WEBVTT 00:00.300 --> 00:02.536 - Production funding for behind the headlines 00:02.536 --> 00:06.773 is made possible in part by the WKNO production fund, 00:06.773 --> 00:09.076 the WKNO endowment fund. 00:09.076 --> 00:12.279 And by viewers like you, thank you. 00:12.279 --> 00:14.681 - How Shelby County schools will reopen 00:14.681 --> 00:17.184 tonight, on behind the headlines. 00:17.184 --> 00:19.753 [upbeat music] 00:33.667 --> 00:35.235 I'm Eric Barnes with the Daily Memphian. 00:35.235 --> 00:36.603 Thanks for joining us. 00:36.603 --> 00:39.139 Today is the third in a series of shows we've been doing 00:39.139 --> 00:42.309 on the challenges of reopening schools, 00:42.309 --> 00:44.144 specifically the Shelby County schools. 00:44.144 --> 00:47.347 But in the past few weeks we've talked to an epidemiologist 00:47.347 --> 00:50.484 about social emotional risks of reopening 00:50.484 --> 00:53.420 as well as the COVID risks, obviously of reopening. 00:53.420 --> 00:54.888 We've talked to a number of researchers 00:54.888 --> 00:57.991 who've looked at academic studies around the country 00:57.991 --> 00:59.726 and even around the world about 00:59.726 --> 01:04.631 best practices for reopening and the risks of learning loss. 01:04.631 --> 01:08.001 We had a head of the Freedom Prep Charter School Network, 01:08.001 --> 01:10.537 five charter schools covering pre-K through 12 01:10.537 --> 01:13.273 who had opened hybrid had closed back down. 01:13.273 --> 01:15.575 All those shows are available on wkno.org 01:15.575 --> 01:16.810 or you can go even go to YouTube 01:16.810 --> 01:18.378 and search for behind the headlines. 01:18.378 --> 01:20.814 Today, I'm very pleased to be joined by 01:20.814 --> 01:23.283 the chair of the Shelby County school board, 01:23.283 --> 01:24.818 Miska Clay Bibs. 01:24.818 --> 01:26.620 Miska, thank you for being here. 01:26.620 --> 01:28.555 - Hi Eric, thank you for having me. 01:28.555 --> 01:31.325 - And I'm also joined by Bill Dries, 01:31.325 --> 01:33.894 reporter with The Daily Memphian. 01:33.894 --> 01:35.729 As we start this, you know 01:35.729 --> 01:38.565 this last few shows we've done focused on this 01:38.565 --> 01:41.601 and in the fall we had superintendent Joris Ray on, 01:41.601 --> 01:44.871 I think twice in the fall talking about how, excuse me 01:44.871 --> 01:46.406 how virtual learning was going. 01:46.406 --> 01:48.942 We had superintendents from all, I believe all of the, 01:48.942 --> 01:51.311 the suburban schools have been on. 01:51.311 --> 01:52.479 I mean, if I've learned anything 01:52.479 --> 01:55.615 it's a simple thing, which is, this is not a simple issue. 01:55.615 --> 01:58.485 And so nothing I ask today or say today is in any way 01:58.485 --> 02:00.854 meant to reflect that there are easy answers 02:00.854 --> 02:04.224 and simple answers to this incredibly complicated problem. 02:04.224 --> 02:06.026 As in the, over the course of this month 02:06.026 --> 02:09.029 since we started these shows you all have announced 02:09.029 --> 02:11.598 you're going to reopen the Shelby County schools 02:11.598 --> 02:14.901 pre-K through fifth, will open on March 1st 02:14.901 --> 02:17.804 and then the sixth through 12th graders on March eight. 02:17.804 --> 02:19.773 My first question is, I mean 02:19.773 --> 02:22.609 you've been under intense pressure from the state, 02:22.609 --> 02:25.679 from local legislators, from the governor. 02:25.679 --> 02:28.348 Some even even talking about withholding funding 02:28.348 --> 02:30.817 to Shelby County schools, if they did not reopen 02:30.817 --> 02:32.819 and Shelby County schools is the last system 02:32.819 --> 02:36.056 not to have reopened in an optional or even hybrid way. 02:36.056 --> 02:38.125 Nashville Metro schools being the, 02:38.125 --> 02:40.027 or Metro Davidson schools being the other 02:40.027 --> 02:42.295 that chose to be up in a couple of weeks ago. 02:42.295 --> 02:45.365 So the real question is, are you reopening by choice 02:45.365 --> 02:47.801 or simply because the pressure got to be too great. 02:47.801 --> 02:51.004 - In that very question, there's a combination. 02:51.004 --> 02:52.639 I think we are definitely, 02:52.639 --> 02:55.275 at this point are opening by choice. 02:55.275 --> 02:59.946 There is a borderline and you have to get to a majority 02:59.946 --> 03:01.548 for any decision to move forward. 03:01.548 --> 03:02.516 So I think, you know 03:02.516 --> 03:04.618 that is me letting you know that there's a majority 03:04.618 --> 03:07.788 of the board members who have said, okay now is a good time. 03:07.788 --> 03:11.224 You know, when we make guiding decisions and, you know 03:11.224 --> 03:13.693 have guiding conversations with superintendent Ray, 03:13.693 --> 03:14.795 that is exactly, you know 03:14.795 --> 03:16.830 what we think about as we move forward. 03:16.830 --> 03:18.632 And the reality of it is there's still, 03:18.632 --> 03:20.901 there was absolutely some pressure from the state 03:20.901 --> 03:22.169 around what this looks like. 03:22.169 --> 03:23.437 So it's a combination. 03:23.437 --> 03:24.271 You know, again 03:24.271 --> 03:25.472 I'm glad you prefaced this whole conversation 03:25.472 --> 03:28.709 about there is no easy answer because there's not. 03:28.709 --> 03:31.211 I think, you know, one of the reasons why we stayed 03:31.211 --> 03:34.081 closed as long as we had is because 03:34.081 --> 03:36.183 we just have a different demographic, 03:36.183 --> 03:37.584 of families that we're serving 03:37.584 --> 03:39.986 and community looks different. 03:39.986 --> 03:43.457 So for us, we, it was make making sure we maintain 03:43.457 --> 03:45.826 that our families were safe and our teachers were safe. 03:45.826 --> 03:48.462 So we are where we are today. 03:48.462 --> 03:50.430 And I think based upon the fact that people, I think, 03:50.430 --> 03:52.165 also, this is a community issue. 03:52.165 --> 03:54.034 You know, we need the community to understand 03:54.034 --> 03:57.237 that they must take, you know, things say safely as well 03:57.237 --> 03:59.506 and the numbers are going down. 03:59.506 --> 04:01.241 They're kind of consistent right now 04:01.241 --> 04:02.175 which is a great thing. 04:02.175 --> 04:04.511 So I hope they continue to stay that way. 04:04.511 --> 04:06.546 - Let me ask you just some logistical questions 04:06.546 --> 04:08.048 and then we'll bring Bill Dries in, 04:08.048 --> 04:09.749 this is optional for parents. 04:10.917 --> 04:12.486 - It is optional. 04:12.486 --> 04:16.289 - Yes, the teachers will, who've been doing virtual school 04:16.289 --> 04:17.257 from maybe from their homes. 04:17.257 --> 04:18.925 All teachers will be back in the building 04:18.925 --> 04:20.894 whether they're teaching in-person class 04:20.894 --> 04:23.663 or they're doing virtual school, do I have that correct? 04:23.663 --> 04:25.332 - That is correct. 04:25.332 --> 04:29.202 - And then the folks who have been pressuring you 04:29.202 --> 04:31.471 to reopen, other school systems as well, 04:31.471 --> 04:33.473 but obviously just talking about Shelby County schools, 04:33.473 --> 04:34.841 there are number of things they point to. 04:34.841 --> 04:37.410 One of the main ones is the CDC guidelines, 04:37.410 --> 04:38.578 which wrapped up, you know, 04:38.578 --> 04:41.381 went to a number of studies have been done that so far. 04:41.381 --> 04:43.683 And with a fair number of school systems having opened 04:43.683 --> 04:45.352 some staying open the whole time, 04:46.186 --> 04:48.188 the schools have not been the source 04:48.188 --> 04:51.658 of a dramatically large amount of spread and infection. 04:51.658 --> 04:53.760 There are many caveats on that. 04:53.760 --> 04:54.761 That there was enough distancing, 04:54.761 --> 04:57.597 there were masks, there were proper ventilation. 04:57.597 --> 05:00.534 Do you feel like the CDC guidelines are, 05:00.534 --> 05:01.835 you're gonna be able to meet those 05:01.835 --> 05:03.069 within Shelby County schools 05:03.069 --> 05:06.306 and thus this is safe to do. 05:06.306 --> 05:10.410 - So, you know, first, let me just say great question. 05:10.410 --> 05:12.245 'Cause I know people are bringing it up and, you know 05:12.245 --> 05:15.015 trying to use that force around as a guiding principle. 05:15.015 --> 05:17.050 The reality of it is though the guidelines 05:17.050 --> 05:18.985 and I think oftentimes guidelines are made 05:18.985 --> 05:21.655 not necessarily with who we are in mind. 05:21.655 --> 05:22.722 You know, we are, 05:23.623 --> 05:26.426 Well, I would say this Shelby County schools 05:26.426 --> 05:27.761 is the center of community. 05:27.761 --> 05:31.031 I think a lot of where we are is happened 05:31.031 --> 05:33.733 because we have maintained and been vigilant around 05:33.733 --> 05:35.969 keeping families safe at home. 05:35.969 --> 05:39.439 So that's one thing it's also community aspect to this 05:39.439 --> 05:40.373 because now, you know 05:40.373 --> 05:43.476 families are going back into buildings, it will shift. 05:43.476 --> 05:45.745 The reality of it is when you have guidelines, 05:46.846 --> 05:50.083 my question would be, because we are actually 05:50.083 --> 05:52.919 the number two employer in the city 05:52.919 --> 05:54.754 and number three in the whole state 05:54.754 --> 05:56.256 I mean I have those reversed. 05:56.256 --> 05:58.425 But the reality of is, so you're saying 05:58.425 --> 06:00.227 that the center of community 06:00.227 --> 06:02.295 now is going back into the building. 06:02.295 --> 06:05.165 So we have to be extra cautious around what that looks like. 06:05.165 --> 06:08.301 So that's why I often question around or make the statement 06:08.301 --> 06:10.237 that those are guidelines and guiding principles. 06:10.237 --> 06:13.306 And we're going to do everything we can do to meet that. 06:13.306 --> 06:16.610 I think families who have decided to go in 06:16.610 --> 06:19.379 and that number is about 31, 32% 06:19.379 --> 06:20.914 and the rest are staying home. 06:20.914 --> 06:26.019 So in that reality, there should not be a problem. 06:26.019 --> 06:27.754 The, well, some school, 06:27.754 --> 06:28.989 last question before I go to Bill, 06:28.989 --> 06:31.291 will some schools maybe because of ventilation 06:31.291 --> 06:32.892 or just their physical layout, 06:32.892 --> 06:34.194 the physical, you know 06:34.194 --> 06:36.463 that you won't be able to get enough distancing, 06:36.463 --> 06:38.298 will, some schools may be not open, 06:38.298 --> 06:40.634 or will all of them be open? 06:40.634 --> 06:42.435 Well, I mean, the school itself is only 06:42.435 --> 06:45.071 is only, it's based upon who's deciding to go in. 06:45.071 --> 06:47.407 So let's keep that as the number one thing 06:47.407 --> 06:49.442 because there are some schools that 06:49.442 --> 06:51.778 a whole school community may decide, 06:51.778 --> 06:53.413 we're not going into the building. 06:53.413 --> 06:54.915 Let's be realistic about that. 06:54.915 --> 06:57.851 When you have over 75% of your family saying, 06:57.851 --> 06:59.886 they do not want to go back into a building. 06:59.886 --> 07:01.354 There may be some schools 07:01.354 --> 07:04.190 that still may have adults only in the building. 07:04.190 --> 07:05.258 Let me bring in Bill Dries. 07:05.258 --> 07:07.227 And we were doing a first, 10-and-a-half years 07:07.227 --> 07:08.061 we've been doing this show 07:08.061 --> 07:09.362 and Bill is joining us by phone 07:09.362 --> 07:11.898 because it's still feels like 2020 today. 07:11.898 --> 07:13.500 But Bill, thanks for being here by phone 07:13.500 --> 07:15.168 and go ahead with that, Miska Clay Bibs, 07:15.168 --> 07:17.437 the chair of the Shelby County school board. 07:18.571 --> 07:19.406 - Thank you, Eric 07:19.406 --> 07:21.341 and sorry for the inconvenience this morning 07:21.341 --> 07:23.143 as we record this. 07:24.411 --> 07:28.915 Chairwoman, let me ask you about where parents are on this 07:28.915 --> 07:31.718 and you cited the figure of 31 to 32% 07:31.718 --> 07:36.156 choosing to go back to in-person classes. 07:37.123 --> 07:39.259 I think sometimes we get the impression 07:39.259 --> 07:42.095 that parents are all of one mind on this. 07:42.095 --> 07:45.699 Give me an idea of what you hear from parents about this. 07:46.633 --> 07:49.135 - Let me tell you in the community that I represent, 07:49.135 --> 07:52.439 which is you know, parts of Hickory Ridge, 07:52.439 --> 07:56.843 Hickory Hill community, parts of South East Memphis, 07:56.843 --> 07:57.877 parts of white Haven, 07:57.877 --> 07:59.913 parts of South Memphis in the airport corridor. 07:59.913 --> 08:01.147 They've been very clear with me 08:01.147 --> 08:03.350 that they are not going back into the building. 08:03.350 --> 08:05.919 You know, they are overwhelmingly stating 08:05.919 --> 08:08.121 that that is something that they are, you know, 08:08.121 --> 08:10.724 concerned with and they wanna make sure that they stay safe. 08:10.724 --> 08:12.392 You know, and I, and I'm saying overwhelming 08:12.392 --> 08:14.994 because you know, there may be some families within 08:14.994 --> 08:16.563 you know, my district can say yes, 08:16.563 --> 08:18.732 but the majority of them that have reached out to me 08:18.732 --> 08:20.600 have been very clear that they are not. 08:20.600 --> 08:23.937 You know, I think when you still have about, 08:23.937 --> 08:27.640 when you have over 70% with the last time we did a survey 08:27.640 --> 08:29.576 and we are giving them another opportunity 08:29.576 --> 08:31.745 to change the choice right now, as we speak 08:31.745 --> 08:33.546 before March 1st hits, 08:33.546 --> 08:38.551 the numbers were over 70% saying no and the rest saying yes. 08:38.818 --> 08:42.322 So I think what is happening is in this conversation 08:42.322 --> 08:45.759 people are forgetting that the families who are saying no 08:45.759 --> 08:48.595 had been very vigilant about no, they're not ready yet. 08:49.562 --> 08:52.265 - And when was the previous survey that you did 08:52.265 --> 08:54.968 where you asked parents to indicate their choice? 08:54.968 --> 08:58.004 - It was done like around mid winter 08:58.004 --> 08:59.539 because originally when we had, 08:59.539 --> 09:02.375 the thinking was we were saying in February, 09:02.375 --> 09:05.512 because it was right before the holiday break 09:05.512 --> 09:06.713 around that time. 09:06.713 --> 09:08.481 And I think because we were really being hopeful 09:08.481 --> 09:10.750 that vaccines would be available earlier. 09:10.750 --> 09:13.019 And that has been a large part of the conversation 09:13.019 --> 09:16.055 in now that vaccines are now becoming more available 09:16.055 --> 09:18.425 which for me was something that I really wanted to have 09:18.425 --> 09:21.394 as a resource for teachers 09:21.394 --> 09:24.330 and for families before making that decision. 09:25.532 --> 09:26.800 - Do you know 09:26.800 --> 09:30.003 do you have verifiable figures at this point 09:30.003 --> 09:34.441 on what the learning loss might be 09:34.441 --> 09:38.478 from the time that we've been away from in-person classes, 09:38.478 --> 09:41.481 because as you know, there's a lot of discussion about that 09:41.481 --> 09:43.850 and there are even some numbers that are being thrown around 09:43.850 --> 09:47.520 about what the learning loss might look like. 09:47.520 --> 09:49.389 - Yeah, you know, I would say this, 09:49.389 --> 09:51.858 we did a committee meeting about 09:51.858 --> 09:53.626 a couple months ago on learning loss. 09:53.626 --> 09:54.761 And it was just really showing 09:54.761 --> 09:57.030 that the learning loss is not any greater 09:57.030 --> 09:59.199 than what it would have been had we been in the building. 09:59.199 --> 10:02.635 You know, I can definitely refer you to those numbers 10:02.635 --> 10:05.805 from our chief academic officer Dr. Antonio Bert, 10:05.805 --> 10:08.141 but he was, we use mastery connect, 10:08.141 --> 10:10.076 is how we capture information. 10:10.076 --> 10:12.212 And within that, it was showing that 10:12.212 --> 10:14.948 part of it was some of our, you know, 10:14.948 --> 10:18.618 our early learning students, like our pre-K 10:18.618 --> 10:20.553 through second graders, were actually 10:20.553 --> 10:23.156 a little bit ahead of schedule and just right on par 10:23.156 --> 10:25.425 because of the family involvement that they're getting. 10:25.425 --> 10:28.394 But the reality of it is the numbers are not as skewed 10:28.394 --> 10:29.796 as what people are using around 10:29.796 --> 10:31.865 what learning loss looks like for us. 10:31.865 --> 10:34.300 Because again, I think the disconnect 10:34.300 --> 10:36.536 that people have had with Shelby in particular 10:36.536 --> 10:39.205 around this conversation, is teachers are teaching. 10:39.205 --> 10:41.174 Teachers are really showing up. 10:41.174 --> 10:44.644 I visited virtual classrooms several times in my district 10:44.644 --> 10:47.547 and they are really showing up and I have to applaud them 10:47.547 --> 10:49.549 for all of the hard work that they're doing. 10:51.284 --> 10:54.521 - I know that recently you were able 10:54.521 --> 10:58.157 to get some vaccinations for teachers. 10:58.157 --> 11:02.829 It is, is your goal here to get what vaccinations you can 11:02.829 --> 11:04.731 for teachers prior to the, 11:04.731 --> 11:08.101 this phased in reopening for in-person classes? 11:09.235 --> 11:11.671 - Absolutely, I think, you know, 11:11.671 --> 11:13.806 and I'm talking from my personal perspective, 11:13.806 --> 11:16.576 you know, again I always maintain we're a board of nine 11:16.576 --> 11:19.012 and, you know there means nine different opinions. 11:19.012 --> 11:21.314 But my personal opinion was the fact that I realized 11:21.314 --> 11:23.716 that vaccines really needs to be a resource 11:23.716 --> 11:25.818 as we ask teachers to come into buildings. 11:25.818 --> 11:29.856 So I'm excited that there has been a bigger push 11:29.856 --> 11:31.558 around making sure that that's available. 11:31.558 --> 11:34.561 Unfortunately, one of those days was 11:34.561 --> 11:36.563 right in the middle of a snow storm 11:36.563 --> 11:38.231 that happened earlier this week 11:38.231 --> 11:41.568 but we're also just heard recently that they are 11:41.568 --> 11:44.804 trying to push more vaccines to us. 11:44.804 --> 11:47.373 So hopefully that will get going faster. 11:47.373 --> 11:49.475 And, you know, the County commission also is 11:49.475 --> 11:50.877 they're pushing on their side 11:50.877 --> 11:54.380 to make sure vaccines become more available. 11:54.380 --> 11:56.449 - And before I send you back to Eric, 11:56.449 --> 12:00.653 in that regard, is the school system involved 12:00.653 --> 12:02.422 in talks with the state 12:02.422 --> 12:06.192 about moving teachers up in the line 12:06.192 --> 12:08.161 so to speak for vaccinations? 12:09.162 --> 12:12.031 - We absolutely have had that conversation several times, 12:12.031 --> 12:14.233 we did not get an answer. 12:14.233 --> 12:15.969 So we're thankful for those who've decided 12:15.969 --> 12:17.904 to help us advocate. 12:17.904 --> 12:20.540 - Was, a quick thing on vaccinations. 12:20.540 --> 12:23.176 There was a little bit of Dr. Joris Ray superintendent 12:23.176 --> 12:26.546 got a vaccine this past week when there was suddenly 12:26.546 --> 12:30.083 an, as has happened in many, many cases around the, 12:30.083 --> 12:32.352 the city and County, suddenly vaccine is available, 12:32.352 --> 12:33.386 they don't want it to go to waste 12:33.386 --> 12:35.054 and, you know, shot them out 12:35.054 --> 12:36.823 he was able to get a vaccine. 12:36.823 --> 12:38.625 Some people pushed back that wasn't appropriate. 12:38.625 --> 12:41.594 He said that, "Look, I'm modeling good behavior. 12:41.594 --> 12:44.297 We do have some hesitancy among teachers. 12:44.297 --> 12:45.732 It's been true across the board. 12:45.732 --> 12:48.301 All kinds of professions where there's hesitancy to get it." 12:48.301 --> 12:51.204 Was it appropriate for Dr. Ray to get a shot? 12:51.204 --> 12:52.972 - Absolutely, I mean, when I say it was appropriate 12:52.972 --> 12:55.575 because he really, if buildings are open, 12:55.575 --> 12:56.943 he's gonna be in the building. 12:56.943 --> 12:58.611 Now, one of the things that I, 12:58.611 --> 13:02.248 most of my school visits that I've done with him 13:02.248 --> 13:03.516 have been all in person. 13:03.516 --> 13:06.252 So that's how I know what's happening inside those buildings 13:06.252 --> 13:08.087 in my district, had been with him. 13:08.087 --> 13:10.623 Then my virtual visits of course had been aligned. 13:10.623 --> 13:12.892 But the reality of it is, when I choose to go in a building 13:12.892 --> 13:14.661 most of those times I'm going with him. 13:14.661 --> 13:17.964 So he is absolutely in and out, in and out of buildings 13:17.964 --> 13:18.965 on the regular. 13:18.965 --> 13:20.800 So if he's asking teachers to go back 13:20.800 --> 13:22.902 that means he's showing up in the building as well. 13:22.902 --> 13:25.705 - Do you, on that issue of hesitancy 13:25.705 --> 13:27.540 or resistance to getting the vaccine, 13:27.540 --> 13:29.175 do you, have you all surveyed teachers 13:29.175 --> 13:30.309 and staff on that front? 13:30.309 --> 13:32.812 Do you have any sense if it is widespread resistance 13:32.812 --> 13:34.747 or is it a small number? 13:34.747 --> 13:37.884 - I think early on, they did a survey asking teachers about 13:37.884 --> 13:40.887 who would be interested in taking the vaccine. 13:40.887 --> 13:43.289 And I don't wanna misquote the number 13:43.289 --> 13:48.428 but it was probably around 40% who went ahead and said yes 13:48.428 --> 13:50.797 that they would, and this was way before we even know 13:50.797 --> 13:52.432 when the vaccine was gonna be available. 13:52.432 --> 13:53.266 - Got you, got you. 13:53.266 --> 13:55.068 Which is a lifetime ago. 13:55.068 --> 13:56.502 On this issue of learning loss, 13:56.502 --> 13:58.871 the other concern folks have, people have had 13:58.871 --> 14:02.742 and have brought up and I've talked to educators about this 14:02.742 --> 14:05.611 is kids who are just sort of have disappeared 14:05.611 --> 14:09.482 or are only erratic in logging into virtual school. 14:09.482 --> 14:12.051 That is obviously, even one kid is very concerning 14:12.051 --> 14:14.654 but some have talked about very widespread issues 14:14.654 --> 14:17.023 about that, of kids who are just kind of not logging in 14:17.023 --> 14:20.093 not getting on their zoom calls, the classrooms. 14:20.093 --> 14:21.594 Do you know what those numbers are 14:21.594 --> 14:24.497 and what all can you do about it right now? 14:25.364 --> 14:27.200 - I don't know what those numbers are 14:27.200 --> 14:30.103 but I will say this is an opportunity 14:30.103 --> 14:31.838 because we are pushing them. 14:31.838 --> 14:33.005 These are the same questions. 14:33.005 --> 14:34.874 You know, Eric, thank you for asking. 14:34.874 --> 14:36.776 These are the same questions that we as a board 14:36.776 --> 14:38.711 ask our administration around 14:38.711 --> 14:40.079 what are we gonna do about it? 14:40.079 --> 14:43.716 And they have a strong family community engagement plan 14:43.716 --> 14:45.718 as well as a strong academic plan 14:45.718 --> 14:47.353 in order to be able to meet the needs of those families. 14:47.353 --> 14:49.222 Because the reality of it is, 14:50.757 --> 14:53.693 I think as I said in a different interview is that 14:53.693 --> 14:55.161 none of this is normal. 14:55.161 --> 14:58.664 And we're trying to put normal, make this a normal situation 14:58.664 --> 14:59.899 with a normal fix. 14:59.899 --> 15:02.535 So it's gonna take actually extra effort. 15:02.535 --> 15:04.971 It's gonna take extra input from families. 15:04.971 --> 15:07.306 It's gonna take extra input for all involved 15:07.306 --> 15:09.075 in order for us to make sure that we, 15:09.075 --> 15:10.843 you know, feel all of the gaps. 15:10.843 --> 15:12.678 And this is the opportunity. 15:12.678 --> 15:14.747 You know, I don't look at things in a negative. 15:14.747 --> 15:16.949 I always see an opportunity for growth. 15:16.949 --> 15:18.651 So this is an opportunity for growth 15:18.651 --> 15:20.887 for our family and community engagement, 15:20.887 --> 15:25.091 as well as some of our truancy team to work together 15:25.091 --> 15:26.826 in collaboration around what it looks like 15:26.826 --> 15:28.628 to connect with families. 15:28.628 --> 15:31.931 - The, we talk about learning loss 15:31.931 --> 15:32.765 and you were talking about, you know, 15:32.765 --> 15:35.034 not as bad as the numbers and 15:35.034 --> 15:36.936 that people are throwing around. 15:36.936 --> 15:39.939 But do you think that there will be 15:39.939 --> 15:42.375 at some point we will get past this, right? 15:42.375 --> 15:43.476 I mean, at some point. 15:43.476 --> 15:44.977 Will there be a need at that point 15:44.977 --> 15:48.714 to address the kids who have fallen behind, 15:48.714 --> 15:50.950 the kids who haven't been able or have chosen 15:50.950 --> 15:53.653 or just for whatever reason have not been able to log in 15:53.653 --> 15:55.555 and participate in virtual school. 15:55.555 --> 15:58.257 People have talked about, and the state has talked about 15:58.257 --> 16:01.027 summer camps or summer school. 16:01.027 --> 16:02.562 There's potential of tutoring. 16:02.562 --> 16:05.598 What are your plans for those kids who have fallen behind 16:05.598 --> 16:09.101 somewhat or dramatically to get them caught back up? 16:09.101 --> 16:10.136 - Great question, Eric. 16:10.136 --> 16:12.705 And I'm just gonna start off with saying what 16:12.705 --> 16:16.342 I hope that this same level of advocacy and concern 16:16.342 --> 16:18.711 is will happen beyond this pandemic. 16:18.711 --> 16:19.812 In Shelby County schools 16:19.812 --> 16:22.515 we've been working really hard just in general making sure 16:22.515 --> 16:25.751 we offer opportunities for students during the summer 16:25.751 --> 16:26.953 to be able to catch them up. 16:26.953 --> 16:29.455 You know, we have our superintendents learning Academy 16:29.455 --> 16:31.724 that has been happening for the past several years 16:31.724 --> 16:35.061 that we make available to all students who, 16:35.061 --> 16:36.996 whose families shoots for them to attend. 16:36.996 --> 16:39.565 Our summer school, you know, options are robust. 16:39.565 --> 16:41.534 We make sure that we have them connected. 16:41.534 --> 16:45.137 We also have fall in spring learning Academy 16:45.137 --> 16:47.206 so this is not new for us. 16:47.206 --> 16:48.808 So I think that's the aspect of it. 16:48.808 --> 16:50.276 I wanna just start off by saying 16:50.276 --> 16:52.945 the work that we're doing is very consistent. 16:52.945 --> 16:55.448 Again, I hope that the same people who are pushing 16:55.448 --> 16:58.017 for advocating for quote, unquote learning loss 16:58.017 --> 17:01.520 and summer programming, keep it up way beyond the pandemic 17:01.520 --> 17:02.889 because this is the work Shelby County schools 17:02.889 --> 17:04.690 has been doing for quite some time. 17:04.690 --> 17:06.893 And this just means we're revving it up. 17:06.893 --> 17:09.462 These are the same things we will consistently do. 17:09.462 --> 17:10.296 These are the same things 17:10.296 --> 17:12.798 that we wanna make sure are available, but more importantly, 17:12.798 --> 17:13.633 we wanna make sure 17:13.633 --> 17:15.601 for those who are not familiar with it 17:15.601 --> 17:18.371 are familiar with it and make sure that they sign up. 17:18.371 --> 17:19.906 - One more question before I go back to Bill. 17:19.906 --> 17:22.541 And that is one of the other, in the series of shows 17:22.541 --> 17:24.644 that we've done lately, and I've seen it elsewhere 17:24.644 --> 17:25.611 and heard it elsewhere, 17:25.611 --> 17:28.447 that people point to for the the need to reopen 17:28.447 --> 17:32.551 is the social-emotional aspect of kids being isolated, 17:32.551 --> 17:36.656 of kids, you know, just, just, I mean, depression and I mean 17:36.656 --> 17:40.059 just terrible stats on suicidal thoughts. 17:40.059 --> 17:42.128 And we talked to an expert about that last week. 17:42.128 --> 17:44.897 These are national kind of stats. 17:44.897 --> 17:46.866 Some kids aren't doing well with this, right? 17:46.866 --> 17:49.101 They don't get to play, they don't get to see friends, 17:49.101 --> 17:50.536 they don't have socialization. 17:50.536 --> 17:54.040 How much does that weigh on you as the board chair 17:54.040 --> 17:57.143 and as a board, as a school system, as a whole? 17:57.143 --> 17:59.111 I think it weighs on us heavily period. 17:59.111 --> 18:02.982 You know, we take our SEL programming very important. 18:02.982 --> 18:06.352 Even before the pandemic, we always, 18:06.352 --> 18:08.287 let me not say we always, there was a group of us 18:08.287 --> 18:10.756 that really pushed the thought around 18:10.756 --> 18:12.892 beefing up what our SEL programming looked like. 18:12.892 --> 18:14.827 And then the pandemic hit. 18:14.827 --> 18:16.462 Luckily we had already decided 18:16.462 --> 18:18.397 to make some investments in that. 18:18.397 --> 18:19.699 So for those who are choosing 18:19.699 --> 18:20.933 to come back into the building, 18:20.933 --> 18:23.235 they will now have access to that. 18:23.235 --> 18:25.605 And then even when the pandemic first started 18:25.605 --> 18:29.342 we made sure that we had opportunities for connection 18:29.342 --> 18:32.111 around mental health that were really important 18:32.111 --> 18:33.212 and it is something. 18:33.212 --> 18:37.249 But I think the other aspect is like moving it, you know 18:37.249 --> 18:40.686 out broader is that this is happening to everyone. 18:40.686 --> 18:42.221 It's not just the students. 18:42.221 --> 18:43.456 I think, you know, it's important 18:43.456 --> 18:45.224 for us to understand the fact that 18:45.224 --> 18:47.493 this is happening across the nation. 18:47.493 --> 18:49.528 And it's also happening to adults. 18:49.528 --> 18:52.198 As I mentioned to someone in another interview 18:52.198 --> 18:56.836 I have literally been at my desk and doing, you know 18:56.836 --> 18:59.739 phone calls and working from my desk 18:59.739 --> 19:01.974 since March 15th of last year. 19:01.974 --> 19:03.743 So there's, you know, I, you know 19:03.743 --> 19:06.045 adults are not having the same interaction. 19:06.045 --> 19:08.714 My son is a first semester college student. 19:08.714 --> 19:11.183 He is doing, you know, college courses online. 19:11.183 --> 19:12.785 And we're having that conversation 19:12.785 --> 19:15.121 around how this looks so different for them. 19:15.121 --> 19:18.657 So a lot of people are being hit across, you know 19:18.657 --> 19:20.860 a lot of, you know, different communities. 19:20.860 --> 19:23.029 The reality of it is, it's gonna take all of us 19:23.029 --> 19:25.531 hands on deck to make sure that this looks different. 19:25.531 --> 19:28.300 And it's also saying, pulling a community with it. 19:28.300 --> 19:30.703 You know, it's not just them being in the school building, 19:30.703 --> 19:33.673 it's also whoever else it is that they come in contact with 19:33.673 --> 19:36.075 supporting them through it as well. 19:36.075 --> 19:37.843 - Let me bring Bill back in by phone. 19:37.843 --> 19:39.412 - All right. 19:39.412 --> 19:43.883 And, you know, talking about just literal examples 19:43.883 --> 19:46.385 I'm gonna be the guy to ask about the digital divide 19:46.385 --> 19:49.688 here again too after experiencing a bit of it this morning. 19:49.688 --> 19:54.693 But, anyway, I think we all knew that the digital divide 19:56.028 --> 19:58.798 was an issue in our community 19:58.798 --> 20:03.202 before COVID-19 ever reared it's head. 20:04.503 --> 20:07.373 So what do you think we know 20:07.373 --> 20:11.477 about the state of that digital divide in Memphis 20:11.477 --> 20:15.481 that maybe we didn't know or what have we found out about it 20:15.481 --> 20:16.816 that has confirmed 20:16.816 --> 20:19.585 some of the things we thought about it before? 20:19.585 --> 20:20.686 - Great question Bill. 20:20.686 --> 20:23.789 I think because we were one of the first districts 20:23.789 --> 20:26.725 in the nation to be able to go one-to-one, you know, 20:26.725 --> 20:30.296 what we see is that it is definitely some more 20:30.296 --> 20:33.065 growth opportunities regarding connection, 20:33.065 --> 20:35.801 not about, you know not about having the device, 20:35.801 --> 20:38.370 not about having an access to hotspot 20:38.370 --> 20:40.106 because we did all of those things. 20:40.106 --> 20:43.742 But the reality of it is as a, you know, community 20:43.742 --> 20:45.111 when I talk about, think about 20:45.111 --> 20:47.813 like both governments working together to find out 20:47.813 --> 20:50.950 how to have a better just logistically, 20:50.950 --> 20:53.552 a better system around, you know 20:53.552 --> 20:55.688 whether it's fiber optics or whether it's towers 20:55.688 --> 20:58.124 whatever it is that needs to happen, Rodman 20:58.124 --> 20:59.425 whatever it is that needs to happen. 20:59.425 --> 21:00.659 I'm not a techie in that sense 21:00.659 --> 21:02.461 so I'm just throwing terms out there 21:02.461 --> 21:04.096 but whatever it is that needs to happen 21:04.096 --> 21:06.398 in order for us to have better connectivity 21:06.398 --> 21:09.869 this past year has shown us 21:09.869 --> 21:12.037 that there's still some work that needs to be done. 21:12.037 --> 21:14.240 Because there is definitely some, 21:14.240 --> 21:16.675 a different round of connection that happens 21:16.675 --> 21:21.680 kind of in the North Haven, Woodstock Bolton, 21:22.014 --> 21:25.017 Vegeta community and then where I am 21:25.017 --> 21:29.021 in South East Memphis community you know, 21:29.021 --> 21:30.122 we're pretty stable 21:30.122 --> 21:32.558 but here lately it gets kind of sketchy. 21:32.558 --> 21:33.492 So then, you know, 21:33.492 --> 21:36.061 then I hear from families who own the South Memphis 21:36.061 --> 21:38.798 and the white Haven side of my community that represents, 21:38.798 --> 21:40.499 so it's different everywhere. 21:40.499 --> 21:42.268 So this is an opportunity I think 21:42.268 --> 21:46.806 for government to come together for a better infrastructure. 21:46.806 --> 21:47.640 - All right. 21:47.640 --> 21:49.742 And in the special session of the legislature, 21:49.742 --> 21:53.078 when these bills were passed on summer school 21:53.078 --> 21:56.682 and afterschool programs to help catch up students, 21:56.682 --> 22:00.186 was there enough state funding included in that 22:00.186 --> 22:03.155 to get the job done here in our city? 22:04.356 --> 22:06.425 - Well, you know, I think, 22:06.425 --> 22:08.394 to my point that I was saying to Eric earlier 22:08.394 --> 22:10.529 the reality of it is we've been making it work. 22:10.529 --> 22:12.598 So any additional funds that we get 22:12.598 --> 22:14.166 is definitely very helpful. 22:14.166 --> 22:16.902 We have realized a long time ago 22:16.902 --> 22:18.704 that those were the programs that we needed 22:18.704 --> 22:20.973 in order to continue to push our students forward. 22:20.973 --> 22:23.509 So for us, it wasn't a brand new conversation. 22:23.509 --> 22:26.078 Again, as I mentioned before, 22:26.078 --> 22:28.747 I hope some of those same advocates who are pushing for 22:28.747 --> 22:31.116 that additional funding, continue to do it 22:31.116 --> 22:32.718 past the pandemic. 22:32.718 --> 22:35.454 - Right, and the final point, 22:36.488 --> 22:38.657 also what came up in the legislature 22:38.657 --> 22:40.492 was this whole discussion about 22:40.492 --> 22:43.495 what do you do with a student who is in the third grade, 22:43.495 --> 22:46.498 who is not at reading level? 22:46.498 --> 22:49.268 And I know the school board over many years 22:49.268 --> 22:51.136 has had discussions periodically 22:51.136 --> 22:55.307 about the idea of retaining a third grader 22:55.307 --> 22:58.110 until they are at reading level or until they meet 22:58.110 --> 23:01.380 or show some kind of progress realistically, 23:01.380 --> 23:03.115 toward that goal. 23:03.115 --> 23:04.783 Where do you think the school board is 23:04.783 --> 23:09.154 in that discussion that that's come up again now? 23:09.989 --> 23:11.023 - You know, it was interesting 23:11.023 --> 23:12.825 that it did come up at the state level. 23:12.825 --> 23:14.693 And as you mentioned, we have been talking about it 23:14.693 --> 23:17.363 for quite some time, which we did our, you know, 23:17.363 --> 23:20.032 third grade policy is around it. 23:20.032 --> 23:22.768 And, you know, definitely have those key factors 23:22.768 --> 23:25.337 that start from pre-K on up to second grade 23:25.337 --> 23:26.672 that you have to hit in order for you 23:26.672 --> 23:28.607 to be promoted to the third grade. 23:28.607 --> 23:29.975 I think now as a board 23:29.975 --> 23:32.411 it is just resurfacing the conversation 23:32.411 --> 23:34.647 and making sure that we're tight on it 23:34.647 --> 23:37.216 and making sure that we also, 23:37.216 --> 23:38.784 because we've been through the pandemic 23:38.784 --> 23:41.453 and this is where I will say where extra supports 23:41.453 --> 23:43.889 need to happen, is making sure we do those extra things 23:43.889 --> 23:46.959 before we just say, someone hasn't hit the market 23:46.959 --> 23:47.960 that we do those extras 23:47.960 --> 23:51.163 before we decide on not promoting them. 23:51.163 --> 23:53.365 - How much, with just a few minutes left here, 23:53.365 --> 23:57.870 you know, the, the teachers unions have been pretty adamant 23:57.870 --> 23:59.204 about not going back. 23:59.204 --> 24:01.840 People throw around the notion that 24:01.840 --> 24:03.876 a big chunk of teachers would retire 24:03.876 --> 24:07.246 if they were forced to go back when it wasn't safe. 24:07.246 --> 24:10.516 How much does pressure from the teacher unions 24:10.516 --> 24:12.117 come into play in your thinking? 24:13.185 --> 24:14.153 - I will say this, 24:14.153 --> 24:17.656 you know, I, Eric, when you finish 24:17.656 --> 24:19.491 you'll know how many board members we have. 24:19.491 --> 24:22.294 I am one of nine. [both laugh] 24:23.228 --> 24:25.464 I'm gonna always make that win, you know, 24:25.464 --> 24:26.932 and say I'm one of nine. 24:26.932 --> 24:28.801 And for me, I hear teachers. 24:28.801 --> 24:31.236 I understand, you know what they're saying, 24:31.236 --> 24:33.138 but as a board, you have to get to five 24:33.138 --> 24:35.240 on any decision that's being made. 24:35.240 --> 24:38.610 So I think this is an opportunity for us to, you know 24:38.610 --> 24:42.348 be real clear on what it is and be supportive of Dr. Ray 24:42.348 --> 24:45.651 in understanding that what additional supports 24:45.651 --> 24:46.518 we can give to teachers. 24:46.518 --> 24:47.619 I don't know the numbers. 24:47.619 --> 24:50.556 I'd be honest and say, I've heard from one union 24:50.556 --> 24:52.591 and I've heard from another union. 24:52.591 --> 24:55.794 And oftentimes they do not share the same thoughts. 24:55.794 --> 24:58.063 Sometimes they do share the same thoughts. 24:58.063 --> 25:02.868 But I will say we, as a board have also had conversations 25:02.868 --> 25:05.637 around what does it look like to fill that shortage 25:05.637 --> 25:06.939 if that happens. 25:06.939 --> 25:09.541 So we have to be prepared either way. 25:09.541 --> 25:12.044 - Last thing, and we probably don't enough time for it 25:12.044 --> 25:14.179 but the like all school systems, 25:14.179 --> 25:15.914 the first round of federal money, 25:15.914 --> 25:18.050 there was a big, there was some millions of dollars 25:18.050 --> 25:19.985 that came to the Shelby County school system. 25:19.985 --> 25:22.788 I think there's an estimated 190 million more 25:22.788 --> 25:23.622 that's about to come. 25:23.622 --> 25:25.124 I think I have that right. 25:25.124 --> 25:26.925 How will that, how was that money been spent 25:26.925 --> 25:28.927 and how will it be spent going forward? 25:28.927 --> 25:29.762 - Great question. 25:29.762 --> 25:31.563 We have a board budget retreat that's coming up 25:31.563 --> 25:32.498 where we're gonna talk about 25:32.498 --> 25:34.166 how we're gonna spend those SO 2.0 funds. 25:35.100 --> 25:37.035 There are some things that we already know 25:37.035 --> 25:37.936 that we need to do, 25:37.936 --> 25:42.408 but as a board we have not collectively had the conversation 25:42.408 --> 25:44.109 around where they will go. 25:44.109 --> 25:46.545 But a good portion of that is going to make sure that 25:46.545 --> 25:49.581 we are doing, in having the supplies needed 25:49.581 --> 25:51.817 for those who choose to go back into the building. 25:51.817 --> 25:54.486 - Is it, and there's been some talk maybe of tutoring 25:54.486 --> 25:56.822 and summer sessions and that kind of 25:56.822 --> 25:58.724 making, helping kids get caught up is, 25:58.724 --> 26:00.993 can the money go towards that as well? 26:00.993 --> 26:04.663 - It can, but you know, again 26:04.663 --> 26:07.633 I don't wanna say where something's gonna go again 26:07.633 --> 26:09.468 because we haven't had the conversation 26:09.468 --> 26:12.704 as a whole board around the direction of those dollars. 26:12.704 --> 26:15.207 We've only brought up one or two things. 26:15.207 --> 26:16.575 - And that is all the time we have this week. 26:16.575 --> 26:18.677 Miska Clay Bibs, thanks for joining us. 26:18.677 --> 26:22.815 Remember, you can get past episodes of the show at wkno.org 26:22.815 --> 26:25.083 or you can download the full podcast of the show 26:25.083 --> 26:26.485 from the daily Memphian site 26:26.485 --> 26:28.921 or wherever you get your podcasts. 26:28.921 --> 26:31.590 [upbeat music]