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>> PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP SHOULD

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BE REMOVED FROM OFFICE SO SAYS

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THE EDITOR-IN-CHIEF OF THE

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INFLUENTIAL EVANGELICAL

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PUBLICATION "CHRISTIANITY

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TODAY".

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HIS EDITORIAL PUBLISHED THURSDAY

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READS IN PART...

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>> HERE TO TALK ABOUT THE

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EDITORIAL AND THE BACKLASH HAD

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HAS GENERATE SECOND ITS AUTHOR

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MARK GALLI EDITOR-IN-CHIEF OF

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"CHRISTIANITY TODAY".

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WELCOME TO "CHICAGO TONIGHT."

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DESCRIBE THE REACTION YOU'VE

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RECEIVED PRO AND CON?

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>> WELL IT'S --

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AS YOU CAN TELL I'M ON THE SHOW

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BECAUSE IT'S BEEN VERY INTENSE.

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WE EXPECT LIKE ON A TYPICAL DAY

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AT "CHRISTIANITY TODAY" WE MIGHT

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HAVE 500 PEOPLE VIEWING OUR SITE

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AT ANY TIME A HOT ARTICLE MIGHT

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HAVE 5,000 PEOPLE.

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OUR SITE CRASHED DURING THE

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HEIGHT OF THE INTEREST THERE

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WERE 17,000 PEOPLE THIS IS

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BEYOND ANYTHING WE ANTICIPATED.

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>> AND IN TERMS OF THE FEEDBACK?

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>> THE FEEDBACK HAS BEEN MIXED.

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THERE'S BEEN A FAIR NUMBER OF

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CRITICISM, OF COURSE.

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BUT THERE HAS BEEN A SURPRISING

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NUMBER OF PASSIONATE

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AFFIRMATIONS.

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THE MOST TYPICAL AFFIRMATION

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WOULD BE THANK YOU, THANK YOU,

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THANK YOU.

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AND EXPLAMATION POINTS I'M GLAD

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SOMEONE SAID THIS I NOW KNOW I'M

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NOT CRAZY.

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>> IN TERMS OF THE CRITICISM?

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ARE YOU GETTING EQUAL AMOUNTS OF

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PRO AND CON?

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>> NO.

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WELL IT'S HARD TO SAY TOTAL.

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WHAT COMES IN MY E-MAIL BOX SO

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REFRESHING BECAUSE IT'S 10 TO

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ONE FOR.

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WHAT COMES IN THE COMPANY'S

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MAILBOX IS 50/50 TO THREE TO ONE

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AGAINST.

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>> SO THE PEOPLE WHO CRITICIZE

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THE POSITION WHAT ARE THE POINTS

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THAT THEY MAKE?

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>> WELL, THIS IS THE THING THAT

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HAS BEEN A LITTLE DISAPPOINTING

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I DON'T FIND MANY MAKING

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ARGUMENTS AGAINST MY ARGUMENT.

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THEY ARE SAYING THINGS LIKE WE

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SHOULD NEVER CRITICIZE A SITTING

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PRESIDENT BECAUSE HE IS PUT

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THERE BY GOD OR YOU BELONG TO

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CHRISTIANITY YESTERDAY YOU ARE

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OUT OF TOUCH WITH THE

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EVANGELICAL MOVEMENT.

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I THINK THE MORE SUBSTANTIVE

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REPLY IS LOOK HE HAS DONE

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TREMENDOUS THINGS FOR THE

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PRO-LIFE MOVEMENT AND I'M

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PRO-LIFE THAT IS AWESOME AND

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DONE TREMENDOUS THINGS FOR

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FREEDOM FOR CHRISTIANS OVERSEAS.

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>> INCLUDING THE APPOINTMENT OF

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CONSERVATIVE JUDGES.

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>> LED TO A MORE PRO-LIFE

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FRIENDLY JUDICIARY.

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THEY WILL SAY IN SPITE OF HIS

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MORAL RECORD, WE THINK HE IS

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TREMENDOUS.

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AND SO THAT WOULD BE THE

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ARGUMENT AGAINST.

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>> THE PRESIDENT HAS TWEETED

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THAT THERE BEEN A GOOD

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TRANSACTIONAL RELATIONSHIP

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BETWEEN HIM AND EVANGELICALS.

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IS THAT PERSUASIVE?

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>> NO.

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SO THAT'S THE POINT OF MY

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EDITORIAL THAT HAD BEEN PER

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PERSUASIVE IN HELPING ME

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CHARITABLELY UNDERSTAND TRUMP

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SUPPORTERS WHO SAID ON THE ONE

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HAND HE IS NOT EXEMPLAR OF

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CHARITY OR GOOD MORALS BUT HE

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DOES DELIVER ON THESE THINGS.

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AND IT WAS WITH THE IMPEACHMENT

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HEARINGS THAT SOMETHING IN ME

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WENT CLICK AND SAID THAT DOESN'T

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WORK ANYMORE.

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THAT BALANCE DOESN'T WORK

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ANYMORE.

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>> WHAT WAS THAT THAT WENT

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CLICK?

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>> TO BE HONEST I'VE BEEN

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THINKING ABOUT THAT THE LET ME

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GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE.

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MY WIFE WHEN IN HIGH SCHOOL THEY

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HAD A STAR RUNNING BACK WHO

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COULD RUN CIRCLES AROUND

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EVERYONE AND THE COACH WANTED

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HIM BUT HE HAD A BAD ATTITUDE

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NOT A TEAM PLAYER, LATE FOR

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PRACTICE, AND BAD DISCIPLINE AND

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THE COACH SAID IN SPITE OF ALL

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THE GOOD HE DOES, HE IS

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SABOTAGING TIMOR RALE AND UNITY.

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HE IS GONE.

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AND I THINK YOU SEE THAT IN JOBS

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YOU SEE THAT WHERE PEOPLE SEE

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SOMEBODY THAT HAS STRENGTHS OR

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BRINGS SOMETHING GOOD TO THE

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TABLE AT SOME POINT YOU SAY TO

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YOURSELF IT'S NOT WORTH IT

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ANYMORE.

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AND FOR ME THE IMPEACHMENT

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HEARINGS WAS THE POINT WHERE

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IT'S LIKE CLICK.

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I THINK WE ARE GIVING UP MORE IN

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TERMS OF OUR REPUTATION, THE

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REPUTATION OF THE GOSPEL AND THE

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CHURCH THAN WE ARE GETTING FOR

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WHAT TRUMP IS DOING FOR US.

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>> BUT YOUR EDITORIAL DOES NOT

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FOCUS ON POLICIES IT FOCUSES ON

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MORALITY.

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>> CORRECT.

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>> FOR PEOPLE WHO HAVE NOT READ

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YOUR EDITOR YAL RALE WHAT IS

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YOUR MORAL ARGUMENT?

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>> THE MORAL ARGUMENT BETWEEN

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HIS ACTIONS BEFORE AND DURING

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THE PRESIDENCY WHICH WE ALL

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DECRY, HIS WORDS AT PUBLIC

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EVENTS HIS WORDS IN TWEETS,

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CULMINATING WITH HISTORYING TO

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COERCE A LEADER OF A FOREIGN

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NATION TO GET DIRT ON HIS

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POLITICAL ENEMIES WHICH IS

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UNCONSTITUTIONAL BUT FROM OUR

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POINT OF VIEW IT'S IMMORAL.

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>> WHY IS IT IMMORAL ASIDE FROM

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THE CONSTITUTIONALITY OF IT,

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POLITICALLY, IT MIGHT BE CLEARLY

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IT WAS DANGEROUS BUT WHY IS IT

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IMMORAL?

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>> WELL ON THE SIMPLE FACT THAT

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HE PROMISED TO UPHOLD THE

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CONSTITUTION AND THE

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CONSTITUTION SAYS THE PRESIDENT

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OF THE UNITED STATES CANNOT

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BRIBE AND THIS IS A FORM OF

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BRIBERY.

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EXTORTION IS A FORM OF BRIBERY.

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IT IS A IMMORAL IN THAT REGARD.

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SO THAT CULMINATES IN A MORAL --

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OF COURSE I'M STACKING THIS UP

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AGAINST AN ASSUMED KNOWLEDGE OF

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MY READERS OF THE 10

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COMMANDMENTS I'M NOT EXPLAINING

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EVERYTHING I ASSUME THEY HAVE

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THAT KNOWLEDGE.

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I COME TO THE CONCLUSION THAT HE

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IS MORALLY UNFIT.

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I THINK IT IS A GOOD

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DISTINCTION.

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I'M NOT MAKING A POLITICAL

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ARGUMENT NOT SAYING THAT DONALD

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TRUMP SHOULD BE KICKED OUT WE

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SHOULD PUT IN THIS OTHER

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CANDIDATE THAT IS NOT OUR

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INTEREST.

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OUR INTEREST IS THE MORAL

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DIMENSION OF THIS.

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>> BECAUSE THE PRESIDENT TWEETED

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A SERIES OF TWEETS.

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>> I GUESS THE MAGAZINE,

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COUNTRIES CRIMINALS, IS LOOK

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"CHRISTIANITY TODAY" IS LOOKING

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FOR ELIZABETH WARREN OR BERNIE

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SANDERS

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>> YOUR REACTION TO THE TWEETS?

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>> THAT IS ALMOST A CLASSIC

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EXAMPLE OF THE PRESIDENT'S

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TWEETS THAT MISS CHARACTERIZE,

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SLANDER, AND TELL OUT RIDE

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FALSEHOODS ABOUT THINGS.

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HE IS RIGHT ABOUT ONE THING AND

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THAT IS NO WE HAVE NOT HAD A

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RELATIONSHIP WITH BILL RUTHHART

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PERSONALLY FOR 20 YEARS BUT THE

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FAR WE ARE FAR LEFT IS CRAZY

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ASSERTION.

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WE ARE CHAMPIONING DEMOCRATIC

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CANDIDATES THAT IS ABSURD.

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THE ARGUMENT HE IS MORALLY UNFIT

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FOR THE PRESIDENCY.

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I DON'T CARE WHO GETS IN HIS

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PLACE AS LONG AS THEY ARE

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MORALLY FIT AND THAT WOULD

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CONSTITUTE DOZENS IF NOT

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HUNDREDS OF CANDIDATES.

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THAT IS NOT --

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I DON'T HAVE A DOG IN THAT

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FIGHT.

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I HAVE A DOG IN THE FIGHT WHEN

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THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED

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STATES ACTS IN A QUESTIONABLY

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MORAL WAY THAT I BELIEVE IT

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AFFECTS NOT JUST HIS PRESIDENCY

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AND REPUTATION OF THE UNITED

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STATES BUT ALSO AFFECTS THE

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QUALITY OF LIFE IN AMERICA

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ITSELF.

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I'M CALLED AS A CHRISTIAN TO

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LOVE MY NEIGHBOR.

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AND IF THE HEAD OF STATE IS

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DOING THINGS THAT IS MAKING IT

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HARDER FOR US TO HAVE

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CONVERSATIONS WITH ONE ANOTHER

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TO TREAT EACH OTHER CIVILLY AND

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TO PRACTICE BASIC MORAL

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PRINCIPLES THAT IS A PROBLEM.

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>> AS YOU KNOW A GROUP OF 200

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EVANGELICAL LEADERS WROTE AN

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OPEN LETTER SAYING YOUR

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EDITORIAL WAS OFFENSIVE AND IT

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TARGETED NOT JUST THE PRESIDENT

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BUT THOSE WHO SUPPORT HIM.

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IS THAT AN ACCURATE READING OF

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YOUR PIECE?

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>> IT IS WELL THE FACT THAT --

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I DON'T KNOW THEY HAVE TO DECIDE

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WHETHER THEY ARE OFFENDED.

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THE FACT THAT I WAS QUESTIONING

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THEIR SPIRITUAL INTEGRITY, OF

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COURSE, A MORAL ARGUMENT IN AN

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ESSAY THAT SAYS YOU OUGHT TO

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RECONSIDER WHAT YOU ARE DOING

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BECAUSE IT HAS MORAL

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COMPLICATIONS, YES I'M SAYING

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YOU NEED TO REPENT AND CHANGE

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YOUR MIND LIKE THEY ARE TELLING

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ME YOU ARE BEING JUDGMENTAL AND

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ARROGANT AND ALL THESE THINGS.

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THEY ARE QUESTIONING MY

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SPIRITUAL INTEGRITY AND THEY

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SHOULD THEY ARE BROTHERS AND

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SISTERS IN CHRIST.

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IF THEY THINK I'M DOING

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SOMETHING IN ERROR THEY SHOULD

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SAY SO.

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THAT I SHOULD BE OFFENDED BY

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THAT?

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I AM NOT OFFENSED I --

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OFFENDED I LISTEN TO WHAT THEY

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SAY AND I PRAY ABOUT IT AND

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THINK ABOUT IT.

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AND THAT IS WHAT I'M ASKING THEM

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TO DO TO SELF QUESTION THEIR

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SPIRITUAL PRIORITIES AND IF THEY

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COME AWAY AFTER THAT SERIOUS

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PRAY AND CONVERSATIONS DO WE

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STILL STAND WHERE WE WILL, I

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HAVE NOTHING MORE TO SAY BUT I

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NEED TO ASK AS EDITOR-IN-CHIEF

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OF "CHRISTIANITY TODAY" HARD

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QUESTIONS.

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>> YOU'VE SAID YOU ARE CONCERNED

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ABOUT THE LASTING IMPACT ON

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EVANGELICALS AS A RESULT OF THE

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SUPPORT OF SO MANY EVANGELICALS

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FOR THE PRESIDENT WHAT.

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IS THAT IMPACT IN YOUR MIND?

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>> WELL, THE IMPACT HAS ALREADY

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BEEN FELT.

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FOR A FEW YEARS NOW, PEOPLE WHO

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ARE EITHER EVANGELICAL CENTRIST

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OR OUTSIDE THE FAITH AND LOOKING

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AT THE FAITH AND HEARING THE

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CLAIMS WE MAKE ABOUT WHAT IS

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TRUE AND RIGHT AND GOOD AND THEY

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SEE A LARGE SEGMENT OF THE WORLD

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DEFENDING OR JUSTIFYING OR

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IGNORING PRETENDING LIKE IT IS

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NOT A PROBLEM ALL THE

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PRESIDENT'S IMMORAL ACTIONS AND

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TWEETS.

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IT CAUSES --

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IN THE LONG-RUN --

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ON SO MANY CAUSES WE CARE ABOUT

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FROM PRO-LIFE TO CONCERN FOR THE

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POOR AND IMMIGRATION WHY WOULD

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PEOPLE LISTEN TO US AND SAY

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THESE ARE MORAL AND RIGHT THINGS

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WE OUGHT TO DO AS A NATION WHY

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ARE THEY GOING TO BELIEVE US IF

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THEY ARE GOING TO POINT AND SAY

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WHAT HAPPENED WITH YOUR SUPPORT?

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WHY WASN'T MORAL AND ETHICS AN

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IMPORTANT PART OF YOUR

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CONVERSATION WITH DONALD TRUMP.

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>> BILLBILLY GRAHAM'S SON SAID E

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WOULD BE DISAPPOINTED AND HIS

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FATHER VOWED FOR TRUMP.

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>> I DID NOT KNOW HIS FATHER AS

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CLOSELY AS HE DID.

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BASED ON BILLY GRAHAM'S PUBLIC

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STATEMENTS AFTER HIS

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RELATIONSHIP WITH NIXON FELL

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APART, IT'S HARD FOR ME TO

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IMAGINE THAT HE WOULD BE

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ENTHUSIASTIC SUPPORT IROF DONALD

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TRUMP.

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BUT THAT IS WHAT I IMAGINE.

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I DON'T KNOW ENOUGH TO PUT A

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STAKE IN THE GROUND ON THAT.

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>> YOU HAVE NO EXPECTATION THAT

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YOUR EDITORIAL WILL CHANGE THE

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MINDS OF TRUMP SUPPORTERS.

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WHY DID YOU WRITE IT?

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>> I WROTE IT, THE THING DRIVING

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ME TO WRITE IT AT THE MOMENT

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THIS WAS THE RIGHT THING TO SAY

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AT THE RIGHT MOMENT.

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IN RETROSPECT THE POSITIVE

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EFFECT IT'S HAVING IS AS I SAID

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THERE'S BEEN HUNDREDS IF NOT

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00:11:23,300 --> 00:11:28,133
THOUSANDS OF E-MAILS AND LETTERS

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AND PHONE CALLS THAT HAVE SAID

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00:11:26,766 --> 00:11:33,466
THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU.

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I DIDN'T KNOW IT AT THE TIME.

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I WISH I WAS PRESSURED TO SAY I

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DID NOT REALIZE THE DEPTH OF THE

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00:11:36,233 --> 00:11:41,566
PASSION HOW MANY PEOPLE WANTED

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00:11:37,800 --> 00:11:43,666
AN EVANGELICAL PUBLICATION TO

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SAY ENOUGH.

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AND I'M HAPPY THAT THAT HAS