WEBVTT 00:01.335 --> 00:01.501 - [Female Announcer]  Production funding for 00:01.501 --> 00:04.805  Behind the Headlines   is made possible in part by 00:04.805 --> 00:06.874  the WKNO Production Fund, 00:06.874 --> 00:08.876  the WKNO Endowment Fund, 00:08.876 --> 00:11.111  and by viewers like you. 00:11.111 --> 00:11.945  Thank you. 00:13.347 --> 00:16.783 - Senator Bob Corker tonight on Behind the Headlines. 00:16.783 --> 00:20.621 (dramatic music) 00:33.467 --> 00:35.435 I'm Eric Barnes, publisher of the Memphis Daily News. 00:35.435 --> 00:36.837 Thanks for joining us. 00:36.837 --> 00:38.839 I am joined tonight by Bob Corker, US Senator. 00:38.839 --> 00:40.340 Thank you for being here. 00:40.340 --> 00:42.009 - Yeah, good to be with you here, you and Bill both. 00:42.009 --> 00:43.777 - Yeah absolutely, absolutely. 00:43.777 --> 00:47.114 Also Bill Dries, senior reporter with the Memphis Daily News. 00:47.114 --> 00:48.949 Well again, thank you very much for being here. 00:48.949 --> 00:51.685 I guess where we are, we're actually taping this 00:51.685 --> 00:53.620 on Tuesday I should say, so this will air on Friday 00:53.620 --> 00:57.858 but we're give or take 90, 100 days into Trump's presidency 00:57.858 --> 01:00.928 and it's, you know, he's an unconventional candidate, 01:00.928 --> 01:02.863 an unconventional president. 01:02.863 --> 01:05.165 Your thoughts on this first 100 days 01:05.165 --> 01:08.502 and what's been unexpected, your thoughts. 01:08.502 --> 01:12.673 - So I saw him yesterday briefly and what I would, 01:13.874 --> 01:17.511 the administration is evolving a great deal. 01:17.511 --> 01:20.714 I mean you had a candidate who was at rallies 01:20.714 --> 01:23.250 and really didn't have a lot of institutional support 01:23.250 --> 01:26.286 if you will, and developed a lot of his positions 01:26.286 --> 01:30.090 based on responses during that period of time. 01:30.090 --> 01:31.625 And now he's coming into office 01:31.625 --> 01:33.927 and he's having to deal with the world as it is 01:33.927 --> 01:35.662 with all the complexities. 01:35.662 --> 01:37.664 And from a foreign policy standpoint where, 01:37.664 --> 01:39.499 I'm chairman of the foreign relations committee, 01:39.499 --> 01:41.468 so that's obviously a major focus. 01:41.468 --> 01:44.404 I've seen him evolve in a very positive way. 01:44.404 --> 01:47.007 I was somewhat concerned about some of the 01:47.007 --> 01:50.077 campaign statements relative to foreign policy 01:50.077 --> 01:52.946 but on every front I've seen him evolve to 01:52.946 --> 01:56.717 a very, very, much more positive place, 01:56.717 --> 01:58.485 all around the world. 01:58.485 --> 02:01.388 So I actually have been gratified by that. 02:01.388 --> 02:05.726 He's got a really crack, great national security team 02:05.726 --> 02:08.295 around him, and they've been a little slow 02:08.295 --> 02:10.864 putting personnel in place, let's face it, 02:10.864 --> 02:12.332 and have gone through it, 02:12.332 --> 02:14.401 it's not like he came there with this host of people 02:14.401 --> 02:17.104 that he'd served with as a governor or senator 02:17.104 --> 02:19.573 or something like that, so, you know, 02:19.573 --> 02:22.275 but again, on the foreign policy front, 02:22.275 --> 02:25.245 I'd say I'm very, very pleased with how they've evolved. 02:25.245 --> 02:26.780 - And we'll dive into some of that 02:26.780 --> 02:28.415 foreign policy, those issues, but again, 02:28.415 --> 02:29.916 just reflecting a little on his presidency, 02:29.916 --> 02:32.019 he's even starting to get a little criticism 02:32.019 --> 02:35.789 that he's moderating, because he had a very conservative, 02:35.789 --> 02:38.558 very right wing in many positions, anti-NATO, 02:38.558 --> 02:41.561 we're gonna get disengaged from the world, 02:41.561 --> 02:44.531 so is that just part of the process? 02:44.531 --> 02:45.966 You've been a senator for what now, 02:45.966 --> 02:47.467 10-plus years give or take, 02:47.467 --> 02:50.604 is it part of the process that Washington does moderate? 02:50.604 --> 02:54.875 And even almost limit on how extreme a view you can have, 02:54.875 --> 02:56.543 left or right? 02:56.543 --> 02:59.813 - No, I think, look, if I were to run 02:59.813 --> 03:02.015 for that big office, if you will, 03:02.015 --> 03:04.351 I know exactly where I stand. 03:04.351 --> 03:06.853 I've been around these issues for years, 03:06.853 --> 03:09.356 and ask me a question, I'll answer it, 03:09.356 --> 03:11.925 and usually it's based on a decade of 03:11.925 --> 03:14.094 understanding national issues. 03:14.094 --> 03:17.364 I think that with the President, again, 03:19.066 --> 03:21.768 it was just an evolution that was taking place, 03:21.768 --> 03:23.804 and I don't think it's moderating him. 03:23.804 --> 03:25.972 As a matter of fact, having spent some time with him 03:25.972 --> 03:29.743 as potential Secretary of State or potential VP person, 03:29.743 --> 03:33.747 I knew from day one he was not, if you will, 03:33.747 --> 03:36.483 a right-wing person in any way. 03:36.483 --> 03:38.452 But I think what's happening is, 03:38.452 --> 03:42.122 he's having people come in the scene 03:42.122 --> 03:43.657 from other parts of the world, 03:43.657 --> 03:45.826 he's beginning to understand these issues 03:45.826 --> 03:48.195 are much more complex than a soundbite 03:48.195 --> 03:50.097 or something said at a rally, 03:50.097 --> 03:51.998 and I think it's a good thing. 03:51.998 --> 03:54.935 I mean, he's developing a depth of knowledge 03:54.935 --> 03:57.871 that wasn't there, obviously, before he was elected. 03:57.871 --> 04:00.006 - Before we go to Bill, how seriously 04:00.006 --> 04:02.242 did you consider going into the administration? 04:02.242 --> 04:05.979 - The Vice President thing I very quickly shared with them 04:05.979 --> 04:08.815 that I didn't think it was the right role for me. 04:08.815 --> 04:11.151 I mean, just early on in the day of, 04:11.151 --> 04:12.752 I spent an entire day with him, 04:12.752 --> 04:15.622 but early on in that day, as was publicly documented, 04:15.622 --> 04:18.325 I just didn't feel like it was the right thing for me. 04:18.325 --> 04:20.327 For them, for me to do it either. 04:20.327 --> 04:23.263 Secretary of State, that was interesting. 04:23.263 --> 04:25.432 I've spent time in foreign policy 04:25.432 --> 04:27.834 and have traveled the world extensively 04:27.834 --> 04:31.705 and just came from Uganda, there on some refugee issues, 04:31.705 --> 04:33.607 and so that was interesting, 04:33.607 --> 04:36.443 but at the same time I had a role in the Senate 04:36.443 --> 04:38.345 as chairman of the foreign relations committee 04:38.345 --> 04:40.013 that was also, so. 04:40.013 --> 04:42.949 In that particular case, had I been asked, 04:42.949 --> 04:44.718 that would've been something that would've 04:44.718 --> 04:47.120 strongly considered and done, okay. 04:47.120 --> 04:51.258 But I think the Tillerson nomination was really for him, 04:51.258 --> 04:53.326 pretty inspired, I mean, here's a guy that's 04:53.326 --> 04:55.595 had a company all around the world, 04:55.595 --> 04:57.063 the President respects 04:57.063 --> 04:59.199 big companies and business like that, 04:59.199 --> 05:02.569 and I think allowed him to come in in a very good way. 05:02.569 --> 05:04.371 Rex and I have a great relationship, 05:04.371 --> 05:06.072 and I think all's worked well. 05:06.072 --> 05:07.541 - Bill? 05:07.541 --> 05:11.211 - Senator, where do you think our foreign policy is 05:11.211 --> 05:15.382 on Syria in the wake of the administration's strikes 05:16.783 --> 05:21.388 in Syria in retaliation for the gassing of the town. 05:21.388 --> 05:23.590 Has it changed our foreign policy? 05:23.590 --> 05:26.960 - Well, I talked to the President that night, 05:26.960 --> 05:29.963 he had just left the leader of China 05:33.333 --> 05:37.304 and the strikes had occurred just momentarily before, 05:37.304 --> 05:39.706 I think it was some ways transformative for him. 05:39.706 --> 05:42.642 I think when he saw the gassing of people there 05:42.642 --> 05:44.444 and its effect, I think these things, 05:44.444 --> 05:46.880 sometimes when you're running, 05:46.880 --> 05:49.015 I've been to these refugee camps, Bill, 05:49.015 --> 05:51.651 and I know these, many of the Syrians, 05:51.651 --> 05:55.622 they call me, believe it or not, from the conflict areas, 05:55.622 --> 05:58.458 they come visit me in the offices, 05:59.859 --> 06:03.997 so I had a visceral, a real tie to what was happening there, 06:05.432 --> 06:07.901 I know Assad, I met him before the conflict began. 06:07.901 --> 06:11.438 I think for the President, it made a personal connection 06:11.438 --> 06:14.274 to what was happening there, and in some ways I do think, 06:14.274 --> 06:16.843 quickly, he realized what it meant to be 06:16.843 --> 06:19.546 the President of the United States and Commander-in-Chief 06:19.546 --> 06:22.315 on issues like that, so in many ways, yes, 06:22.315 --> 06:25.185 I do think it affected his foreign policy. 06:25.185 --> 06:28.722 I thought the response that we gave was exactly right, 06:28.722 --> 06:31.825 it was surgical, it was tied to what had occurred, 06:31.825 --> 06:35.228 it was at the airport where the chemical weapons 06:35.228 --> 06:38.098 had taken off and where they had been stored, 06:38.098 --> 06:40.567 so I thought he did exactly the right thing. 06:40.567 --> 06:44.571 I think people, Bill, there's actually a minimum 06:45.705 --> 06:47.774 of two things going on in Syria, 06:47.774 --> 06:50.143 there's the Assad regime and what he's doing to 06:50.143 --> 06:54.581 his own people, in the western part of the country mostly, 06:54.581 --> 06:56.983 and then you've got what's happening with ISIS 06:56.983 --> 06:58.718 in Raqqa and other areas, 06:58.718 --> 07:00.553 and then all the various groups that are 07:00.553 --> 07:01.955 on one side or another. 07:01.955 --> 07:04.391 So there's actually two different things, in many ways, 07:04.391 --> 07:05.825 that are happening there. 07:05.825 --> 07:08.328 But I thought his response to what Assad did 07:08.328 --> 07:10.830 was perfectly appropriate and the right thing to do. 07:10.830 --> 07:13.833 - So then does our response on that, 07:15.168 --> 07:18.371 should it change our policy to refugees? 07:18.371 --> 07:22.242 Should it change our outlook on the travel ban 07:22.242 --> 07:25.245 or the administration's outlook on the travel ban, 07:25.245 --> 07:28.948 having seen this problem that can cause people 07:28.948 --> 07:31.718 to flee from an area like that? 07:31.718 --> 07:34.688 - Yeah, I think, Bill, where we blew it in Syria was, 07:34.688 --> 07:38.758 we had great conversations that were taking place 07:39.926 --> 07:42.796 between Turkey and us to create a no-fly zone 07:42.796 --> 07:47.167 along the border and also to deal with flights 07:47.167 --> 07:51.004 over the northwest triangle of Aleppo, 07:51.004 --> 07:52.739 and there was an opportunity at that time 07:52.739 --> 07:55.775 to keep refugees from flooding into Europe by 07:55.775 --> 07:59.346 creating a place for them to stay within their own country, 07:59.346 --> 08:01.848 and our former president just never could 08:01.848 --> 08:04.284 get to that decision process, 08:04.284 --> 08:06.519 and I'm not sure that Turkey wasn't continuing 08:06.519 --> 08:09.856 to move the bar, can't speak to what was happening there, 08:09.856 --> 08:13.760 but I think that the real solution to Syria, 08:13.760 --> 08:16.296 refugee-wise, would've been to figure out a way 08:16.296 --> 08:19.366 for them to be able to stay within their own country, 08:19.366 --> 08:22.202 but when we would not step up with others to help 08:22.202 --> 08:26.005 make that happen, it created a flight out of the country. 08:26.005 --> 08:28.808 As it relates to the travel ban, it's my hope 08:28.808 --> 08:31.544 that they'll go through this in a very speedy way, 08:31.544 --> 08:35.014 they'll realize that, they'll put things in place 08:35.014 --> 08:37.984 to make sure that Americans feel safe about what's happening 08:37.984 --> 08:42.255 and we can move on and normalize our policies. 08:42.255 --> 08:45.091 - So is it possible, in your view, 08:46.626 --> 08:48.094 for us to work for the elimination 08:48.094 --> 08:50.063 or neutralization of ISIS 08:50.063 --> 08:54.234 and also work toward a day when Assad is not in power, 08:55.835 --> 08:58.838 and a day soon when Assad is not in power? 08:58.838 --> 09:01.841 Can those two be pursued at the same time? 09:01.841 --> 09:04.310 - They can, I mean, in fairness, 09:04.310 --> 09:06.913 there was an interesting Tom Friedman editorial 09:06.913 --> 09:10.717 just in the last few days that I read, 09:10.717 --> 09:14.454 the fact is that we're actually helping Assad in some ways 09:14.454 --> 09:18.625 by trying to rid Raqqa of ISIS and other parts of Syria. 09:19.793 --> 09:21.995 At the same time, the reason we're doing that 09:21.995 --> 09:23.663 is they're a threat to us, I mean, 09:23.663 --> 09:26.699 this is where many of the efforts against 09:26.699 --> 09:30.203 Western civilization, against our allies in Europe and us, 09:30.203 --> 09:32.405 that's where they're planned, is out of Raqqa, 09:32.405 --> 09:35.809 so you end up in these complex situations. 09:35.809 --> 09:39.379 So the answer is yes, you can try to deal with ISIS, 09:39.379 --> 09:42.449 in a way, for Assad it benefits him, 09:42.449 --> 09:44.250 because we're dealing with one of the 09:44.250 --> 09:47.387 problems within the country, but on the other hand, 09:47.387 --> 09:50.023 yes, I think we can work with the world community 09:50.023 --> 09:53.660 to try to rid the country, over time, of Assad, 09:53.660 --> 09:55.829 who's lost his legitimacy. 09:56.996 --> 09:58.698 My hope is he's gonna end up behind bars, 09:58.698 --> 10:01.935 I mean, this guy's a war criminal, there's no question, 10:01.935 --> 10:04.404 there's no doubt in my mind he's a war criminal, 10:04.404 --> 10:06.940 he's tortured people, I don't know if you've seen 10:06.940 --> 10:10.410 the Holocaust Museum exhibit of Caesar, who's gone in 10:10.410 --> 10:13.880 and photographed the torture of his own people, 10:13.880 --> 10:18.051 it's beyond belief that in 2017 this is happening. 10:20.320 --> 10:23.857 And again, I hope we're able to work with others 10:23.857 --> 10:26.693 in a constructive way to move him on out. 10:26.693 --> 10:28.795 - Do you worry, we look back at, I mean, 10:28.795 --> 10:30.630 no one at this table and I don't think 10:30.630 --> 10:33.633 many people in the United States would defend Assad. 10:33.633 --> 10:37.837 But do you look back at Afghanistan, at Iraq, at Libya, 10:37.837 --> 10:40.273 and the destabilizing of dictators, 10:40.273 --> 10:42.175 however horrendous they are, 10:42.175 --> 10:44.110 they then destabilize that country 10:44.110 --> 10:47.547 and what comes next, we haven't really mastered, 10:47.547 --> 10:51.084 and this refugee crisis is in part driven, 10:51.084 --> 10:53.953 all kinds of terrorism is driven in part, 10:53.953 --> 10:57.223 the immigration ban, so when you say removing Assad, 10:57.223 --> 11:00.126 do you worry about what that next step could be? 11:00.126 --> 11:01.928 - Yeah, you said remove Assad, 11:01.928 --> 11:04.030 I said work for a future towards that. 11:04.030 --> 11:06.766 So look, yeah, for that very reason, 11:06.766 --> 11:10.036 I thought what we did in Libya was actually, 11:10.036 --> 11:13.106 what we didn't do in Syria in 2013, 11:13.106 --> 11:15.909 from my standpoint, public service-wise, 11:15.909 --> 11:18.244 was the lowest moment of my career, 11:18.244 --> 11:20.079 when we had an opportunity, 11:20.079 --> 11:23.950 the moderate rebels actually had momentum near Damascus, 11:23.950 --> 11:26.352 things were moving, and these were people who 11:26.352 --> 11:30.957 were really moderate people who just wanted a country, 11:30.957 --> 11:32.725 like ours if you will. 11:32.725 --> 11:34.494 When we didn't take those actions, 11:34.494 --> 11:36.429 and since 500,000 people are dead, 11:36.429 --> 11:38.231 half the country displaced, 11:38.231 --> 11:39.866 that was the low moment. 11:39.866 --> 11:42.068 But let me go back to the Libya issue. 11:42.068 --> 11:44.971 I thought that was a terrible mistake on our part. 11:44.971 --> 11:49.876 Here we have a guy, Gaddafi, who's a terrible person, 11:49.876 --> 11:54.047 who had rid his country of weapons of mass destruction. 11:56.049 --> 11:57.483 So we killed him. 11:58.685 --> 12:00.486 So, I mean, what kind of signal has that sent 12:00.486 --> 12:01.988 the leader of North Korea? 12:01.988 --> 12:03.823 The leader of North Korea's basically saying, 12:03.823 --> 12:05.992 "If I can have nuclear weapons, 12:05.992 --> 12:08.194 "I'm gonna die an old man in my bed, 12:08.194 --> 12:10.630 unlike what happened to Gaddafi." 12:10.630 --> 12:13.132 So that was a terrible thing for us to do. 12:13.132 --> 12:17.370 In Iraq, no doubt, we went in, we had no plan 12:17.370 --> 12:19.372 and thought we were gonna turn this country 12:19.372 --> 12:22.141 into a mirror of United States, 12:22.141 --> 12:24.277 and I've been there I don't know how many times, 12:24.277 --> 12:27.747 I'm just telling you, Iraq is not gonna be governed 12:27.747 --> 12:30.116 exactly like the United States, so no, 12:30.116 --> 12:31.551 we've made a lot of mistakes, 12:31.551 --> 12:33.419 and therefore with Assad, it can't be 12:33.419 --> 12:35.588 just going in and crumbling the regime. 12:35.588 --> 12:37.724 The fact is, the Alawite population, 12:37.724 --> 12:40.393 which is about 10% of the people who used to live there, 12:40.393 --> 12:42.061 it's even greater now, right, 12:42.061 --> 12:43.529 but they're the folks that are the, 12:43.529 --> 12:46.099 they're the more secular oriented, I might add, 12:46.099 --> 12:49.202 and they protect Christians, 12:49.202 --> 12:52.705 we need that institutional group of people 12:53.906 --> 12:55.241 to be there in the country, 12:55.241 --> 12:57.043 but Assad himself as a leader, 12:57.043 --> 12:59.445 it's my hope we'll try him for war crimes 12:59.445 --> 13:01.748 and put him in jail. 13:01.748 --> 13:03.616 - Just briefly, there was talk, 13:03.616 --> 13:07.086 an unsourced article about the Trump administration 13:07.086 --> 13:08.721 talking about putting more troops, 13:08.721 --> 13:10.857 tens of thousands of US troops into Syria, 13:10.857 --> 13:14.093 are you aware of that, are you in favor 13:14.093 --> 13:15.495 of more troops going in? 13:15.495 --> 13:17.063 - No, not at all. 13:17.063 --> 13:19.632 I think there are some additional special operators 13:19.632 --> 13:23.603 that have gone in, it's amazing to see 13:23.603 --> 13:25.872 what these guys are able to do as far as directing 13:25.872 --> 13:28.174 drone attacks and those kinds of things, 13:28.174 --> 13:30.276 but as far as infantry on the ground, nobody, 13:30.276 --> 13:32.412 I don't know of anybody that's interested in that. 13:32.412 --> 13:34.080 There might be a couple of senators. 13:34.080 --> 13:36.249 - Right, (laughs) a couple senators. 13:36.249 --> 13:38.317 You mentioned North Korea, and I should say again 13:38.317 --> 13:40.086 because it's a pretty quickly moving situation, 13:40.086 --> 13:42.021 we're taping this on Tuesday, it will air on Friday. 13:42.021 --> 13:44.257 Your thoughts on where, what next with North Korea? 13:44.257 --> 13:47.060 The tension is building, a lot of pressure, 13:47.060 --> 13:49.362 different kind of talk from the Trump administration 13:49.362 --> 13:50.897 than the previous administration, 13:50.897 --> 13:53.032 and yet no administration, Republican or Democratic, 13:53.032 --> 13:55.301 has figured this one out. 13:55.301 --> 13:56.903 What do you think the direction should be? 13:56.903 --> 13:58.738 - Part of the failure of dealing with North Korea 13:58.738 --> 14:02.642 was Bush 41, Clinton, Bush 43, Obama, and now, 14:02.642 --> 14:06.212 now they're on the brink of getting, they're really, 14:06.212 --> 14:09.148 in another couple years it's beyond return. 14:09.148 --> 14:11.818 They're gonna have the ability to deliver an ICBM 14:11.818 --> 14:14.921 on the continental United States. 14:14.921 --> 14:17.056 Open source reporting would say that they've got 14:17.056 --> 14:18.891 20 to 30 warheads now. 14:20.727 --> 14:23.463 And so it's got to be dealt with. 14:25.331 --> 14:27.767 And China, this is almost a cliche to say, 14:27.767 --> 14:30.903 everyone knows this but China is the most important partner, 14:30.903 --> 14:33.639 I think the President and their leader had 14:33.639 --> 14:36.642 a very good meeting and beginning relationship building, 14:36.642 --> 14:40.513 and I think turning the volume up right now 14:40.513 --> 14:43.549 is an important thing to do, with the acknowledgement 14:43.549 --> 14:48.087 that what you could bring in is Russia, China, 14:48.087 --> 14:50.723 South Korea, Japan, into a conflict, 14:50.723 --> 14:53.760 so you've gotta be careful as to how you do that, 14:53.760 --> 14:55.661 but I think this is an issue that 14:55.661 --> 14:57.263 we've got to go ahead and address, 14:57.263 --> 14:59.999 otherwise you're gonna be beyond return. 14:59.999 --> 15:02.135 - Bringing it back home a little bit, 15:02.135 --> 15:04.604 we talked about immigration and the travel ban. 15:04.604 --> 15:08.141 When the first ban went in and then it was rescinded, 15:08.141 --> 15:09.375 a second went out there, 15:09.375 --> 15:11.344 all this pressure on immigrants and travel, 15:11.344 --> 15:13.312 did you hear from companies in Tennessee? 15:13.312 --> 15:17.083 From FedEx to Nissan, the universities, 15:17.083 --> 15:19.552 I mean there was some talk of people being stranded, 15:19.552 --> 15:22.355 the impact on students and employees and so on. 15:22.355 --> 15:23.856 Did you hear from your people? 15:23.856 --> 15:25.158 - I don't know if you remember, 15:25.158 --> 15:26.726 but I sent out a very terse response, 15:26.726 --> 15:29.729 within 20 minutes heard from the White House, 15:29.729 --> 15:31.798 but no, it was just poorly crafted, 15:31.798 --> 15:34.634 people with green cards were in the air, 15:34.634 --> 15:36.803 when they landed, they had no idea, 15:36.803 --> 15:40.273 the position changed I think three times over the weekend 15:40.273 --> 15:43.910 as far as what authorized holders of the ability 15:43.910 --> 15:46.712 to be here in our country were able to do. 15:46.712 --> 15:50.616 So they got that more right, they dropped Iraq, 15:52.084 --> 15:55.521 I was in Iraq about the time they were crafting it, 15:55.521 --> 15:57.857 just about a month or five weeks ago, 15:57.857 --> 16:01.294 and communicated with him, "Look, here we are 16:01.294 --> 16:04.130 fighting side by side," and basically saying-- 16:04.130 --> 16:05.932 - [Eric]  Translators and   allies, people who've been-- 16:05.932 --> 16:07.600 - Yeah, these guys have risked their lives, 16:07.600 --> 16:09.836 and this is just not appropriate. 16:09.836 --> 16:11.637 So I think they fine-tuned it, 16:11.637 --> 16:13.706 here's what I hope and what I think everyone hopes, 16:13.706 --> 16:15.641 is that they're gonna go through this process 16:15.641 --> 16:18.177 of understanding the vetting, how it works, 16:18.177 --> 16:20.313 get to a place where we feel like we have 16:20.313 --> 16:22.882 all the appropriate steps in place 16:22.882 --> 16:24.984 and then we're gonna normalize our policy. 16:24.984 --> 16:26.719 - Well, segue a little bit with immigration 16:26.719 --> 16:30.122 to illegal immigration from Mexico and South America, 16:30.122 --> 16:31.657 and that's been, obviously the wall, 16:31.657 --> 16:32.925 and I don't really particularly need 16:32.925 --> 16:35.695 to talk about the wall per se, but in terms of, 16:35.695 --> 16:37.530 you were mayor, Mayor of Chattanooga, 16:37.530 --> 16:40.566 mayors across the country, cities across the country, 16:40.566 --> 16:42.568 started to feel a lot of pressure from the administration 16:42.568 --> 16:44.804 in terms of whatever a sanctuary city means, 16:44.804 --> 16:48.541 and not enforcing immigration custom actions. 16:49.842 --> 16:51.377 I think Mayor Strickland's been on the show 16:51.377 --> 16:53.546 and talked about how, look, we're not in the business, 16:53.546 --> 16:55.448 the Memphis police department is not in the business 16:55.448 --> 16:59.819 of breaking down doors and rounding up illegal immigrants. 16:59.819 --> 17:02.221 You don't have to comment on Memphis policy, 17:02.221 --> 17:04.257 but your take on what the appropriate, 17:04.257 --> 17:05.725 what should cities be doing? 17:05.725 --> 17:07.927 How should cities work with the federal government, 17:07.927 --> 17:10.529 with undocumented illegal immigrants? 17:10.529 --> 17:13.599 - Yeah, like on one hand you're right, 17:13.599 --> 17:16.302 I used to be a mayor and your local police department 17:16.302 --> 17:19.972 is not the customs service or the immigration service, 17:19.972 --> 17:22.642 you don't want that to be the case, 17:22.642 --> 17:24.343 you don't want to nationalize what's happening 17:24.343 --> 17:25.845 in the local level. 17:25.845 --> 17:29.949 On the other hand, there are cities that actually advertise 17:31.317 --> 17:33.853 and try to create a situation where they lure people, 17:33.853 --> 17:35.855 that's inappropriate, and so I think there's, 17:35.855 --> 17:39.859 I do think that when that is taking place, 17:39.859 --> 17:42.395 when there's an obvious obfuscation if you will 17:42.395 --> 17:44.463 of our US immigration policy, 17:44.463 --> 17:47.867 then that's got to be dealt with in the appropriate way. 17:47.867 --> 17:49.602 - [Eric] Bill? 17:49.602 --> 17:51.570 - So talking about something like 17:51.570 --> 17:53.339 the rollout of the travel ban 17:53.339 --> 17:55.808 and things that went wrong with it, 17:55.808 --> 17:59.378 was that a function of a new administration 18:00.546 --> 18:04.517 finding its legs or do we have something deeper 18:04.517 --> 18:09.155 going on, a fight for views within the administration, 18:09.155 --> 18:12.491 competing ideologies in the White House? 18:13.893 --> 18:15.728 - Course I wasn't sitting in that meeting, okay, 18:15.728 --> 18:18.631 or the meetings that took place leading up to that, 18:18.631 --> 18:22.668 my sense is it was a rush to get something out there 18:22.668 --> 18:26.639 that was stated was gonna be dealt with during the campaign 18:26.639 --> 18:29.542 without crossing all T's and dotting all I's, 18:29.542 --> 18:31.811 and I think it was probably part of 18:31.811 --> 18:33.646 the first part of your question, 18:33.646 --> 18:36.749 it was they're new, they're wanting to have impact. 18:36.749 --> 18:38.617 I think, again, the longer they're there, 18:38.617 --> 18:41.854 the more is realized that hey, these issues, 18:41.854 --> 18:44.523 healthcare for instance, are a lot more difficult 18:44.523 --> 18:46.726 than we ever thought, but I think it's the first, 18:46.726 --> 18:49.762 I don't think it was, I know there have been 18:49.762 --> 18:52.298 some competing views on things, 18:52.298 --> 18:54.734 but I would rack it up to the first point. 18:54.734 --> 18:58.070 - So when we were in the primary season, 18:59.505 --> 19:03.209 you and Senator Alexander talked a good deal about this, 19:03.209 --> 19:06.545 at the time when Trump was not the nominee apparent, 19:06.545 --> 19:08.647 and your point at that time was, 19:08.647 --> 19:10.816 if he gets the most votes, 19:12.752 --> 19:15.688 how do you deny him the nomination, 19:15.688 --> 19:17.957 how do you go against that? 19:19.191 --> 19:23.029 And he wound up being the nominee, so. 19:23.029 --> 19:24.597 When you're President, though, 19:24.597 --> 19:26.665 it seems as if once you win the election, 19:26.665 --> 19:30.836 that all changes and doesn't count for a whole lot 19:32.872 --> 19:37.443 like it did when you were going for the nomination. 19:37.443 --> 19:41.480 Do you think that Trump has been accepted, 19:41.480 --> 19:44.550 given the closeness of the general election, 19:44.550 --> 19:46.452 the popular vote in it? 19:48.254 --> 19:51.390 - Oh, you know, look, I just came from a town hall meeting, 19:51.390 --> 19:54.326 and I can assure you that not the entire country 19:54.326 --> 19:57.997 has accepted, and there's a lot of division, 20:01.333 --> 20:04.370 you think about the country was on a trajectory 20:04.370 --> 20:08.274 under President Obama and people on the Democratic side 20:08.274 --> 20:10.409 thought that Secretary Clinton 20:10.409 --> 20:12.078 would continue that trajectory 20:12.078 --> 20:14.180 and all of a sudden the trajectory's in 20:14.180 --> 20:18.217 a very different direction in many ways. 20:18.217 --> 20:22.388 So no, I think the country, just the type of campaign 20:23.556 --> 20:25.925 that took place, it really, if you look at 20:25.925 --> 20:28.227 the Western world in general, 20:28.227 --> 20:32.465 we're seeing this happen all round the world right now, 20:32.465 --> 20:34.800 it's not just happening here in our own nation, 20:34.800 --> 20:37.169 and what you see is a population of people 20:37.169 --> 20:39.505 who generally speaking feel 20:39.505 --> 20:41.540 very insecure about their futures. 20:41.540 --> 20:44.944 You think about what's happening with technology, 20:44.944 --> 20:49.014 you look at people who may be 55 years old, 20:49.014 --> 20:52.084 who've worked hard all their life, 20:52.084 --> 20:54.153 maybe they didn't get the highest education level 20:54.153 --> 20:55.788 but they've done all the right things 20:55.788 --> 20:57.990 and they're looking at their future 20:57.990 --> 21:00.459 as being different than they ever thought. 21:00.459 --> 21:02.228 And then you've got a group of people 21:02.228 --> 21:06.332 who have a whole different set of concerns. 21:06.332 --> 21:09.668 So right now, no, the country continues to be, 21:09.668 --> 21:12.071 there's no question, divided, 21:13.239 --> 21:15.875 and just the nature of the election itself, 21:15.875 --> 21:18.611 I think helped make that occur. 21:18.611 --> 21:20.813 Now it's his job, regardless of that, 21:20.813 --> 21:22.781 he's President of the United States, 21:22.781 --> 21:26.185 it's his job to understand that and figure out 21:26.185 --> 21:27.820 a way to bring people together because 21:27.820 --> 21:30.156 we've got some huge issues that need to be solved. 21:30.156 --> 21:32.691 - During the campaign, Trump won in no small part 21:32.691 --> 21:36.128 because of Rust Belt, exactly what you describe, 21:36.128 --> 21:38.097 that insecurity and people feeling like, 21:38.097 --> 21:40.432 "Hey, I've been left behind in this new economy" 21:40.432 --> 21:42.668 and the death of manufacturing jobs there. 21:42.668 --> 21:44.103 A lot of people talk about, 21:44.103 --> 21:46.705 not so much that they went to Mexico 21:46.705 --> 21:48.407 but automation and just changes in the economy, 21:48.407 --> 21:50.843 but a lot of those jobs came to the south. 21:50.843 --> 21:52.978 If you talk about auto makers and go back to Volkswagen, 21:52.978 --> 21:55.114 when you were, I think that started when you were, 21:55.114 --> 21:56.382 I might get my timing wrong, 21:56.382 --> 21:57.650 but you were very involved in getting 21:57.650 --> 21:59.485 the Volkswagen plant into Chattanooga. 21:59.485 --> 22:01.720 Is some of this just, I mean, 22:01.720 --> 22:03.455 no one would want to say this to an individual, 22:03.455 --> 22:05.157 the 55-year-old person you described, 22:05.157 --> 22:07.426 but as a whole, is it just a matter of 22:07.426 --> 22:11.363 the economy shifts, jobs move, technology changes, 22:11.363 --> 22:13.966 and they're just painful choices that people have to make? 22:13.966 --> 22:16.702 - Look, a big part of it is that. 22:17.837 --> 22:21.507 It's the way our society is changing. 22:21.507 --> 22:23.576 At the same time, I will say, 22:23.576 --> 22:25.244 there are some things in these trade agreements 22:25.244 --> 22:26.712 that need to be altered. 22:26.712 --> 22:28.814 And the interesting thing is, despite all the rhetoric, 22:28.814 --> 22:30.783 the President of Mexico understands that, 22:30.783 --> 22:34.987 is more than willing to make some changes. 22:34.987 --> 22:37.556 We have some other ones that need to be looked at. 22:37.556 --> 22:39.124 - Short of throwing them out the door 22:39.124 --> 22:40.859 and starting from scratch on NAFTA. 22:40.859 --> 22:42.261 - No, I think you've already seen 22:42.261 --> 22:43.829 the statements that are being made, 22:43.829 --> 22:46.365 it's gonna be tweaked, it's not gonna be thrown out. 22:46.365 --> 22:48.067 There's a whole supply chain that's been 22:48.067 --> 22:50.402 built up around that that benefits Tennessee, 22:50.402 --> 22:51.070 - [Eric] And Memphis, absolutely. 22:51.070 --> 22:54.073 - It really does, no question. 22:54.073 --> 22:57.409 So I think that, though, we have, again, 22:59.278 --> 23:01.680 the Western world, and I'm gonna include 23:01.680 --> 23:03.883 Europe and us collectively, 23:05.751 --> 23:09.922 we have a challenge that people, I think, lesser so, 23:12.825 --> 23:16.829 feel the opportunity to achieve and aspire to be 23:18.230 --> 23:20.866 what they thought they were gonna be earlier in life 23:20.866 --> 23:23.335 and it's something we gotta deal with as a society. 23:23.335 --> 23:24.803 - Some of that comes from, 23:24.803 --> 23:27.439 and we gave you 26 minutes, we have two or three minutes left, 23:27.439 --> 23:29.141 some of that comes from healthcare, 23:29.141 --> 23:31.477 and Trump ran on, and many many Republicans ran on 23:31.477 --> 23:34.914 repealing and replacing, getting rid of Obamacare. 23:34.914 --> 23:39.618 In the House at least that died pretty publicly. 23:39.618 --> 23:42.121 Is reform or replacement of Obamacare 23:42.121 --> 23:44.723 dead for this year, does it seem? 23:44.723 --> 23:49.194 - I don't think it's dead... I don't think it's dead. 23:49.194 --> 23:52.564 I sense there's some movement on the House side, 23:52.564 --> 23:54.300 they wanted to start first. 23:54.300 --> 23:56.168 The Senate was gonna make changes, okay, 23:56.168 --> 23:58.971 different sensibilities on the Senate side 23:58.971 --> 24:01.707 than on the House side in some cases. 24:01.707 --> 24:04.176 And senators have a little bit more ability 24:04.176 --> 24:06.478 to singularly express themselves 24:06.478 --> 24:10.082 just because of the smaller numbers of people. 24:10.082 --> 24:13.952 But look, I hope we will deal with it, 24:13.952 --> 24:15.554 I think you know Lamar and I have offered 24:15.554 --> 24:17.456 a piece of legislation that will grant 24:17.456 --> 24:20.359 Tennesseeans who don't have a choice, 24:20.359 --> 24:22.127 there's no plan for them to go into, 24:22.127 --> 24:24.997 the ability to use that same subsidy or tax credit 24:24.997 --> 24:26.999 to buy plans that are off the exchange 24:26.999 --> 24:29.201 just as a stopgap measure. 24:29.201 --> 24:32.271 But look, it's gotta be dealt with appropriately 24:32.271 --> 24:35.274 and we've gotta make sure that people have opportunities, 24:35.274 --> 24:37.109 real opportunities to purchase healthcare 24:37.109 --> 24:38.444 that is useful to them. 24:38.444 --> 24:40.946 - But do you hear, is it just an accepted fact 24:40.946 --> 24:43.615 that Obamacare as the foundation is the law of the land 24:43.615 --> 24:45.484 and it's really gonna be about tweaking now, 24:45.484 --> 24:49.621 about additional things, versus a complete repeal of it 24:49.621 --> 24:51.657 and a whole new system being put in place? 24:51.657 --> 24:53.592 - Yeah, I even think the words that people are using-- 24:53.592 --> 24:55.594 - [Eric]  Just the practicality of it. 24:55.594 --> 24:57.896 - The words that people are using are "replace" or "reform," 24:57.896 --> 25:01.300 and it deals with three things, really, 25:01.300 --> 25:04.436 it deals with making sure that 25:04.436 --> 25:08.040 the ten essential health benefits are altered 25:08.040 --> 25:09.975 to give people flexibility so that 25:09.975 --> 25:12.177 Washington's not telling you the kind of policy 25:12.177 --> 25:16.181 that you can buy, so that's a big factor 25:16.181 --> 25:18.417 and really what affects people in a big way. 25:18.417 --> 25:20.319 It's about giving states the ability to 25:20.319 --> 25:23.522 really do Medicaid in a more flexible way 25:23.522 --> 25:25.657 and our governor would love to see that happen, 25:25.657 --> 25:28.060 governors all across our country would, 25:28.060 --> 25:30.629 and making sure that these tax credits or subsidies 25:30.629 --> 25:33.165 are actually appropriately done so that people, 25:33.165 --> 25:34.867 especially lower-income citizens, 25:34.867 --> 25:37.169 really have the opportunity to buy healthcare. 25:37.169 --> 25:39.071 - With just a few, 30 seconds left, 25:39.071 --> 25:40.539 do you want to make any news today, 25:40.539 --> 25:42.474 you mentioned the governor is termed out, 25:42.474 --> 25:44.943 people have talked about you being interested in that job, 25:44.943 --> 25:46.645 are you interested in running for Tennessee governor? 25:46.645 --> 25:48.881 - I'm not really interested in making any news. 25:48.881 --> 25:52.584 I'm here in the state to travel, it's a huge honor, 25:52.584 --> 25:54.620 I think I told you I'd been in Uganda 25:54.620 --> 25:58.190 and seen just the devastation there just a few days ago, 25:58.190 --> 26:00.926 270,000 people in a refugee camp. 26:00.926 --> 26:02.694 We have a lot of issues here 26:02.694 --> 26:04.163 in our state and in our country, 26:04.163 --> 26:05.964 it's still the greatest country on earth, 26:05.964 --> 26:07.766 Tennessee with the greatest citizens, 26:07.766 --> 26:09.268 and thank you for letting me be here. 26:09.268 --> 26:11.336 - All right, well thank you very much for being here, 26:11.336 --> 26:13.071 thank you Bill, thank you for joining us. 26:13.071 --> 26:15.574 Join us again next week. 26:15.574 --> 26:18.310 (dramatic music)