(female announcer)
  This is a production

of WKNO-Memphis.

Production funding for
  "Behind the Headlines" is

made possible in part by..

The push for more business for
minority owned firms tonight on

"Behind the Headlines."

[theme music]

I'm Eric Barnes, publisher
of The Memphis Daily News.

Thanks for joining us.

We're joined tonight by Mauricio
Calvo from Latino Memphis.

Thanks for being here.

Glad to be here.

Darrell Cobbins, C-E-O
of Universal Commercial.

Thanks for being here.

Thank you.

And Ron Redwing
from 100 Black Men.

Thanks for being here.

I'm going to start, I
think, with you Darrell.

This push came up why?

It's been certainly a topic
of conversation for decades.

Different strategies,
different approaches.

Some success or changes in terms
of how minority owned businesses

get government and
quasi-governmental contracting

and so on.

But this new push
came about why?

Well, I think, uh, early this
summer you saw in the news both

in print and in the media,
um, stories whether it's in

government.

Also, I think Wendy Thomas wrote
a piece about the disparity that

existed whether it's
in government contracts,

also in the private
sector, as it related to the,

uh, disparity that existed.

There's a disparity study
that was done in 1994 that

highlighted the galring holes
that existed whether where it

related to minority and women
owned businesses and the 1% that

they got, um, as it
related to prime contracts.

And I think when that
was brought to light,

the big question
mark was that was 1994.

And it's 2014.

And that was 20 years ago.

And we still sit here 20
years later with that hole still

existing.

What is the percentage now?

Well, um, the most recent census
data was in 2007 that showed

that eight-tenths
of 1% is the number.

The number of?

Grosse receipts that minority
and women owned businesses.

And is that Memphis or Shelby
County or the United States?

Well, that's the Memphis M-S-A.

And, uh, and that's, um,
and that was pre 2008.

So, I think we can probably
assume that that number may be

even worse since 2007.

Because of the
recession or because..

Exactly.

And so, I think that number
may be being updated soon since

2007.

And so, the impetus for this
recent push was that we need to

examine as a community, um,
that issue as a priority.

When you look at our
poverty situation,

when you look at the fact that
Latinos and African-Americans

make up almost 70% of the
population in this community but

Latino poverty in Memphis and
Shelby County is 72% higher than

the national average
for Latinos in America.

African-American poverty in
Memphis and Shelby County is

almost 32% higher than
African-American poverty in the

United States.

We have to examine that.

And not that minority and women
owned business can solve that.

But there's a solution there.

Yeah.

That we need to take a look at.

And what would..

Let me bring Ron in here
and I'll get to Mauricio.

In your ideal world, the
approach would entail what?

A new appraoch to
bidding projects out,

new requirements for
percentage participation?

I mean what are the details
of how this changes from your

point-of-view?

Eric, I think there are
a lot of opportunities,

as Darrell said, to
examine best practices,

what works.

For example, in the 1994
study, there were a number of

reccomendations that were
outlined as to what could happen

or what should happen to at
least address the issue of the

disparity that exists.

For exmaple, they talked
about looking at mentor protege

programs, looking at
de-bundling your large bids,

more training and workshop
opportunities for small,

women owned businesses.

But those are just some thinigs
that could be addressed or

looked at to address the issue.

And then beyond that when you
talk about engaging the private

sector, looking at opportunities
that they engage more and become

more creative and inviting in
opportunities at the private

sector.

Because we recognize these
numbers can't be reached through

government alone.

It has to be a partnership
with the private sector.

So to that in, we've scheduled
and met with a number of the

private business advocacy groups
such as Memphis Tomorrow through

their many programs and
involvement as it relates to

this issue.

We're meeting with the Chamber
of Commerce and a number of

other organizations to look at
ways to address that very issue

and best practices
throughout the country.

We're not talking about
reinventing the wheel.

The one thing we know for sure,
there has to be a change for

Memphis to become the city of
choice and to make the kinds of

differences that
we're talking about.

Mauricio, we talk
about 1994 to now.

The Hispanic and
Latino population has grown

dramatically in
that period of time.

So, your take, your perspective
on this and the importace of

this and the mechanisms, the way
in which chane could happen that

would satisfy you.

Sure.

And I agree with Darrell.

I mean I think we have been
talking about it for 20 years.

I will add that perhaps
the recent comments from the

Commissioner Henri Brooks kind
of sparked this conversation.

So, that was a
really awkward moment.

I think the good thing out of
that is that people are talking

about this.

Again, I'm not saying
that she created this.

But it did create
a sense of, like,

well, let's just regroup
and talk about these issues.

Are Latinos a true minority
here?

Or this disparity?

I think it was an invitation to
go back to the table and look at

these things.

I mean Latinos obviously want..

They want a share of the pie.

But we also have to see that
many Latinos are not ready to be

contractors.

They're not licensed.

So, I think we have to look at
really at a broad prospective

and say okay, we need to do
training for folks that are

starting a business.

I think we should make a
push whether it's black,

white, Latino or
other for local business,

for small businesses.

I mean I love to see this huge
construction on 40 and other

places with
out-of-town companies doing it.

You know, I think,
because at the end of the day,

even if it's a small minority
owned business out of Georgia,

how does that benefit us?

I mean I know at the end of
the day it employs people here.

Let's just bring
businesses from here first.

Right.

And you get, to
Darrell maybe, you get..

Mauricio brings up the point
that critics or skeptics of

these kind of
efforts will say, well,

there it's all well and good to
say that you want to have more

minority owned businesses
leading these contracts.

But those
businesses aren't out there.

And so, on some level,
there's a chicken and egg thing.

Right?

If there aren't enough
businesses qualified to do it,

it's not that they're
not inherently qualified.

They just don't
have the experience.

Because maybe in the past, they
were explicitly blocked out.

That's maybe less so now.

I mean there's progress.

But there aren't as many
minority owned businesses.

There aren't, you know, for
the population that's 50%

African-American, there aren't
50% African-American businesses.

So, how do you balance that?

How do you get that chicken and
egg thing going in the direction

you want?

You first.

That's why I said we
have to examine it.

I'm not sitting here
saying, uh, let's start blaming.

But I'm saying let's examine it.

And it's sort of like the
car is broken and the hood is,

you know, there's smoke coming
out of the hood and the stop

engine light is on.

You know, we need to pop the
hood and get up under there and

figure out what the issue is.

Right.

And so, if there's
a lack of talent,

so to speak, let's figure
out where the needs are,

what the opportunities are.

And to Mauricio's
point, if there is a,

uh, lack of talent in
specific areas where there are

opportunities, let's provide
the technical assistance.

Let's provide the training.

Let's provide the, um,
training and the skills to,

uh, to provide opportunities
for folks that go in to those

particular areas
where there is business.

And in part is..

100 Black Men is in part an
answer to some of the things

you're talking about.

Is that correct?

Well..

Because you should tell people
what that is if they're not

familiar with your organization.

Sure.

100 Black Men is a civic
organization of professional men

whose focus is mentoring,
uh, primarily young boys.

Lately our focus has
been in education,

primarily with
our charter school,

MAHS, Memphis Academy
of Health Sciences.

But I wanted to touch on
that, Darrell's point.

You know, in some instances,
we talk about new business,

training businesses.

But in a lot of instances,
it's about recognizing and

acknowledging the
businesses that are there.

Businesses are in waiting and
just looking for an opportunity.

So, when we can match the
need with the opportunity,

then I think we can
begin to move the needle.

And particularly where business
are of scale where they can work

on large construction project or
if it's through some contracting

mechanism.

It's the opportunity, I think,
that we're missing in this whole

conversation.

And we got to get there.

But don't..

I mean it seems like..

Maybe this is a very,
uh, superficial response.

You tell me if it is.

Whenever a big
project, a big ticket item,

you know, a Bass
Pro, a Crosstown,

Graceland, you know,
Whitehaven redevelopment area.

There's always some kind
of condition in thereof,

you know, X percent.

Or it seems like there's some
kind of condition in there.

X percent, 25%
minority participation.

Like when FedEx Forum was built.

Do those requirements not work?

And are they not real?

Are they not enough?

Sure.

I think they're real.

I think it's where we also have
to be intentional about making

sure that those who are ready,
those who are prepared and

qualified have the opportunities
to really seek those,

uh, those business, uh,
procurement opportunities as

they exist.

You can question.

When you start getting to
percentages and numbers and that

sort of thing, that's
neither here nor there.

But where we have companies
to Mauricio's point that are

qualified, that are ready, we
should be doing everything we

can to allow those companies or
businesses the opportunities to

participate.

Let me put this question on you.

You know, again, people who
listen to this maybe and say,

well, you know, once you..

If you mandate that X percentage
or is going to be a minority

participation.

That gives them an
unfair advantage.

This is what people might say.

Because they're
guaranteed that work.

They're going to get that work,
that subcontract or contract,

regardless of being the lowest
bidder of the highest qualified

person.

Say with tax or public
projects where it's tax money.

That costs everyone,
could be the argument.

So, again, is
that how you see it?

That this is guaranteed work
regardless of quality or cost?

No, absolutely not.

So, I think there's no
silver bullet for this.

It is a very complex issue.

It is something that I think
we have to look after the tax

payers and bring quality for us.

And then we just, like you said,
we have to be intentional about

looking quality and price
winning the local market.

I go back to push for local
businesses to have an important

share.

Because to your point, if
they are 70% of people in the

population..

If the minority population in
Shelby County and maybe even

more when you put
women, African-Americans,

Latinos and
everybody else is 70,

80%..

Well, if you make a
push for local businesses,

you're automatically sharing
some of that wealth with,

you know, with the people here
that are minority or otherwise.

So, but absolutely not.

I don't think you should give a
minority preference because your

racial profile.

But I think there are
enough quality talent here.

We just have to create
those opportunities,

be more intentional.

And I think you can.

I think you can achieve most of
all if we're smart and we work

really intentional about this.

And, you know, to
that point, you know,

let's put this in contest.

You know, we're talking about
opportunities for the majority

of this community at
the end of the day.

You know, let's be candid here.

You know, we've seen here in
recent weeks or months the

situations in
Ferguson, you know,

all the explosions that are
going on as it relates to

violence.

I now sit on a committee that
the Mayor has called together to

focus on youth violence.

But that gets down to the core
of what we're talking about.

This is just not
business for business sake.

But we're talking about
issues of drugs and violence,

particularly youth violence.

What we're looking at is a
systemic problem with young folk

with no hope who are in despair
and don't believe that things

can be better for them.

So, when we look at looking at
providing business opportunities

for local companies who might
hire some of these young people

right here in Memphis and Shelby
County for businesses who may

engage some of these young men
and women who are on the streets

with no jobs, no
place to go, no hope.

Then, you can begin to
address those issues.

And I don't think you can
address those issues without

addressing the issues of
joblessness and hopelessness as

it relates to this community.

And particularly in a community
like Memphis where our poverty

rates are at an all-time high,
where the violence is continuing

to tick up and up and up as it
relates to our young people.

We got to address those issues.

And this is by far one of
those ways to begin to do that.

Creating other
paths of opportunity.

By creating other opportunities
for them beyond what has been

provided to them.

So, it's about hope and having
opportunities and a place to go

for many of these young people.

And let me get you
back in the conversation.

But again, to that point,
you run your own business.

But you run your own
business and your contracted.

And you want to get the highest
quality deal and not the best

price.

How do you and your
business view this notion of,

you know, am I going to
give preference to an

African-American owned
company or subcontractor or a,

you know, somebody to work
for you when they're way more

expensive and maybe not
as experienced as this,

um, white owned company?

I mean how do you balance that
as a business owner just in your

world.

I also sit on the board of
Memphis Light Gas and Water,

which I think is
one of the best,

um, companies in this city of
public or private when it comes

to achieving
supplier diversities.

So, there's a
balance when you look at,

you know, achieving
the best price and also,

getting the quality and
experience when it comes to

achieving supplier diversity.

And so, there's a local
bidding preference and also,

um, a prioritization in terms
of making sure that the dollars

circulate in the local economy.

And, uh, and they do
it very successfully.

Um, but to Ron's point, what I
would want to emphasize also,

you know, I sit in on a
lot of economic development

conversations and sit
on a lot of initiatives.

And as it relates to
our local school system,

I think one of the things that
we have to be cognoscente of is

that when we are
educating our young people,

we are, uh, educating them
not to be laborers and workers.

We should be educating
and empowering them to be

entrepreneurs and innovators.

Yeah.

And to this end of minority
business growth and development,

the Memphis that we are looking
to create should be one of

innovation and entrepreneurism.

And when we, uh, talk to
our young people and when we

envision the
Memphis of tomorrow,

where I went to high school,
Memphis University School,

they're not talking to
them about being workers.

They're talking to
them about being leaders.

And I think when we talk about
minority business growth and

development, what we need to
be envisioning is these young

people being leaders.

Yeah, yeah.

Um, you talked about
economic development.

Another area that I mentioned
some of these big ticket

projects and the percentages
for minority contracts,

there is a pilot program.

The pilot program, a big
spotlight on that right now.

Um, that there
are some kind of..

It's a goal or requirement that.

uh, that there be
minority participation.

We had Reid Dulberger from EDGE,
the pilot umbrella organization,

on recently.

That's the kind of goal I think
that people at the table are

talking about is a good goal.

And yet, you do
hear people who say,

well, that's an impediment.

It's one more If
you're going to do,

uh, big projects in Memphis
and attract companies and you're

going to put a pilot program
that's more complicated in and

of itself than the incentives
you can get in Fayette County

and DeSoto County.

And then, you put this minority
participation requirement on top

of that.

Heck, we'll just
move to DeSoto County.

We'll just put our project
in Fayette County and take

advantage of all the
great things in Memphis.

How do you address that?

I mean if Memphis loses a
project outright because of too

much bureaucracy and
too many requirements,

isn't that self-defeating also?

Go ahead.

I think it's about messaging.

Instead of putting some
impediment or some requirement,

let's put back some incentive.

You know, if you
get this contract,

you are a
whatever owned company.

You may be a corporation.

If you turn around and give
more participation to local

businesses, to minority
and women owned businesses,

you'll get this incentive.

So, it's not saying
that's a penalty.

But yeah, rather some
incentive and some extra.

Because at the end of the
day, everybody will win.

And to your point, you
have to start early.

We have to start with
the charter schools.

But anyway, going back
to that specific point,

that's an incentive and
people will be like well,

I want to business in Memphis.

And I want to do business
with local business owners.

Your take?

To the point also,
Eric, keep in mind that,

you know, of course, we have to
find that balance as it relates

to the pilot
program and, you know,

how those funds are divvied up
and how we utilize that program.

But we can't get away from
the fact that if it weren't for

those, these companies wouldn't
be coming to Memphis or Shelby

County.

We wouldn't have the jobs.

We wouldn't have
those opportunities.

So, those
programs are important.

And when you look at
what's happening with the pilot

program, for example, I'll
cite the Electrolux program.

I think they had, uh, upwards
of 30% of local and minority

participation.

As a matter of fact,
when you add local,

I think it was even higher.

So, there are some glowing
examples of how this can work

and where it will dwell.

And, of course, they're
hiring out of the M-S-A over at

Electrolux upwards of 75%.

And the people
are from this area.

So, those are opportunities that
really benefit the community.

You got to find that balance.

You don't want the pilots to
be an impediment to what's

happening.

But you do want them to work
because we cannot afford to lose

companies to our
neighboring cities.

So, the balance
is the key there.

We've talked a
lot about the, um,

government sector
maybe and the quasi-pilot.

Electrolux clearly a
private organization.

But there was a lot of
public money involved.

But for you all, just
dealing without the pilots.

With any of these
totally free of government,

what is..

What do you think the best
practice is or the best parts

you like to see businesses
have in terms of working with,

um, contracting with,
um, minority businesses?

So, I don't want
to name companies.

But, you know, get totally
out of the public sector.

Because there's no
enforcement mechanism there.

Obviously there are
anti-discrimination laws with

employment and so on.

But how do you break
through and work with a,

I mean, white owned
business as, you know,

someone who owns your
minority owned business?

How do you break through there?

How does that happen?

Well, I think the thing
we said is number one,

we know we have great
corporations here in Memphis and

Shelby County.

Great leadership.

It's been intentional in having
the will and understanding and

big picture of including women
and minority in small businesses

in their procurement process.

Because it's good for the
community at the end of the day.

And I think some of the
best practices are outlined.

And those are certainly the
kinds of conversations we're

having with advocacy
groups like the Chamber,

like Memphis Tomorrow, who
are saying we want to have,

we want to engage.

We're charging the city and
county both their governments

and others who are involved in
this business to identify what

those best practices are.

For example, I mentioned the
mentor protege program where

small businesses pair up with
larger businesses and they work

with them on
training, development,

their best practices, purchasing
powers and any other initiatives

that make sense for them.

But through their experience and
bringing these small companies

on, those are we know
winning combinations through

experiences,
through existing, uh,

partnerships.

Go ahead.

Joint ventures have proven
to be extremely successful.

My firm actually is joint
ventured with C-B Richard Ellis

and we've been working with the
city of Memphis and evaluating

the suitability of a state
office building Downtown for the

city of Memphis to determine
it's suitability whether the

city should take that on.

And that's worked
extremely well.

And so, those
types of partnerships,

um, you know, provide
opportunities that might not

actually be available to
minority businesses to actually

take on opportunities.

There's this fundamental
irony that we're talking about

minority businesses.

I'm the minority at this table.

You know, and within the
city of Memphis at least.

You know, there's
an obvious gap.

We didn't have women owned
representatives on the show and

so, I apologize for that.

But, um, is part of it just
getting people to acknowledge

and not resist that notion that
Memphis is a city that's a very

diverse city.

And if you're going to say
you're not going to work with

minority owned businesses,
you're excluding 50 to 75% of

the companies or 50
to 75% of the people.

I mean is it that simple.

Yeah, I think that's
the changing culture.

And that's a change in culture
that everybody at this table,

uh, you know, we're a part of
this new Memphis right now where

we are conscious about this.

Like, you know, we know if I
call Darrell for a business real

estate deal, I'm not going
to call him just because he's

black.

I'm just going to call him
because I think he's a great guy

and he does good business.

But so, yeah, you need to watch.

But I think you just need to
have this culture where we can

all work together
at the same time,

have the supply of more
businesses that are ready to do,

more leaders.

It's hard to enforce all of
these things all day long.

At one point, we'll just
have to think differently.

And I think a lot of people are
thinking differently nowadays.

And all of us are
just like, hey,

let's just do business.

Right, right.

Just a minute left here.

Ekundayo Bandele
runs Hattiloo Theatre.

After he was on the show, he
talked about how actually the

strength of Hattiloo in Overton
Square is that they brought a

whole new audience
to Overton Square.

And I wonder if that's
also part of the pitch that..

I don't know who I
want to throw this to.

But that notion of this.

Don't do this just
because it's, uh,

you feel like you
should or whatever.

But do it because it's access
to a whole nother network of

businesses or people, of
customers and clients.

There's no question about it.

You're bringing new
talent to the table.

You're growing businesses and
people who are going to live

here who are consumers.

I mean it just makes sense for
Memphis and Shelby County to do

it.

And, uh, at the end of the day,
it's about this community being

the best
community that we can be.

But everybody needs to benefit
and share in that American dream

and in that
American pie with that.

Alright.

Well, we're going
to leave it there.

Ron Redwood, thank
you for being here.

Mauricio Calvo, Darrell
Cobbins, thank you all.

Thank you for joining us.

Join us again next week.

Goodnight.

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