION OF GYN

VIOLENCE AND GUN

LIMITATIONS PROVEHICLE SUCH

STRONG FEELINGS?

>> IT'S AN EMOTIONAL ISSUE, AND

IT'S DIFFICULT

SOMETIMES TO HAVE A DISCUSSION,

AND EVEN MORE SO WHEN

PEOPLE DON'T UNDERSTAND THE

ISSUE, WHETHER THE

CONSTITUTIONAL OR LEGAL ELEMENTS

TO IT, LAST SUMMER

WHEN RUNNING FOR REELECTION, I

SHOWED A DEMOCRAT MEMBER

OF THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY OPPOSED

TO THE SECOND AMENDMENT

AND GUN RIGHTS, A PIECE OF MY

CAMPAIGN LITERATURE, AND

THIS INDIVIDUAL SAID, THE SECOND

AMENDMENT, THAT'S THE

GUN ONE, RIGHT?

>> I THOUGHT THIS PERSON WAS

JOKING, AND THEN I LOOKED

AT THIS PERSON AND WAS SHOCKED

TO LEARN THERE WAS NO

JOKE THERE. AND SO THIS IS A

PERSON WHO WILL GO TO THE

FLOOR OF THEIR RESPECTIVE

CHAMBER AND SPEAK VERY

PARTIALLY ON THE ISSUE OF GUN

CONTROL, AND SO BEFORE I

THINK WE CAN HAVE A REEL

LEGITIMATE CONVERSATION ABOUT

GUN RIGHTS AND SAFETY, WE HAVE

TO UNDERSTAND THE

DOCUMENTS AND THE ROLE THEY

PLAY.

>> AND EDUCATION AN ISSUE.

>> IN MANY WAYS.

>> IT WOULDN'T TAKE A STUDENT OF

THE CONSTITUTION MUCH

TIME TO READ THE SECOND

AMENDMENT, I THINK IT'S 23

WORDS, AND IF YOU LOOK AT

INDIANA CONSTITUTION, EVEN

SHORTER, 17 WORDS, IF YOU LOOK

AT THE AMOUNT OF PASSION

AND ENERGY POUR WORD, A HIGH

QUOTIENT.

>> I THINK ANY TIME YOU HAVE

ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE

CONSTITUTION OF THE UNITED

STATES OR THE STATE OF

INDIANA, THERE'S GOING TO BE

PASSION. ONE THING I'VE

FELT IS WE NEED TO TAKE INTO

CONSCIOUS THE TIMES AND

ERA, INTO HAD HE THESE THINGS

WERE PASSED, PRACTICALLY,

DO SOME OF THOSE THINGS WORK,

THERE ARE MANY THINGS WE

HAVE IN THE STATE OF INDIANA,

THAT NONE OF US WOULD

EVER THINK OF WOULD BE AS

MANIABLE TODAY, BUT FOR SOME

REASON WHEN WE TALK ABOUT RIGHTS

AND PRIVILEGES, WE

TALK ABOUT GUN RIGHTS, THERE'S

RIGHTS TO VOTE, WE DON'T

HAD

WHEN

WE DON'T HAVE THAT PASSION AND

DISCUSSION, BUT WHEN YOU

TALK ABOUT INDIVIDUALS' RIGHTS

TO CARRY A HANDGUN,

CONCEAL THAT HANDGUN, AND WHERE

THEY CAN CARRY IT.

>> RIGHT TO PRAY, AASSEMBLE,

THESE ARE ALL ISSUES

CERTAINLY IMPORTANT AND THEY DO

PROVOKE DISCUSSION, BUT

NOT THE SAME LEVEL.

>> WELL, IT'S YOUR OPINION,S AN

INDIVIDUAL WHO BELIEVES

THAT OUR DUTY IN THE STATE

LEGISLATURE IS TO PROTECT

THOSE WHO CAN'T PROTECT

THEMSELVES, I THINK IT'S

IMPORTANT TO UNDERSTAND THAT IF

YOU WANT TO CARRY YOUR

HAND GUN, I HAVE FOR PROBLEM

WITH INDIVIDUALS, I JUST

THINK WE NEED TO HAVE STRICTER

RULES. WHEN AN

INDIVIDUAL CAN GO TO A A GUN

SHOW AND GET A SO-CALLED

BACKGROUND CHECK, THE INDIVIDUAL

WHO IS SELLING THE GUN

HAS NO LICENSE TO SELL THE GUN

AND THEN AN INDIVIDUAL

CAN BUY IT AND WALK-OUT, THAT'S

DANGEROUS.

>> I THINK THAT'S ONE

DISAGREEMENT WE WOULD HAVE WITH

THIS, WE DON'T TAKE AN OATH TO

DO WHAT WE THINK IS

RIGHT, BUT TO PROTECT AND DEFEND

THE CONSTITUTION, I

HAVE EVERY REASON TO BELIEVE

THAT SENATOR DAILY FEELS

AS PARTIALLY ON THE OPPOSING

SIDE OF THE ISSUE AS I DO

PROTECTING OUR RIGHTS, I'D

RECOMMEND ANYONE, SOME OF MY

LIBERAL FRIENDS WHO THINK THIS

IS A GROWING, LIVING

DOCUMENT AND WE INTERPRET WORDS

AS TIME GOES BY,

INSTEAD OF AMENDING THE

CONSTITUTION, IF YOU ARE GOING

DOWN AN INTERSTATE AND GOING 70

MILES AN HOUR, WHEN TRY

GOING 90 MILES AN HOUR, AND WHEN

PULLED OVER, JUST TELL

THE POLICE OFFICER THE SPEED

LIMIT IS A LIVING

BREATHING LAW, AND THE ROADS ARE

SAFER, AND YOU THAT

YOU HAD IT WOULD BE A GOOD IDEA

OF INTERPRETING THE

SPEED LIMIT, AND I DON'T THINK

THE OFFICER WILL

BIOTHAT.

>> STRICT DESTRUCTION INSIST

VERSUS LIVING BREATHING

DOCUMENT. OBVIOUSLY AN ISSUE,

THAT MEMBERS OF THE

SUPREME COURT AND JUDGES AROUND

THE STATE WRESTLE WITH

ALL THE TIME. PROFESSOR THOMAS

STUCKY, YOU'VE STUDIED

THESE SORTS OF THINGS AND

WATCHED THE DEBATES, IT

BOGLESS MY MIND THAT 2300 BILLS

HAVE BEEN PASSED IN

LESS THAN TWO MONTHS, SOME PRO,

SOME ANTIGUN, BUT

AGAIN, I KEEP GOING BACK TO THE

NOTION OF THE PASSION

AND RHETORIC. I SAW THIS WEEK A

LAWMAKER FROM SUBARU

BAN ST. LOUIS INTRODUCED A BILL

THAT WOULD CRIMINALIZE

THE INTRODUCTION OF GUN CONTROL

LEGISLATION, WHAT DOES

THAT SAY ABOUT THE LEVEL OF

DISCUSSION ON THIS ISSUE?

>> FROM THE STANDPOINT OF

THINKING ABOUT THIS AS A

PUBLIC POLICY ISSUE, IT'S AN

INCREDIBLY DIFFICULT

DISCUSSION BECAUSE THERE ARE SO

MANY MOVING PARTS. THE

PROBLEM, AND I PREFER TO SPEAK

OF THE PROBLEM OF GUN

VIOLENCE AS OPPOSED TO GUN

CONTROL, BECAUSE GUN

VIOLENCE IS A VERY COMPLEX

ISSUE, INCLUDING DOMESTIC

VIOLENCE WHERE A GUN IS A

PRESENT, MASS SHOOTINGS, A

DIFFERENT SCENARIO AND WOULD

REQUIRE DIFFERENT PUBLIC

POLICIES TO ADDRESS THOSE, AND

THEN YOU HAVE THE VERY

REAL PROBLEM UNFORTUNATELY SO

COMMON THAT YOUNG

PREDOMINANTLY POOR INDIVIDUALS

ARE CARRYING WEAPONS TO

PROTECT THEMSELVES, EITHER OUT

OF A SENSE OF FEAR OR

BECAUSE THEY'RE ENGAGED IN

CRIMINAL ACTIVITY AND

SHOOTING EACH OTHER, AND GUN

VIOLENCE IS RELATED TO THE

ISSUE OF GUN CONTROL BUT ALSO

VERY DIFFERENT, AND I

THINK THE FOCUS ON IMMEDIATELY

JUMPING TO THE QUESTION

OF GUN CONTROL CREATES A LARGE

DEGREE OF HEAT WITHOUT

MUCH LIGHT, PEOPLE WHO FEEL

STRONGLY ON EITHER SIDE OF

THE ISSUE, HAVE ENOUGH COMPLEX

INFORMATION IN FRONT OF

THEM TO SUPPORT THEIR VIEWS.

THERE'S CLEARLY ON THE

STRICT CONSTRUCTION INSIST SIDE,

EVIDENCE TO SUPPORT

THAT VIEW, AND ON THE ORDERS

OTHER SIDE, THERE'S

CLEARLY ENOUGH LANGUAGE TO

SUPPORT THAT AS WELL, SO

BECAUSE THE CONSTITUTIONAL PIECE

OF THIS REALLY COMES

TO SOME OF THE CORE AND THE CRUX

OF OUR CULTURE IN SOME

WAYS, THAT IT BECOMES ALMOST

IMPOSSIBLE, AND WHAT'S

DIFFICULT ABOUT THIS AS A PERSON

WHOSE TRYING TO

UNDERSTAND THE RESEARCH FROM, IF

YOU CAN, OBJECTIVELY

DO THIS, IS THAT GENERALLY

SPEAKING PEOPLE START WITH

THE CONCLUSION AND FIND EVIDENCE

TO SUPPORT THEIR

POSITION AND THERE'S ENOUGH

EVIDENCE TO SUPPORT BOTH

POSITIONS, SO PEOPLE REALLY NOT

EVEN SPEAKING TO EACH

OTHER ABOUT THE SAME THINGS.

>> YOU RAISE AN INTERESTING

POINT ABOUT THE TERMS AND

SEMANTICS, I'VE SEEN SEVERAL

THINGS THIS WEEK, THE VERY

TERM GUN CONTROL, IS THAT A

LOADED -- NO REPUBLICAN

INTENDED, IT HAS NEGATIVE BADGE

ASSOCIATED WITH IT, AND

IF YOU LOOK AT THE SPEECHES THE

PRESIDENT HAS HEAD,

TALKS ABOUT GUNS, VIOLENCE, BUT

NOT NECESSARILY GUN

GUN

CONTROL CONTROL. YOU HAVE

HEARD, CHIEF ABOUT PEOPLE

WHO MAKE THE GUNS, STUDY ABOUT

GUNS,ER EVERY DAY, YOU

AND YOUR 65 OFFICERS KEEPING

STUDENTS SAFE, WHAT'S THE

REALITY?

>> FOR ME, THERE'S A REALITY

THROUGH EVERYTHING ALREADY

BEEN DISCUSSED, WE TALK ABOUT

THE FEW SHORT WORDS, AND

THE INTERPRETATION, AND YOU MAKE

AN ANALOGY THAT A

POLICE OFFICER WOULDN'T ACCEPT,

YOUR EXPLANATION THAT

TRAFFIC LAWS ARE A LIVING

BREATHING DOCUMENT, HOWEVER,

I DON'T THINK I'VE SEEN SO FEW

WORDS SO WIDELY

INTERPRETED AS TO THE ORIGINAL,

AND CURRENT INTENT. I

HAVE A CLOSE PERSONAL FRIEND

MUCH AN ADVOCATE TO CARRY

A GUN, AND I SUGGEST TO HIM, AS

LONG AS AS IT'S IN YOUR

POCKET, POSSESSION, IT'S SAFE,

BUT HE'S HAD HIS GUN

TAKEN, I WORRY ABOUT THINGS SUCH

AS HEALTH HEAL, I

DON'T KNOW OF MY MASS SHOOTINGS

AT THE HANDS OF SOMEONE

WHO IS ANYTHING MORE THAN A

PERSON SUFFERING FROM A

MENTAL HEALTH ISSUE, REGARDLESS

OF LET'S IN THEIR HAND,

STRICTER GUN CONTROLS IN ASIAN

COUNTRIES -- I'VE GOT TO

SUPPORT ANYONE'S RIGHT AS A

REASONABLE INDIVIDUAL, AND

THAT'S HOW LAWS ARE WRITTEN, A

REASONABLE INDIVIDUAL

INTERPRETING THIS, I'M NOT SURE

WE UNDERSTAND WHO THAT

IS, WHO A REASONABLE PERSON IS,

ARE WE ON THIS PANEL

REASONABLE? CERTAINLY, ON A

DAY-TO-DAY BASIS, WE'VE

GOT TO BE, BUT I'M NOT SURE THE

PEOPLE WHO DEBATE THIS

HAVE A PERFECT UNDERSTAND OF

WHAT'S OUT HERE IN THE

SENSE THAT THE LIVES OUR

CHILDREN LIVE CURRENTLY, THIS

YOUNG MAN THAT ENACTED THIS

HOUNDERS CRIME IN

CONNECTICUT -- HORRENDOUS CRIME

IN CONNECTICUT, WHETHER

HE HAS AN UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT

WE'RE TALKING ABOUT,

WASN'T THE ISSUE, HIS LIFE WAS

CLOUDED BY MENTAL HEALTH

ISSUES, OR HIS MOTHER MIGHT HAVE

THOUGHT HE WAS SAFE IN

TEACHING HIS GUN SAFETY, IT

DIDN'T WORK.

>> PRESUMABLY SOME OF THE

STUDENTS, SENIORS OVER 18,

THEORETICALLY THEY COULD HAVE

CONCEALED, CARRY PERMITS,

THEY CAN'T CARRY THEM IN SCHOOL,

BUT DOES THAT GIVE YOU

PAUSE WHEN YOU SEE THESE

STUDENTS CARRY THEIR BOOK BAGS

CAN BE CARRYING A WEAPON?

>> I THINK THAT'S A REALLY

POSSIBILITY ON ALL OF OUR

CAMPUSES THROUGHOUT THIS NATION,

THERE'S A POSSIBILITY

SOMEONE IS CARRYING A WEAPON OF

SOME SORT, THAT ISN'T

WHAT GIVES ME PAUSE AS MUCH AS

THE PAIN AND SUFFERING

THESE CHILDREN ARE GOING THROUGH

AND THE LIVES THEY

HAVE TO LIVE, IT'S NOT

RECOGNIZED, IN MY OPINION, AT

THE APPROPRIATE LEVEL, IF WE'RE

TALKING ABOUT

REASONABLE INDIVIDUALS,

CERTAINLY REASONABLE

INDIVIDUALS OUGHT TO HAVE THE

RIGHT TO CARRY A FIREMAN

AND PROTECT THEMSELVES AND OTHER

PEOPLE, THAT'S NOT

WHAT'S HAPPENING, IN MY OPINION,

THOSE GUNS NOT IN THE

HANDS OF REASONABLE INDIVIDUALS.

>> TWO POINTS THERE, FIRST WITH

RESPECT TO THE MENTAL

HEALTH ISSUE, IT IS ABSOLUTELY

THE INDICATE THERE ARE

SOME INDIVIDUALS, AND WE HAVE A

DIFFICULT SITUATION

HERE, IN THAT THOSE EXAMPLES

LIKE NEW TOWN ARE SO

HORRIFIC, AND THIS IS IN NO WAY

TO MINIMIZE THOSE, BUT

WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT THE NUMBER

OF PEOPLE WITH MENTAL

HEALTH ISSUES AND THE NUMBER OF

PEOPLE WHO HAVE MENTAL

HEALTH ISSUES WHO ARE

POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS, EVEN

PROFESSIONALS HAVE AN EXTREME

DIFFICULTY IDENTIFYING OF

THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE MENTAL

HEALTH ISSUES, WHICH ONES

COULD BE DANGEROUS, IT'S

EXTREMELY DIFFICULT TO

IDENTIFY WHO OF THE PEOPLE WHO

PERIODICALLY APPEAR TO

BE OUT OF CONTROL IN SOME WAYS,

WOULD BE IN A POSITION

OR WOULD BE CAPABLE OF

COMMITTING THOSE ACTS.

>> SO EVEN BROADER BACKGROUND

CHECKS MIGHT NOT

NECESSARILY PICK UP SOMEBODY'S

PROPROPENSITY FOR

VIOLENCE.

>> AND THIS IS WHAT MAKES IT

DIFFICULT BECAUSE YOU

COULD CREATE A SITUATION WHERE

YOU WOULD MONITOR OR

CHANGE THE ABILITY OF PEOPLE TO

HAVE FIREARMS THAT HAVE

MENTAL HEALTH ISSUES, BUT IN

TERMS OF -- IT'S WHAT WE

CALL THE PREDICTION PROBLEM,

BEING ABLE TO PREDICT

WHICH OF THESE HUNDRED THOUSANDS

PEOPLE WILL BECOME THE

TWO OR THREE WHO TURN INTO THAT

NEW TOWN SHOOTER,

THAT'S NOT TO SAY THERE AREN'T

REASONABLE THINGS WE CAN

DO, BUT IT'S SIMPLY UNTRUE THAT

THE PEOPLE THAT ARE --

THAT HAVE MENTAL HEALTH ISSUES

ARE THE PEOPLE

COMMITTING VIOLENCE, BECAUSE,

THAT MAY BE ONE PIECE OF

IT, BUT IF YOU LOOK AT OVER 1

1,000 FIREARM HOMICIDE IN

2010, AND PREDOMINANTLY THOSE

WERE OF HAS BEEN GUNS,

INDIVIDUALS ENGAGED IN SEARS OF

ACTIVITIES THAT ARE NOT

WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.

>> I WOULDN'T DISAGREE WITH WHAT

YOU SAID, YOU

CLARIFIED MUCH BETTER, TO SAY

THESE ARE VERY, VERY

ISOLATED SITUATIONS, AND YOU

HAVE DONE AS MUCH STUDY IN

THAT FIELD AS I HAVE IN THE

FIELD OF MASS AND SERIAL

MURDERS, I COULDN'T AGREE WITH

YOU MORE.

>> FOR OBVIOUS REASONS, AND THE

SHOOTNESS IN NEW TOWN

AND OTHERS, SCHOOLS HAVE BEEN A

FOCAL POINT, AND YOU

PROFESSOR MENTIONED, WHAT CAN WE

DO EVEN IF WE CAN'T

IDENTIFY OR PREDICT WHO MIGHT

HAVE A SOURCE OF TROUBLE?

>> LET ME CLARIFY. I'M NOT

SAYING WE CAN'T PREDICT,

I'M SAYING IT'S NOT A SIMPLE

SITUATION TO BE ABLE TO

SAY IF YOU DO X, YOU'LL HAVE Y.

AND I'LL JUST THIS

POINT AND LET OTHER JUMP IN:

ONE OF THE THINGS I THINK

WE HAVE TO LOOK AT HERE IS THAT

LIKE MANY COMPLEX

PROBLEMS, THERE ARE LIKELY TO BE

MULTI FACETED

SOLUTIONS, I LIKE TO THINK OF

THIS IN TERMS OF TRAFFIC

SAFETY, IT'S NOT ABOUT A

SPECIFIC PIECE OF ACTIVITY,

IT'S A SERIES ACROSS A VARIETY

OF DOMAINS, AND THAT'S

WHERE I THINK IN THE LONG RUN --

>> GOVERNOR MIKE PENCE HAS SAID

THIS IS NOT A MATTER OF

TOO MUCH ACCESS TO GUNS, IT'S

ACCESS TO SCHOOLS.

>> I THINK IT'S APPROPRIATE TO

DISCUSS THIS GUN CONTROL

ISSUE IN THAT VEIN, AND I HAVE

NEVER SAID PEOPLE DON'T

HAVE A RIGHT TO CARRY A FIREMAN,

I'M SAYING WE NEED TO

BE RESPONSIBILITY TO UNDERSTAND

THAT SOMETIMES THOSE

INDIVIDUALS CARRYING A FIREMAN

ARE NOT THOSE

INDIVIDUALS THAT WE EVER HAD THE

INTENT TO ALLOW TO

CARRY A FIREMAN. CONSISTENT

BACKGROUND CHECKS, IN MY

OPINION, WILL PROVIDE SOME

SAFETY, IN ADDITION TO THAT,

YOU CAN GO BUY A FIREMAN, GET A

LICENSE, CARRY A

FIREMAN, AND NEVER KNOW HOW TO

USE IT. NOW, I DON'T

THINK THAT OUR FOUNDING FATHERS

EVER THOUGHT WE WOULD

BE DRIVING, AS SENATOR BRENT

WALTZ THOUGHT, A HUNDRED

MILES PER HOUR ON THE STREET,

BUT WE AS LAWMAKERS HAVE

DETERMINED THAT THAT CAR IS A

DANGEROUS PIECE OF

EQUIPMENT, IT WOULD REQUIRE

SOMEONE TO HAVE AT LEAST

THE BASIC SUNDAYSINGS OF HOW TO

CONTROL THAT VEHICLE.

WHY DON'T WE HAVE THE SAME

THING, EVEN THOUGH IT'S A

RIGHT, FOR PEOPLE WHO CARRY A

FIREMAN? WHY DON'T THEY

HAVE TO HAVE THE BASIC

UNDERSTANDING, AND THE

DIFFICULTIES TO UNLOCK THE

SAFETY, SHOOT IT, CLEAN IT.

>> BRENT WALTZ?

>> THERE ARE HUNDREDS OR

THOUSANDS OF ITEMS WE DEAL

WITH EVERY DAY THAT COULD BE

EXTREMELY DANGEROUS, SAWS

CHAIN SUES, I'VE NEVER USED A

CHAINSAW IN MY LIFE, MY

-- MY

UNCLE ALMOST GOT HIS LEG CUTOFF,

SHOULD WE HAVE A

LICENSE TO BY A CHAIN SAW AT

WAL-MART OR MENARDS.

THERE ARE THINGS THAT I WOULD

ARGUE CAN EVERY BIT AS

LETHAL AS A FIREMAN.

>> THE DIFFERENCE, IN MY VIEW,

THAT CHAINSAWS ARE NOT

USED AS WEAPONS AGAINST OTHER

PEOPLE ON A REGULAR

BASIS, SO OUR RESPONSIBILITY IN

TERMS OF PUBLIC

POLICY --

>> REAL QUICKLY, SENATE BILL 1,

THE ONE BILL THAT

HASN'T BEEN SENT TO RULES

COMMITTEE, THAT WOULD BE

ADDITIONAL FUNDING, PROPERTY TAX

$10 MILLION FOR SCHOOL

RESOURCE OFFICERS, IS THAT GOING

TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE,

DO YOU THINK IF THAT'S FUNDED

AND ENACTED?

>> I DO, IT'S A KICK START FOR

SOME SCHOOL DISTRICTS

CHORE PROBABLY HEADED IN THAT

DIRECTION AND COULD USE

THE ASSISTANCE IN FUNDING AND IN

WAKING US UP. IF YOU

WANT TO PUT IT IN THAT

DIRECTION, IF THEY HASN'T CHOSEN

THAT AS AN OPPORTUNITY UTILIZING

LOCAL LAW ENFORCEMENT.

>> WELL, THAT'S PART OF THE

FEDERAL LEGISLATION, WE

NEED TO MAKE SURE WE UNDERSTAND

THAT PART OF THE

FEDERAL LEGISLATION DOES PROVIDE

ADDITIONAL FUNDING FOR

SCHOOLS TO HAVE RESOURCE

OFFICERS, WE DON'T NEED TO

LOOK AT THIS IN A BOX. IF

CONGRESS GOES ALONG WITH

THIS, CONGRESS WILL PROVIDE

ADDITIONAL FUNDING FOR

RESOURCES --

>> EVEN IF THEY DON'T WE'RE

EXAMINING TO PROVIDE IN THE

STATE OF INDIANA, KIDS' SAFETY

VERY IMPORTANT.

>> I NEED ANY REFEREE WHISTLE

HERE, WE CAN GO ON AND

ON.

AGAIN, MY GUESTS HAVE BEEN

REPUBLICAN SENATOR BRENT WALTZ

OF GREENWOOD...

DEMOCRATIC SENATOR GREG TAYLOR

OF INDIANAPOLIS ...THOMAS

STUCKY, A CRIMINAL-JUSTICE

PROFESSOR AT INDIANA

UNIVERSITY-PURDUE UNIVERSITY AT

INDIANAPOLIS...AND STEVE GARNER,

POLICE CHIEF FOR INDIANAPOLIS

THE TOPIC IS HEALTH CARE!

OUR EXPERT PANEL WILL SHOOT FROM

THE H.I.P...

YOU'LL GET THAT JOKE ON THE NEXT

TIME NOW FOR OUR WEEKLY

CONVERSATION WITH ED FEIGENBAUM,

PUBLISHER OF THE NEWSLETTER

EE, ASIDE FROM THE SCHOOL

OFFICER RESOURCE FUNDING

BILL, BASICALLY BILLS SENT TO

RULES, WILL HEAR NOTHING

FROM THEM.

>> I THINK LEADERS THEY WILL

THEY DID EVERYTHING THEY

COULD TO EXPAND GUN RIGHTS, WE

SAW MAJOR EXPANSIONS OF

THE ABILITY TO CARRY, AND

THERE'S NOT REALLY A GREAT

APPETITE TO EXPAND THINGS EVEN

FURTHER AT THIS POINT.

>> TWO BILLS THAT DID GET SOME

ATTENTION, ONE WOULD

ALLOW STUDENTS, COLLEGE STUDENTS

ON PUBLIC COME POSES

TO CARRY CONCEALED WEAPONS IF

THEY HAD PERMITS. THE

OTHER ONE WOULD SAY, BASICALLY,

IF WE MAKE THE GUNS AND

ANDAMMUNITION HERE, IT'S NOT A

FEDERAL ISSUE, IT'S A

STATE ISSUE, TENTH AMENDMENT, DO

YOU THINK ANY OF THOSE

WILL RESONATE IN THE FUTURE?

>> ABSOLUTELY, WE'LL HAVE A BIG

DISCUSSION ABOUT TENTH

AMEANT ISSUES, WE'RE HAVING

THOSE TALKS RIGHT NOW ON A

A MACROLEVEL, AND THE GUNS IN

THE HIGHER EDUCATION

INSTITUTION BILL BEING PUSHED

BACK AGAINST BY THE

COLLEGES THEMSELVES, AND ALSO

AGAINST THE LEGISLATION

THAT EXPANDED THE LEGISLATION TO

CARRY IN THE LAST TWO

YEARS, FROM THE ACCIDENT THE

INDIANA CHAMBER OF

COMMERCE, SO THERE ARE ISSUES

WITH SOME OF THOSE BILLS

KEEPING THOSE THINGS OUT OF THE

REAL COMMITTEE

HEARINGS.

>> AND SENATE BILL 1, THE SCHOOL

RESOURCE OFFICER BILL,

WILL IT GET FUNDED? A NOTION OF

$10,000,000.23 GRANTS.

>> THEY'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT

THAT IN THE HOUSE

COMMITTEE, WAYS AND MEANS, AND

THE ATTORNEY GENERAL HAS

MADE THIS A MAJOR PRIORITY, IT

WILL CERTAINLY BE TALKED

ABOUT IN THE NEXT TWO MONTHS.

. THANKS AS ALWAYS FOR YOUR

INSIGHT.

WELL, THAT CONCLUDES ANOTHER

EDITION OF "INDIANA LAWMAKERS."

I'M JON SCHWANTES, AND, ON

BEHALF OF WFYI PUBLIC MEDIA,

INDIANA'S OTHER

PUBLIC-BROADCASTING STATIONS,

AND THESTATEHOUSEFILE.COM, I

THANK YOU FOR TUNING IN AND

INVITE YOU TO JOIN US AGAIN AT

THE SAME TIME NEXT WEEK.

UNTIL THEN...