OFFICERS MUST ACTIVATE
BODY-CAMERAS TO RECORD PURSUITS
IN FULL AND PROHIBITS
FOOT-PURSUITS STEMMING FROM
MINOR TRAFFIC OFFENSES.
AND JOINING US WITH THEIR TAKE
ARE ROBERT BOIK FROM THE CHICAGO
POLICE DEPARTMENT, HE IS THE
EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF THE OFFICE
OF CONSTITUTIONAL POLICING AND
REFORM.
AREWA KAREN WINTERS A CO-CHAIR
OF THE COMMUNITY WORKING GROUP
THAT WAS ASSEMBLED TO PROVIDE
COMMUNITY INPUT ON POLICE
REFORM.
RETIRED POLICE OFFICER RICHARD
WOOTEN FOUNDER OF GATHERING
POINT COMMUNITY COUNCIL AND
NUSRAT CHOUDHURY LEGAL DIRECTOR
AT THE A.C.L.U. OF ILLINOIS.
WELCOME ALL OF YOU BACK TO
"CHICAGO TONIGHT."
ROBERT BOIK THE FIRST QUESTION I
HAVE WHEN LOOKING AT THIS LIST
OF RULES IT IS A LOT OF THINGS
FOR OFFICERS TO KEEP IN MIND.
LIKE A CHECKLIST IN A SITUATION
THAT COULD BE HEAT OF THE
MOMENT.
HOW IS AN OFFICER ABLE TO GO
THROUGH THESE THINGS WHEN
DECIDING WHETHER OR NOT TO
ENGAGE?
>> ONE THING THAT POLICY
PRIORITIZES IS NOT ONLY OFFICER
SAFETY BUT SAFETY FOR THE
COMMUNITY AS WELL.
IT REALLY CREATES SEVERAL LINES
FOR OFFICERS WHERE THEY HAVE TO
WEIGH THE RISK OF ENGAGING IN
THE PURSUIT WITH THE NEED TO
APPREHEND THE OFFENDER.
AND ENHANCES SUPERVISOR
RESPONSIBILITIES SUCH THAT
OFFICERS REALLY ARE TAKING
DIRECTION ON A CONTINUOUS BASIS
AND THAT, AGAIN, THAT IS
DESIGNED AROUND ENHANCING
SAFETY.
>> AND NUSRAT CHOUDHURY THIS
COMES IN THE WAKE OF THE TOLEDO
AND THE ANTHONY ALVAREZ
SHOOTINGS THAT CAME AFTER
FOOT-PURSUITS.
DO YOU THINK THE RULES HELP
PREVENT FUTURE SITUATIONS LIKE
ANTHONY ALVAREZ AND TOLEDO?
>> THE RULES DON'T GO FAR
ENOUGH.
WE KNOW THAT CHICAGO HAS A
PROBLEM WITH DEADLY
FOOT-PURSUITS BORN OUT BY THE
KILLINGS YOU MENTION AND YEARS
OF DATA AND WHAT WE NEED A
POLICY TO DO IS TO BE CLEAR AND
EASY TO UNDERSTAND FOR OFFICERS
TO REALLY GRASP AND IMPLEMENT IN
REALTIME UNDER IMMENSE PRESSURE
AND THIS POLICY IS VERY LONG.
IT INCLUDES VAGUE LANGUAGE AND
IT DOESN'T PUT UP CLEAR ENOUGH
GUARDRAILS ESPECIALLY WITH
RESPECT TO PROHIBITING
FOOT-PURSUITS FOR MINOR
OFFENSES.
YOU REFERRED EARLIER CLASS A
MISDEMEANORS BUT THERE ARE
EXCEPTIONS FOR CLASS B AND C
MISDEMEANORS IN THE POLICY AND
IT'S WORTH UNDERSCORING THAT
SOMETHING AS LOW AS GAMBLING
POSSESSION OF ALCOHOL BY A
MINOR, POSSESSION OF DRUG
PARAPHERNALIA THOSE OFFENSES FOR
WHICH A FOOT-PURSUIT WOULD BE
PERMITTED UNDER THIS POLICY.
>> YESTERDAY SUPERINTENDENT
DAVID BROWN EMPHASIZED THAT HE
FELT IT WAS IMPORTANT TO LISTEN
TO THE COMMUNITY AND HERE IS A
LITTLE BIT OF WHAT HE SAID.
>> WE LIKELY WILL HEAR SOMETHING
THAT WE DIDN'T THINK OF.
AND WE WANT THE BENEFIT OF
HEARING THAT FROM THE COMMUNITY
THAT WE NEED TO INCLUDE IN THIS
POLICY.
IT'S WORTHWHILE.
YOU WILL NEVER HEAR ME SAY
ENGAGING THE COMMUNITY IS A BAD
THING.
THE COMMUNITY NEEDS TO BE
ENGAGED AT EVERY OPPORTUNITY TO
HELP US BUILD TRUST.
>> AREWA KAREN WINTERS DO YOU
THINK THIS POLICY WAS A RESULT
OF COMMUNITY INPUT?
>> ABSOLUTELY.
AND NOW I WANT TO SAY THIS
PROBABLY STARTED PRIOR TO EVEN
THE COALITION COMING FORWARD
WITH THE CONSENT DECREE.
BECAUSE HISTORICALLY THIS HAS
BEEN HAPPENING OVER AND OVER AND
OVER TIME AND TIME AGAIN IN
BLACK AND BROWN COMMUNITIES.
SO I DEFINITELY THINK IT WAS
FROM THE PEOPLE THE PRESSURE
FROM THE PEOPLE TO NOT ONLY HAVE
THE CONSENT DECREE BUT TO HAVE
POLICE REFORM.
BECAUSE IT IS VERY NECESSARY
VERY NEEDED IN THIS CITY.
SO IN THIS POLICY DOESN'T CUT
IT.
>> YOU ARE SAYING IT WAS NOT
ENOUGH INPUT FROM THE COMMUNITY
AS THE SUPERINTENDENT SAYS HE
WANTED TO LISTEN TO THE
COMMUNITY.
RICHARD WOOTEN, AS A FORMER COP
I WILL PRESENT THIS QUESTION TO
YOU HOW DO YOU GO THROUGH IN
YOUR HEAD IS THIS A CLASS A
MISDEMEANOR?
IS THIS PERSON A THREAT TO THE
COMMUNITY?
A CHECKLIST IN A SITUATION THAT
CAN BE HEATED?
>> EXACTLY.
THIS IS PUTTING MORE STRESS ON
THE OFFICERS AND CAUSING THEM TO
MAKE MORE MISTAKES.
WHEN IS A GOOD TIME TO CHASE AND
WHEN IS NOT A GOOD TIME IS GOING
TO PUT THEIR LIVES FURER IN
DANGER.
I THINK THE POLICY SHOULD BE
MORE SPECIFIC AND CLEAR AND
ADDRESS WHAT THEY CAN CHASE FOR
AND WHEN THEY CAN CHASE.
BECAUSE WHEN I WAS GOING THROUGH
THE POLICY MYSELF, IT IS JUST SO
WISHY WASHY AND LEAVES OUT A LOT
OF ROOM FOR MUCH ERROR.
>> ROBERT BOIK THERE ARE A LOT
OF RESPONSES.
YOU'VE HEARD THE CRITICISM NOT
ENOUGH COMMUNITY INPUT, IT
DOESN'T GO FAR ENOUGH, IT'S TOO
VAGUE IN ITS LANGUAGE AND THAT
IT COULD BE DANGEROUS FOR THE
POLICE HAVING TO CONSIDER ALL
THESE THINGS.
YOUR RESPONSE TO THOSE ISSUES?
>> SO I WANT TO START WITH
COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT BECAUSE
IT'S JUST NOT TRUE TO SAY THIS
POLICY WASN'T DEVELOPED WITH ANY
COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT.
MS. WINTERS GROUP MET WITH US
AND WE TALKED EXTENSIVELY WHAT
SHOULD BE INCLUDED IN A
FOOT-PURSUIT POLICY.
AND I WOULD ALSO SAY THAT THE
A.C.L.U. AND OTHERS ARE SEEKING
SPECIAL TREATMENT WITH RESPECT
TO ENGAGEMENT AND WHAT WE'VE PUT
FORWARD IS A VERY COMPREHENSIVE
PLAN, THE MOST COMPREHENSIVE
PLAN THAT THE DEPARTMENT EVER
ENGAGED IN TO GET FEEDBACK FROM
THE COMMUNITY AND OUR OFFICERS
INCLUDING A WEBINAR ON JUNE 1
TWO COMMUNITY MEETINGS ONE IN
JUNE AND ONE IN JULY.
THE POLICY IS OPEN NOW FOR
PUBLIC COMMENT WE INVITE PUBLIC
COMMENT FROM EVERYONE ACROSS THE
CITY OF CHICAGO AND WHAT WE'RE
HOPING TO DO IS TO HAVE BROAD
COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT AND TO HEAR
FROM EVERY COMMUNITY ACROSS THE
CITY.
WITH RESPECT TO THE POLICY
ITSELF, AGAIN, IT PRIORITIZED
OFFICER SAFETY.
IT DOES CREATE A BRIGHT LINE AND
CLEAR RESPONSIBILITIES FOR
SUPERVISORS.
>> AND NUSRAT CHOUDHURY THE
POLICE DEPARTMENT THIS IS
INTERIM THEY ARE STUDYING THIS
AND WANTED TO GET SOMETHING OUT
QUICKLY IN THE WAKE OF ANTHONY
ALVAREZ AND TOLEDO.
WHAT ARE THE THINGS THAT YOU
BELIEVE SHOULD BE IN A PERMANENT
POLICY?
>> I THINK TO UNDERSCORE THAT
OTHERS COULD HAVE BEEN GIVEN THE
CHANCE TO GIVE INPUT AS
DEVELOPING AN INTERIM POLICY
MAKING THAT POINT CLEAR IT IS
NOT ABOUT THE A.C.L.U. BUT FROM
PEOPLE IN DIRECTLY IMPACTED
COMMUNITIES.
AND WHAT THE POLICY SHOULD
INCLUDE THIS POLICY DOES NOT
INCLUDE EARLY AND A CLEAR
STATEMENT THAT FOOT-PURSUITS ARE
EXTRAORDINARILY DANGEROUS.
WE KNOW THE CITY HAS A PROBLEM
WITH DEADLY FOOT-PURSUITS AND
THAT IS NOT MADE CLEAR IN THE
PURPOSE OF THE POLICY OR BUT
WHAT WE GET INSTEAD WISHY WASHY
STATEMENTS THAT LEAVE A LOT OF
ROOM FOR OFFICER DISCRETION TO
ENGAGE IN A FOOT-PURSUIT EVEN
WHEN THERE ARE MINOR OFFENSES,
EVEN IF THE CATEGORIES OF
OFFENSES THAT ARE IDENTIFIED IN
THE FOOT-PURSUIT AND THAT IS NOT
THE CLEAR, EASY TO
OPERATIONALIZE GUIDANCE THAT
WILL RESTRICT WHAT HAS BEEN A
DEADLY PRACTICE IN THE CITY OF
CHICAGO FOR A LONGTIME.
>> AND AREWA KAREN WINTERS
COMMUNITY GROUPS DID SUGGEST
DOZENS OF RECOMMENDATIONS MANY
DID NOT MAKE IT IN HERE.
WHAT DO YOU BELIEVE SHOULD MAKE
IT INTO THIS POLICY THAT WAS
LEFT OUT?
>> I APPRECIATE RICHARD WOOTEN.
I CANNOT SAY WE HAD AN EXTENSIVE
CONVERSATION THEY DID INTRODUCE
CONCEPTS BUT WE DIDN'T RECEIVE
ANYTHING WRITTEN SO WE DIDN'T
HAVE A CHANCE TO PROCESS AND GO
THROUGH AND MAKE
RECOMMENDATIONS.
BUT IN 2019, THE COALITION DID
SUBMIT THINGS.
WHAT I'M MORE CONCERNED ABOUT IS
THE PROHIBITIONS.
I DIDN'T SEE PROHIBITIONS WITH
IT AND ONE OF THEM FOR ME IS SO
MANY OF OUR YOUNG PEOPLE ARE
SHOT IN THEIR BACKS WHILE THEY
ARE RUNNING AWAY, FLEEING, THEY
SAY THAT THEY ARE A THREAT TO
THE COMMUNITY BUT REALLY AT THAT
INSTANCE THEY ARE ONLY A THREAT
TO THEMSELVES HOW CAN POLICE
OFFICERS ENGAGING THE THREAT
WITHOUT KILLING THEM AND HARMING
THEM?
SO THAT IS I THINK SERVE AND
PROTECT IN THE WORST CASE
SCENARIOS WHERE THEY HAVE A
WEAPON NOT HAVE A WEAPON IF THEY
ARE NOT OPENLY SHOOTING AT
ANYONE IN MOST CASES THEY ARE
NOT THEY ARE RUNNING AWAY.
CLIMBING FENCES AND THEY LOSE
THEIR LIVES.
I WANT TO SEE OUR POLICE
DEPARTMENT ENGAGE WITH OUR YOUNG
PEOPLE IN OUR COMMUNITIES WHERE
EVERYONE CAN COME OUT SAFE.
>> RICHARD WOOTEN HOW DO POLICE
OFFICERS FEEL ABOUT
FOOT-PURSUITS IN GENERAL?
DO THEY FEEL THAT THEY CARRY A
LOT OF RISK AND DANGER WITH
THEM?
WOULD THEY RATHER NOT ENGAGE IN
A FOOT-PURSUIT?
OR RATHER BE ABLE TO ENGAGE THAT
WAY?
>> YOU KNOW, FOOT-PURSUITS IS
PART OF THE JOB AND WE
UNDERSTAND THAT.
AN AUGUST OF 192001 WE LOST A
GREAT OFFICER FROM A
FOOT-PURSUIT WHO WAS SHOT BY AN
OFFENDER.
BUT WE NEED TO UNDERSTAND THAT
FOOT-PURSUITS SOMETIMES IS JUST
NOT NECESSARY.
YOU KNOW WHEN YOU HAVE GAMBLING,
IN A BLACK AND BROWN COMMUNITIES
THESE ARE MOST YOUR
FOOT-PURSUITS.
GAMBLING, SUSPENDED DRIVER'S
LICENSE, DRINKING ON A PUBLIC
WAY OR SOME OTHER MINOR INCIDENT
WHERE YOU KNOW THE INDIVIDUAL IS
GOING TO RETURN IN THAT AREA
AGAIN THE NEXT DAY.
WHY PURSUE HIM WHEN YOU KNOW
THEY ARE GOING TO BE THERE.
AND WHAT HAPPENS WHEN AN OFFICER
SEES THE PARTICULAR CRIMES IN
ITS ACT THEY BEGIN TO KICK IN
AND THEY GO RUNNING.
WHAT WE NEED IS A STATEMENT
WITHIN THE POLICY THAT SAYS WE
WILL NOT CHASE ANYONE UNLESS
IT'S LIFE-THREATENING AND A
CLASS A FELONY.
YOU KNOW, OTHER THAN THAT THERE
SHOULD NOT BE FOOT-PURSUITS YOU
PUT THE OFFICER IN DANGER AND
THE COMMUNITY IN DANGER AND THE
INDIVIDUAL THAT IS RUNNING IN
DANGER BECAUSE THEY DON'T WANT
TO BE CAUGHT BY THE POLICE.
>> AND POLICY MENTIONS THERE IS
MORE TO COME ON THIS.
THEY ARE GOING TO HAVE A
COMMUNITY REVIEW PROCESS AND
COME OUT WITH MORE SPECIFIC
PROPOSALS IN SEPTEMBER.
OUR THANKS TO AREWA KAREN