>>HANK: YOU CAN DRIVE BY

THESE RUINS EVERY DAY AND

UNLESS YOU'RE REALLY CURIOUS

YOU'RE NOT GOING TO STOP THE

CAR AND GET OUT AND LOOK AT

IT.

>>KEVIN MACNUTT: THE BOOK IS

TO BE AN ADVOCATE FOR THESE

RUINS SO PEOPLE KNOW THAT

THEY'RE THERE AND KNOW THAT

THEY'RE WORTH PRESERVING.

TERRI ALLARD: AFTER YEARS OF

STUDYING ABANDONED MILLS,

HOMES, CANALS AND VILLAGES,

OUR GUEST TODAY FULFILLED HIS

LIFE-LONG DESIRE TO PROVIDE A

TESTAMENT TO THE CREATIVITY,

SKILLS, AND CHALLENGES OF

THOSE WHO CAME BEFORE US.

JOIN US AS WE TALK WITH,

CHARLOTTESVILLE ARCHITECT AND

AUTHOR, HENRY “HANK ” BROWNE,

ABOUT HIS BOOK VANISHING

HISTORY, RUINS IN VIRGINIA.

COME ON!

TERRI>>HANK, WHAT IS IT THAT

HAS ALWAYS FASCINATED YOU

ABOUT RUINS?

HANK>>I THINK WHEN I WAS A

YOUNG LAD IN CONNECTICUT, WE

USED TO HAVE ICE ON THE MILL

POND. AND ALL OF THE MILLS

HAD BEEN ABANDONED PRIOR TO

WORLD WAR TWO AND AS A KID OF

COURSE ANY OPENING IN A

BUILDING WAS JUST A CAVE AND

IT WAS WONDERFUL TO GET

INSIDE AND THEY LEFT ALL OF

THE MACHINERY THERE, THEY

LEFT THE BOBBINS. AND IT WAS

JUST A MAGICAL PLACE SO, THAT

STARTED IT AND THEN OF COURSE

I GREW UP AND THEN THE NEXT

THING I KNOW I'M HERE IN

SCHOOL AT THE ARCHITECTURE

SCHOOL AT VIRGINIA AND MY

AUNT WHO LIVES IN SCOTTSVILLE

WOULD ALLOW ME TO BORROW HER

CAR, SHE WAS A VERY BRAVE

WOMAN, SO I WOULD BRAVE —

TAKE THE CAR AND DRIVE ALL

AROUND THE COUNTY AND I WOULD

FIND OLD BUILDINGS, AND OUT

THERE

THERE WOULD BE A TURNOUT SHED

FALLING DOWN OR A RUIN OF AN

OLD HOUSE WHERE SOMEONE WOULD

HAVE LIVED AND RAISED A

FAMILY.

TERRI>>AND AT SOME POINT YOU

RESTORED A MILL, WALKER'S

MILL. TALK ABOUT THAT

PROJECT.

HANK>>WALKER'S MILL WAS A

DEAD BUILDING, I WATCHED IT

FOR 50 YEARS FALL DOWN.

TERRI>>AND WHERE WAS IT?

HANK>>IT'S ON THE ROAD

BETWEEN GORDONSVILLE AND

CISMONT, AND THE ONLY THING

THAT SAVED IT WAS THE ROOF

WAS SAFE OVER THE ENTIRE

STRUCTURE. THAT WAS LONG LONG

HOURS OF WONDERFUL TIME FOR

ME.

TERRI>>WHEN WAS IT THAT YOU

DECIDED AFTER ALL THESE YEARS

OF STUDYING RUINS, AND BEING

FASCINATED BY RUINS, WHEN WAS

IT THAT YOU DECIDED THAT YOU

WERE GOING TO PUT THIS BOOK

TOGETHER?

HANK>>30 YEARS AGO. AND IT

WAS SOMETHING YOU KNOW THEY

SAY YOU HAVE A BUCKET LIST OR

YOU HAVE AN ITCH THAT HAS TO

BE SCRATCHED. I HAD THIS ITCH

THAT I HAD TO SCRATCH. YOU

KNOW I'D BE IN THE MIDDLE OF

NOWHERE IN FLOYD COUNTY

WALKING DOWN A PATH AND THIS

WAS BEFORE I MET KEVIN.

TERRI>>YEAH, THE PHOTOGRAPHER

FOR YOUR BOOK. RIGHT.

HANK>>YEAH. EXACTLY. AND SO I

WOULD LOOK AND THERE WOULD

THIS OLD MILL THAT WAS

SITTING THERE GETTING FRAUGHT

AND I WAS JUST ATTRACTED TO

THAT AND KEVIN AND I FORMED

A RELATIONSHIP WHERE WE

REALLY KIND OF BROTHERS UNDER

THE SKIN BECAUSE HE LOVED TO

GO “LOOK AT THAT! LOOK AT

THAT! ”AND I WOULD SAY, “YEAH,

THAT'S OKAY BUT LOOK AT

THAT! ”

TERRI>>OH, THAT'S THE PERFECT

PARTNERSHIP.

HANK>>YEAH, IT WAS GREAT.

>>KEVIN MACNUTT: IT'S LIKE A

CORNUCOPIA OF RUINS. THERE'S

RUINS ALL OVER THE PLACE. IT

WAS INTERESTING CAPTURING

THESE PLACES BECAUSE THEY

WEREN'T, IT WASN'T ALWAYS AT

THE MOST IDEAL SHOOTING

TIMES. LIKE WE DID HAVE TO

SHOOT IN THE RAIN QUITE A

BIT. THERE WAS ONE RUIN WHERE

I HAD TO HIKE SEVEN MILES IN

TO THE RUIN AND THEN SEVEN

MILES BACK. SO IT WAS LIKE A

FIFTEEN MILE HIKE ROUND HIKE

INTO THE RUINS. I WAS

DEFINITELY TIRED AFTER THAT

ONE.

TERRI>>THERE'S SUCH A VARIETY

IN THIS BOOK. WE'RE STANDING

HERE AT BARBOURSVILLE RUINS,

TELL US A LITTLE BIT ABOUT

THIS.

HANK>>THE THING THAT I LOVE

ABOUT BARBOURSVILLE IS THAT

CAN YOU IMAGINE GOVERNOR

BARBOUR SAYING TO HIS FRIEND

THOMAS JEFFERSON, THOMAS, I

THINK I'M GOING TO BUILD A

HOUSE IN ORANGE BECAUSE I'M

THE SHERIFF OF ORANGE. AND

THOMAS WOULD SAY THAT'S VERY

FINE, GOVERNOR, AND THIS

WOULD BE FOUR YEARS BEFORE

ANYTHING WAS CLEARED BECAUSE

YOU HAD TO BURN THE WOOD TO

GET THE CHARCOAL TO FIRE THE

BRICK, YOU HAD TO FIND THE

MUD, YOU HAD TO DIG THE MUD,

YOU HAD TO PUT IT IN TO

MOLDS, YOU HAD TO DRY IT

FIRST AND THEN YOU HAD TO

FIRE IT. AND SO THIS IS NOT

AN EASY THING IN THOSE DAYS

TO MAKE A BUILDING OF THIS

SIZE AND STATURE COME OUT OF

THE GROUND. SO FOR THREE OR

FOUR YEARS THERE'D BE NOTHING

AROUND HERE EXCEPT WORKMAN.

TERRI>>SO, WHAT HAPPENED?

WHAT HAPPENED? THIS BURNED. .

.

HANK>>OH, 1884, CHRISTMAS

DAY, CAN YOU IMAGINE? THEY

HAD A FIRE. THE FIRE HAS BEEN

SAID TO BE MANY DIFFERENT

THINGS, GENERALLY SPEAKING I

GO WITH THE THESIS OF A

CHRISTMAS TREE CAUGHT FIRE.

TERRI>>BECAUSE THEY WERE LIT

WITH REAL CANDLES AT THE

TIME.

HANK>>WITH CANDLES. AND CAN

YOU IMAGINE? THEY ACTUALLY

CARRIED THE TABLES OUTSIDE,

ON THE LAWN HERE, AND

CONTINUED THEIR CHRISTMAS.

TERRI>>BECAUSE YOU COULDN'T

PUT THE FIRE OUT.

HANK: THAT'S RIGHT, YOU HAD

TO HAVE WATER.

TERRI: AND WHAT'S REALLY

GREAT TOO ABOUT THE RUINS

HERE IS THAT THEY'RE BEING

PRESERVED.

HANK>>YES. THEY'RE BEING

PRESERVED IN THE CORRECT WAY.

TERRI>>AND THAT WOULD BE--

HANK>>WELL, YOU STAY OFF OF

THE RUINS AS MUCH AS YOU CAN

BECAUSE IT'D BE LIKE AN

ORIENTAL RUG WITH A TRUCK

WALKING OVER IT ALL THE TIME,

IT'D BREAK DOWN AND FALL

APART. THE REASON YOU CAN'T

GO INSIDE THESE RUINS IS

BECAUSE YOU'RE STEPPING ON

FABRIC, YOU'RE STEPPING ON

FABRIC. WE CALL IT

ARCHITECTURAL FABRIC.

TERRI: RIGHT.

HANK: AND THAT IS VERY

FRAGILE AND IT WOULD BREAK

DOWN AND AFTER A HUNDRED

YEARS YOU'D HAVE NOTHING. AND

PEOPLE BELIEVE IT OR NOT WILL

GO IN AND PICK UP A BRICK AND

BRING IT HOME TO AUNT JULIE,

THEN AUNT JULIE WOULD USE IT

AS A DOOR STOP, THEN WHEN

AUNT JULIE WOULD DIE, OUT

WENT THE BRICK, THE RUINS

JUST BEGIN TO MELT.

TERRI>>AND IT'S IMPORTANT.

IT'S IMPORTANT TO RESTORE

THEM BECAUSE THEY TELL US SO

MUCH ABOUT OUR HISTORY. TALK

ABOUT THAT ANGLE TOO, WHY

THAT'S SO IMPORTANT.

HANK>>LISTEN, YOU KNOW WE CAN

WRITE BOOKS ABOUT THESE

HISTORIC MONUMENTS

WHAT THIS DOES IT ALLOWS

THE PERSON TO UP

AND IMAGINE, JUST AS I DID AS

A LITTLE BOY

THINGS

THAT WENT ON INSIDE THESE

BUILDINGS. AND SO IT'S NOT

JUST READING SOMEONE ELSE'S

HISTORY THAT THEY'VE WRITTEN,

YOU'RE WRITING YOUR OWN

HISTORY WHEN YOU SEE A RUIN

AND YOU GO UP TO IT AND YOU

THINK ABOUT IT.

KEVIN MACNUT: WHAT I THINK

ABOUT MOST WHEN I'M WALKING

AROUND THE RUINS IS HOW TO

BEST CAPTURE THEM BECAUSE I'M

TRYING TO GET ALL THE ANGLES.

I MAY TAKE 100 SOME PHOTOS TO

GET FIVE THAT WE NEED BUT

THAT'S WHAT I THINK IS MOST

IMPORTANT ABOUT THIS BOOK IS

TO TAKE PEOPLE TO THESE

PLACES WITHOUT THEM ACTUALLY

PHYSICALLY GOING TO THEM.

KEEPING THEM IN THEIR NATURAL

STATE THE BEST WE CAN.

TERRI>> TALK ABOUT SOME OF

THE CANALS IN YOUR BOOK THAT

YOU'VE COVERED.

HANK>>ONE IN PARTICULAR THAT

I LIKE I THINK THAT THE ONE

IN THE PATOWMAC BECAUSE IT'S

THE POTOMAC AND GEORGE

WASHINGTON IS ONE OF THOSE

SUBSCRIBERS TO THE FUNDS

BEING RAISED TO GET THIS

CANAL AND SO IT INVOLVED THE

BUSINESS COMMUNITY, IT

INVOLVED PEOPLE WHO WERE

WORKING TO BUILD THESE

CANALS. WE HAVE GOOD RUINS BY

DOWN IN PALMYRA. MILL THAT IS

STILL THERE AT THE FOUNDATION

AND PART OF THE OLD CANALS

ARE STILL THERE.

TERRI>>YOU COVER KILNS IN THE

BOOK.

HANK>>YES, DID YOU KNOW, WE

FOUND THROUGH RESEARCH, THERE

ARE ABOUT 179 KILNS IN THE

WESTERN PART OF THE STATE.

THAT'S AN ENORMOUS NUMBER.

AND THEY MADE PIG IRON FOR

THE MOST PART. THEY HAD A

FORM THAT LOOKED LIKE A SOW

LAYING ON HER SIDE AND THEN

ALL OF THESE LITTLE PIGLETS

TERRI>>OH, WOW.

HANK>>AND IT WAS A MAJOR

EXPORT FROM THIS COUNTRY TO

ENGLAND.

TERRI>>OH, THAT'S JUST REALLY

FASCINATING. WHAT ELSE IS

FASCINATING IS YOU HAVE FULL

VILLAGES THAT ARE RUINS, TALK

ABOUT SOME OF THOSE.

HANK>>WELL, YOU KNOW

MATILDAVILLE IS ON THE GREAT

FALLS IN WASHINGTON, IT'S

MARVELOUS BECAUSE YOU CAN

WALK THROUGH IT. AND THEY

TELL A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE

TOWN. AND IT'S CALLED

MATILDAVILLE BECAUSE THE

ENGINEER WHO WAS WORKING ON

THE CANAL, HIS WIFE WAS NAMED

MATILDA. BUT ONCE THE CANAL

NO LONGER FUNCTIONED, IT WAS

ABANDONED, PEOPLE DIDN'T GO

BACK AND SO THE WHOLE TOWN

JUST FELL DOWN TO STONES,

THEY'RE STILL THERE, YOU CAN

SEE THEM. AND THEN ONE OF THE

OTHER ONE'S IS OVER IN THE

VALLEY WHICH IS A — A LOT OF

THEM COULD BE OLD SPRINGS

OVER THERE IN THE VALLEY THAT

ARE NO LONGER IN USE. YOU

HAVE WARM SPRINGS, HOT

SPRINGS AND YOU HAD A SPRING

CALLED SWEET TRUBILIA AND

THEN RED SULPHUR AND BLUE

SULPHUR AND ALL THESE SPRINGS

AND THOSE HAD LITTLE TOWNS

THAT SPRUNG UP AROUND THEM

AND THE LITTLE TOWNS WHEN THE

SPRINGS WENT THE LITTLE TOWNS

FOLDED BACK INTO THE GROUND.

>>

TERRI>>YOU'VE ALSO COVERED

TUNNELS, RAILROAD STATIONS IN

THE BOOK.

HANK>>THE RAILROAD STATIONS

ARE SUCH A HEARTBREAKING

THING BECAUSE WE HAVE THEM

AND THEY'RE NOW GOING MUCH

MORE FAST, THEY'RE GOING —

THEY'RE FALLING DOWN AND NO

ONE IS PROTECTING THEM. WE

HAVE THREE OF THEM IN THE

BOOK BUT THEY'RE A WHOLE

SERIES OF THEM THAT WENT FROM

HARRISONBURG DOWN TO ROANOKE.

NOW THE AQUADUCTS IN THE

TUNNELS MUST HAVE BEEN BUILT

BY THE SAME GROUP OF IRISH,

SCOTCH-IRISH AND WELSH

BECAUSE THE JOINING IS ALL

THE SAME, IF YOU GO UP TO THE

JOINTS THEY'RE THE SAME AND

THE CUTTING OF THE ARCHES ARE

ALL THE SAME. SO THERE'S A

WHOLE HISTORY THERE OF PEOPLE

BROUGHT OVER TO THIS COUNTRY

TO DO A SPECIFIC THING AND

THE RAILROADS.

TERRI>>AND A LOT OF SLAVES

BUILT A LOT OF THESE

STRUCTURES.

HANK>>YOU KNOW,SLAVERY IS AN

ISSUE THAT IS FINALLY COMING

UP TO THE SURFACE. AND AS YOU

SEE THE BRICK ON THIS

BUILDING LOOK HOW UNIFORM

THEY ARE. IF THEY WERE A

SIXTEENTH OR AN EIGHTH OFF

THE JOINTS WOULD WANDER ALL

OVER THE WALL. THERE WAS MUCH

EXPERTISE ON THE PART OF

SLAVES.

KEVIN MANUTT: THEY TELL WHERE

WE'VE BEEN NOT ONLY AS A

STATE BUT AS A COUNTRY.

THERE'S A LOT OF INDUSTRIAL

HISTORY, A LOT OF FARMING

HISTORY. IT BASICALLY IS SORT

OF A HISTORY OF THE HUMAN

CONDITION BOTH AS VIRGINIANS

AND BOTH AS AMERICANS. AND I

THINK IT'S SOMETHING THAT'S

IMPORTANT TO BE PRESERVED AND

THE MAIN GOAL OF THIS BOOK IS

TO BE AN ADVOCATE FOR THESE

RUINS.

>>HANK: A LOT OF PEOPLE DON'T

KNOW, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT

CAME OUT OF THE LEAGUE OF

NATIONS WAS GUIDELINES FOR

RESTORING THE DAMAGE OF WWI.

THEY WERE THEN BROUGHT IN AS

THE BIBLE FOR THE

PRESERVATION OF BUILDINGS FOR

THE NATIONAL PARK SERVICE

WHICH WAS THEN BROUGHT INTO

THE PRESERVATION COMMUNITY.

SO OUR THESIS, OUR LOGIC

COMES FROM THE LEAGUE OF

NATIONS.

>>TERRI: MMM. TALK ABOUT

MENOKIN. BECAUSE THERE'S

SOMETHING THAT'S A GREAT

EXAMPLE OF--

HANK>> YES, THAT IS JUST A

MARVELOUS EXAMPLE OF THE

EXTREME THAT IS GOING ON

RIGHT NOW AND THAT IS THE

EPITOME OF IT WHERE THEY'RE

USING GLASS, STRUCTURAL GLASS

TO KEEP THE WEATHER OFF THE

BUILDING FABRIC AND THEY'RE

GOING TAKING EACH STONE AND

MEASURING IT AND PUTTING IT

IN A PILE AND FINDING OUT

WHERE IT GOES BACK IN TO THE

BUILDING. AND THAT IS JUST

EXTRAORDINARY. AND THE OTHER

PLACE THAT I KNOW THAT'S

DOING THAT IS THE ACROPOLIS

IN ATHENS WHICH I WAS ABLE TO

BE THERE.

HANK>> SO IF SOMEBODY SAYS

WHAT DID A WINE CELLAR LOOK

LIKE? I WAS AT MENOKIN AND I

WALKED IN THAT WINE CELLAR.

TERRI>>SO TELL US ABOUT

MERRIE MILL, RIGHT DOWN THE

ROAD IN CISMONT.

HANK>>WELL, IT WAS BUILT BY

COLONEL THOMAS WALKER'S SON,

SAME SORT OF STRUCTURE, SAME

SORT OF BEAMS AND

CONFIGURATION.

TERRI: AS WALKER'S MILL

HANK: AS WALKER'S MILL, AND

STONE FOUNDATION WITH BRICK

ABOVE, WITH WOOD, GORGEOUS

BUILDING. AND I'M SURE

SOMEONE IS GOING TO RESTORE

THAT. IT TAKES A LOT OF TIME

AND EFFORT TO GET INVOLVED IN

SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

TERRI>>HANK, THANK YOU SO

MUCH FOR SPENDING TIME WITH

US TODAY, THIS HAS BEEN

REALLY FASCINATING, I

APPRECIATE IT.

HANK>>WELL, YOU'VE GIVEN ME

THE OPPORTUNITY TO EXPRESS

THE THINGS THAT I'VE BEEN

TRYING TO GET VIRGINIANS AND

THE REST OF THE NATION

INVOLVED IN. THANKS A LOT FOR

HAVING ME.