>>> THE NEED TO CONSERVE WATER
IN ARIZONA IS A GIVEN.

IN ARIZONA IS A GIVEN.
YET THERE'S A LONG WAY TO GO AND

YET THERE'S A LONG WAY TO GO AND
LACK OF CONSENSUS ON DIRECTION.

LACK OF CONSENSUS ON DIRECTION.
>> EVENTUALLY, ARIZONA WILL HAVE

>> EVENTUALLY, ARIZONA WILL HAVE
MORE WATER DEMANDS BECAUSE IT

MORE WATER DEMANDS BECAUSE IT
WILL HAVE MORE PEOPLE THAN THE

WILL HAVE MORE PEOPLE THAN THE
EXISTING WATER SUPPLY.

EXISTING WATER SUPPLY.
WHICH MEANS THAT WE'LL HAVE TO

WHICH MEANS THAT WE'LL HAVE TO
FIND MORE WATER SOMEWHERE.

FIND MORE WATER SOMEWHERE.
WE CAN'T CONSERVE OUR WAY OUT OF

WE CAN'T CONSERVE OUR WAY OUT OF
IT.

IT.
>> THAT AND ANOTHER VIEW ON

>> THAT AND ANOTHER VIEW ON
WATER, PLUS 50 YEARS AFTER JOHN

WATER, PLUS 50 YEARS AFTER JOHN
F. KENNEDY'S DEATH, WE LOOK AT

F. KENNEDY'S DEATH, WE LOOK AT
HIS CONNECTIONS TO OUR STATE.

HIS CONNECTIONS TO OUR STATE.
IT'S "ARIZONA WEEK."

IT'S "ARIZONA WEEK."
>> PRODUCTION OF ARIZONA WEEK IS

>> PRODUCTION OF ARIZONA WEEK IS
MADE POSSIBLE IN PART BY A GRANT

MADE POSSIBLE IN PART BY A GRANT
FROM THE STONEWALL FOUNDATION

FROM THE STONEWALL FOUNDATION
AND FROM THE MEMBERS OF ARIZONA

AND FROM THE MEMBERS OF ARIZONA
PUBLIC MEDIA.

PUBLIC MEDIA.
THANK YOU FOR YOUR CONTINUED

THANK YOU FOR YOUR CONTINUED
SUPPORT.

ONCE AGAIN, YOUR MODERATOR,
MICHAEL CHIHAK.

MICHAEL CHIHAK.
>> BEHIND MANY ECONOMIC AND

>> BEHIND MANY ECONOMIC AND
POLITICAL SOCIAL DECISIONS IN

POLITICAL SOCIAL DECISIONS IN
ARIZONA IS THE QUESTION OF WHERE

ARIZONA IS THE QUESTION OF WHERE
WE WILL GET WATER OR IF IT ISN'T

WE WILL GET WATER OR IF IT ISN'T
PART OF SUCH DISCUSSIONS, IT

PART OF SUCH DISCUSSIONS, IT
SHOULD BE.

SHOULD BE.
TALK OF THE STATE'S SHORT TERM

TALK OF THE STATE'S SHORT TERM
AND LONG TERM WATER ISSUES

AND LONG TERM WATER ISSUES
ABOUND AND MUCH IS IN THE WORKS.

ABOUND AND MUCH IS IN THE WORKS.
THIS WEEK, THE MORRISON

THIS WEEK, THE MORRISON
INSTITUTE FOR PUBLIC POLICY AT

INSTITUTE FOR PUBLIC POLICY AT
ARIZONA STATE UNIVERSITY HELD A

ARIZONA STATE UNIVERSITY HELD A
FORUM ON WATER AND AZPM'S

FORUM ON WATER AND AZPM'S
CHRISTOPHER CONOVER CAUGHT UP

CHRISTOPHER CONOVER CAUGHT UP
WITH ONE OF ITS PARTICIPANTS,

WITH ONE OF ITS PARTICIPANTS,
FORMER U.S. SENATOR JON KYL, WHO

FORMER U.S. SENATOR JON KYL, WHO
REMAINS ACTIVE IN ARIZONA'S

REMAINS ACTIVE IN ARIZONA'S
WATER FUTURE.

WATER FUTURE.
>> SENATOR, THANK YOU SO MUCH

>> SENATOR, THANK YOU SO MUCH
FOR SITTING DOWN WITH US.

FOR SITTING DOWN WITH US.
>> GLAD TO BE HERE.

>> GLAD TO BE HERE.
>> YOU JUST SPENT ABOUT AN HOUR

>> YOU JUST SPENT ABOUT AN HOUR
DOING A PANEL DISCUSSION TALKING

DOING A PANEL DISCUSSION TALKING
ABOUT WATER AND ONE OF THE BIG

ABOUT WATER AND ONE OF THE BIG
TAKE-AWAYS I HEARD FROM YOU WAS

TAKE-AWAYS I HEARD FROM YOU WAS
IT'S A TWOFOLD PROBLEM.

IT'S A TWOFOLD PROBLEM.
SHORT TERM AND LONG TERM.

SHORT TERM AND LONG TERM.
FOR ARIZONA AND REALLY, THE

FOR ARIZONA AND REALLY, THE
NATION AS A WHOLE, BUT REALLY,

NATION AS A WHOLE, BUT REALLY,
ARIZONA.

ARIZONA.
IF YOU CAN FOR OUR VIEWERS, TALK

IF YOU CAN FOR OUR VIEWERS, TALK
A LITTLE ABOUT SOME OF THE SHORT

A LITTLE ABOUT SOME OF THE SHORT
TERM VERSUS LONG TERM PROBLEMS.

TERM VERSUS LONG TERM PROBLEMS.
>> SURE.

>> SURE.
FIRST LET'S TALK ABOUT LONG

FIRST LET'S TALK ABOUT LONG
TERM, BECAUSE THAT'S MORE EASILY

TERM, BECAUSE THAT'S MORE EASILY
UNDERSTOOD.

UNDERSTOOD.
EVENTUALLY, ARIZONA WILL HAVE

EVENTUALLY, ARIZONA WILL HAVE
MORE WATER DEMANDS BECAUSE IT

MORE WATER DEMANDS BECAUSE IT
WILL HAVE MORE PEOPLE THAN THE

WILL HAVE MORE PEOPLE THAN THE
EXISTING WATER SUPPLY, WHICH

EXISTING WATER SUPPLY, WHICH
MEANS THAT WE WILL HAVE TO FIND

MEANS THAT WE WILL HAVE TO FIND
MORE WATER SOMEWHERE.

MORE WATER SOMEWHERE.
WE CAN'T CONSERVE OUR WAY OUT OF

WE CAN'T CONSERVE OUR WAY OUT OF
IT.

IT.
THAT HELPS BUT IT'S NOT THE

THAT HELPS BUT IT'S NOT THE
SILVER BULLET.

SILVER BULLET.
SO AUGMENTATION OF OUR WATER

SO AUGMENTATION OF OUR WATER
SUPPLY EVENTUALLY WILL BE PART

SUPPLY EVENTUALLY WILL BE PART
OF THE SOLUTION, AND THAT WILL

OF THE SOLUTION, AND THAT WILL
BE VERY, VERY EXPENSIVE,

BE VERY, VERY EXPENSIVE,
SOMETHING LIKE DESALINIZATION.

SOMETHING LIKE DESALINIZATION.
THAT'S DOWN THE ROAD.

THAT'S DOWN THE ROAD.
WE HAVE TO FIGURE OUT HOW TODAY

WE HAVE TO FIGURE OUT HOW TODAY
TO BE ABLE TO AFFORD AND DEVELOP

TO BE ABLE TO AFFORD AND DEVELOP
POLITICAL SUPPORT FOR THOSE

POLITICAL SUPPORT FOR THOSE
SOLUTIONS SO THEY ARE IN PLACE

SOLUTIONS SO THEY ARE IN PLACE
AND READY WHEN THE TIME COMES.

AND READY WHEN THE TIME COMES.
IN THE SHORT TERM, WE HAVE A

IN THE SHORT TERM, WE HAVE A
VARIETY OF ISSUES THAT HAVE TO

VARIETY OF ISSUES THAT HAVE TO
BE DEALT WITH.

BE DEALT WITH.
FIRST, WE HAVE BEEN ENGAGED NOW

FIRST, WE HAVE BEEN ENGAGED NOW
FOR SEVERAL DECADES IN THE WATER

FOR SEVERAL DECADES IN THE WATER
ADJUDICATION, FIGURING OUT WHO

ADJUDICATION, FIGURING OUT WHO
HAS THE RIGHTS TO THE SURFACE

HAS THE RIGHTS TO THE SURFACE
WATER IN THE STATE.

WATER IN THE STATE.
WE'VE MADE A LOT OF HEADWAY IN

WE'VE MADE A LOT OF HEADWAY IN
COURT.

COURT.
THERE HAVE BEEN SEVERAL INDIAN

THERE HAVE BEEN SEVERAL INDIAN
WATER SETTLEMENTS BECAUSE INDIAN

WATER SETTLEMENTS BECAUSE INDIAN
TRIBES ARE CLAIMANTS AND WHEN

TRIBES ARE CLAIMANTS AND WHEN
THE PARTIES CAN GET TOGETHER AND

THE PARTIES CAN GET TOGETHER AND
SETTLE THOSE DIFFERENCES RATHER

SETTLE THOSE DIFFERENCES RATHER
THAN FIGHTING ABOUT THEM IN

THAN FIGHTING ABOUT THEM IN
COURT, THAT'S A BIG PIECE OF THE

COURT, THAT'S A BIG PIECE OF THE
PUZZLE SOLVED.

PUZZLE SOLVED.
BUT THE CONGRESS ISN'T GOING TO

BUT THE CONGRESS ISN'T GOING TO
HAVE ANY MORE MONEY TO SUPPORT

HAVE ANY MORE MONEY TO SUPPORT
THESE INDIAN WATER SETTLEMENTS

THESE INDIAN WATER SETTLEMENTS
IN THE NEAR TERM, SO THAT'S A

IN THE NEAR TERM, SO THAT'S A
PROBLEM.

PROBLEM.
SECONDLY, THERE ARE SOME LEGAL

SECONDLY, THERE ARE SOME LEGAL
ISSUES THAT HAVE BECOME VERY,

ISSUES THAT HAVE BECOME VERY,
VERY DIFFICULT.

VERY DIFFICULT.
AND THIRD, THE STATE COURT THAT

AND THIRD, THE STATE COURT THAT
ADJUDICATES THESE WATER CLAIMS

ADJUDICATES THESE WATER CLAIMS
HAS THE ASSISTANCE OF THE

HAS THE ASSISTANCE OF THE
DEPARTMENT OF WATER RESOURCES AS

DEPARTMENT OF WATER RESOURCES AS
ITS TECHNICAL SUPPORT ENTITY.

ITS TECHNICAL SUPPORT ENTITY.
THEY BRING ALL THE DATA TO THE

THEY BRING ALL THE DATA TO THE
TABLE AND INTERPRET IT FOR THE

TABLE AND INTERPRET IT FOR THE
COURT.

COURT.
IF THEY'RE NOT ADEQUATELY FUNDED

IF THEY'RE NOT ADEQUATELY FUNDED
SO THAT THEY CAN PROVIDE THE

SO THAT THEY CAN PROVIDE THE
ANALYSIS THE COURT NEEDS, THEN

ANALYSIS THE COURT NEEDS, THEN
THE COURT COULD DECIDE THAT IT

THE COURT COULD DECIDE THAT IT
CANNOT USE THE ARIZONA COURT

CANNOT USE THE ARIZONA COURT
SYSTEM TO RESOLVE THESE THINGS

SYSTEM TO RESOLVE THESE THINGS
AND IT MAY TRY TO GO TO THE

AND IT MAY TRY TO GO TO THE
FEDERAL COURT, WHERE SOME OF THE

FEDERAL COURT, WHERE SOME OF THE
PARTIES WOULD RATHER BE.

PARTIES WOULD RATHER BE.
WELL, THAT WOULD UPSET AN ENTIRE

WELL, THAT WOULD UPSET AN ENTIRE
APPLE CART OF LAW THAT WE HAVE

APPLE CART OF LAW THAT WE HAVE
DEVELOPED OVER THE LAST SEVERAL

DEVELOPED OVER THE LAST SEVERAL
DECADES HERE, SO AMONG THE SHORT

DECADES HERE, SO AMONG THE SHORT
TERM PROBLEMS ARE JUST FUNDING

TERM PROBLEMS ARE JUST FUNDING
THE DEPARTMENT OF WATER

THE DEPARTMENT OF WATER
RESOURCES SO IT CAN PROVIDE THE

RESOURCES SO IT CAN PROVIDE THE
TECHNICAL EXPERTISE TO THE

TECHNICAL EXPERTISE TO THE
COURT, FIND A WAY TO CONTINUE TO

COURT, FIND A WAY TO CONTINUE TO
GET INDIAN WATER SETTLEMENTS

GET INDIAN WATER SETTLEMENTS
ACCOMPLISHED, FIND A WAY TO DEAL

ACCOMPLISHED, FIND A WAY TO DEAL
WITH PROBLEMS LIKE THE NAVAJO

WITH PROBLEMS LIKE THE NAVAJO
GENERATING STATION WHICH

GENERATING STATION WHICH
PROVIDES THE POWER BY WHICH

PROVIDES THE POWER BY WHICH
CENTRAL ARIZONA PROJECT WATER IS

CENTRAL ARIZONA PROJECT WATER IS
PUMPED AND DELIVERED AT A MUCH

PUMPED AND DELIVERED AT A MUCH
LESS EXPENSIVE RATE THAN WOULD

LESS EXPENSIVE RATE THAN WOULD
BE THE CASE OTHERWISE, A VARIETY

BE THE CASE OTHERWISE, A VARIETY
OF SHORT AND INTERMEDIATE RANGE

OF SHORT AND INTERMEDIATE RANGE
PROBLEMS LIKE THAT THAT REQUIRE

PROBLEMS LIKE THAT THAT REQUIRE
OUR ATTENTION.

OUR ATTENTION.
>> YOU TOUCHED ON A NUMBER OF

>> YOU TOUCHED ON A NUMBER OF
THINGS BUT ONE OF THE THINGS YOU

THINGS BUT ONE OF THE THINGS YOU
JUST MENTIONED WAS ARIZONA'S

JUST MENTIONED WAS ARIZONA'S
COURTS RESOLVING SOME OF THIS

COURTS RESOLVING SOME OF THIS
ADJUDICATION.

ADJUDICATION.
ARIZONA IS IN A UNIQUE POSITION

ARIZONA IS IN A UNIQUE POSITION
THAT OUR STATE COURTS CAN DO

THAT OUR STATE COURTS CAN DO
THAT.

THAT.
WE DON'T HAVE TO GO TO CONGRESS

WE DON'T HAVE TO GO TO CONGRESS
OR THE FEDERAL COURTS FOR THIS.

OR THE FEDERAL COURTS FOR THIS.
>> THAT'S RIGHT.

>> THAT'S RIGHT.
AND WHEN THE SUPREME COURT MADE

AND WHEN THE SUPREME COURT MADE
ITS HISTORIC DECISION THAT THE

ITS HISTORIC DECISION THAT THE
ARIZONA COURT SYSTEM WAS THE

ARIZONA COURT SYSTEM WAS THE
PROPER PLACE FOR EVERYBODY, THE

PROPER PLACE FOR EVERYBODY, THE
FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, THE INDIAN

FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, THE INDIAN
TRIBES, THE STATE CLAIMANTS,

TRIBES, THE STATE CLAIMANTS,
EVERYBODY ELSE, TO BE IN ONE

EVERYBODY ELSE, TO BE IN ONE
PLACE TO HAVE ALL OF THE CLAIMS

PLACE TO HAVE ALL OF THE CLAIMS
ASSERTED ONE AGAINST ANOTHER SO

ASSERTED ONE AGAINST ANOTHER SO
THAT WHEN A COURT FINALLY MAKES

THAT WHEN A COURT FINALLY MAKES
A DECISION AND SAYS HERE'S THE

A DECISION AND SAYS HERE'S THE
DECREE, YOU HAVE THE FIRST RIGHT

DECREE, YOU HAVE THE FIRST RIGHT
TO THIS MUCH WATER, YOU HAVE THE

TO THIS MUCH WATER, YOU HAVE THE
SECOND RIGHT TO THIS MUCH WATER

SECOND RIGHT TO THIS MUCH WATER
AND SO ON DOWN THE LINE, IT

AND SO ON DOWN THE LINE, IT
APPLIES TO EVERYBODY EQUALLY.

APPLIES TO EVERYBODY EQUALLY.
JUST IMAGINE THE SITUATION IF

JUST IMAGINE THE SITUATION IF
YOU HAD FEDERAL COURTS ISSUING

YOU HAD FEDERAL COURTS ISSUING
ONE DECREE AND THE STATE COURTS

ONE DECREE AND THE STATE COURTS
ISSUING A COMPETING DECREE.

ISSUING A COMPETING DECREE.
HOW DO YOU RESOLVE THAT?

HOW DO YOU RESOLVE THAT?
SO THE SUPREME COURT SAID GET

SO THE SUPREME COURT SAID GET
TOGETHER, ONE PLACE, STATE COURT

TOGETHER, ONE PLACE, STATE COURT
IS THE RIGHT PLACE BECAUSE THE

IS THE RIGHT PLACE BECAUSE THE
STATE CAN BE SUPPORTED BY THE

STATE CAN BE SUPPORTED BY THE
DEPARTMENT OF WATER RESOURCES

DEPARTMENT OF WATER RESOURCES
AND THE ARIZONA LAW THAT ENABLES

AND THE ARIZONA LAW THAT ENABLES
THAT SUPPORT.

THAT SUPPORT.
>> AS ARIZONA CONTINUES TO GROW,

>> AS ARIZONA CONTINUES TO GROW,
OBVIOUSLY YOU SAID WE CAN'T

OBVIOUSLY YOU SAID WE CAN'T
CONSERVE OUR WAY OUT OF THIS.

CONSERVE OUR WAY OUT OF THIS.
WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO TURN TO

WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO TURN TO
SCIENCE AND INDUSTRY.

SCIENCE AND INDUSTRY.
IS THERE EVER GOING TO BE A

IS THERE EVER GOING TO BE A
POINT OR I GUESS MORE CORRECTLY,

POINT OR I GUESS MORE CORRECTLY,
THERE WILL BE A POINT WHERE

THERE WILL BE A POINT WHERE
ARIZONA'S GOING TO LOOK

ARIZONA'S GOING TO LOOK
DIFFERENT AS A RESULT OF WATER.

DIFFERENT AS A RESULT OF WATER.
WHAT DO YOU THINK ARIZONA WILL

WHAT DO YOU THINK ARIZONA WILL
LOOK LIKE IN THE FUTURE

LOOK LIKE IN THE FUTURE
REGARDING WATER?

REGARDING WATER?
>> IT'S ALREADY LOOKING A LOT

>> IT'S ALREADY LOOKING A LOT
DIFFERENT.

DIFFERENT.
A LOT OF WATER THAT HAD BEEN

A LOT OF WATER THAT HAD BEEN
USED FOR AGRICULTURE IS NOW

USED FOR AGRICULTURE IS NOW
BEING USED FOR DOMESTIC AND

BEING USED FOR DOMESTIC AND
INDUSTRIAL USE.

INDUSTRIAL USE.
WATER -- AGRICULTURE CONSUMES A

WATER -- AGRICULTURE CONSUMES A
LOT OF WATER AND SO THAT'S ONE

LOT OF WATER AND SO THAT'S ONE
WAY THE STATE LOOKS DIFFERENT

WAY THE STATE LOOKS DIFFERENT
NOW THAN IT DID LET'S SAY 30

NOW THAN IT DID LET'S SAY 30
YEARS AGO.

YEARS AGO.
WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO MAKE SOME

WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO MAKE SOME
TOUGH DECISIONS.

TOUGH DECISIONS.
DO WE WANT PHOENIX, FOR EXAMPLE,

DO WE WANT PHOENIX, FOR EXAMPLE,
TO LOOK A LOT LIKE THE MORE

TO LOOK A LOT LIKE THE MORE
DESERT ORIENTED COMMUNITY OF

DESERT ORIENTED COMMUNITY OF
TUCSON.

TUCSON.
THEY DON'T USE AS MUCH WATER PER

THEY DON'T USE AS MUCH WATER PER
CAPITA AS WE DO IN PHOENIX, BUT

CAPITA AS WE DO IN PHOENIX, BUT
A LOT OF THE WEALTH THAT IS

A LOT OF THE WEALTH THAT IS
GENERATED FOR THE STATE COMES AS

GENERATED FOR THE STATE COMES AS
A RESULT OF THE ENVIRONMENT THAT

A RESULT OF THE ENVIRONMENT THAT
WE HAVE HERE IN THE SALT RIVER

WE HAVE HERE IN THE SALT RIVER
VALLEY WITH ALL THE RESORTS AND

VALLEY WITH ALL THE RESORTS AND
GOLF COURSES AND THE OTHER

GOLF COURSES AND THE OTHER
THINGS THAT MAKE OUR COMMUNITY

THINGS THAT MAKE OUR COMMUNITY
HERE UNIQUE.

HERE UNIQUE.
SO THERE'S A TRADE-OFF THERE.

SO THERE'S A TRADE-OFF THERE.
THERE'S ALSO A TRADE-OFF IN

THERE'S ALSO A TRADE-OFF IN
TERMS OF PLANTS THAT USE A LOT

TERMS OF PLANTS THAT USE A LOT
OF WATER ALSO REDUCE THE HEAT.

OF WATER ALSO REDUCE THE HEAT.
THE HEAT SINK EFFECT.

THE HEAT SINK EFFECT.
SO WE'LL HAVE TO HAVE ALL OF

SO WE'LL HAVE TO HAVE ALL OF
THOSE DEBATES AND WHAT I'M

THOSE DEBATES AND WHAT I'M
HOPING IS THAT WE WILL DO THAT

HOPING IS THAT WE WILL DO THAT
IN A WAY THAT DEVELOPS CONSENSUS

IN A WAY THAT DEVELOPS CONSENSUS
AND DOESN'T HAVE A LOT OF

AND DOESN'T HAVE A LOT OF
CONFLICT IN THE MEANTIME.

CONFLICT IN THE MEANTIME.
>> YOU MENTIONED ENVIRONMENT AND

>> YOU MENTIONED ENVIRONMENT AND
SOME PEOPLE MIGHT NOT SEE

SOME PEOPLE MIGHT NOT SEE
ENVIRONMENT I DON'T WANT TO SAY

ENVIRONMENT I DON'T WANT TO SAY
IN CONFLICT BUT THAT'S PROBABLY

IN CONFLICT BUT THAT'S PROBABLY
THE EASIEST WAY TO SAY IT, WITH

THE EASIEST WAY TO SAY IT, WITH
WATER, BUT THE NAVAJO GENERATING

WATER, BUT THE NAVAJO GENERATING
CENTER, WE HAVE AN ARGUMENT THAT

CENTER, WE HAVE AN ARGUMENT THAT
DOES BOIL DOWN TO --

DOES BOIL DOWN TO --
>> THEY ARE TWO ISSUES, AIR

>> THEY ARE TWO ISSUES, AIR
VERSUS WATER.

VERSUS WATER.
THE NAVAJO GENERATING STATION IS

THE NAVAJO GENERATING STATION IS
BEING ASKED BY THE EPA AND ASKED

BEING ASKED BY THE EPA AND ASKED
AS A EUPHEMISM, THEY ORDER YOU

AS A EUPHEMISM, THEY ORDER YOU
TO REDUCE YOUR POLLUTION AND IN

TO REDUCE YOUR POLLUTION AND IN
ORDER TO DO THAT, YOU HAVE TO

ORDER TO DO THAT, YOU HAVE TO
SPEND OVER $1 BILLION TO PUT NEW

SPEND OVER $1 BILLION TO PUT NEW
POLLUTION CONTROL EQUIPMENT ON A

POLLUTION CONTROL EQUIPMENT ON A
PLANT THAT, WELL, THE OWNERS

PLANT THAT, WELL, THE OWNERS
HAVE TO DECIDE HOW MUCH MORE

HAVE TO DECIDE HOW MUCH MORE
THEY'RE WILLING TO PUT INTO THE

THEY'RE WILLING TO PUT INTO THE
PLANT TO KEEP IT OPERATING IN

PLANT TO KEEP IT OPERATING IN
THE LONG TERM.

THE LONG TERM.
THE BUREAU OF RECLAMATION U.S.

THE BUREAU OF RECLAMATION U.S.
GOVERNMENT OWNS 30% OF THAT

GOVERNMENT OWNS 30% OF THAT
PLANT, AND THAT POWER IS WHAT'S

PLANT, AND THAT POWER IS WHAT'S
USED TO PUMP C.A.P. WATER OUT OF

USED TO PUMP C.A.P. WATER OUT OF
THE COLORADO RIVER ALL THE WAY

THE COLORADO RIVER ALL THE WAY
TO PHOENIX AND FURTHER UPHILL TO

TO PHOENIX AND FURTHER UPHILL TO
TUCSON.

TUCSON.
IT WOULD COST USERS AN ENORMOUS

IT WOULD COST USERS AN ENORMOUS
SUM OF MONEY IF WE DIDN'T HAVE

SUM OF MONEY IF WE DIDN'T HAVE
THE RELATIVELY CHEAP HYDROPOWER

THE RELATIVELY CHEAP HYDROPOWER
COMING OUT OF GLEN CANYON DAM TO

COMING OUT OF GLEN CANYON DAM TO
DO THAT.

DO THAT.
SO THERE'S A CASE WHERE

SO THERE'S A CASE WHERE
ALLEGEDLY PROTECTING THE AIR

ALLEGEDLY PROTECTING THE AIR
QUALITY AROUND PAGE, ARIZONA IS

QUALITY AROUND PAGE, ARIZONA IS
A REASON TO REQUIRE SACRIFICE OF

A REASON TO REQUIRE SACRIFICE OF
EVERYONE ELSE WITH RESPECT TO

EVERYONE ELSE WITH RESPECT TO
THE COST OF WATER.

THE COST OF WATER.
WITH REGARD TO WATER ITSELF, THE

WITH REGARD TO WATER ITSELF, THE
FEDERAL GOVERNMENT IS BEGINNING

FEDERAL GOVERNMENT IS BEGINNING
TO ASSERT WHAT IT CALLS RESERVED

TO ASSERT WHAT IT CALLS RESERVED
WATER RIGHT CLAIMS TO WATER IN

WATER RIGHT CLAIMS TO WATER IN
WATER COURSES, IN STREAMS, IN

WATER COURSES, IN STREAMS, IN
RIVERS, TO SUPPORT THE FLORA AND

RIVERS, TO SUPPORT THE FLORA AND
FAUNA AS PART OF THAT WATERSHED,

FAUNA AS PART OF THAT WATERSHED,
THE FISH, TURTLES, FROGS, REEDS

THE FISH, TURTLES, FROGS, REEDS
ALONG THE SIDE OF THE BANKS, THE

ALONG THE SIDE OF THE BANKS, THE
BIRDS THAT LIVE IN THERE AND THE

BIRDS THAT LIVE IN THERE AND THE
REST OF IT.

REST OF IT.
IF YOU CREATE A WILDERNESS AREA,

IF YOU CREATE A WILDERNESS AREA,
THE ASSUMPTION IS THAT YOU'RE

THE ASSUMPTION IS THAT YOU'RE
GOING TO SAVE ENOUGH WATER TO

GOING TO SAVE ENOUGH WATER TO
KEEP THAT WILDERNESS AREA GOING.

KEEP THAT WILDERNESS AREA GOING.
WELL, THAT MEANS THE WATER HAS

WELL, THAT MEANS THE WATER HAS
TO FLOW DOWN THE RIVER.

TO FLOW DOWN THE RIVER.
YOU, LET'S SAY A FARMER, CAN'T

YOU, LET'S SAY A FARMER, CAN'T
TAKE WATER OUT UPSTREAM, DIVERT

TAKE WATER OUT UPSTREAM, DIVERT
IT FOR IRRIGATING YOUR FARM,

IT FOR IRRIGATING YOUR FARM,
BECAUSE THAT WATER HAS TO STAY

BECAUSE THAT WATER HAS TO STAY
IN THE RIVER ALL THE WAY DOWN TO

IN THE RIVER ALL THE WAY DOWN TO
WHEREVER IT EVENTUALLY FLOWS.

WHEREVER IT EVENTUALLY FLOWS.
THOSE ARE ISSUES THAT HAVE TO BE

THOSE ARE ISSUES THAT HAVE TO BE
RESOLVED.

RESOLVED.
THEY ARE LEGAL ISSUES, THEY ARE

THEY ARE LEGAL ISSUES, THEY ARE
POLITICAL ISSUES, AND IT'S GOING

POLITICAL ISSUES, AND IT'S GOING
TO TAKE A LOT OF WORK.

TO TAKE A LOT OF WORK.
THOSE ARE SOME OF THE SHORT AND

THOSE ARE SOME OF THE SHORT AND
INTERMEDIATE TERM ISSUES THAT I

INTERMEDIATE TERM ISSUES THAT I
SPOKE OF THAT HAVE TO BE

SPOKE OF THAT HAVE TO BE
RESOLVED SO THAT WE WILL IN

RESOLVED SO THAT WE WILL IN
EFFECT KNOW HOW MUCH WE WILL

EFFECT KNOW HOW MUCH WE WILL
NEED TO AUGMENT OUR SUPPLY ON

NEED TO AUGMENT OUR SUPPLY ON
DOWN THE ROAD.

DOWN THE ROAD.
>> IT DOESN'T SOUND LIKE ANY OF

>> IT DOESN'T SOUND LIKE ANY OF
THE SHORT INTERMEDIATE OR LONG

THE SHORT INTERMEDIATE OR LONG
TERM ISSUES ARE WHAT IS KNOWN AS

TERM ISSUES ARE WHAT IS KNOWN AS
LOW-HANGING FRUIT.

LOW-HANGING FRUIT.
ALL THAT SEEMS TO HAVE BEEN

ALL THAT SEEMS TO HAVE BEEN
PICKED.

PICKED.
>> YES.

>> YES.
AS WE DISCUSSED TODAY, THE

AS WE DISCUSSED TODAY, THE
DECISIONS THAT HAVE TO BE MADE

DECISIONS THAT HAVE TO BE MADE
IN THE FUTURE ARE GOING TO BE

IN THE FUTURE ARE GOING TO BE
TOUGH DECISIONS.

TOUGH DECISIONS.
THERE MAY HAVE TO BE TRADE-OFFS

THERE MAY HAVE TO BE TRADE-OFFS
AMONG WATER USERS, AMONG AREAS

AMONG WATER USERS, AMONG AREAS
OF THE STATE.

OF THE STATE.
THERE MAY BE SOME PRETTY BIG

THERE MAY BE SOME PRETTY BIG
COSTS ASSOCIATED WITH THIS.

COSTS ASSOCIATED WITH THIS.
BUT HERE'S THE GOOD NEWS.

BUT HERE'S THE GOOD NEWS.
ARIZONA HAS ALWAYS MANAGED TO BE

ARIZONA HAS ALWAYS MANAGED TO BE
AHEAD OF EVERYONE ELSE IN TERMS

AHEAD OF EVERYONE ELSE IN TERMS
OF ITS WATER AVAILABILITY

OF ITS WATER AVAILABILITY
BECAUSE WE HAVE LEADERS WITH

BECAUSE WE HAVE LEADERS WITH
FORESIGHT TO LOBBY FOR THE

FORESIGHT TO LOBBY FOR THE
RECLAMATION ACTS CREATION AND

RECLAMATION ACTS CREATION AND
THE CREATION OF THE SALT RIVER

THE CREATION OF THE SALT RIVER
PROJECT, TO LOBBY FOR THE

PROJECT, TO LOBBY FOR THE
CENTRAL ARIZONA PROJECT AND THE

CENTRAL ARIZONA PROJECT AND THE
FUNDING THAT CAN BEGIN TO

FUNDING THAT CAN BEGIN TO
DELIVER OUR SHARE OF COLORADO

DELIVER OUR SHARE OF COLORADO
RIVER WATER TO ARIZONA, THE

RIVER WATER TO ARIZONA, THE
FORESIGHT TO DEVELOP THE GROUND

FORESIGHT TO DEVELOP THE GROUND
WATER MANAGEMENT ACT TO BEGIN

WATER MANAGEMENT ACT TO BEGIN
CONSERVING OUR GROUND WATER AND

CONSERVING OUR GROUND WATER AND
USING IT SENSIBLY AND SO ON.

USING IT SENSIBLY AND SO ON.
THIS ISN'T A SITUATION WHERE

THIS ISN'T A SITUATION WHERE
ARIZONA FACES A CRISIS.

ARIZONA FACES A CRISIS.
WE'RE IN BETTER SHAPE THAN MOST

WE'RE IN BETTER SHAPE THAN MOST
PLACES.

PLACES.
WHAT WE HAVE TO DO IS FOLLOW THE

WHAT WE HAVE TO DO IS FOLLOW THE
SAME HISTORIC MODEL THAT

SAME HISTORIC MODEL THAT
ARIZONANS DID IN THE PAST,

ARIZONANS DID IN THE PAST,
ANTICIPATE WAY OUT INTO THE

ANTICIPATE WAY OUT INTO THE
FUTURE A PROBLEM, GET TOGETHER

FUTURE A PROBLEM, GET TOGETHER
AND SOLVE THE PROBLEM SO THAT

AND SOLVE THE PROBLEM SO THAT
IT'S NEVER A CRISIS.

IT'S NEVER A CRISIS.
AND BY WORKING AT IT EARLY ON

AND BY WORKING AT IT EARLY ON
HERE, I THINK WE CAN AVOID THAT

HERE, I THINK WE CAN AVOID THAT
AND WE CAN CONTINUE TO SAY TO

AND WE CAN CONTINUE TO SAY TO
THE REST OF THE COUNTRY, HEY,

THE REST OF THE COUNTRY, HEY,
COME OUT TO ARIZONA, WE'RE GOING

COME OUT TO ARIZONA, WE'RE GOING
TO HAVE A WONDERFUL ENVIRONMENT

TO HAVE A WONDERFUL ENVIRONMENT
FOR YOU, PLENTY OF WATER TO

FOR YOU, PLENTY OF WATER TO
BOOT.

BOOT.
>> THANK YOU SO MUCH.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH.
>> THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU.
YOU BET.

YOU BET.
>> FOR ANOTHER POINT OF VIEW ON

>> FOR ANOTHER POINT OF VIEW ON
THE STATE'S WATER PICTURE,

THE STATE'S WATER PICTURE,
CHRISTOPHER CONOVER SPOKE WITH

CHRISTOPHER CONOVER SPOKE WITH
UNIVERSITY OF ARIZONA LAW

UNIVERSITY OF ARIZONA LAW
PROFESSOR AND WATER LAW EXPERT,

PROFESSOR AND WATER LAW EXPERT,
ROBERT GLENNON.

ROBERT GLENNON.
>> THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR SITTING

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR SITTING
DOWN WITH US.

DOWN WITH US.
WE HEARD FROM SENATOR KYL ABOUT

WE HEARD FROM SENATOR KYL ABOUT
SOME OF THE WATER ISSUES IN THE

SOME OF THE WATER ISSUES IN THE
STATE, AND THE BIG TAKE-AWAY IT

STATE, AND THE BIG TAKE-AWAY IT
SEEMS FOR EVERYBODY THAT WE'VE

SEEMS FOR EVERYBODY THAT WE'VE
TALKED TO ABOUT WATER IS NOBODY

TALKED TO ABOUT WATER IS NOBODY
DISAGREES WE'RE GOING TO RUN OUT

DISAGREES WE'RE GOING TO RUN OUT
OF WATER IF NOTHING CHANGES.

OF WATER IF NOTHING CHANGES.
BUT CONSERVATION ISN'T GOING TO

BUT CONSERVATION ISN'T GOING TO
GET US OUT OF THIS.

GET US OUT OF THIS.
WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO LOOK TO

WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO LOOK TO
SCIENCE OR SOME OTHER METHOD TO

SCIENCE OR SOME OTHER METHOD TO
SAVE US.

SAVE US.
NOT SURE YOU SEE IT QUITE THE

NOT SURE YOU SEE IT QUITE THE
SAME WAY.

SAME WAY.
>> I THINK IT MAY DEPEND ON WHAT

>> I THINK IT MAY DEPEND ON WHAT
WE MEAN BY CONSERVATION, BECAUSE

WE MEAN BY CONSERVATION, BECAUSE
THE BUREAU OF RECLAMATION ISSUED

THE BUREAU OF RECLAMATION ISSUED
A STUDY LAST YEAR THAT SAID THAT

A STUDY LAST YEAR THAT SAID THAT
CONSERVATION IS, IN FACT, ONE OF

CONSERVATION IS, IN FACT, ONE OF
THE BEST WAYS GOING FORWARD.

THE BEST WAYS GOING FORWARD.
WHAT WON'T WORK IS THE OLD WAY

WHAT WON'T WORK IS THE OLD WAY
OF DOING THINGS, MASSIVE

OF DOING THINGS, MASSIVE
PIPELINES, BIZARRE IDEAS TO TOW

PIPELINES, BIZARRE IDEAS TO TOW
ICEBERGS FROM THE ARCTIC, TAP

ICEBERGS FROM THE ARCTIC, TAP
INTO THE MISSOURI RIVER.

INTO THE MISSOURI RIVER.
THOSE THINGS ARE NOT FEASIBLE,

THOSE THINGS ARE NOT FEASIBLE,
SAID THE BUREAU, BUT WHAT IS

SAID THE BUREAU, BUT WHAT IS
FEASIBLE IS CONSERVATION, REUSE,

FEASIBLE IS CONSERVATION, REUSE,
MAYBE SOME DESAL OF BRACKISH

MAYBE SOME DESAL OF BRACKISH
WATER.

WATER.
CONSERVATION'S A BIG PART.

CONSERVATION'S A BIG PART.
IT'S NOT GOING TO WORK SIMPLY IF

IT'S NOT GOING TO WORK SIMPLY IF
YOU AND I OR A FEW NEW PEOPLE

YOU AND I OR A FEW NEW PEOPLE
JOIN US IN NOT LEAVING THE WATER

JOIN US IN NOT LEAVING THE WATER
RUNNING WHILE THEY BRUSH THEIR

RUNNING WHILE THEY BRUSH THEIR
TEETH.

TEETH.
THAT'S A TRIVIAL AMOUNT.

THAT'S A TRIVIAL AMOUNT.
IT'S A SYMBOLIC AMOUNT BUT

IT'S A SYMBOLIC AMOUNT BUT
TRIVIAL.

TRIVIAL.
BUT A LOT OF FARMING STILL IS

BUT A LOT OF FARMING STILL IS
PRETTY INEFFICIENT AND IF

PRETTY INEFFICIENT AND IF
FARMERS WERE TO BECOME MORE

FARMERS WERE TO BECOME MORE
EFFICIENT, THAT WOULD FREE UP A

EFFICIENT, THAT WOULD FREE UP A
LOT OF NEW WATER.

LOT OF NEW WATER.
NOW, THE PEOPLE WHO WANT THAT

NOW, THE PEOPLE WHO WANT THAT
WATER OF COURSE ARE THE CITIES.

WATER OF COURSE ARE THE CITIES.
THAT'S THE GROWTH.

THAT'S THE GROWTH.
AND SO IT SEEMS SIMPLE ENOUGH TO

AND SO IT SEEMS SIMPLE ENOUGH TO
SAY TO THE CITIES PUT SOME MONEY

SAY TO THE CITIES PUT SOME MONEY
ON THE TABLE, PAY FARMERS TO

ON THE TABLE, PAY FARMERS TO
MOVE FROM FLOOD IRRIGATION TO A

MOVE FROM FLOOD IRRIGATION TO A
CENTER PIVOT OR FROM A CENTER

CENTER PIVOT OR FROM A CENTER
PIVOT TO DRIP OR MICRO, REALLY

PIVOT TO DRIP OR MICRO, REALLY
EFFICIENT SYSTEMS.

EFFICIENT SYSTEMS.
THEY WILL USE LESS WATER, GROW

THEY WILL USE LESS WATER, GROW
THE SAME PRODUCT, BUT THE CITIES

THE SAME PRODUCT, BUT THE CITIES
AND INDUSTRY WILL GET THE EXTRA

AND INDUSTRY WILL GET THE EXTRA
WORK THAT'S SAVED.

WORK THAT'S SAVED.
THAT'S CONSERVATION OF THE BEST

THAT'S CONSERVATION OF THE BEST
SORT.

SORT.
>> MY UNDERSTANDING IS THE VAST

>> MY UNDERSTANDING IS THE VAST
MAJORITY OF OUR WATER, OUR

MAJORITY OF OUR WATER, OUR
C.A.P. WATER, ACTUALLY GOES TO

C.A.P. WATER, ACTUALLY GOES TO
AGRICULTURE.

AGRICULTURE.
VERY LITTLE OF IT COMES TO YOUR

VERY LITTLE OF IT COMES TO YOUR
HOUSE, MY HOUSE, OUR VIEWERS'

HOUSE, MY HOUSE, OUR VIEWERS'
HOUSE.

HOUSE.
SO LITTLE CHANGE IN AGRICULTURE

SO LITTLE CHANGE IN AGRICULTURE
WOULD HAVE A BIG DIFFERENCE FOR

WOULD HAVE A BIG DIFFERENCE FOR
US.

US.
>> WELL, STATE-WIDE, IF YOU

>> WELL, STATE-WIDE, IF YOU
THINK ABOUT GROUND WATER AND

THINK ABOUT GROUND WATER AND
SALT RIVER AS A SYSTEM, FARMERS

SALT RIVER AS A SYSTEM, FARMERS
USE ABOUT 70% OF THE WATER.

USE ABOUT 70% OF THE WATER.
SO IF WE COULD GET FARMERS FROM

SO IF WE COULD GET FARMERS FROM
70% TO 60%, THAT WOULD ALMOST

70% TO 60%, THAT WOULD ALMOST
DOUBLE THE SUPPLY FOR CITIES.

DOUBLE THE SUPPLY FOR CITIES.
SO IT'S A TREMENDOUS

SO IT'S A TREMENDOUS
OPPORTUNITY.

OPPORTUNITY.
BUT THE PROBLEM IS, FARMERS

BUT THE PROBLEM IS, FARMERS
REALLY, MOST OF THEM, AREN'T IN

REALLY, MOST OF THEM, AREN'T IN
A POSITION FINANCIALLY TO BEAR

A POSITION FINANCIALLY TO BEAR
THE COSTS OF THIS INFRASTRUCTURE

THE COSTS OF THIS INFRASTRUCTURE
OVERHAUL.

OVERHAUL.
FOR THE CITIES, IT'S A ROUNDING

FOR THE CITIES, IT'S A ROUNDING
ERROR.

ERROR.
SO LET'S GET THE CITIES ON BOARD

SO LET'S GET THE CITIES ON BOARD
OF HELPING THE FARMERS MODERNIZE

OF HELPING THE FARMERS MODERNIZE
THEIR INFRASTRUCTURE, AND THEY

THEIR INFRASTRUCTURE, AND THEY
WILL GET THE WATER THAT'S SAVED

WILL GET THE WATER THAT'S SAVED
AND THE FARMERS STAY IN

AND THE FARMERS STAY IN
BUSINESS.

BUSINESS.
>> AGRICULTURE IS HUGE BUSINESS

>> AGRICULTURE IS HUGE BUSINESS
IN ARIZONA, ONE OF THE THINGS

IN ARIZONA, ONE OF THE THINGS
OUR ECONOMY RESTS ON, SO ANY

OUR ECONOMY RESTS ON, SO ANY
CHANGE COULD HAVE BIG

CHANGE COULD HAVE BIG
TRICKLE-DOWN EFFECTS BUT IT

TRICKLE-DOWN EFFECTS BUT IT
DOESN'T SOUND LIKE YOU ARE

DOESN'T SOUND LIKE YOU ARE
SAYING THAT'S IT, YOU KNOW, PUT

SAYING THAT'S IT, YOU KNOW, PUT
HOUSES OR SHOPPING MALLS IN ALL

HOUSES OR SHOPPING MALLS IN ALL
THE FIELDS, WE'RE OUT OF

THE FIELDS, WE'RE OUT OF
AGRICULTURE, JUST NEED TO DO

AGRICULTURE, JUST NEED TO DO
SOME MODIFICATION.

SOME MODIFICATION.
>> ACTUALLY, THE ROLE OF

>> ACTUALLY, THE ROLE OF
AGRICULTURE IS MUCH REDUCED FROM

AGRICULTURE IS MUCH REDUCED FROM
WHERE IT WAS WHEN WE HAD THE

WHERE IT WAS WHEN WE HAD THE
FOUR OR FIVE Cs THAT INCLUDED

FOUR OR FIVE Cs THAT INCLUDED
COTTON AND CITRUS.

COTTON AND CITRUS.
AGRICULTURE'S PROBABLY LESS THAN

AGRICULTURE'S PROBABLY LESS THAN
1% OF GROSS STATE PRODUCT BUT

1% OF GROSS STATE PRODUCT BUT
STILL, IT'S AN IMPORTANT PART OF

STILL, IT'S AN IMPORTANT PART OF
WHO WE ARE AS A PEOPLE, AS A

WHO WE ARE AS A PEOPLE, AS A
CULTURE.

CULTURE.
MOREOVER, THE FARMERS HAVE

MOREOVER, THE FARMERS HAVE
RIGHTS TO THE WATER.

RIGHTS TO THE WATER.
IT'S THEIR WATER RIGHTS THAT

IT'S THEIR WATER RIGHTS THAT
WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.

WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.
SO YOU NEED TO GIVE FARMERS AN

SO YOU NEED TO GIVE FARMERS AN
INCENTIVE IF YOU EXPECT THEM TO

INCENTIVE IF YOU EXPECT THEM TO
DO SOMETHING DIFFERENTLY.

DO SOMETHING DIFFERENTLY.
OTHERWISE, THEY WILL CONTINUE

OTHERWISE, THEY WILL CONTINUE
DOING WHAT THEY ARE DOING, WHICH

DOING WHAT THEY ARE DOING, WHICH
IS SOMETIMES NOT VERY EFFICIENT.

IS SOMETIMES NOT VERY EFFICIENT.
>> WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT WATER

>> WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT WATER
RIGHTS, ARIZONA'S A JUNIOR

RIGHTS, ARIZONA'S A JUNIOR
PARTNER ON THE COLORADO RIVER.

PARTNER ON THE COLORADO RIVER.
SOME PEOPLE HAVE SAID IT'S TIME

SOME PEOPLE HAVE SAID IT'S TIME
TO RELOOK AT THAT LEGISLATION,

TO RELOOK AT THAT LEGISLATION,
THAT BODY OF LAW REALISTICALLY.

THAT BODY OF LAW REALISTICALLY.
YOU ARE ALSO A LAW PROFESSOR.

YOU ARE ALSO A LAW PROFESSOR.
WHAT ARE THE CHANCES OF THAT

WHAT ARE THE CHANCES OF THAT
WATER LAW MASSIVELY EVER

WATER LAW MASSIVELY EVER
CHANGING ON RIGHTS OF THE

CHANGING ON RIGHTS OF THE
COLORADO?

COLORADO?
>> I'M PRETTY OPTIMISTIC ABOUT

>> I'M PRETTY OPTIMISTIC ABOUT
THAT, CHRISTOPHER.

THAT, CHRISTOPHER.
OVER THE LAST 20 YEARS, YOU'VE

OVER THE LAST 20 YEARS, YOU'VE
SEEN AN UNPRECEDENTED AMOUNT OF

SEEN AN UNPRECEDENTED AMOUNT OF
COOPERATION AND CONCILIATION

COOPERATION AND CONCILIATION
AMONG SEVEN BASIN STATES.

AMONG SEVEN BASIN STATES.
THEY DID SO IN AN IMPORTANT

THEY DID SO IN AN IMPORTANT
AGREEMENT IN 2007.

AGREEMENT IN 2007.
THEY DID SO JUST LAST YEAR IN

THEY DID SO JUST LAST YEAR IN
WHAT IS CALLED MINUTE 319, WHERE

WHAT IS CALLED MINUTE 319, WHERE
STATES ARE PUTTING FORWARD MONEY

STATES ARE PUTTING FORWARD MONEY
TO MODERNIZE INFRASTRUCTURE, TO

TO MODERNIZE INFRASTRUCTURE, TO
HELP WITH EFFICIENCY

HELP WITH EFFICIENCY
IMPROVEMENTS, AND THEN GETTING

IMPROVEMENTS, AND THEN GETTING
SOME RIGHTS AS A RESULT OF THAT.

SOME RIGHTS AS A RESULT OF THAT.
THE BIG WILD CARD IN ALL OF THIS

THE BIG WILD CARD IN ALL OF THIS
IS CLIMATE CHANGE, AND OUR

IS CLIMATE CHANGE, AND OUR
RIGHTS TRADITIONALLY WERE SET UP

RIGHTS TRADITIONALLY WERE SET UP
ON A ZERO SUM GAME.

ON A ZERO SUM GAME.
IT'S MY RIGHT OR YOUR RIGHT.

IT'S MY RIGHT OR YOUR RIGHT.
IT'S NOT A SHARED RIGHT.

IT'S NOT A SHARED RIGHT.
BUT WHAT WE NEED TO BE BUILDING

BUT WHAT WE NEED TO BE BUILDING
IN IS RESILIENCY IN THE FORM OF

IN IS RESILIENCY IN THE FORM OF
RISK STRATEGIES THAT HELP US

RISK STRATEGIES THAT HELP US
WHEN THE DROUGHT PERSISTS.

WHEN THE DROUGHT PERSISTS.
SO FOR EXAMPLE, SOMETHING AS

SO FOR EXAMPLE, SOMETHING AS
SIMPLE AS A DRY YEAR OPTION,

SIMPLE AS A DRY YEAR OPTION,
WHERE THE CITY SAYS TO AN

WHERE THE CITY SAYS TO AN
ALFALFA FARMER, WE ARE IN TOUGH

ALFALFA FARMER, WE ARE IN TOUGH
SHAPE THIS YEAR, HOW ABOUT YOU

SHAPE THIS YEAR, HOW ABOUT YOU
FALLOW YOUR LAND, WE WILL PAY

FALLOW YOUR LAND, WE WILL PAY
YOU FOR WHAT YOU WOULD HAVE

YOU FOR WHAT YOU WOULD HAVE
GROWN BUT WE'LL TAKE THE WATER

GROWN BUT WE'LL TAKE THE WATER
THIS YEAR.

THIS YEAR.
THAT'S THE KIND OF STUFF, THE

THAT'S THE KIND OF STUFF, THE
OUT OF THE BOX THINKING THAT WE

OUT OF THE BOX THINKING THAT WE
NEED GOING FORWARD.

NEED GOING FORWARD.
>> HOW DO WE CHANGE OVERALL

>> HOW DO WE CHANGE OVERALL
THINKING, I GUESS EVERYBODY'S

THINKING, I GUESS EVERYBODY'S
THINKING, TUCSON A NUMBER OF

THINKING, TUCSON A NUMBER OF
YEARS AGO EMBARKED ON A PROGRAM

YEARS AGO EMBARKED ON A PROGRAM
TO GET PEOPLE TO PULL OUT THEIR

TO GET PEOPLE TO PULL OUT THEIR
LAWNS AND REALLY DO A LOT OF

LAWNS AND REALLY DO A LOT OF
CONSERVATION AROUND THE HOME

CONSERVATION AROUND THE HOME
WITH ZERO SCAPING.

WITH ZERO SCAPING.
WE LOOK UP AT PHOENIX AND THERE

WE LOOK UP AT PHOENIX AND THERE
ARE STILL PLENTY OF LAWNS, IT

ARE STILL PLENTY OF LAWNS, IT
HAS BEEN SAID WELL, PHOENIX

HAS BEEN SAID WELL, PHOENIX
NEEDS THAT, MORE TOURISTS GO

NEEDS THAT, MORE TOURISTS GO
THERE, THEY NEED THE WATER FOR

THERE, THEY NEED THE WATER FOR
THE GOLF COURSES AND THINGS LIKE

THE GOLF COURSES AND THINGS LIKE
THAT TO BRING PEOPLE IN.

THAT TO BRING PEOPLE IN.
HOW DO WE CHANGE THIS THINKING?

HOW DO WE CHANGE THIS THINKING?
>> SECESSION?

>> SECESSION?
THAT'S RIDICULOUS THAT THEY NEED

THAT'S RIDICULOUS THAT THEY NEED
IT FOR TOURISM.

IT FOR TOURISM.
GOLF COURSES HELP TOURISM, BUT

GOLF COURSES HELP TOURISM, BUT
LAS VEGAS HAS SPENT $200 MILLION

LAS VEGAS HAS SPENT $200 MILLION
RIPPING OUT LAWNS AND 40 MILLION

RIPPING OUT LAWNS AND 40 MILLION
PEOPLE A YEAR GO TO LAS VEGAS.

PEOPLE A YEAR GO TO LAS VEGAS.
SO YOU CAN HAVE A TOURIST MAGNET

SO YOU CAN HAVE A TOURIST MAGNET
WITHOUT WATER RUNNING DOWN THE

WITHOUT WATER RUNNING DOWN THE
STREET.

STREET.
YOU KNOW AS WELL AS I,

YOU KNOW AS WELL AS I,
CHRISTOPHER, WHENEVER YOU GO TO

CHRISTOPHER, WHENEVER YOU GO TO
PHOENIX, YOU SEE WATER RUNNING

PHOENIX, YOU SEE WATER RUNNING
DOWN THE STREET.

DOWN THE STREET.
YOU SEE LAWNS NOT WHERE KIDS ARE

YOU SEE LAWNS NOT WHERE KIDS ARE
PLAYING ON THE LAWNS, BUT LOS

PLAYING ON THE LAWNS, BUT LOS
ANGELES AS -- LAWNS AS A BUFFER

ANGELES AS -- LAWNS AS A BUFFER
A SIDEWALK OR A FENCE TO ANOTHER

A SIDEWALK OR A FENCE TO ANOTHER
FENCE, WHERE NO ONE CAN EVEN SEE

FENCE, WHERE NO ONE CAN EVEN SEE
THE LAWN.

THE LAWN.
WE CAN DO BETTER.

WE CAN DO BETTER.
>> LONG TERM, OBVIOUSLY THESE

>> LONG TERM, OBVIOUSLY THESE
ARE DIFFICULT DECISIONS TO MAKE.

ARE DIFFICULT DECISIONS TO MAKE.
IT'S EASY FOR US TO SIT HERE AND

IT'S EASY FOR US TO SIT HERE AND
SAY THIS IS WHAT NEEDS TO BE

SAY THIS IS WHAT NEEDS TO BE
DONE BUT GETTING PEOPLE TO DO

DONE BUT GETTING PEOPLE TO DO
IT, THERE ARE A LITTLE MORE

IT, THERE ARE A LITTLE MORE
DIFFICULT.

DIFFICULT.
LONG TERM, ARE YOU HOPEFUL THESE

LONG TERM, ARE YOU HOPEFUL THESE
DECISIONS CAN BE MADE BEFORE WE

DECISIONS CAN BE MADE BEFORE WE
REACH A CRISIS LEVEL OR IS IT

REACH A CRISIS LEVEL OR IS IT
GOING TO TAKE A REAL CRISIS

GOING TO TAKE A REAL CRISIS
LEVEL WHERE PEOPLE TURN ON THEIR

LEVEL WHERE PEOPLE TURN ON THEIR
TAP AND NOTHING COMES OUT BEFORE

TAP AND NOTHING COMES OUT BEFORE
BIG CHANGES COME?

BIG CHANGES COME?
>> WELL, WE'RE IN A CRISIS RIGHT

>> WELL, WE'RE IN A CRISIS RIGHT
NOW.

NOW.
WATER STILL COMES OUT OF THE

WATER STILL COMES OUT OF THE
TAP, BUT POWER PLANTS ARE NOT

TAP, BUT POWER PLANTS ARE NOT
BEING BUILT.

BEING BUILT.
RESIDENTIAL AND COMMERCIAL

RESIDENTIAL AND COMMERCIAL
DEVELOPMENT PROJECTS CANCELED.

DEVELOPMENT PROJECTS CANCELED.
FACTORIES CLOSING.

FACTORIES CLOSING.
SOME PLACES AROUND THE COUNTRY

SOME PLACES AROUND THE COUNTRY
HAVE RUN OUT OF WATER.

HAVE RUN OUT OF WATER.
SO THE CRISIS IS HERE.

SO THE CRISIS IS HERE.
BUT THERE ARE STILL CHOICES AND

BUT THERE ARE STILL CHOICES AND
PATHS TO SELECT BETWEEN AND

PATHS TO SELECT BETWEEN AND
AMONG TO KEEP THE CRISIS FROM

AMONG TO KEEP THE CRISIS FROM
BECOMING A CATASTROPHE.

BECOMING A CATASTROPHE.
THAT'S WHAT WE NEED.

THAT'S WHAT WE NEED.
AND THAT'S GOING TO REQUIRE

AND THAT'S GOING TO REQUIRE
POLITICAL WILL AND MORAL

POLITICAL WILL AND MORAL
COURAGE.

COURAGE.
>> THANKS FOR SITTING DOWN WITH

>> THANKS FOR SITTING DOWN WITH
US.

US.
>> GOOD TO SEE YOU, CHRISTOPHER.

>> GOOD TO SEE YOU, CHRISTOPHER.
>> MANY AMERICANS OF A CERTAIN

>> MANY AMERICANS OF A CERTAIN
AGE REMEMBER WHERE WE WERE 50

AGE REMEMBER WHERE WE WERE 50
YEARS AGO WHEN WE HEARD THE NEWS

YEARS AGO WHEN WE HEARD THE NEWS
OF JOHN F. KENNEDY'S

OF JOHN F. KENNEDY'S
ASSASSINATION.

ASSASSINATION.
TO MARK THE ANNIVERSARY, WE'LL

TO MARK THE ANNIVERSARY, WE'LL
LOOK AT KENNEDY'S TIME AND

LOOK AT KENNEDY'S TIME AND
CONNECTIONS TO ARIZONA.

CONNECTIONS TO ARIZONA.
JOINING ME IS TUCSON HISTORIAN

JOINING ME IS TUCSON HISTORIAN
JIM TURNER, WHO HAS RESEARCHED

JIM TURNER, WHO HAS RESEARCHED
AND WRITTEN ABOUT JFK IN OUR

AND WRITTEN ABOUT JFK IN OUR
STATE.

STATE.
WELCOME, MR. TURNER.

WELCOME, MR. TURNER.
>> THANK YOU, MICHAEL.

>> THANK YOU, MICHAEL.
>> TELL US ABOUT THE FIRST TIME

>> TELL US ABOUT THE FIRST TIME
THAT YOU KNOW OF THROUGH YOUR

THAT YOU KNOW OF THROUGH YOUR
RESEARCH THAT JFK CAME TO

RESEARCH THAT JFK CAME TO
ARIZONA.

ARIZONA.
>> WELL, IT WAS 1936, IN THE

>> WELL, IT WAS 1936, IN THE
SPRING AND SUMMER OF 1936.

SPRING AND SUMMER OF 1936.
>> AND WHAT WAS HE DOING HERE?

>> AND WHAT WAS HE DOING HERE?
>> WELL, SURPRISINGLY ENOUGH, HE

>> WELL, SURPRISINGLY ENOUGH, HE
WAS WORKING ON A RANCH JUST

WAS WORKING ON A RANCH JUST
SOUTH OF -- WELL, IT WAS OUTSIDE

SOUTH OF -- WELL, IT WAS OUTSIDE
OF BENSON.

OF BENSON.
THE MAN WHO OWNED THE RANCH,

THE MAN WHO OWNED THE RANCH,
JOHN G.F.SPIDEN, HAD THIS RANCH.

JOHN G.F.SPIDEN, HAD THIS RANCH.
HE CAME TO ARIZONA IN 1932.

HE CAME TO ARIZONA IN 1932.
HE WAS A WALL STREET BANKER, BUT

HE WAS A WALL STREET BANKER, BUT
HE HAD HEALTH PROBLEMS, SO LIKE

HE HAD HEALTH PROBLEMS, SO LIKE
MANY OTHERS, HE CAME TO ARIZONA.

MANY OTHERS, HE CAME TO ARIZONA.
>> AND KENNEDY CAME TO HIS RANCH

>> AND KENNEDY CAME TO HIS RANCH
AS A TEENAGER 17, 18 YEARS OLD,

AS A TEENAGER 17, 18 YEARS OLD,
AROUND THERE, WITH HIS OLDER

AROUND THERE, WITH HIS OLDER
BROTHER, JOE, AND THEY SPENT HOW

BROTHER, JOE, AND THEY SPENT HOW
MUCH TIME ON THAT RANCH?

MUCH TIME ON THAT RANCH?
>> ABOUT SIX MONTHS.

>> ABOUT SIX MONTHS.
SPRING AND SUMMER, AND JFK HAD

SPRING AND SUMMER, AND JFK HAD
BEEN IN LONDON ATTENDING THE

BEEN IN LONDON ATTENDING THE
LONDON SCHOOL OF ECONOMICS, AND

LONDON SCHOOL OF ECONOMICS, AND
GOT VERY SICK.

GOT VERY SICK.
I'M NOT QUITE SURE IF IT WAS

I'M NOT QUITE SURE IF IT WAS
PNEUMONIA BUT IT WAS SOMETHING

PNEUMONIA BUT IT WAS SOMETHING
PRETTY BAD, SO HE HAD TO COME

PRETTY BAD, SO HE HAD TO COME
HOME AND HIS FATHER JOSEPH HAD A

HOME AND HIS FATHER JOSEPH HAD A
FRIEND WHO WAS A JOURNALIST WHO

FRIEND WHO WAS A JOURNALIST WHO
KNEW MR. SPIDEN AND SAID WHY

KNEW MR. SPIDEN AND SAID WHY
DON'T YOU SEND JACK OUT TO THE

DON'T YOU SEND JACK OUT TO THE
RANCH TO RECUPERATE.

RANCH TO RECUPERATE.
AND EVIDENTLY, THEY JUST SENT

AND EVIDENTLY, THEY JUST SENT
JOE ALONG TO BE HIS COMPANION.

JOE ALONG TO BE HIS COMPANION.
>> WHAT DID THEY DO ON THE

>> WHAT DID THEY DO ON THE
RANCH?

RANCH?
DID THEY JUST HANG OUT OR --

DID THEY JUST HANG OUT OR --
>> NO, THEY DID REAL COWBOY

>> NO, THEY DID REAL COWBOY
STUFF AND IT WAS A PAID JOB.

STUFF AND IT WAS A PAID JOB.
THEIR FATHER FELT THAT THEY

THEIR FATHER FELT THAT THEY
SHOULD LEARN, ACTUALLY DO

SHOULD LEARN, ACTUALLY DO
SOMETHING WITH THEIR HANDS, SO

SOMETHING WITH THEIR HANDS, SO
THEY RODE FENCE, THEY FIXED,

THEY RODE FENCE, THEY FIXED,
MENDED FENCES, HERDED CATTLE,

MENDED FENCES, HERDED CATTLE,
BUT ALSO BUILT AN ADOBE OFFICE

BUT ALSO BUILT AN ADOBE OFFICE
FOR THE RANCH OWNER AND LATER

FOR THE RANCH OWNER AND LATER
ON, MR. SPIDEN SAID HE WOULD

ON, MR. SPIDEN SAID HE WOULD
LIKE TO CALL IT THE HOUSE THAT

LIKE TO CALL IT THE HOUSE THAT
JACK BUILT BECAUSE HE HAD

JACK BUILT BECAUSE HE HAD
ACTUALLY BUILT IT OUT OF ADOBE

ACTUALLY BUILT IT OUT OF ADOBE
BRICKS.

BRICKS.
>> AFTER THAT, THE KENNEDY

>> AFTER THAT, THE KENNEDY
BROTHERS WENT BACK HOME AND THEY

BROTHERS WENT BACK HOME AND THEY
BOTH WENT -- ENROLLED IN

BOTH WENT -- ENROLLED IN
HARVARD.

HARVARD.
BUT KENNEDY, JOHN KENNEDY, CAME

BUT KENNEDY, JOHN KENNEDY, CAME
BACK TO ARIZONA AGAIN FOR HEALTH

BACK TO ARIZONA AGAIN FOR HEALTH
REASONS A FEW YEARS LATER.

REASONS A FEW YEARS LATER.
THIS WAS AFTER HIS WORLD WAR II

THIS WAS AFTER HIS WORLD WAR II
INJURIES, RIGHT?

INJURIES, RIGHT?
>> RIGHT.

>> RIGHT.
AFTER P.T. 109 WAS RAMMED IN

AFTER P.T. 109 WAS RAMMED IN
AUGUST OF 1942, HE OF COURSE

AUGUST OF 1942, HE OF COURSE
REINJURED HIS BACK.

REINJURED HIS BACK.
HE AND BROTHER JOE JOINED THE

HE AND BROTHER JOE JOINED THE
HARVARD FOOTBALL TEAM IN THE

HARVARD FOOTBALL TEAM IN THE
FALL OF '36 AND HE INJURED IT

FALL OF '36 AND HE INJURED IT
THERE, BUT -- SO AFTER THE P.T.

THERE, BUT -- SO AFTER THE P.T.
109 CRASH, HE WENT TO THE CASTLE

109 CRASH, HE WENT TO THE CASTLE
HOT SPRINGS RESORT OUTSIDE OF

HOT SPRINGS RESORT OUTSIDE OF
PHOENIX AND RECUPERATED FOR

PHOENIX AND RECUPERATED FOR
THREE MONTHS THERE.

THREE MONTHS THERE.
>> FOR THREE MONTHS.

>> FOR THREE MONTHS.
>> YEAH.

>> YEAH.
>> BUT HE ALSO, AS YOUR STORY

>> BUT HE ALSO, AS YOUR STORY
TELLS IT, GOT A LITTLE BIT BORED

TELLS IT, GOT A LITTLE BIT BORED
WITH -- THERE WASN'T MUCH ACTION

WITH -- THERE WASN'T MUCH ACTION
THERE.

THERE.
>> RIGHT.

>> RIGHT.
IT'S 55 MILES OUTSIDE OF

IT'S 55 MILES OUTSIDE OF
PHOENIX, NORTHWEST OF PHOENIX,

PHOENIX, NORTHWEST OF PHOENIX,
AND IT WAS BUILT IN 1896, SO IT

AND IT WAS BUILT IN 1896, SO IT
WAS A RESORT FOR THE

WAS A RESORT FOR THE
VANDERBILTS, ASTORS, BUT HE'S 23

VANDERBILTS, ASTORS, BUT HE'S 23
YEARS OLD AND IT WAS PRETTY

YEARS OLD AND IT WAS PRETTY
BORING, SO THEN HE WENT TO THE

BORING, SO THEN HE WENT TO THE
BILTMORE, ARIZONA BILTMORE IN

BILTMORE, ARIZONA BILTMORE IN
PHOENIX, AND THAT WAS TOO PROPER

PHOENIX, AND THAT WAS TOO PROPER
FOR HIM.

FOR HIM.
HE WOUND UP AT THE CAMELBACK INN

HE WOUND UP AT THE CAMELBACK INN
AND STAYED I'M NOT QUOTE SURE

AND STAYED I'M NOT QUOTE SURE
HOW LONG.

HOW LONG.
BUT THAT WAS MORE TO HIS LIKING.

BUT THAT WAS MORE TO HIS LIKING.
A LOT MORE ACTION.

A LOT MORE ACTION.
>> THEN HE WENT BACK TO

>> THEN HE WENT BACK TO
MASSACHUSETTS, RAN FOR CONGRESS,

MASSACHUSETTS, RAN FOR CONGRESS,
BECAME A U.S. SENATOR, MADE

BECAME A U.S. SENATOR, MADE
ANOTHER VISIT TO ARIZONA NOW AS

ANOTHER VISIT TO ARIZONA NOW AS
A PUBLIC FIGURE, 1958.

A PUBLIC FIGURE, 1958.
CORRECT?

CORRECT?
>> YES.

>> YES.
>> U.S. SENATOR.

>> U.S. SENATOR.
>> I WAS REALLY SURPRISED TO

>> I WAS REALLY SURPRISED TO
LEARN THAT, THAT TUCSON HISTORY

LEARN THAT, THAT TUCSON HISTORY
IS ONE OF MY FAVORITE SUBJECTS,

IS ONE OF MY FAVORITE SUBJECTS,
AND ONE OF THE THINGS WE CAN BE

AND ONE OF THE THINGS WE CAN BE
REALLY PROUD OF IS THE ARIZONA

REALLY PROUD OF IS THE ARIZONA
FORUM.

FORUM.
WE WERE ABLE TO BRING LEADING

WE WERE ABLE TO BRING LEADING
FIGURES IN POLITICS AND THEATER

FIGURES IN POLITICS AND THEATER
AND EVERYTHING ELSE WOULD COME

AND EVERYTHING ELSE WOULD COME
TO APPEAR ON THE SUNDAY EVENING

TO APPEAR ON THE SUNDAY EVENING
FORUM WHICH WAS OPEN TO THE

FORUM WHICH WAS OPEN TO THE
PUBLIC AND IT WAS A PANEL

PUBLIC AND IT WAS A PANEL
SITUATION WHERE PEOPLE WOULD BE

SITUATION WHERE PEOPLE WOULD BE
INTERVIEWED.

INTERVIEWED.
>> HERE AT THE UNIVERSITY OF

>> HERE AT THE UNIVERSITY OF
ARIZONA IN WHAT IS NOW CALLED

ARIZONA IN WHAT IS NOW CALLED
CENTENNIAL HALL.

CENTENNIAL HALL.
>> RIGHT.

>> RIGHT.
>> ANY IDEA WHAT KIND OF CROWD

>> ANY IDEA WHAT KIND OF CROWD
KENNEDY DREW AT THAT TIME?

KENNEDY DREW AT THAT TIME?
>> I'M REALLY NOT SURE.

>> I'M REALLY NOT SURE.
BUT THE BEST QUESTION THAT I

BUT THE BEST QUESTION THAT I
LEARNED ABOUT WAS SOMEBODY IN

LEARNED ABOUT WAS SOMEBODY IN
THE AUDIENCE ASKED HIM, IT'S A

THE AUDIENCE ASKED HIM, IT'S A
PANEL SITUATION, DO YOU THINK A

PANEL SITUATION, DO YOU THINK A
42-YEAR-OLD MAN COULD RUN FOR

42-YEAR-OLD MAN COULD RUN FOR
PRESIDENT, AND THIS IS IN 1958,

PRESIDENT, AND THIS IS IN 1958,
SO JACK REALLY QUICK ON HIS

SO JACK REALLY QUICK ON HIS
HEELS, SAID NO, BUT I THINK A

HEELS, SAID NO, BUT I THINK A
43-YEAR-OLD MAN COULD RUN FOR

43-YEAR-OLD MAN COULD RUN FOR
PRESIDENT.

PRESIDENT.
>> WHICH WOULD BE JUST A COUPLE

>> WHICH WOULD BE JUST A COUPLE
YEARS LATER.

YEARS LATER.
>> THAT'S RIGHT.

>> THAT'S RIGHT.
>> AND HE DID RUN FOR PRESIDENT

>> AND HE DID RUN FOR PRESIDENT
A COUPLE YEARS LATER.

A COUPLE YEARS LATER.
>> ABSOLUTELY.

>> ABSOLUTELY.
>> THEN HIS NEXT TIME THAT WE

>> THEN HIS NEXT TIME THAT WE
KNOW OF AT LEAST BASED ON YOUR

KNOW OF AT LEAST BASED ON YOUR
RESEARCH THAT HE WAS IN ARIZONA

RESEARCH THAT HE WAS IN ARIZONA
WAS JUST BEFORE THAT 1960

WAS JUST BEFORE THAT 1960
PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION.

PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION.
>> RIGHT.

>> RIGHT.
HIS PLANE LANDED IN PHOENIX,

HIS PLANE LANDED IN PHOENIX,
PHOENIX AIRPORT, AT 3:00 IN THE

PHOENIX AIRPORT, AT 3:00 IN THE
MORNING.

MORNING.
HE GOT OFF THE PLANE AND THIS IS

HE GOT OFF THE PLANE AND THIS IS
NOVEMBER 3rd, AND THERE WAS A

NOVEMBER 3rd, AND THERE WAS A
LITTLE TINY CROWD THERE AND HE

LITTLE TINY CROWD THERE AND HE
MADE -- HE GAVE A FEW WORDS, AND

MADE -- HE GAVE A FEW WORDS, AND
THEN GOT BACK ON THE PLANE AND

THEN GOT BACK ON THE PLANE AND
TWO DAYS LATER, WE HAD THE

TWO DAYS LATER, WE HAD THE
ELECTION AND HE WAS PRESIDENT.

ELECTION AND HE WAS PRESIDENT.
SO THIS WAS KIND OF THE LAST

SO THIS WAS KIND OF THE LAST
CAMPAIGN STOP THAT HE HAD.

CAMPAIGN STOP THAT HE HAD.
>> HE WAS PROBABLY ON HIS WAY TO

>> HE WAS PROBABLY ON HIS WAY TO
CALIFORNIA, WHICH HE WON -- NO,

CALIFORNIA, WHICH HE WON -- NO,
HE LOST IN THAT ELECTION, AND HE

HE LOST IN THAT ELECTION, AND HE
LOST ARIZONA TO RICHARD NIXON IN

LOST ARIZONA TO RICHARD NIXON IN
THAT ELECTION AS WELL, ALTHOUGH

THAT ELECTION AS WELL, ALTHOUGH
AT THAT AIRPORT SPEECH, AND I

AT THAT AIRPORT SPEECH, AND I
SAW A COPY OF IT, HE SAID THAT

SAW A COPY OF IT, HE SAID THAT
BARRY GOLDWATER WAS WRONG, THAT

BARRY GOLDWATER WAS WRONG, THAT
HE WOULD -- THAT THE DEMOCRATS

HE WOULD -- THAT THE DEMOCRATS
WOULD PREVAIL IN ARIZONA.

WOULD PREVAIL IN ARIZONA.
NIXON TOOK ARIZONA 56% TO ABOUT

NIXON TOOK ARIZONA 56% TO ABOUT
44% FOR KENNEDY.

44% FOR KENNEDY.
OTHER ARIZONA CONNECTIONS FOR

OTHER ARIZONA CONNECTIONS FOR
KENNEDY, ANYTHING THAT YOU KNOW

KENNEDY, ANYTHING THAT YOU KNOW
OF?

OF?
>> 1961, BACK IN PHOENIX AT THE

>> 1961, BACK IN PHOENIX AT THE
WESTWARD --

WESTWARD --
>> HE'S PRESIDENT NOW.

>> HE'S PRESIDENT NOW.
>> YES, ABSOLUTELY.

>> YES, ABSOLUTELY.
VERY FEW PRESIDENTS ACTUALLY --

VERY FEW PRESIDENTS ACTUALLY --
WELL, I GUESS MAYBE HALF A DOZEN

WELL, I GUESS MAYBE HALF A DOZEN
VISITED ARIZONA WHILE THEY WERE

VISITED ARIZONA WHILE THEY WERE
PRESIDENT.

PRESIDENT.
BUT SENATOR CARL HAYDEN WAS

BUT SENATOR CARL HAYDEN WAS
CELEBRATING HIS 50th YEAR IN

CELEBRATING HIS 50th YEAR IN
CONGRESS.

CONGRESS.
HE WENT TO CONGRESS IN 1912,

HE WENT TO CONGRESS IN 1912,
WHEN ARIZONA BECAME A STATE, SO

WHEN ARIZONA BECAME A STATE, SO
IN 1961, '62, JACK KENNEDY CAME

IN 1961, '62, JACK KENNEDY CAME
TO ARIZONA TO HELP CARL HAYDEN

TO ARIZONA TO HELP CARL HAYDEN
CELEBRATE.

CELEBRATE.
>> THEN CARL HAYDEN WAS A U.S.

>> THEN CARL HAYDEN WAS A U.S.
SENATOR, WE HAVE A PICTURE OF

SENATOR, WE HAVE A PICTURE OF
HIM COMING UP IN A FEW MINUTES,

HIM COMING UP IN A FEW MINUTES,
HE WAS A U.S. SENATOR AND AT

HE WAS A U.S. SENATOR AND AT
THAT TIME, HE SET THE LONGEVITY

THAT TIME, HE SET THE LONGEVITY
RECORD FOR BEING A MEMBER OF

RECORD FOR BEING A MEMBER OF
CONGRESS.

CONGRESS.
>> THAT'S RIGHT.

>> THAT'S RIGHT.
>> IT'S SINCE BEEN BROKEN.

>> IT'S SINCE BEEN BROKEN.
BUT KENNEDY WAS HERE TO

BUT KENNEDY WAS HERE TO
CELEBRATE WITH CARL HAYDEN, WHO

CELEBRATE WITH CARL HAYDEN, WHO
WAS A DEMOCRAT, BY THE WAY,

WAS A DEMOCRAT, BY THE WAY,
RIGHT?

RIGHT?
>> OH, I KNEW THAT.

>> OH, I KNEW THAT.
>> NOW, WHAT LED YOU TO DO YOUR

>> NOW, WHAT LED YOU TO DO YOUR
RESEARCH IN THIS?

RESEARCH IN THIS?
WE JUST HAVE A SHORT TIME

WE JUST HAVE A SHORT TIME
REMAINING, LESS THAN A MINUTE.

REMAINING, LESS THAN A MINUTE.
>> SURE.

>> SURE.
I WAS WORKING AT THE ARIZONA

I WAS WORKING AT THE ARIZONA
HISTORICAL SOCIETY, AND RETIRED

HISTORICAL SOCIETY, AND RETIRED
FROM THE HISTORIAN POSITION

FROM THE HISTORIAN POSITION
THERE, AND A FRIEND OF MINE WHO

THERE, AND A FRIEND OF MINE WHO
WAS VOLUNTEERING AT THE MUSEUM

WAS VOLUNTEERING AT THE MUSEUM
IN BENSON, ARIZONA, SHOWED ME

IN BENSON, ARIZONA, SHOWED ME
THIS PHOTOCOPY OF A NEWSPAPER

THIS PHOTOCOPY OF A NEWSPAPER
PICTURE, AND HE SAID CAN YOU

PICTURE, AND HE SAID CAN YOU
TELL WHO'S IN THAT PICTURE.

TELL WHO'S IN THAT PICTURE.
I WENT OH, MY GOSH, IT'S JFK AS

I WENT OH, MY GOSH, IT'S JFK AS
A TEENAGER.

A TEENAGER.
>> SO YOU STARTED INTO THAT.

>> SO YOU STARTED INTO THAT.
>> YEAH.

>> YEAH.
>> EXCELLENT.

>> EXCELLENT.
MR. TURNER, JIM TURNER, ARIZONA

MR. TURNER, JIM TURNER, ARIZONA
HISTORIAN, THANKS SO MUCH FOR

HISTORIAN, THANKS SO MUCH FOR
SPEAKING WITH US TODAY.

SPEAKING WITH US TODAY.
>> WELL, THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

>> WELL, THANKS FOR HAVING ME.
>>> AS A 14-YEAR-OLD FRESHMAN AT

>>> AS A 14-YEAR-OLD FRESHMAN AT
A CATHOLIC HIGH SCHOOL, I WAS AS

A CATHOLIC HIGH SCHOOL, I WAS AS
TAKEN WITH KENNEDY'S CHARISMA AS

TAKEN WITH KENNEDY'S CHARISMA AS
ANYONE.

ANYONE.
MY MEMORY IS OF HEARING THE NEWS

MY MEMORY IS OF HEARING THE NEWS
ON MY TRAN SISTOR RADIO WHEN

ON MY TRAN SISTOR RADIO WHEN
HOME FROM SCHOOL IN TUCSON.

HOME FROM SCHOOL IN TUCSON.
I IMMEDIATELY CALLED MY DAD AND

I IMMEDIATELY CALLED MY DAD AND
TRIED TO REACH MY MOM, THEN

TRIED TO REACH MY MOM, THEN
REMAINED GLUED TO THE RADIO FOR

REMAINED GLUED TO THE RADIO FOR
THE REST OF THE DAY.

THE REST OF THE DAY.
KENNEDY'S LIFE AND DEATH MADE

KENNEDY'S LIFE AND DEATH MADE
THEIR MARKS ON OUR NATION AND ON

THEIR MARKS ON OUR NATION AND ON
EACH OF US AS INDIVIDUAL

EACH OF US AS INDIVIDUAL
AMERICANS.

AMERICANS.
FOR ME, HE WAS AN ADULT WITH

FOR ME, HE WAS AN ADULT WITH
WHOM I COULD IDENTIFY, BECAUSE

WHOM I COULD IDENTIFY, BECAUSE
HE WAS YOUTHFUL AND CLEAR IN

HE WAS YOUTHFUL AND CLEAR IN
ENUNCIATING HIS VIEW OF WHAT THE

ENUNCIATING HIS VIEW OF WHAT THE
WORLD SHOULD BE LIKE.

WORLD SHOULD BE LIKE.
FOR AN IDEALISTIC TEENAGER, THAT

FOR AN IDEALISTIC TEENAGER, THAT
WAS CAPTIVATING AND THE SUDDEN

WAS CAPTIVATING AND THE SUDDEN
LOSS LEFT A VOID NOT FILLED IN

LOSS LEFT A VOID NOT FILLED IN
THAT TIME BY ANY OTHER LEADER.

THAT TIME BY ANY OTHER LEADER.
WE'LL END THIS EVENING WITH A

WE'LL END THIS EVENING WITH A
MONTAGE OF PHOTOS MARKING JFK'S

MONTAGE OF PHOTOS MARKING JFK'S
CONNECTION TO ARIZONA STARTING

CONNECTION TO ARIZONA STARTING
WITH THIS 1961 IMAGE FROM THE

WITH THIS 1961 IMAGE FROM THE
TUCSON CITIZEN OF THE PRESIDENT

TUCSON CITIZEN OF THE PRESIDENT
AT A NEWS CONFERENCE IN TUCSON.

AT A NEWS CONFERENCE IN TUCSON.
KENNEDY VISITED ARIZONA MORE

KENNEDY VISITED ARIZONA MORE
THAN WE MIGHT HAVE BEEN AWARE,

THAN WE MIGHT HAVE BEEN AWARE,
INCLUDING AS HISTORIAN JIM

INCLUDING AS HISTORIAN JIM
TURNER MENTIONED, TIME AS A

TURNER MENTIONED, TIME AS A
TEENAGER ON A RANCH NEAR BENSON.

TEENAGER ON A RANCH NEAR BENSON.
HERE HE IS WITH COWBOY PETE

HERE HE IS WITH COWBOY PETE
HAVERTY IN A PHOTO DATED 1936

HAVERTY IN A PHOTO DATED 1936
FROM THE ARIZONA REPUBLIC.

FROM THE ARIZONA REPUBLIC.
SOUTHERN ARIZONA CONGRESSMAN

SOUTHERN ARIZONA CONGRESSMAN
STUART UDALL BECAME KENNEDY'S

STUART UDALL BECAME KENNEDY'S
SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR AND

SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOR AND
MORRIS UDALL, SHOWN WITH KENNEDY

MORRIS UDALL, SHOWN WITH KENNEDY
IN THIS PHOTO FROM THE UDALL

IN THIS PHOTO FROM THE UDALL
ARCHIVES AT THE U OF A SUCCEEDED

ARCHIVES AT THE U OF A SUCCEEDED
HIS BROTHER IN CONGRESS.

HIS BROTHER IN CONGRESS.
FINALLY, THIS IMAGE ALSO FROM

FINALLY, THIS IMAGE ALSO FROM
THE U OF A UDALL ARCHIVES SHOW

THE U OF A UDALL ARCHIVES SHOW
ARIZONA POLITICAL LEADERS DURING

ARIZONA POLITICAL LEADERS DURING
KENNEDY'S PRESIDENCY FROM LEFT,

KENNEDY'S PRESIDENCY FROM LEFT,
CONGRESSMAN JOHN RHODES, SENATOR

CONGRESSMAN JOHN RHODES, SENATOR
BARRY GOLDWATER, GOVERNOR PAUL

BARRY GOLDWATER, GOVERNOR PAUL
FANNON, CONGRESSMAN MORRIS

FANNON, CONGRESSMAN MORRIS
UDALL, SENATOR CARL HAYDEN, AND

UDALL, SENATOR CARL HAYDEN, AND
INTERIOR SECRETARY STUART UDALL.

INTERIOR SECRETARY STUART UDALL.
THAT'S OUR PROGRAM FOR FRIDAY,

THAT'S OUR PROGRAM FOR FRIDAY,
NOVEMBER 22nd, 2013.

NOVEMBER 22nd, 2013.
NEXT FRIDAY, A LOOK AT ARIZONA'S

NEXT FRIDAY, A LOOK AT ARIZONA'S
BUSINESS RELATIONSHIPS WITH

BUSINESS RELATIONSHIPS WITH
MEXICO.

MEXICO.
FOR "ARIZONA WEEK" I'M MICHAEL

FOR "ARIZONA WEEK" I'M MICHAEL
CHIHAK.

CHIHAK.
>> PRODUCTION OF "ARIZONA WEEK"

>> PRODUCTION OF "ARIZONA WEEK"
IS MADE POSSIBLE IN PARTS BY A

IS MADE POSSIBLE IN PARTS BY A
GRANT FROM THE STONEWALL

GRANT FROM THE STONEWALL
FOUNDATION AND BY THE MEMBERS OF

FOUNDATION AND BY THE MEMBERS OF
ARIZONA PUBLIC MEDIA.

ARIZONA PUBLIC MEDIA.
THANK YOU FOR YOUR CONTINUED

THANK YOU FOR YOUR CONTINUED
SUPPORT.